Sun wheels, fire chariots and winged discs

Originally posted by Jason88
reply to post by Pimander

 

Thank you for the explanation.
(snip)
Then, these pictures the OP provides depicted man's intimate understanding of these vast, complicated concepts (snip) That each is progressing by possessing this knowledge. Does that make sense?

I do think that the possession of a knowledge of the heavens and how to use it to navigate, survey, grow crops, time births etc. is fundamental to becoming civilised. That is why these symbols are found wherever we find civilisation, as they are the trade mark symbols of a leadership who could create a civilisation (for the reasons I give briefly above and at the top of page 3).

However, that is not to say that some of the winged disks and chariots do not represent (sometimes in composite with what I described) literal craft or lights in the sky etc. That idea has some merit and is difficult to dismiss. However they definitely do have other profound symbolic meanings and to ignore those makes us look foolish to anyone who understands that.

As for advanced civilisations from before 10 000 years ago - how can that be dismissed. We can't be sure as we have almost no data. We didn't even know of all current civilisations until the last several hundred years. We only know of 10% of the species in existence now.

If tomorrow there were a cataclysmic ice age caused by comet impact (tsunamis and earthquakes, volcanic dust and century long winter triggering cooler climate) then there was floods as the ice melted destroying even the ruins of most cities then what would be left after say 10 000 years? What if we were nearly wiped out.

If 12000 years later a new civilisation did a hundred random digs of earth and encountered modern man, they would almost certainly only hit agricultural or wilderness areas and conclude that we are a simple agricultural civilisation with a penchant for the ritual offering of plastic fetishes to a hungry god (rubbish tips and the non-biodegradable plastics which will still be around). There would be traces and clues of what we once were. There would be myths and traditions. However sceptics, educated to believe that they are the pinnacle of evolution and therefore their civilisation the greatest ever, would not accept small clues. They may would probably win the argument but would be wrong in their assumptions.

reply to post by Skyfloating


This is another great thread from you!

However, some questions come to mind:

What does the number 8 represent?

If your theory is correct, why do you suspect the gods left Earth?

Has anyone considered that gyroscopes, the flower of life, and these sun dials are all likely related? It seems like many of the UFO accounts (if you believe them) even include what amounts to be a large gyroscope/wheel spinning silently to power the craft.

Here's an interesting patent on gyroscopic levitation:
Gyroscopic Levitation

Someone please check out my post on here and make it a thread quick!

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Of course SUN wheels will be all over the world, because everybody can see the SUN. Anyone who thinks that these represent alien spacecraft and not the sun is dumber than a rock.

reply to post by Skyfloating

Very, very interesting topic (even tho I've only read the 1st page so far!) A memory of an image in DC keeps nagging at me. It's a traffic circle- a particular one. For some reason, the Vatican pic on the first page reminded me of it. While searching for it, I did come across a couple you may find interesting.

www.alaskaroundabouts.com...

And, this one... creapily looks like an all-seeing eye incorporated into a cross and a circle:
publicorgtheory.files.wordpress.com...

The google image preview for the next one states: "

" It occupies a traffic circle on the wide east-west boulevard Thanon"

Don't even know where this is, but the name "Thanon" reminds me of some of the other names you thew out for review in your opening post. Oh, and check out the oblisk and wing-looking sculptures in the center of it! Link to pic: Click Here!

Speaking of obelisks, the google image preview for the next one states: "This is the oldest Egyptian obelisk..." but my search terms were exactly this: washington dc traffic circle. The preview pic shows a guy standing next to an obelisk that has totem pole looking carving on one face. It appears to be out in the middle of nowhere... no traffic circle in sight, and it's Egypt- not Washington, DC like specified in search string. I know google's not perfect, but did it have to error by returning an obelisk in Egypt vs. traffic circle in Washington, DC? Just Hmmm, that's all. Link: Click Here.

Or just type my same search string into google: washington dc traffic circle
There are too many oddities to note, in terms of the statues in the center and/or 8 roads connecting to the circle. I'll take up 4 pages of your thread if I keep this up...

Originally posted by Kandinsky
Hiya Sky. No doubt the thread will generate scores of flags and an overwhelming level of agreement with the notion that all these symbols were flying devices and space craft.

Naturally, I'm opposed to the idea of ancient astronauts or even 'lost advanced technology.' We have no evidence of the infrastructure needed to build machines at any point or location in ancient history. Things that fly need engines or power sources. They need metal presses, steel and alloy foundries, lathes, and machines to build nuts, bolts and washers. They need factories of one size or other. Another point is that the civilisation that creates them would need to face great catastrophe in order to lose the machines and all that knowledge. Your contention would need earth-shattering events that removed the knowledge from all the civilisations you suggest had these machines. Such a series of events, spread across continents and a period of some thousands of years would need to erase all the evidence and then erase evidence of itself.

Alternatively, the objects and symbols in your images are actually what they are claimed to be...sun symbols. The sun has always been very important to humans, being both a source of heat and way of measuring time and seasons. As we developed agriculturally, it also grew in importance. It's no surprise that we have tried to capture the qualities of the sun in objects and images. A lot of these have become stylised and specific to regions and cultures. The 'winged disc' was shared by Egyptians, Assyrians and the Sumerians with the wings representing the vaults of the skies iirc.

I guess the 'abridged version' of my argument is this; either we were flying around in stuff for thousands of years or these symbols are representations of the Sun.

a valid point but your logic only takes into account technology as we understand physics and an assumption that there isnt a suppression of ancient technology. its a very narrow view of reality. one that leaves no room for error.

And Jesus Christ as the Sun God if it has not been already posted:

stellarhousepublishing.com...

But there has been a sun wheel on the sun itself this summer:

www.spaceweather.com...

reply to post by tim3lord

a valid point but your logic only takes into account technology as we understand physics and an assumption that there isnt a suppression of ancient technology. its a very narrow view of reality. one that leaves no room for error.

Maybe, there's a margin for error in a later post I made.

If we have to use the possibility of a global cover-up to prop up a position, I tend to assume it's in error. Further to that, there's never been a reasonable explanation, in my opinion, for an elaborate suppression of 'ancient technology.'

We've had 40 years of Cold War hostility, political unrest in Latin America, conflict in North Africa etc. Is it reasonable to believe that in the midst of all this, they are colluding in a cover-up? Can they all be sharing a secret?

Or is it more reasonable to accept our currently held view of history (say from ~3000BC) is broadly accurate and that 'flying machines' arrived with the Montgolfier brothers?

Originally posted by Kandinsky
Hiya Sky. No doubt the thread will generate scores of flags and an overwhelming level of agreement with the notion that all these symbols were flying devices and space craft.

Naturally, I'm opposed to the idea of ancient astronauts or even 'lost advanced technology.' We have no evidence of the infrastructure needed to build machines at any point or location in ancient history. Things that fly need engines or power sources. They need metal presses, steel and alloy foundries, lathes, and machines to build nuts, bolts and washers. They need factories of one size or other. Another point is that the civilisation that creates them would need to face great catastrophe in order to lose the machines and all that knowledge. Your contention would need earth-shattering events that removed the knowledge from all the civilisations you suggest had these machines. Such a series of events, spread across continents and a period of some thousands of years would need to erase all the evidence and then erase evidence of itself.

Alternatively, the objects and symbols in your images are actually what they are claimed to be...sun symbols. The sun has always been very important to humans, being both a source of heat and way of measuring time and seasons. As we developed agriculturally, it also grew in importance. It's no surprise that we have tried to capture the qualities of the sun in objects and images. A lot of these have become stylised and specific to regions and cultures. The 'winged disc' was shared by Egyptians, Assyrians and the Sumerians with the wings representing the vaults of the skies iirc.

I guess the 'abridged version' of my argument is this; either we were flying around in stuff for thousands of years or these symbols are representations of the Sun.

Actually it's more than possible that much of what we look for in regards to technology did get destroyed. We had a global flood/ cataclysm that happened at least 10,000 BC (most likely longer). If you wiki or google the great deluge myth you will find out that almost every culture have a cataclysm story that involves the flooding of their known world. Remember during the ice age, the ice sheets where massive, in Canada it was the thickest by about 2 miles thick sheet of ice. Where New York is located, the ice sheet was at least 1 mile thick. With that much ice the world oceans where lower by350 to 450 feet (I think it was alot lower). I've discussed this last year on other posts about finding an ocean level software on certain websites. This way you can see how much land was around when just 400 feet of water was pulled away from the ocean. And with all cultures they tend to build close to large bodies of water. So during the Ice Age melt it could have sharply increased the deph of the ocean and put many of what we are lookikng for under the water for at least 10,000 yearsss.

reply to post by hoghead cheese

Actually it's more than possible that much of what we look for in regards to technology did get destroyed. We had a global flood/ cataclysm that happened at least 10,000 BC (most likely longer).

I've no doubt a lot of our history is submerged; but disagree about a 'global flood.' Sure, the sea has risen and regional flood events are a familiar act of nature to this day. The thing is, those rising sea levels could only be cataclysmic if people remained still for a couple of hundred years whilst it lapped around their ankles.

We'd also need to account for why there's no inland evidence for these cultures/civilisations/aliens and their flying machines. A flash flood or tsunami can reap devastation on an area (Katrina?), but it isn't wiped from the face of the Earth. New Orleans is still there and so is the West Coast of Sumatra.

I think I posted a less than polite reply to one of your posts early this year? It was to do with the pyramids. I apologise completely for the tone of that reply.

reply to post by this_is_who_we_are


The bible also states that at the end of time,"every person will be like an eagle in the sky" that doesnt have to mean they are litterally in the sky,that just means they are free now.

Originally posted by Pimander
The idea many ancient priesthoods was that to perfect himself (they were mainly male unfortunately), man needed to be in balance with the universe which was symbolicallyy at the centre of the wheel of the heavens like the sun. Yes they knew the sun was at the centre thousands of years ago, which is obvious if you look at Helios (sun god) in the centre of those zodiacs. That is why the symbol for the self (freemasons will know this symbol) and the symbol for the sun are the same (i.e. the circle with a point at the centre)

So you see that the sun is mythically and symbolically interwoven with the concept of the vast wheel of the heavens - which it appears to move through, yet is also paradoxically at the centre of.

.

This is a theory to consider. I like it a lot, even though it contradicts my OP. I can see how a priests Self-Realization is symbolized as a point at the center of the wheel.

Originally posted by DreamerOracle
I decided to do a little digging on the Vatican and found this:

Good find, especially the part about the "noble race" which very much ties into what the Chinese, Ancient Egyptians and others say about the "Gods" and their descendants (and which is probably the reason Hitler - deeming his own race "noble" - was interested.

If you look up the famous St. Peters Dome in the Vatican you will see a Sun-Wheel right at its center...

Just to add...

In 1901, divers working off the Greek island of Antikythera found the remains of a 2,000-year-old clocklike mechanism. Now in the Greek National Archaeological Museum, the extraordinary find is a complex assembly of twenty or more precision gears designed to compute the motions of the Sun, Moon and planets.

Seems as if this consistent device shows proof that our early ancestors weren't as stupid as we truly think.

Source

Originally posted by Kandinsky
reply to post by tim3lord

 

a valid point but your logic only takes into account technology as we understand physics and an assumption that there isnt a suppression of ancient technology. its a very narrow view of reality. one that leaves no room for error.

Maybe, there's a margin for error in a later post I made.

If we have to use the possibility of a global cover-up to prop up a position, I tend to assume it's in error. Further to that, there's never been a reasonable explanation, in my opinion, for an elaborate suppression of 'ancient technology.'

We've had 40 years of Cold War hostility, political unrest in Latin America, conflict in North Africa etc. Is it reasonable to believe that in the midst of all this, they are colluding in a cover-up? Can they all be sharing a secret?

Or is it more reasonable to accept our currently held view of history (say from ~3000BC) is broadly accurate and that 'flying machines' arrived with the Montgolfier brothers?

again reasonable logic to question the lid placed on information pertaining to possible advanced technology cover ups. there are a couple of problems i foresee with the premise there there is NO suppression of the truth.

too many unexplained megalithic structures and their construction. The level of workmanship IN MY OPINION far supersedes anything they could have accomplished with the SUPPOSED level of technological advancement of the time. Not to mention the myriad of OOPARTS i know, i know some are hoax's some have been explained. but only 1 needs to be right for the whole house of cards to come crashing down.

in regards to rogue states not revealing the true history of the world it might be that only a select few people have access to the real information. most 3rd world politicians and banana republic statesmen are more interested in lining their own pockets than revealing any truth to the mass populace. why would they care if know the truth or not. they want to manipulate the masses just as much as Uncle TOM. they just dont have the resources to do so. You think wars, political assassinations, terrorism and all the rest of this theatrical garbage is anything more than a facade to keep you distracted kill you and make money off you? seriously? Governments have the freedoms of its people in mind? My friend they fear us more than we fear them. by them i mean the people in power. i would suggest that the so called elite are survivors of whatever previous civilizations existed before the flood. So to answer your question yes i do believe the government or rather the people in power do collude to keep the masses in the dark only because the truth would destroy the illusion they have worked so hard to maintain.

This is all theory based on my own research into the subject and by no means is it a concrete picture of whats going on. as with anything there is major disinformation diffused into the truth to sidetrack the real issues and truth. BUT the fact remains no matter how much things change THEY ALWAYS REMAIN THE SAME. power shifts hands countries take turns being the big dog but humanity is forever guided along the likes of greed and power. despite the common mans desire to live a free and peaceful existence we have been warring and killing each other since as far back as history goes. you can say this is the nature of man but i would suggest it is the nature that has been bred into us. i have no desire to kill anybody nor do i have the desire to take someones house or land. people are sheep and we have herd mentality tall poppies are quickly taken care of unless they uphold or promote the status quo. in the light of everything going on now with wikileaks there is no way in hell you can tell me things are not being suppressed.

i could go on for days and days but i would only be going around in circles. the truth is none of us knows the truth and thats the way it will remain untill they drop the ball or decide to end this game. i dont see them releasing the noose they have over our heads voluntarily so my only hope is that they will drop the ball and we will free ourselves. But i look around and see a sea of zombies brain dead and loyal to the game. and i shudder....

reply to post by Skyfloating


Sorry for replying before I read your thread, I am just glad to see a new thread from you and want to say thanks for the early Christmas present!!

It's so obvious they were trying to worship the 'UFO', because to them the UFO would look like a being of God because of its technology was cosmically superior to anything in them days and they still are to this day.

If the Wright brothers didn't invent flying we would of still looked at UFO's as the same importance as the ancient man did.

This is a bit off topic but i believe Jesus was an alien. His intelligence would of astonished the simple folk of his time, so much they wanted to document his words(bible).

reply to post by Skyfloating


It seems that the four corners of the sun wheel in some way represent the four corners of the Earth. It's all how you interpret it.