New Agers are the False Prophets of Revelations

For starters, the difference between christianity-based and new-age based religions is hundreds of years of dogma and practice passed-down through the years or centuries. Alot of Christianity's dogma is based on parabolic analogy and logos, if you think hard enough, you'll see that information was very hard to come by back then, since many were illiterate and the only connection people had was by word and since many had different languages, they used "logos" or signs and symbols. This is one of the main reasons the eastern roman empire fell at Constantinople, they fell into idol worship. This is much like your "glossed-up" photoshopped avatar of yourself you use on Facebook; it doesn't look like you, but only a "gussied-up" version of you as a "logos,' for other people to see. IF they saw you in person, you'd not be recognized. Kinda like and "idol?"

IN all religions, there are many things which are truth and some dogmatic parts which are pulled and pieced together from other pagan origins and adopted into the religion and it becomes canon. Isn't it ironic that all of these have some common thread way back in the ancient times? Think about it, would you reveal that a religion has common roots in some pagan ritualistic practice? But truth is truth, no matter how much you pile on the "dogma." Pun intended.

Originally posted by Student X

Originally posted by SeekerofTruth101There are no esoteric teachings in the messages sent by our Creator. The words are in plain view for all to see.

J
"The Christian of the future will be a mystic or he will not exist." -Karl Rahner

edit on 24-1-2011 by Student X because: (no reason given)

OMG you know the difference between "Exoteric" and "Esoteric" wow that is worth a star.

Sorry Karl Rahner is wrong. The mystic by dint of his own experiences runs the risk of leaving the congregationalists far behind and will incur their wrath for they are a wrathful people. Many mystics reach the stage where their journey become like crossing wide stream whilst putting your own stepping stones in place ahead of you. It can be a lonely path.

Originally posted by tiger5

Originally posted by Student X

Originally posted by SeekerofTruth101There are no esoteric teachings in the messages sent by our Creator. The words are in plain view for all to see.

J
"The Christian of the future will be a mystic or he will not exist." -Karl Rahner

edit on 24-1-2011 by Student X because: (no reason given)

OMG you know the difference between "Exoteric" and "Esoteric" wow that is worth a star.

Sorry Karl Rahner is wrong. The mystic by dint of his own experiences runs the risk of leaving the congregationalists far behind and will incur their wrath for they are a wrathful people. Many mystics reach the stage where their journey become like crossing wide stream whilst putting your own stepping stones in place ahead of you. It can be a lonely path.

Sometime, it can mean standing in the middle of a river and waiting on the next "stepping-stone" to "appear;" They don't just "pop-up" like magic, it's a serendipitous and the process enjoys many epiphanies along the way, but don't wear your good Sunday shoes, because you're going to get your feet wet. Sometime it can be months or years until the next "stepping-stone," but all of this really depends on "how badly" a person wishes to understand the mysteries of G_d, and if they have an open-mind and heart. If you have these last two things, then the process can proceed very quickly, and in certain circumstances, can go very quickly as fast as human thought.

reply to post by prepared4truth

I would like to know if anybody agrees or disagrees with this statement and provide reasons why. How would this make you feel if you were accused by a Christian of being the Anti-Christ?

Happened to me.....

Was basically indoctrinized by Western styled Evangelical Christianity ...studied for 14 months, got baptized .....then after the baptism ......all types of Mystical experiences started happening to me, off and on ego deaths, being Blinded by the inner light like Saul/Paul, transcendence, timelessness, Dark Night of the Soul, etc etc.

Then when going back to the Church and questioning the pastors, theologians, highly accredited theologian authors who run Christian Universities ....NOT a single one of them knew what I was talking about as far as direct experiences.....

I was shown that the majority of Western Xtianity is being run by a bunch of Psuedo-Intellectual know-hows who know the Bible intellectually ...but not experientially. It made me sick to my stomach to find that out and in my endeavor to ask and question everything ...I was basically rejected by the leaders of those churches.

However I did find that the hermits, monks, and mystics who spent lots of time in comtemplation ...they got it, they knew, they experienced God directly beyond words.

I asked everything. Even saw that possibly the Gnostics had alot of it right. Saw that the Gospel of Thomas was true and was left out of the Bible. Coincidentally it is so far the oldest of all NT gospels and in it one can find many connections to other philosophies/religions.

I also found that many New Agers also have the knowledge of certain pieces of truth that may not be in the Bible.

Bottom line for me is that Jesus was dumbing it down to the Jews, talking cryptically and using symbols. It took me mystical direct experiences, studying all other religions including New Agers, studying philosophy, NDE's, and lots of meditation for it to finally make sense.

The biggest thing these days for me that Christianity lacks is a proper knowledge of psychology, ego death, knowing the self, how you operate and why and the lack of being able to question and use critical thinking.

And I still consider myself a Christian ...albeit a mystical one.

Originally posted by Student X
Just saying that doesn't make it so. Especially when I can provide passages from the Bible that indicate otherwise. What is plain for all to see, is that there is secret Wisdom in the Bible:

"Behold, you delight in truth in the inward being, and you teach me wisdom in the secret heart." Psalm 51:6

"But we impart a secret and hidden wisdom of God, which God decreed before the ages for our glory." 1 Corinthians 2:7

I have not made any money from my studies of esoterica, or from my studies of the fields of comparative mysticism-religion-mythology which I consider a necessary component of esoteric understanding. So I guess my life puts the lie to your words, since I don't seek to profit. I only seek Divine Wisdom.

For some the exoteric layer is good enough. It is there for a reason - not everyone can be a mystic. Its a full-time job, and there are other jobs that need doing. So it makes sense that there would be an exoteric layer for the man-on-the-street.

But now we are living in the age of information. Cross-cultural comparison and analysis is possible in a systematic and deep way, and it has shown that esoteric currents flow under the surface of world religion and myth. The only valid way to interpret a sacred text is in that light.

Face up to it. The exoteric layer is corrupted by fundamentalism and the esoteric layer is coming to light. God can help you to make the transition.

"The Christian of the future will be a mystic or he will not exist." -Karl Rahner

edit on 24-1-2011 by Student X because: (no reason given)

Sigh.... You see and read and still yet not comprehend. Who wrote Psalms or Corinthians that you qouted? Was it the direct word of our Creator? No, it is only the words of a mortal, nevertheless, a flawed mortal that we all humans are. It is the writer's perception and praise, but NOT the word or teachings from our Creator or His divine messengers.

I am sure you will now attempt to find His words to justify your stances, and I could easily do it for you. But that is not the point of comprehension, nor 'do I say it is so' and becomes my imposition to your beliefs.

All I ask of you is to this time, read and attempt to comprehend what the sacred book tells you, those words from our Creator. Simply that, and do not attempt to use your own preconcieved notions from the cynical world around us to cloud your judgement, and in the end, it will lead to a better understanding of our Heavenly Father, whom will never and had never abandon us, unless we are absolutely unworthy and many a times we are at that stage.

I, an insignificant nobody cares not if you profit or not, for just like me, are nobodies. Those that I am concern with are those who in a position to influence a large majority of the people, and that is a danger if gifted free will is abused.

Unlearn to learn, if it is the truth you seek. Walk before you learn to run, inorder to seek for divine wisdom, and it all lays in the sacred book, with the heart to find, on free will, easily understood if you truly seek.

Mysticism is an exclusive domain for an initiated few. But fortunately, the sacred book had never dwelt in mysticism, all is in plain sight for EVERYONE to know, is transparent so that none would be left behind. It had always been the intention of the sacred book by the grace of our Creator. Any mysticism is purely man made egoistically, and that trait is never meant for humans, for we have nothing to be egoistical about when compared to the wonders of the billion years old Universe.

Originally posted by SeekerofTruth101

Originally posted by Student X
Just saying that doesn't make it so. Especially when I can provide passages from the Bible that indicate otherwise. What is plain for all to see, is that there is secret Wisdom in the Bible:

"Behold, you delight in truth in the inward being, and you teach me wisdom in the secret heart." Psalm 51:6

"But we impart a secret and hidden wisdom of God, which God decreed before the ages for our glory." 1 Corinthians 2:7

I have not made any money from my studies of esoterica, or from my studies of the fields of comparative mysticism-religion-mythology which I consider a necessary component of esoteric understanding. So I guess my life puts the lie to your words, since I don't seek to profit. I only seek Divine Wisdom.

For some the exoteric layer is good enough. It is there for a reason - not everyone can be a mystic. Its a full-time job, and there are other jobs that need doing. So it makes sense that there would be an exoteric layer for the man-on-the-street.

But now we are living in the age of information. Cross-cultural comparison and analysis is possible in a systematic and deep way, and it has shown that esoteric currents flow under the surface of world religion and myth. The only valid way to interpret a sacred text is in that light.

Face up to it. The exoteric layer is corrupted by fundamentalism and the esoteric layer is coming to light. God can help you to make the transition.

"The Christian of the future will be a mystic or he will not exist." -Karl Rahner

edit on 24-1-2011 by Student X because: (no reason given)

Sigh.... You see and read and still yet not comprehend. Who wrote Psalms or Corinthians that you qouted? Was it the direct word of our Creator? No, it is only the words of a mortal, nevertheless, a flawed mortal that we all humans are. It is the writer's perception and praise, but NOT the word or teachings from our Creator or His divine messengers.

But you must see the flaw in that logic right?

Christians claim that God spoke through the people who wrote these books, which is why they are in the Bible. They were divinely inspired and are parallel to God speaking these words to us.

Yet on another side of this coin, when issues like these are pointed out, people tend to say "It was written by man, what do you expect?"

So which is it?

My truth isn't necessarily your truth, nor is buddha's truth necassarily my truth or your truth...etc etc...that doesn't mean any of us are the anichrist.

reply to post by SeekerofTruth101

Any mysticism is purely man made egoistically, and that trait is never meant for humans, for we have nothing to be egoistical about when compared to the wonders of the billion years old Universe.

I couldn't possibly ever in my whole life on this planet disagree more with the above statement.

More than anything, I wanted to know God, to be like Christ, read the Bible, had friends in all different religions ....but what happened to me from reading the Bible and being Baptized was that I was thrusted into mystical realities. A mystic cannot choose to be a mystic ...it is something that God applies to a person as a natural spiritual state.

In these states I saw the possibility and glimpses of complete Ego death (Not I but Christ in me). Was shown things I cannot even speak of, things that the average Joe wouldn't believe.

True Mysticism is the furthest thing I can possibly conceive of from "Man made egotism." Mysticism is the true and natural state of the Spiritual realm, where time is seen as non-existent, where infinity is seen to be alive, where the ego itself slowly comes to a eventual and final complete death.

Oh and Student X's quote here:

"The Christian of the future will be a mystic or he will not exist." -Karl Rahner

Has to be in my experience one of the greatest Christian Truths that exists today. Exotericism only gets one so far and is just the emperors clothes. We can read about God ...or experience God. I'd rather experience directly that which most only read and speculate about.

The Versions of Christianity we see today are dying ..... and what will remain when those deaths occur is that a few true Christian Mystics will remain and they will be the torch bearers of Truth when everything around falls apart.

I came into this thread hoping to read an intellectual debate and although there was some healthy debate, it was mostly vile and underhanded comments made towards people who don't share the same beliefs.

Can people not agree to disagree? Attacking someone's belief system is not the way to get your opinion across. Religious intolerance is the world's biggest problem and I expected more from the fine members of ATS.

Originally posted by SeekerofTruth101
All I ask of you is to this time, read and attempt to comprehend what the sacred book tells you, those words from our Creator.

I am at home in the sacred texts of all the world, as a student of comparative religion and comparative mysticism. So I turn your request back on you, and ask that you give the comparative fields a chance. Spend the rest of the year studying them without fear and asking God for guidance as you do. I recommend that you start with the classic The Hero with a Thousand Faces by Joseph Campbell.

reply to post by Student X


Well I like Thich Naht Hahn's work on Anger. I think nowadays we have such an opportunity to study widely and deeply it is shamefull not to explore it. For years I had tried to understand the phenomenon of Anger but for some reason one book explained it for me. We must also acknowledge that which resonates with our being and incorporate it into our being and practice.

It may not work for anyone else. That is because we are different people in some ways.

reply to post by tiger5


I'm not familiar with his work; thanks for bringing him to my attention.

Originally posted by hawkiye
I find most exoteric fundamentalist Christians (I sometimes call them modern traditional Christians) hang thier hats on certain passages of scripture dogmatically interpreted as black and white by some pastor or perceived leader.

I do see many more people rejecting dogmatic religions and more willing to step outside the box. There is still a lot of Piscean energy left in the churches though. It will take time to dissipate. In the mean time we can lead by example. Saturn X's post was a great example IMO.

I just noticed I said "Saturn X" When I meant "Student X" I though his first post was a good example to set for all of us. Just wanted to make that correction.

reply to post by hawkiye


Saturn X has a nice ring to it...no pun intended

Thank you for your kind words!

reply to post by prepared4truth


This is the age of Revelation or at least some believe so, myself included. Revealing mysteries is the name of the game as this is the time of get on board or be left behind.

Moreover, what type of secrets are you talking about? What secrets should be concealed?


Regards

reply to post by Abovo


There are no secrets, only Truth.

But the truths hiding behind the symbolic works of men is another thread entirely.

Originally posted by prepared4truth
reply to post by Abovo

 

There are no secrets, only Truth.

But the truths hiding behind the symbolic works of men is another thread entirely.

Never give a sword to a man who can't dance.~Confucius

reply to post by prepared4truth


People will not be able to handle the Truth! When this is released to the general public, it will cause the biggest spiritual war ever known to man.

All religions will not be able to accept the fact that their interpretation of faith is wrong when actually, they are all correct by believeing in a higher energy or spiritual power of positive energy inside us all.

Certain elite bloodlines and lodges such as the freemasons and stonemasons have had the true knowledge hidden away from man to achieve the system we all operate under today. There are many secret symbols used for this case from dimensions of certain structures to citys.

Humans have achieved this by the ethic of working hard to support themself and family and helping eachother which is the positive aspect of our spiritual self. Law in all societys is required to assist the innocent and convict the guilty as well as making money for all nations.

The true prophets will know exactly what system we operate under but not be a member of any sect which the information was given by passed generations.

We all operate under the triangular or pyramid operation where the top supports the bottom in direction and the bottom support the top in labour. All human systems operate under this from captains of sporting teams to Kings, Queens, Presidents, Primeministers, Generals of Armys ect which lead the bottom of the triangle which is the general public.

This formation is exactly how money has be formed world wide by the law of Land and Law of the Sea. Law of the Land is each individual countrys law while Law of the Sea is International waters which no seperate country owns. Law of the sea is how nations became able to trade with eachother for the goods they produce. Banks received their name from the Banks of the Sea or rivers where individual private familys that owned the land of the banks of their country began trade for the people of their country. This started the money sector for the produce which we created.

Numbers are in everything we do and are the universal language of us all. Sunworship is where humans first recieved the knowledge of time by calender rotation of earth around the Sun.

The bible states that the serpent tempted humans with knowledge and information by the passages of Adam and Eve. This was in the Garden of Eden which is Earths domain.

Everything in life from trees, plants, animals and humans all require the external element of Fire to live. This is based by the fire triangle which is Fuel, Heat and Oxygen. Every living land or sea creature requires these three elements to survive. This is the negative of life which is why we need law while the positive is our life bringing element of water! Water is our internal positive energy of Mind, Heart & Soul which develops our spirit in learning.

A Positive and a Negative creates fire. This is Satans domain where he tempted man here in Eden. We are all living batterys in life. This is natural.

Frankly the 500lb gorilla in the middle of this argument is that churchgoers are what I would call totalitarians. I was going to write "thinkers" after "totalitarians" in the previous sentence but I do not feel that they think deeply, sensibly or compassionately. Anyway they have an uncritical "my way or go to hell" manner and act like they have Jesus on speed dial.

reply to post by prepared4truth


I agree with what you say; In my opinion New Agers, Christians and others impose their versions of "truth" on people of different belief systems as an attempt to help solidify the reasoning behind their belief or in a legitimate attempt to try and convert someone into following their own relative "truths".

What works for me must work for them right? More than likely the answer is "No" due to difference in such things upbringing, environmental stimulus, genes, social class and a myriad of other forces. I mean it's obvious that we're different from each other in terms of emotions. Why would we expect our belief system to work for someone else? Especially if we don't even know if it works for ourselves?

To me esoteric vs. exoteric is a false dichotomy. Is there no grey area or other avenues to explore?

The fact that we have so many religions, belief systems and philosophies shows that we are incapable of thinking outside our own realities and processes. We anthropomorphize things we cannot possibly comprehend in hopes of putting a label on something we'll never know.

NiNjA