Alien abduction accounts take major hit:

Originally posted by Xcalibur254
reply to post by MarrsAttax

 

What Persinger has found does not require a magnetic field. What his helmet does is virtually lesions an area of the brain. Before Persinger's research we already knew this area of the brain was associated with religious experiences. People who suffer from epilepsy in this area of the brain will occasionally report having a religious experience while seizing.

However, I do agree with you that the abduction scenario seems to be more the product of naturally occurring psychedelics. We already know that '___' exists in the brain and that it seems to have a role in dreaming. We have also seen that people under the influence of psychedelics can report seeing creatures similar in appearance to the Greys. Aleister Crowley even drew a picture of what he saw while on psychedelics. So, from this '___' seems to be a likely explanation for many abduction scearios.

Hi,

Because we can Induce an experience in the lab does not mean all such experiences are thusly unreal.

So I agree that something natural is occuring. But I highly doubt that '___' is the cause for people having such experiences.. at least not all of the people who have reported these things.

That Crowley drew such things does not solely indictate the hallucinogen was the cause of an unreal experience, although it appears on the surface to be that way. It may equally be that the drug 'opened one's awareness' to a point where their physical eyes could now register higher scales on the spectrum than when in a "normal state".

Much like how Dogs and Cats are known to respond to an "unseen something" present in the house of those experiencing the abduction scenario. I base this aspect on my own inteviews conducted with people who claim visitations... and my own experiences since I was a child.. and my child's experiences.

What I'm trying to suggest is that instead of thinking that something must fit into our paradigm, we all need to understand that our paradigm is most likely heavily limited by some factors.. level of education, the associated rightness that is a normal symptom of such, the actual limitations of our Belief-Structure which does enforce boundaries to what we can consider to be normal, and the degree to which our Cultural Indoctrination took root within us as children growing into adulthood.

Originally posted by DrHammondStoat


Is your statement 'most "abductees" discover their ordeals under hypnosis' fact, or is it something you just personally believe or presume?

I read it long ago. I don't remember the source so feel free to disregard it or look for the source on your own. I have met a number of self proclaimed "abductees" and as a group they were less than impressive.

I've had abduction type memories since childhood and never had any need for hypnosis. If you want to believe I'm mentally ill or lying then there's no reasoning with you, you are simply refusing to even consider on realm of possibility. Dr John E. Mack .

Well then, you may be the first abductee I've ever heard of who wasn't full of feces. Maybe.

I met Dr. Mack and even took a private seminar from him. While he was kind, caring, and brilliiant I also think he was completely around the bend.

Originally posted by Human_Alien
Here's what makes me different than you. I don't need that mob-mentality vote to qualify and dignify my deep beliefs.

You don't know me. Therefore you cannot make any qualified comment on what you think I am or am not. Is this the method you employ to divine all of your other alleged 'truths'? It begs the question because you're way off mark!

Originally posted by Human_Alien
Not sure why people are mocking me cause I'm not mocking anyone personally on here. Apparently my beliefs are touching a raw-nerve with some

I haven't mocked you at all. I gave you my observations based on your comments. You aren't touching any raw nerves from what I can see. I have no idea why you think that. Just because someone doesn't agree with you doesn't mean they find what you're saying confronting. There's nothing even mildly revelatory in what you wrote as far as I'm concerned.

Originally posted by Human_Alien
if that's the case perhaps it's time to let go of your dogma and fine-tune your karma!

Catch phrases, though mildly amusing, add no weight to your argument.

IRM

reply to post by DoomsdayRex


I agree and also completely hypocritical too!

Originally posted by wasco2
New research suggests repressed memories don't exist. Since most "abductees" discover their ordeals under hypnosis this represents a major blow to those who claim alien abductions are real and widespread. I've met dozens of claimed "abductees" and always suspected most of them are mentally ill, this just strengthens that belief.

www.abc.net.au...

You're spot on.

If these events had any merit these"abductees" wouldn't need to be asked leading questions by the hypnotist. These ideas of alien abduction are planted into the minds of the mentally weak.

reply to post by Astyanax


To you I say this. I don't need verification or tangible proof to solidify my experience. You are the one stuck in this 3D 'need to be told' reality world of yours.

If you experienced what I have then you'll know what I'm referring to.

I don't need a scientist, laboratory, Petri dish, beaker and analysis to make my experience anymore authentic than it is. You're the ones who are lacking this knowledge therefore you're trying to acquire it via science.
I am fortunate enough to be enlightened.

No offense but I'm glad I'm not you!

Some of you need proof. While some of you believe. I am at a point of my life where I am blessed to know.
I am not alluding that I am better than any of you but I'm certainly on another level of reality and understanding than most.

Peace~

Originally posted by wasco2
New research suggests repressed memories don't exist. Since most "abductees" discover their ordeals under hypnosis this represents a major blow to those who claim alien abductions are real and widespread. I've met dozens of claimed "abductees" and always suspected most of them are mentally ill, this just strengthens that belief.

www.abc.net.au...

I hear that people that deny that aliens exist or having never been abducted are nuts and in denial,
is what i hear, and strengthens that belief

With no evidence being presented, I still stand by my original assertions. People who claim to have been "abducted" are either making it up or are misinterpreting something else like sleep paralysis, hallucination, mental illness etc...

Oh noooos! ATS dun been hacked!!

So, what's up with the avatars?

Or am I the only one seeing her?

I mean, she's kinda hot and all but I really like my No BS better.

Science is mankinds agreed upon explanation for what we know thats works....
By definition will never be perfect.
However its darn useful....
I am going with the theory that there is some reality involved in abductions...despite Valees faireys etc...
The psychologists havent taken into account the telepathic powers of the abductors.yet they brazenly state that therapy itslf can create false memories...
The abductors have used owls deer and other memories to cover the real ones of their apearance.
The memories of many abductees are retrieved spotaneously with some stimulus or without even.
The spontaneous memory recovery seems to cancel out the idea that the abductions memories are implanted or encouraged by the hypnotist.
Physical traces and witnesses argue that the abductions in part at least, are real.
Human mutilations have also been found (Two im sure of, a brazilian peasant, and a US serviceman, though i have heard rumours of them in connection with the hudson valley flap....)
Cattle mutilations also seem to bolster the abduction claims a little bit too...
Taken in context with the other happenings ufo wise, i think it entirely possible that they are occuring regularly.
There is much more study to be done on telepathy and mind control type of methods before we can discount the abductees tales, and pack them off to the house with the backwards jackets..

reply to post by DoomsdayRex


Well everything alive evolves...but to a certin extent...if we evolved from apes..then all apes would be human..we wouldnt have apes..why do we still have apes...we evolve due to weather conditions..food scarity..small mutations..ohh and we would be able to mate with apes and produce offsprings if that was true....but silly people concluded we came from apes because they look so much like us...well its true because we all are made out of the same place..earth.....and if an alien were to look at a man and a dog..they would conclude that were related...both have one heart..stomach..mouth..2 eyes..legs and hands..soo if ur going to say we came from apes..then u would have to say we came from dogs..cats..actually all the animals on earth are our ancestors....get it ??

reply to post by wasco2


Aliens are real..theyv been here for thousands of years..i know this because i spoke to one..ill post my story later..

reply to post by stayjersey


It's clear that you lack a basic grasp on what evolution states. The reason humans and other apes are both still here is because we came from a common ancestor. The thing most evolution detractors don't seem to understand is evolution is not a straight path, it continually branches out. Furthermore, even though us and apes have a common ancestor doesn't mean we are the same species, and thus there is no reason why we should be able to mate with them.

You skeptics make the dumbest arguements I have ever seen.Alien abduction cases only exist in the first place because someone said it happened to them.So common sense tells you we need evidence.Just because hypnosis and mental problems are proven to exist does not dismiss alien abductions.Crediblty and honesty has to also be establsihed in alien abduction cases.Just like we do in murder cases and the law of the land.Use common sense people.Skepticism that is dishonest is no skepticism at all.

I don't know how many times it has to be said.Alot of alien abduction claims have happened when people are driving,or camoing,when they are doing things awake and when they are fully awake and consiencely aware of what is going on and what they are looking at and have realized they have missing time after they have described seeing a disc or oval shaped light or metallic object most of the cases.
Also in most of the mainstream cases people describe the exact same being which have become known as the"GREYS".Which is why the same pattern has left people wondering if it is real.They also describe slightly different looking greys who have become known as the REPTILLIAN like GREYS.
Also I was always fascinated by this subject,but a crazy UFO event has convinced me at least some of the stories are true.

Originally posted by Xcalibur254
reply to post by Human_Alien

 

1. Science hasn't thought the Earth was flat since at least the Greeks. A time before the scientific method was created.


Furthermore, science is an ever evolving field. If we already knew everything then there would be no need for science. Now, since you seem to have a big problem with science why don't you go outside and cut the power lines to your house since that electricity you're using is because of scientific discoveries. Now, science says that you'll be electrocuted if you try to cut the power lines, but what does science know? I'm sure you'll be fine.

The bible says the earth is suspended in space, and that it is round. We knew this before the scientists did.

You will only be electrocuted if you are grounded.
You can hang in mid air suspended thirty feet off the ground holding onto a 10,000 volt power line and be fine, just do not ground yourself.

reply to post by wasco2


I am sure the Greys are happy you are spreading this information. The military too.

reply to post by Turiddu


Absence of proof is not proof of absence.

To legitimately rule out abductions, in general, as being either made up or misinterpreted, one would have to dismiss each and every case on its own. Which is just impossible to do, one should agree with me on that.

To legitimately prove that the phenomenon exists, it is sufficient to have one case that can be proved.

Now, what do I hear by proved? Well, as with a tremendous amount of things in all sciences, there are things that can be proven right, and things that just can't be proven wrong. And there is a vast difference between the two situations.

In ufology, which in itself might not be a science, but rather a set of different scientific methods of putting together pieces of evidence, there are just too many cases that are impossible to conclude with. They are impossible to conclude with, because we don't have enough information or knowledge on what we can actually (and physically) observe.

In court, there are many instances where a case is judged based on evidence, not proof. The judge decides, based on his experience, expertise and on the lot of evidence brought in favor or against the convicted person. He decides whether the guy is guilty or not.

If I had to be the judge in "the UFO case" or "the abduction case", trust me I'd decide that it exists. Even though I have no proof. And I would do that because no one is able to disprove the phenomenon as a whole. Therefore the possibility exists that it is real.