Is the Internet Being Used (right now) to Start World War III?

My opinion,is no it never could. Wars are not started over words on the internet.

If someone is ignorant enough to make war over words on the internet ,chances are that individual is ignorant enough to start war over anything.

Originally posted by crimvelvet
reply to post by hawkiye

 

I know and understand there is massive manipulation and always has been, and all over resources for profit to benefit TPTB etc. And the people have been led by the nose for centuries. However to think everything that has happened has been orchestrated to the inth degree is simply untenable....

There is another group working behind the scenes that most do not know about that are actually on the side of freedom and working to tear down those in control and oppressive systems. And I have as much proof of them as anyone else does of the bad guys or TPTB or what ever you call them working behind the scenes so just to get that out of the way. They have a long term plan too that works generationally just like the bad guys however they honor free will so it seems they have been obscure through much of their history. Also they know tearing down the old systems to fast could set us back instead of move us forward. I know folks will disagree and scoff but that is no different then those who scoff when you tell them of the conspiracies. So I guess we will have to just agree to disagree. However I am here to tell you there is more going on then meets the eye and it is not all in favor of the bad guys.

I sure hope you are right!

I do know there is more than one group. One wants violent over through and a socialist dictatorship and the other wants a slow transformation to a socialist "democratic" dictatorship. Different methods same result.

1. Rights are derived from the state and NOT from the individual.

2. The group is more important than the individual and the largest group is the state.

3. Laws should be applied differently to different classes; (Some pigs are more equal than other pigs)

4. Providing benefits, otherwise known as redistributing wealth, is the proper role of government, as long as the banksters get their half of the pie. (Remember about 45% of the US federal debt is "owed" to the banksters)

I just want to clarify i am not talking about either of the groups you mention.

Originally posted by hawkiye

Originally posted by crimvelvet
reply to post by hawkiye

 

I know and understand there is massive manipulation and always has been, and all over resources for profit to benefit TPTB etc. And the people have been led by the nose for centuries. However to think everything that has happened has been orchestrated to the inth degree is simply untenable....

There is another group working behind the scenes that most do not know about that are actually on the side of freedom and working to tear down those in control and oppressive systems. And I have as much proof of them as anyone else does of the bad guys or TPTB or what ever you call them working behind the scenes so just to get that out of the way. They have a long term plan too that works generationally just like the bad guys however they honor free will so it seems they have been obscure through much of their history. Also they know tearing down the old systems to fast could set us back instead of move us forward. I know folks will disagree and scoff but that is no different then those who scoff when you tell them of the conspiracies. So I guess we will have to just agree to disagree. However I am here to tell you there is more going on then meets the eye and it is not all in favor of the bad guys.

I sure hope you are right!

I do know there is more than one group. One wants violent over through and a socialist dictatorship and the other wants a slow transformation to a socialist "democratic" dictatorship. Different methods same result.

1. Rights are derived from the state and NOT from the individual.

2. The group is more important than the individual and the largest group is the state.

3. Laws should be applied differently to different classes; (Some pigs are more equal than other pigs)

4. Providing benefits, otherwise known as redistributing wealth, is the proper role of government, as long as the banksters get their half of the pie. (Remember about 45% of the US federal debt is "owed" to the banksters)

I just want to clarify i am not talking about either of the groups you mention.

perhaps this is the Good vs Evil ?

or the Yin Yang idea brought up by Proto in:

Many would argue inside us exist three different entities, two that we are quite familiar with, Freud would call these the Id and the Ego, and the Chinese philosophers the Ying and the Yang.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Yin yang are complementary opposites that interact within a greater whole, as part of a dynamic system. Everything has both yin and yang aspects, but either of these aspects may manifest more strongly in particular objects, and may ebb or flow over time. The concept of yin and yang is often symbolized by various forms of the Taijitu symbol, for which it is probably best known in western cultures.....

The nature of yin–yang

In Taoist philosophy, yin and yang (☯) arise together from an initial quiescence or emptiness (wuji, sometimes symbolized by an empty circle), and continue moving in tandem until quiescence is reached again. For instance, dropping a stone in a calm pool of water will simultaneously raise waves and lower troughs between them, and this alternation of high and low points in the water will radiate outward until the movement dissipates and the pool is calm once more. Yin and yang thus are always opposite and equal qualities. Further, whenever one quality reaches its peak, it will naturally begin to transform into the opposite quality: for example, grain that reaches its full height in summer (fully yang) will produce seeds and die back in winter (fully yin) in an endless cycle.

en.wikipedia.org...

reply to post by xuenchen


Thanks for the link, I haven't been able to find much information on current world oil production, and I don't think that is an accident. Saudi oil production is still down from 2007, and I bet the quality of the crude has dropped considerably, if these numbers are even accurate. They give very little information

I think the biggest problem is that between the banks, oil companies, insurance companies, and auto companies, our infrastructure has been made as inefficient as possible to increase the amount of gas, insurance, and automobiles we have to buy, mainly on credit, and the increase in the cost of housing. They laid waste to the small factory towns of the midwest, where buying a home near work was easy and affordable, and there weren't traffic snarls anything like that which exists in the suburban sprawls created over the last couple of decades.

With modern automation capabilities, small production centers could be created all across the country outside of these suburban sprawls. Regions could easily produce all the goods and services needed in that region, instead of having the goods shipped all over the country.

The best answer would be to stop wasting so much energy.

We also need to get rid of planned obsolescence. A lot of what is produced could be made a whole lot better to last a whole lot longer. By producing goods that do not last very long, the ICs get to slice a piece off of the top of everything we make, by forcing us to keep replacing the things we buy.

Why doesn't the auto industry want to see electric cars on the road? They would last a life time. Electric motors have very few moving parts. Batteries are easy to re-cycle.

I would like to see a train system personal vehicle hybrid. Instead of getting into a car with fellow passengers, drive your car up onto a train car, and then enter your destination. Then, when you get to where you are going, you still have a vehicle to get around in. Automate the system, put in multiple lines, so that there are fast rails and slower rails, and rails to exit the system. This would also greatly reduce traffic at the airports, greatly reduce traffic accidents, needs for insurance, and make life a lot more enjoyable.

Other alternative fuel sources, bio-diesel made from hemp, clean burning coal plants, ethanol from sugar cane.

Someone keeps mentioning that there is another material, besides Uranium that can run nuclear power plants, with a lot less danger and less radio active waste, and of course there is wind power, which has proven to be very effective.

reply to post by poet1b

I think that as an institution, corporations have ran their course as far as usefulness goes, and are far more of a problem than a contribution. As the easy to get high quality oil runs out, and the markets turn to alternative energy sources, a great deal of the wealth created by the easily centralized control of big oil is going to dry up, and the giant ICs may go the way of the dinosaur. It is very probably that most of these destructive market trends could be the death throes of the giant ICs. Having worked for a few, I was amazed at how inefficient they are.

I agree with a lot of what you are saying. The giant ICs ARE inefficient. But I think the giant corporations are not helped by oil but are helped by three other things.

The Three Big Advantages:
1. Cheap fiat funny money is loan to the large corporations at low interest rates while small firms have to use their personal savings, home equity and loans from family and venture capitalists at a much higher rate of interest.

2. Peter Drucker stated at a seminar I was in, that one worker now (1985) supports 9 administrative types. This means giant corporations have a lot of paper management systems. Time sheets, weekly reports.... This has all been formalized as ISO ~ The International Organization for Standardization, responsible for the ISO 9000, ISO 14000, ISO 27000, ISO 22000 and other international management standards.

While large corporations NEED these management systems to keep track of what is happening, small firms do not because upper management is in direct contact with their employees. The giant Corporations managed to take this disadvantage and twist it into an advantage by MANDATING these unwieldy and useless "international management standards" be used by small firms BY LAW!

That is what the change to the international HACCP system for food processing plants in 1996 was all about and it is what mandating HACCP for farms starting in 2012 is all about. It works gets rid of the competition very well. see SHIELDING THE GIANT

It has the additional advantage of allowing the laws to be written so government inspection is focused on completing the PAPERWORK correctly and not on what is actually happening. The USDA's knowledge of Conagra's shipping of tainted food and its refusal to go after them is a classic example of how the system actually works.

3. Tax payer support of large corporations:
Again I will use food as an example. The American Tax payer has handed out over $95 billion in agricultural subsidies in a five year period. This money did not go to the small farmers growing veggies or fruit or even livestock, instead it goes to support "commodity crops" like cotton, soybean and corn that are sold below production costs. Monsanto, Cargill and the other grain traders as well as the insurance companies providing crop insurance, end up with our tax dollar. The cheap corn allows Corporate Livestock Confinement and Feedlot Operations to compete successfully with small farm pasture raised. This gave rise to the lethal E. coli 0157:H7 and to much lower nutritional value than grass fed It also allowed grain to be sold overseas at below production cost, bankrupting third world small businessmen.

In addition tax payer funded patents are turned over to the large corporations. Monsanto is in a battle over patent rights with Universities and Hyperion Power Generation is commercially developing the small energy modules [that] were originally designed by Otis "Pete" Peterson and other scientists at Los Alamos National Laboratory in New Mexico.

Another source of patents for the giants is either out right theft of patents from small businesses or hostile takeovers. Today, piracy, counterfeiting and the theft of intellectual property pose a serious threat.... Industry estimates of the cost of such theft range from $250 billion to 750,000 jobs per year. "small businesses can be at a particular disadvantage because they lack the resources and expertise available to larger corporations. Small businesses may also often lack the familiarity with the process of protecting intellectual property..."

How important are small businesses to the U.S. economy?

Small firms:

* Represent 99.7 percent of all employer firms.
* Employ about half of all private sector employees.
* Pay more than 45 percent of total U.S. private payroll.
* Have generated 60 to 80 percent of net new jobs annually over the last decade.
* Create more than half of nonfarm private gross domestic product (GDP).
* Supplied 22.8 percent of the total value of federal prime contracts in FY 2006.
* Hire 40 percent of high tech workers (such as scientists, engineers, and computer workers).
* Are 52 percent home-based and 2 percent franchises.
* Made up 97 percent of all identified exporters and pro­duced 28.6 percent of the known export value in FY 2004.
* Small innovative firms produce 13 times more patents per employee than large patenting firms, and their patents are twice as likely as large firm patents to be among the one percent most cited.
www.tgasbc.org...

In case you have not noticed I am a pro-small business, anti-corporatism capitalist.

reply to post by crimvelvet


Wow....

As always crimvelvet, your posts are direct and to the point, but loaded with very useful information that very, very few people are even aware exists.

I am not really commenting too much on the thread in this reply.
But this is more of a thank you for all of the diligent work you put into each and every reply that you make.

It is truly an honor to post with someone as knowledgeable about REAL LIFE situations as yourself.

Cheers mate!

I am still trying to take in all of the information that you have posted in this thread.

reply to post by xuenchen

what's your take on a "new" energy source in the future?

The OLD energy source that the elite (Rockefeller) killed in the 1950's!

The Elite like the Rockefeller control us and charge huge prices for oil and scare us into poverty with things like "Peak Oil" and the "population explosion"

Now for the first time, scientists have found that ethane and heavier hydrocarbons can be synthesized under the pressure-temperature conditions of the upper mantle —the layer of Earth under the crust and on top of the core.

In other words oil is being continuously made by the earth.

Nissan LEAF ™the new car.™ 100% electric, no-gas. *as low as $25280 net value, after tax savings. MSRP $32780, with federal tax savings from 0 to $7500...

And to power that car:

Lawrence Livermore, Los Alamos, and Argonne national laboratories are designing a self-contained nuclear reactor with tamper-resistant features. Called SSTAR (small, sealed, transportable, autonomous reactor), this next-generation reactor will produce 10 to 100 megawatts electric and can be safely transported on ship or by a heavy-haul transport truck.....

Because thorium reactors will make nuclear reactors more decentralized. Because of no risk of proliferation or meltdown, thorium reactors can be made of almost any size. A 500 ton, 100MW SSTAR-sized thorium reactor could fit in a large industrial room, require little maintenance, and only cost $25 million. A hypothetical 5 ton, truck-sized 1 MW thorium reactor might run for only $250,000 but would generate enough electricity for 1,000 people for the duration of its operating lifetime, using only 20 kg of thorium fuel per year, running almost automatically, and requiring safety checks as infrequently as once a year. That would be as little as $200/year after capital costs are paid off, for a thousand-persons worth of electricity! An annual visit by a safety inspector might add another $200 to the bill. A town of 1,000 could pool $250K for the reactor at the cost of $250 each, then pay $400/year collectively, or $0.40/year each for fuel and maintenance. These reactors could be built by the thousands, further driving down manufacturing costs.....

....Even smaller reactors might be built. The molten salt may have a temperature of around 1,400°F, but as long as it can be contained by the best alloys, it is not really a threat. The small gasoline explosions in your automobile today are of a similar temperature. In the future, personal vehicles may be powered by the slow burning of thorium, or at least, hydrogen produced by a thorium reactor. Project Pluto, a nuclear-powered ramjet missile, produced 513 megawatts of power for only $50 million. At that price ratio, a 10 kW reactor might cost $1,000 and provide enough electricity for 10 persons/year while consuming only 1 kg of thorium every 5 years, itself only weighing 1000kg - similar to the weight of a refrigerator. I’m not sure if miniaturization to that degree is possible, or if the scaling laws really hold. But it seems consistent with what I’ve heard about nuclear power in the past.... www.thorium.tv...

The Basics
.... This thorium fuel cycle carries with it a number of important natural properties some of which contrast sharply with the uranium fuel cycle:

-At no point in the thorium cycle – from mining to waste – can fuel or waste products be used as bomb material in any way;

-The thorium fuel cycle is inherently incapable of causing a meltdown according to the laws of physics; in nuclear reactor parlance, the fuel is said to contain passive safety features;

-Thorium-based fuels do not require conversion or enrichment – two essential phases of the uranium fuel cycle that are exceedingly expensive, and create proliferation risk;

-Thorium fuel cycle waste material consists mostly of 233-uranium, which can be recycled as fuel (with minor actinide content decreased 90-100%, and with plutonium content eliminated entirely);
-Thorium-based fuels are significantly energy efficient;

-Thorium fuel cycle waste material is radiotoxic for tens of years, as opposed to the thousands of years with today’s standard radioactive waste;

-Thorium fuel designs exist today that can be used in all existing nuclear reactors;

-Thorium exists in greater abundance and higher concentrations than uranium making it much less expensive and environmentally-unobtrusive to mine;


These facts have many serious implications for the efficiency and security of energy delivery in the United States, and the world. SOURCE

A Chronology of Nuclear History

Reintroducing Thorium: Chem & Eng News

CHANGE.org Thorium: Nuclear Energy's Clean Little Secret

Originally posted by poet1b
reply to post by xuenchen

 

I think the biggest problem is that between the banks, oil companies, insurance companies, and auto companies, our infrastructure has been made as inefficient as possible to increase the amount of gas, insurance, and automobiles we have to buy, mainly on credit, and the increase in the cost of housing. They laid waste to the small factory towns of the midwest, where buying a home near work was easy and affordable, and there weren't traffic snarls anything like that which exists in the suburban sprawls created over the last couple of decades.

With modern automation capabilities, small production centers could be created all across the country outside of these suburban sprawls. Regions could easily produce all the goods and services needed in that region, instead of having the goods shipped all over the country.

The best answer would be to stop wasting so much energy.

We also need to get rid of planned obsolescence. A lot of what is produced could be made a whole lot better to last a whole lot longer. By producing goods that do not last very long, the ICs get to slice a piece off of the top of everything we make, by forcing us to keep replacing the things we buy.

Why doesn't the auto industry want to see electric cars on the road? They would last a life time. Electric motors have very few moving parts. Batteries are easy to re-cycle.

I would like to see a train system personal vehicle hybrid. Instead of getting into a car with fellow passengers, drive your car up onto a train car, and then enter your destination. Then, when you get to where you are going, you still have a vehicle to get around in. Automate the system, put in multiple lines, so that there are fast rails and slower rails, and rails to exit the system. This would also greatly reduce traffic at the airports, greatly reduce traffic accidents, needs for insurance, and make life a lot more enjoyable.

Other alternative fuel sources, bio-diesel made from hemp, clean burning coal plants, ethanol from sugar cane.

Someone keeps mentioning that there is another material, besides Uranium that can run nuclear power plants, with a lot less danger and less radio active waste, and of course there is wind power, which has proven to be very effective.

This is a truly excellent reply poet and one that makes so much sense that it will probably never happen.

I would say that the biggest problem facing the population today is summed up in one word, inefficiency.
And a lot of this inefficiency is programmed into the system in order to make the most possible money for large international corporate conglomerates, but in order for these large IC's to make the most possible profit, which according to US law, they are obligated to do so despite ethical or moral concerns, they must create and build deplorable systems into their products.... i.e. planned obsolescence.

I emboldened one specific part of your comment that is the MOST important in my humble opinion.

HEMP.

Industrial hemp could save the US economy. It would put small farmers on equal footing with large farming conglomerates such as cargill and con-agra, and it would allow we the people to localize production of nearly EVERY single item that we use for energy, for clothing, for food, for medicine, etc...

Essentially, legalizing the production of hemp across the board would KILL the large corporate conglomerates.
Henry Ford saw hemp as the future of America. He built a car made exclusively from hemp and diesel engines were originally designed to run on hemp oil, not diesel petrol.

Hemp was the lifeblood of the world economy until the industrial revolution, but we are kept so scattered with so many problems that support for industrial hemp is kept at bay by the classic technique of divide and conquer, as well as, tons and tons of disinformation and continual propaganda regarding cannabis sativa.

And now with hemp out of the way, the path toward global hegemony by the large IC's depends on their ability to centralize control of the world's fossil fuel resources. Unlike Hemp, these resources are finite.

And because so, these fossil resources can have their prices manipulated at the whim of TPTB under the guise of "rationing".
And the large IC's seem to be using the internet to foment reactionary forces that will eventually centralize control of a countries fossilized resources into the hands of a few large IC's. (if all goes as planned)

This is WWIII and the internet is the means by which it is conducted; however, this is an information war and not a shot 'em and blow 'em up war as they were in the past.

We have the ability, technology, and human resources to make this a much more egalitarian world, but we are fighting a monster with unlimited patience and resources. This will come to a head, and most likely in our lifetime.

Here is a toast to the little guy.

Cheers.

reply to post by hawkiye

I just want to clarify i am not talking about either of the groups you mention.

Good.

I am very glad to hear that.

It gets very depressing to do all the research and see what an advantage money and lobbyist power gives these people, especially when you factor in the financial strings they attach to groups like Greenpeace, WWF, Friends of the Earth, Food & Water Watch, Organic Consumers, Consumers Union, Boy Scouts, Girl Scouts, YMCA......

These B@S$#@ds have cost me hours and hours of lost work time. Worse I hesitate to invest time or money on improvements for my business and farm because I am not sure if I will find myself out of business tomorrow.

For Example:
I had a great idea and had invested a lot of time and money to "bring the idea to market" only to have a new law and a visit from a government official shut it down. I can not afford to spend $210,000.00 and more to "meet code" for an idea that could gross maybe $5,000 to $20,000 a year. Especially when that "investment" does absolutely nothing for my business or my property. It would have to be considered "the cost of doing business" ie a BRIBE!

reply to post by crimvelvet


Our Federal Government, and most State Governments as well, are CORPORATIONS, and your dilemma regarding your idea for making profit is a perfect example of state corporate thuggery.
I could not repeat this enough times. Corporations are MANDATED BY US LAW TO MAKE THE MOST MONEY FOR THEIR SHAREHOLDERS/BONDHOLDERS.

Corporations are interested in ONE thing and ONE thing only.... Profit.

We are lead to believe that the regulations that are put into place by the State and Federal Governments are here to protect US, WE THE PEOPLE, but that could be the furthest from the truth.

These regulations are put into place in order to mitigate any novel ideas that might ruin corporate profit.
Nikola Tesla is another example of corporate thuggery, along with yourself.

History is a battle of novelty versus tradition and in this sense I will agree with poet1b, novelty is winning.

But by a very slim margin and the more technology advances, the more difficult the battle becomes.

"The biggest problem in the world is that we suffer from a lack of good ideas" - T. McKenna

(I know that I already posted that quote, but it bears repeating over and over and over and over, until people realize the gravity of what he was saying)

If you have never seen this movie, then I highly suggest taking a look, and after watching, Proto's premise that the internet is being used to begin WWIII might make a bit more sense.

reply to post by poet1b

The best answer would be to stop wasting so much energy. We also need to get rid of planned obsolescence. A lot of what is produced could be made a whole lot better to last a whole lot longer....

Again we are on the same page

I was a QC chemist in the plastics industry. The worst thing that was ever done was the campaign to "Recycle" crap plastic.

For example, I have bought muck buckets in 1989 that I still use. I have had to replace the rope handles and they look ratty but they work just fine. I have new buckets I have bought and those I replace every year or two because they crack and disintegrate. Recycling chops the polymer chain lengths shorter and shorter weakening the plastic. My new rubber muck boots only last 6 months before cracking while my old rubber riding boots (25 yrs) are still usable.

Another example is my 1979 trailer bought used in New England. It is still in use. The blasted new trailer I bought five years ago is rusted out and I have to either get a new one or have a lot of welding done... AGAIN!

Decent paint jobs, and the paint IS available (Powder Coated) would do wonders for automobiles and a lot of other products. So would decent engineering. I had a real go round on that subject with a NYPRO plastics engineer who was teaching a course in plastics. The old AT&T made phones capable of falling off a desk with no damage. That turkey engineer considered falling off a desk "abuse" of the object.

The ripping apart of rural communities was done intentionally to make workers dependent on the big corporations and government. You really should read Nicole Johnson's Article. It is THE article that put everything together for me and made me realize the destruction of our society was done intentionally. She has about 4 pages of references attached so she really did her homework.

You are correct decentralized would be a lot nicer but that is not what is planned. The elite want to "REWILD" the USA and push the population into about 30% of the current size. That is what the Wildlands Project and the UN Biodiversity treaty is all about.

MAP We get to live in the tiny green areas.

reply to post by Josephus23

Wow....

As always crimvelvet, your posts are direct and to the point, but loaded with very useful information that very, very few people are even aware exists.

I am not really commenting too much on the thread in this reply.
But this is more of a thank you for all of the diligent work you put into each and every reply that you make....

Thank you.

My goal is to get as much information out there in a form that can be used by others to support what us "Conspiracy Theorists" are trying to say.

We can thank those giant corporations for teaching me how to present data. Nothing like having to go in front of a VP or corporate president and having to defend your budget or your ideas to teach you not to make unsupported statements!

I had some pretty good fights with the corporate accountants ... and WON!



I would also like to note much of my information is from "brainstorming" with a lot of other farmers and farm supporters who did the original back tracking of NAIS (animal Id) to the World Trade Organization.

Gisela of Naisinfocentral did a lot of very careful work. Make a statement without good back up references and she would nail us to the wall!

We had to be very careful because the USDA was calling us DIS-INFO AGENTS. So most of us learned to provide good references.

reply to post by xuenchen


I think that you are onto something xuenchen....

This is a battle of "good" versus "evil" (I will say, however, that I prefer the Nietzchian approach to defining good and evil)

Although they are ambiguous terms, the reality of what is happening can not be denied.

WWIII is an information war. It is a war for the hearts and minds of the people of this planet and it is happening as we speak, and the medium through which the battle is fought is all forms of media.
But mainly it is becoming a battle fought through the internet.

Just think for a second the extent to which we are exposed to propaganda everyday (or as those evil demons like to rename it "public relations").

We are on the front lines. We are the only thing standing between a free society and complete and total corporate mind control.

Keep up the good fight my friend.

Great stuff guys, THANKS, I hear ya. Can't think of more right now to add.

One thing I would say, is that with the internet, we can reply to the nonsense that is put out there. There is a global community here in cyberspace watching, paying attention, and learning a great deal.

We know we have been screwed, we just need to figure out what to do about it.

A good place I would like to start is to take back our government from corporate control. This would be the first step.

First, great responses by crimvelvet and Josephus23 and poet1b about “corporatisms”, energy, and the whole farm/food complex that has taken its (wrongful) place in TPTB “boardroom”!

Combining all this info has created an “encyclopedia” of detail!

All this definitely plays a major part in the events currently going on.

The internet is for sure a key resource for “them” and “us”! and I believe as J23, the internet is the WWIII battleground.

As we have learned on this thread, the sock-puppets ARE here, and in full force!

Instead of “recruiting” a hundred people from the local bowling alley, they get ‘em “online” now a days! Flash Mobs are in style!


J23 states:

We are the only thing standing between a free society and complete and total corporate mind control.

Absolutely! And I think TPTB may be viewing Us as “The Great Wall of China”!


I also think the “animal” RFID “program” could be a precursor trial-run for Humans!
As a recent thread brings to light: !!!

www.abovetopsecret.com...

what better place to test these theories?


I quote crimvelvet:

My goal is to get as much information out there in a form that can be used by others to support what us "Conspiracy Theorists" are trying to say.

We can thank those giant corporations for teaching me how to present data. Nothing like having to go in front of a VP or corporate president and having to defend your budget or your ideas to teach you not to make unsupported statements!

What goes around comes around!


I also believe the Thorium fuel source will eventually replace the standard fossil fuels, and perhaps in combination with solar power if they can ever find the best harness. A car powered by batteries could at least be partially “recharged” while in sunlight for example. Solar panels could provide a secondary power source in buildings, etc.

The whole problem of course is that TPTB in the future will be looking for all the ways possible to exploit the concept as well as the “hardware” and everything connected with it.

Which is the point of the “Yin Yang” theory – opposites exist in relation to each other!

“The “anti-theory” always starts with the end result” --- the goal of the anti-theory is to inject confusion --- confusion is the intended end result – thus the beginning of the anti-theory needs to be confusing!

Josephus23’s “Nietzchian” (I assume Friedrich Nietzsche is referred to?) is a “different” yet “similar” philosophy that I will leave to J23, as I’m sure He knows much more than I do!

Many would attribute the Renaissance to have started with the Protestant movement against the Catholic church. Martin Luther translated the bible to German (to this day modern English is closer to German than Old English). This occurred around the same time as the first working printing press. Bibles became widely distributed and read, and people realized that they had been fooled by the Catholic Church.

Of course, during this time, firearms were beginning to be developed, and were proved to be very effective in battle, eliminating the advantages nobles enjoyed with their suits of armor. Cannons made fortresses indefensible, and the fourth crusade to end the Protestant movement failed.

Guilds began to use their influence through unionization to bargain with the nobles and open markets for trade.

One of the key propaganda tools against the working class has been to associate unions with communism, when unions existed long before communism, and in fact are the basis of the rise of the market system. This is knowledge that needs to be put out there.

I would agree that the current function of unions is very ineffective.

I think that one of the things that people have forgotten is that small businesses formed their own trade guilds. Those looking to start small businesses in these tough times might want to take an example from the past, and look on strengthening small business associations, and see if they can be formed once again into formidable forces capable of dealing with this assault being carried out against the average person by huge institutions.

reply to post by poet1b

A good place I would like to start is to take back our government from corporate control. This would be the first step.

AMEN, Again we are on the same page.

First we need to kick K Street to the MOON and make it illegal for corporations to interfere in the running of a country in an way shape or form!

Speaking of taking back control....
THIS is a really really interesting tidbit I came across many moons ago. (2007)

This started with Ann Veneman who was considered as a possible running mate for Obama.

Ann Veneman joined the United States Department of Agriculture's Foreign Agricultural Service in 1986, serving as Associate Administrator until 1989. During this time she worked on the Uruguay Round talks for the General Agreement on Tariffs and Trade (GATT).

In reflecting on Veneman's record, Meatnews wrote that she "played a key role in eliminating trade barriers and expanding opportunities for American farmers through new export markets. She has worked closely with U.S. Trade Representative Robert Zoellick, helping lead to the successful launch of a new round of trade negotiations for the World Trade Organization.

Ann Veneman served on the board of directors for Calgene Inc. In 1994, Calgene became the first company to bring genetically-engineered food, the Flavr Savr tomato, to supermarket shelves. Calgene was bought out by Monsanto, the nation's leading biotech company, in 1997. Monsanto, in turn, became part of pharmaceutical company Pharmacia in 2000. Monsanto, which donated more than $12,000 to George Bush's presidential bid, wants two things this year: no mandatory labeling of biotech foods and better access to international markets. Veneman also served on the International Food & Agricultural Trade Policy Council www.agritrade.org... , a group funded by Cargill, Nestle, Kraft, and Archer Daniels Midland. [4]

She was Deputy Undersecretary of Agriculture for International Affairs and Commodity Programs from 1989 to 1991. From 1991 to 1993, she served as United States Department of Agriculture's Deputy Secretary, the Department's second-highest position. At this point Veneman took a break from political and administrative office to practice with the law firm and lobby group Patton, Boggs and also served on several boards of directors and advisory groups. Since beginning as UNICEF Executive Director on May 1, 2005, Veneman has made the Millennium Development Goals a priority.

(IPC) International Policy Council on Agriculture, food and Trade: Ann Veneman Biography (USDA)
www.usda.gov...!ut/p/_s.7_0_A/7_0_1OB/.cmd/ad/.ar/sa.retrievecontent/.c/6_2_1UH/.ce/7_2_5JM/.p/5_2_4TQ/.d/1/_th/J_2_9D/_s.7_0_A/7_0_1O B?PC_7_2_5JM_contentid=bios_veneman.xml#7_2_5JM

The IPC was created in 1987 explicitly to drive home the GATT agriculture rules of WTO at Uruguay talks. The IPC demanded removal of ‘high tariff’ barriers in developing countries, remaining silent on the massive government subsidy to agribusiness in the USA and is responsible for the new Food "Safety" Modernization Act of 2010.

The very interesting thing about this BIO of Ann V. is "the law firm and lobby group Patton, Boggs" It was the first firm to start "lobbying" politicians for a client! I can not find my not on unfortunately (from 1987)

Patton Boggs is also one of American Banker’s Top Lead Legal Advisors and the firm is one of the world’s Top Patent Firms. Patton Boggs reported nearly $41 million in lobbying revenue in 2009

They changed the wording some from when I read it three years ago but you can still read between the lines.

Patton Boggs is based in Washington DC, where the firm has been a leading member of the business and legal communities since our founding here in 1962. Long recognized as the nation’s leading public policy law firm, Patton Boggs was a pioneer in merging public policy expertise with traditional legal practice. Today, professionals in our Washington office are recognized internationally for their in-depth knowledge of how government works, their strong, bipartisan relationships with policy makers, and their skill as advocates for their clients... www.pattonboggs.com...

It is really amazing the tangles one finds when one starts pulling on a string.

reply to post by poet1b

...I think that one of the things that people have forgotten is that small businesses formed their own trade guilds. Those looking to start small businesses in these tough times might want to take an example from the past, and look on strengthening small business associations, and see if they can be formed once again into formidable forces capable of dealing with this assault being carried out against the average person by huge institutions.....

What an excellent IDEA! I will pass it along. You see a bit of it happening already with internet groups formed around an occupation or groups like R-Calf and Farm-to-Consumer who are small business people banding together to bring class action suits against the government.

Your idea dove tails quite nicely with one my hubby and I have been knocking around. I sure hope it flys and takes a large chunk out of the Arse of the Corporations.

I also ran across this info from back in 2007-8 it is from 1997 before the World Trade Organization made everything ten times worse.

The world's top 500 companies, it seems, employ 0.05 per cent of the world's population but control a quarter of the world's economic output.

The combined assets of the 50 biggest companies is now 60 per cent of the world's Dollars 20 trillion of productive capital.

In eight sectors, including cars, aerospace, electronics, steel, armaments and media, the top five corporations now control 50 per cent of the global market.

Increasingly the question is: who governs them? And for whom? Ten corporations now control nearly every aspect of the world's food chain. Four control 90 per cent of the world's exports of corn, wheat, tobacco, tea, pineapple, jute and forest products. www.guardian.co.uk...

It is truly frightening isn't it?

reply to post by poet1b


The Renaissance and more specifically the protestant movement have always seemed as though an enigma, IMHO.
It must always be remembered that the renaissance, although the product of reason and logic, was officially sanctioned by the Roman Catholic Church.

We would still be burning at the stake for thinking that the world is not the center of the universe if it were not for the official change of doctrine by the church.
I suppose that the point that I am trying to make here is that nothing happens with open acceptance without the approval of TPTB.

Here is a little nugget of newly changed religious doctrine that might interest some people. It essentially is a new doctrine that states that the Jews are not necessarily "technically" responsible for the crucifixion of Jesus....

Now, by this point, you guys should know that I am no Christian, but this is a perfect example of religion setting social standards.

Now onto Martin Luther....
He was a member of the Rose and the Cross. A secret society that, if one was to the Proto's Rome thread, is said to be tied to Rome.

Could the the entire point of the protestant reformation be the creation Caesar's 13th brigade?
The brigade designed for world domination, and it would be called THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA?

I suppose what I am trying to get at is, more or less, the topic of this thread...

Yes, the printing press did lead to the translation of the bible into a language accessible by the commoner.
And yes that did lead to the protestant reformation, which then lead to the creation of America.

But who is to say that the Catholic Church didn't want this to happen. Like a Trojan Horse.

Kind of like the internet.

Originally posted by Josephus23
reply to post by poet1b

 

The Renaissance and more specifically the protestant movement have always seemed as though an enigma, IMHO.
It must always be remembered that the renaissance, although the product of reason and logic, was officially sanctioned by the Roman Catholic Church.

We would still be burning at the stake for thinking that the world is not the center of the universe if it were not for the official change of doctrine by the church.
I suppose that the point that I am trying to make here is that nothing happens with open acceptance without the approval of TPTB.


Here is a little nugget of newly changed religious doctrine that might interest some people. It essentially is a new doctrine that states that the Jews are not necessarily "technically" responsible for the crucifixion of Jesus....

Now, by this point, you guys should know that I am no Christian, but this is a perfect example of religion setting social standards.

Now onto Martin Luther....
He was a member of the Rose and the Cross. A secret society that, if one was to the Proto's Rome thread, is said to be tied to Rome.

Could the the entire point of the protestant reformation be the creation Caesar's 13th brigade?
The brigade designed for world domination, and it would be called THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA?

I suppose what I am trying to get at is, more or less, the topic of this thread...

Yes, the printing press did lead to the translation of the bible into a language accessible by the commoner.
And yes that did lead to the protestant reformation, which then lead to the creation of America.

But who is to say that the Catholic Church didn't want this to happen. Like a Trojan Horse.

Kind of like the internet.

edit on 3/8/2011 by Josephus23 because: (no reason given)

In his recent book, Pope Benedict XXVI attempts to end anti-Semitism and placate the Jews by literally "pontificating" that the Jewish people during the Crucifixion, and now, bear no guilt for the death of Christ. Only a tiny minority representing the Jewish leaders and a vocal minority, Benedict asserts, were ever blameworthy. ADL's Abe Foxman congratulates the Pope: "Pope Benedict has rejected the previous teachings and perversions that have helped to foster and reinforce anti-Semitism through the centuries. The fact that this Pope is a theologian, and has served as a defender of the faith, makes this statement from the Holy See that much more significant for now and for future generations...."

sounds to me like the Pope is "buttering-up" the public for a possible "Jewish" involvement in the M.E. and N. Africa areas !!

A Judea/Christian coalition perhaps ??

again, the TIMING of statements is suspicious .... and amusing! IMHO