Why do you hate the God of the Bible?

What? I dont get that last post, but thats quite alright. ill continue anyways.

Enron- you seem to be an interesting character for only been only for such a short time. What are your views on Satan? DL saracasticaly brought it up but now Ima ctually interested. So...thoughts?

Originally posted by Scat

Sin didnt cause Jesus' death, getting caught did! PLus, I mean this completely unoffensively, most Christians really just subconciously accept Jesus for that exact reason! all these churches today say "ACCEPT JESUS AND YOULL GO TO HEAVEN!" so people think...hey...i can do whatever i want but if i love jesus......hey i can be a total jerk..but if i love jesus.....etc etc etc. maybe not out loud, or even conciously, but when somebody promises somethng like heaven, people begin to get greedy.


When Jesus was born he was wrapped in strips of cloth. This was a foreshadowing of the death He came for. At His death He was wrapped in strips of cloth too.

I totally agree that many say they believe in Jesus and then do whatever they want to and think they have "escaped" hell and will get to heaven.

I'm here to say you can't fool God, He knows who really means it. And words are backed up by motives in a real christians life.

Also this debate becomes "heated" by people. I'm trying to give an alternative to some views of why The God of the Bible is hated. It's because He is not known correctly that I would like a discussion.

Originally posted by dlbrandt
When Jesus was born he was wrapped in strips of cloth. This was a foreshadowing of the death He came for. At His death He was wrapped in strips of cloth too.

Yes discussions are nice. But you asked us why we dont like the God protrayed in the bIble. We are giving the answers. SO heres another one of mine. What you said right there is why. Because in real life, there are no motifs, no themes, no plot diagrams, no literary devices. Foreshadowing just happens to be one of those literary devices. That, to me (being a writer and all) just enforces that the Bible is a story, a BOOK! No more! Not Gods word because it is humans word. And people killing each other in the name of some God created by a humans book is a slander to the name of my true God.

The slavery I was tlaking about was literal and phsyical, not mental and spiritual. My God of course loves men and women the same. The one in the bible does not. Why? Becaue men wrote the bible and at that time, women were slaves

I was talking about literal slavery too.

And I hope I state this point like I mean. Women are treated badly in the Bible. But that doesn't mean that's how God views them or how He wanted it. It could be in there to get us irritated and show us how wrong it is.

I also mean when sin entered the human race, that distorted how we view each other and affects how we treat each other.

Wow, I never got a response to my opinion. And also, let me take a second to defend my friend Jonna, this has become quite the Chit Chat forum, I have noticed that if moved to BTS, it could lose its well needed publicity. ATS seems more active in my eyes, and many tend to post here instead to earn more points.

Now, I still believe that Christianity was meant to be taken as pure symbolisim and not literal, this is Christianities greatest folly and untill the Church realizes this and creates a better and more uniformed Christian doctrine, Christianity will be at the blunt end of debate and hatred.

As Jesus had once said, The Kindom of Heaven is within you, how hard is this to interpret? The same message can be seen in the east,

" I am Brahman....I dwell within all beings as the soul, the pure consciousness, the ground of all phenomena......
In the days of my ignorance, I used to think of these as being seperate from myself. Now I know that I am all ",
Sanskara.......


And once again in the west,

Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new" - 2 CORINTHIANS 5:17

Christians need to be more open minded to the ultimate Christos within....

Deep

Originally posted by Scatsatan is just evil within us. but then again, it might be as true as my god. id actually like to start a conversation about that, its interesting.

question- why was the thought of satan ever created? fear? or to show that god really does rule everything, even evil?

Thanks for the comment by the way Scat...Satan...hmmm - 1st off, like I said in a previous post, I'm on a spiritual journey of sorts...but I love the topic of religion, it fasinates me, so I try and absorb as much as possible.

To me, if I were a Christian, and even just speaking in a general sense, Satan is your negative belief values. Living in the south, I see racism like nobody's business - a clear example of someone who is lost...Satan takes no physical form...except for maybe this picture by Goya...I've always found it incrediblly disturbing - not just the consumption of flesh, but the lighting...Let me think about a few more things Scat and I'll post again

Originally posted by EnronOutrunHomerun
What about the people who are in it for their politcal advancement? Is Bush a true Christian by sending men and women (some who have doubts) to fight for "freedom" all over the globe.
.

I can't tell you for sure if Bush is really a christian or not. The only one who knows for sure is God, because He knows his motives and thoughts. As far as political advancement. He's at the top unless we get a president of the world, and then we are probably talking anti-christ stuff.

I do have an opinion, I don't agree with everything He's done and there are things he hasn't done that I think he should have.

That's a good arguement...I could get into Bush, but I won't...besides, I have "a few" posts out there already on him.
I know what he claims, but I don't see the support.

I must agree, Zero. First, this has become Chit Chat. And secondly- I support your view. I always believed Chritianity and the whole Bible should be viewed as symbolism. If only ifonly.....

DL- If i confused you, Im sorry. God as in the Bible is portrayed as discriminatory because the people who wrote it were in fact, discriminatory. Thats all I meant. And I firmly stand by it.

Zero- if you could get this thread moved, I know it would make alot of people less aggravated by our little debate. I wouldnt mind.Im sorry if we;ve caused trouble. I just get so worked up in these!

Nice enron! If you are intrigued by the lighting, you should definitely check out some Rembrandt, the lighting is similar and absolutely breathtaking. Your spiritual journey but fascination with religion is all too familiar to me, why else would I be constantly posting in this forum! ha! Your description of Satan sounds alot like mine would be, a "Lord of the FLies" standpoint, I might say. (if you havent read it then that makes no sense whatsoever!:lol

Now on the "flipside," as that term seems to be flying around alot in here, what are you views on demons? Exist? Same as the big man Satan? thoughts?

[edit on 7-2-04 by Scat]

Originally posted by ZeroDeep
Wow, I never got a response to my opinion.

As Jesus had once said, The Kindom of Heaven is within you, how hard is this to interpret? The same message can be seen in the east,

"

And once again in the west,

Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new" - 2 CORINTHIANS 5:17

Your question got lost in the barrage of posts, please ask again.

And as far as the kingdom of heaven being within us, and being a new creature in Christ. A christian is changed from the inside out, God changes our view of what is right and wrong and shows us the truth.

Now I suppose I made a "mistake" by saying truth. You certainly can chose to not believe that. I'm simply stating what I believe.

As Jesus had once said, The Kindom of Heaven is within you, how hard is this to interpret? The same message can be seen in the east,

" I am Brahman....I dwell within all beings as the soul, the pure consciousness, the ground of all phenomena......
In the days of my ignorance, I used to think of these as being seperate from myself. Now I know that I am all ",
Sanskara.......


And once again in the west,

Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new" - 2 CORINTHIANS 5:17

Christians need to be more open minded to the ultimate Christos within....

Deep

I have to admit - as an anthropologist, I love this statement's cultural signifience...

(if you havent read it then that makes no sense whatsoever!:lol

Now on the "flipside," as that term seems to be flying around alot in here, what are you views on demons? Exist? Same as the big man Satan? thoughts?

Then you may be upset - lol - one of the many books on my to-do list, but based off of this disscusion, I'll bump it up - I'm working on some light reading right now...Kafka - - I really am tho - lol

Like I said earlier - I might need a little more time to formulate my thoughts on "evil" - Not that I'm making it up as I go along, but I'd like to be true to myself so I can clarify things for me also...

First thoughts though? Maybe something more on the physical side...like people you can't stand, Jerry Falwell springs to mind - lol - people who are on this planet with a cleat mission to destroy all hope for cultural advancement...speaking of that - allow me to plug a post of mine that hasn't seen much action in that "approximate" areana - www.abovetopsecret.com...
Sorry - the chance was there and I couldn't resist..

BTW Scat - I love Rembrandt...to be honest, my favorite artists who utilizes lighting to its fullest potential - and actually is the defintion behind his technique is Carravagio

[edit on 7/2/2004 by EnronOutrunHomerun]

[edit on 7/2/2004 by EnronOutrunHomerun]

Originally posted by dlbrandt

And I hope I state this point like I mean. Women are treated badly in the Bible. But that doesn't mean that's how God views them or how He wanted it. It could be in there to get us irritated and show us how wrong it is.



I forgot something else I wanted to add to this post. In the Bible God used Deborah to deliver the Israelites once when a man refused to lead by himself. He also used used Esther to save the entire Jewish race. And he placed Rahab(a prostitute) and Tamar in the lineage of Jesus. He also honored Ruth (another outsider of the Jews) in the lineage of Christ. The mother and grandmother of Timothy are also praised for the impact they had on Timothy for Christ.

Sorry, but this is one thing I won't let go of. God loves men and women equally. Yes, that doesn't show up on the earth because WE tend to treat each other like dirt at times. But in eternity God's love for both will be proclaimed in truth.

enron- OHHH what movie is that from!!!!!!!!!!?!??!?!?!??!?!??!?!


light reading....light reading.....light reading...I CANT REMEMBER! i see the scene play out in my mind perfectly but i cant remember the title.

but back on- lordof the flies is extremely short and easy to read, but still a beautiful book. you can read it in two days. i did, then got a 95 on my final because of it. its great though- you really should read it! ill check out the thread

Scat
"Harry Potter" comes to mind - Harmione Granger's intense mental work out

Could be a Woody Allen or Mel Brookes line too...

Thats iT! Harry Potter!!!!

hahahha lovely!thanks a bunch, i was about to kill myself over that one

Originally posted by dlbrandtGod loves men and women equally.

I hope I'm not repeating previous posts here, b/c I try to stay out of specific details with regards to the Bible, given my inherint lack of precise memory...but was it not Eve who was responsible for casting Adam out of Eden

I know this is such a cliche arguement - but why not...

Well, being a Christian myself, I can sometimes understand why there is hatred for Christianity, the Bible. Believe me it fustrates me when people pretend to be really good and all that and when they're around their friends they generally act like bastards.

Here's a saying I find quite fair actually

Personally its not God I dislike, its his fan club I cant stand

[edit on 2-7-2004 by D]

That's an interesting and unique reply from a Christian - I assume you have a great deal of faith but with the obvious desire to question things - I respect that...if that means anything

Hopefully this post will not vanish into BTS, one of mine did that and it's vital signs are officially declared dead now...I want to get back to Scat regarding my beliefs on Satan and demons...most would probablly say they can be summed up like this -

Thanks .

Oh one thing. I'm not saying I'm a perfect Christian, far from it. I screw up quite a lot. But I try to hold dear the beliefs I have been taught and the ones in the Bible and try to follow them the best I possibly can with God's help.




[edit on 2-7-2004 by D]

Why is it that trying to stay true to beliefs you uphold as an individual can be so difficult...just like physical affects in the scientific world?
image.guardian.co.uk... g" target='_blank' class='tabOff'/>
Maybe to some degree it's cathartic...

[edit on 7/2/2004 by EnronOutrunHomerun]