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'Draw Muhammad' Cartoonist Goes Into Hiding at FBI's Insistence After Assassination Threat

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posted on Sep, 16 2010 @ 11:09 AM
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Originally posted by dreampsi
sorry but I have a different view.....

She's an adult and she fully knew that even doing a satirical piece could insight some type of anger over it.



But....
It seems hypocritical to me. Islam believes the following.

Source

3. Scriptures It refers to believing in all the four books; the Torah (Moses), the Psalms (David), the Gospel (Jesus) and the Quran (Mohammad).


So are they practicing Tolerance? If not then why not? Jesus spoke to extreme lengths of tolerance and of turning the other cheek etc. His words are second only to Mohammads in the Quran.

I'm not comparing Christianity to Islam.
I'm just saying is all....





edit on 16-9-2010 by SLAYER69 because: I felt like mashing the keyboard some more with my fat hairy knuckles to correct a typo




posted on Sep, 16 2010 @ 11:09 AM
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reply to post by john_bmth
 


BS, we always hear the same old story over and over again. Are you serious, Moderates could hold a press confrence or issue statements on there websites. They dont though, thats why Moderate Muslims are fairy tales like Santa and the Easter Bunny. (sorry Slayer
)



posted on Sep, 16 2010 @ 11:12 AM
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reply to post by dreampsi
 


What the hell are you talking about? She has the RIGHT to spout off at the mouth and the RIGHT to draw anyone she wants to. Muslims also have the RIGHT to spout off at there mouths, but there rights end when they threaten someones life. Diddnt they kill a danish guy for drawing mohammed as well? Yes they did. And besides I dont go around picking fights



posted on Sep, 16 2010 @ 11:12 AM
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reply to post by dreampsi
 


Yes, because being assassinated is an acceptable response to a cartoonist who is A) Not muslim B) Did not really draw Mohammed for her "draw Mohammad" day C) Spoke against what the participants were submitting.

And even if she did draw Mohammed, it's retarded to think she should be assassinated for it. She lives in a free country and is not muslim.



posted on Sep, 16 2010 @ 11:16 AM
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reply to post by SLAYER69
 


Correct Slayer, However dont you find it odd, that the hold the teachings of Jesus (as he was a prohpet) in there eyes, but they dont actually read the new testament? Things that make you say hmmmmm.



posted on Sep, 16 2010 @ 11:18 AM
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reply to post by SLAYER69
 


of course you aren't comparing islamists with christianity
there is none
one teaches love and the other does not



posted on Sep, 16 2010 @ 11:19 AM
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Originally posted by poedxsoldiervet
reply to post by john_bmth
 


BS, we always hear the same old story over and over again. Are you serious, Moderates could hold a press confrence or issue statements on there websites. They dont though, thats why Moderate Muslims are fairy tales like Santa and the Easter Bunny. (sorry Slayer
)

Utter rubbish. Lots of moderate Muslims have condemned extremism, Unfortunately it doesn't make front page news because it doesn't sell papers.



posted on Sep, 16 2010 @ 11:25 AM
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Originally posted by john_bmth
Utter rubbish. Lots of moderate Muslims have condemned extremism, Unfortunately it doesn't make front page news because it doesn't sell papers.



That may be true.
I guess the real question becomes which side of that coin has the most influence? The Islamic moderates or extremists?




posted on Sep, 16 2010 @ 11:26 AM
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reply to post by john_bmth
 


Yes it took CAIR Years to condemn them, and only after intense pressure.... It doesnt get front page news, because IT RARELY HAPPENS... when that luntic preacher wanted to burn Korans, you hear Jews and Christian leaders condemn it, but not a peep from the muslims over this lady having to go into hiding.... WTF is wrong with that picture?



posted on Sep, 16 2010 @ 11:27 AM
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Originally posted by john_bmth

Originally posted by poedxsoldiervet
reply to post by john_bmth
 


BS, we always hear the same old story over and over again. Are you serious, Moderates could hold a press confrence or issue statements on there websites. They dont though, thats why Moderate Muslims are fairy tales like Santa and the Easter Bunny. (sorry Slayer
)

Utter rubbish. Lots of moderate Muslims have condemned extremism, Unfortunately it doesn't make front page news because it doesn't sell papers.


Apparently there is still a large group of hyper-sensitives left causing troubles constantly. Oh no, this problem doesn't exist. Forgot about that.



posted on Sep, 16 2010 @ 11:32 AM
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Originally posted by poedxsoldiervet
reply to post by john_bmth
 


Yes it took CAIR Years to condemn them, and only after intense pressure.... It doesnt get front page news, because IT RARELY HAPPENS... when that luntic preacher wanted to burn Korans, you hear Jews and Christian leaders condemn it, but not a peep from the muslims over this lady having to go into hiding.... WTF is wrong with that picture?

That's rubbish. Now you're saying "Actually, they have spoken out but only after immense pressure". So basically it lets you weasel your bigoted views in there by condemning them even when they do speak out. Convenient, eh? How about you check out some of these links?

www.newsweek.com...
xrdarabia.org...
uk.ibtimes.com...
www.sundaymercury.net... 6331-27018323/
www.facebook.com...
www.buzzle.com...
157.166.255.31...
www.foxnews.com...
www.dailymail.co.uk...
www.quilliamfoundation.org...

...and that's from a simple google of "moderate muslims condemning extremism". Not that I expect you to read any of the links but stranger things have happened at sea, I suppose.



posted on Sep, 16 2010 @ 11:37 AM
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Before I comment on this I would like to open up with a quote from Edward R. Murrow, from 1959:
This is no time for men who oppose Senator McCarthy's methods to keep silent, or for those who approve. We can deny our heritage and our history, but we cannot escape iresponsibility for the result. There is no way for a citizen of a republic to abdicate his responsibilities. As a nation we have come into our full inheritance at a tender age. We proclaim ourselves, as indeed we are, the defenders of freedom, wherever it continues to exist in the world, but we cannot defend freedom abroad by deserting it at home.

The actions of the junior Senator from Wisconsin have caused alarm and dismay amongst our allies abroad, and given considerable comfort to our enemies. And whose fault is that? Not really his. He didn't create this situation of fear; he merely exploited it -- and rather successfully. Cassius was right. "The fault, dear Brutus, is not in our stars, but in ourselves."

I believe this is a sad day for the country at large, and the federal government ought to be ashamed of itself. The federal government is charged, by the people, the citizens of this country, by the laws, the Constitution of the United States, and even by the very oaths that they took to uphold the rights equally across the board for all of its citizens in this country and abroad, to protect and serve the people, as it is their duty to do such. This concept has been in the country for years, since its founding. It is disgraceful and ultimately disrespectful to the concepts and ideas, that so many have gave so much, to include their very lives to defend and protect, to include different wars and armed conflicts around the world. Our forefathers did not shirnk back in the line of duty, and were willing to sacrafice everything to protect this country and its citizens from the tyranny of the rest of the world. We set the standard, we were the one beacon of hope in a world where at times there was none. Europe suffered 2 major wars on its home soil, and it was the US, that came out to help them out in times past. When Europe did nothing about a problem it was the US that stepped up to the plate, proving that it was a match and could even show up the heads of state around the world. We were respected and a power to be reconded with. Even some of the worst Presidents, not counting Obama, commaned respect against those who did not like the US, whose very ideology were counter to the beliefs that we had. We have never backed down from a challenge or a threat.
But that has changed and the question is why now. Why now is a group of malcontents, terrorist and extremists, why now are they holding the US hostage to the point of where we can not exercise the very liberties and freedoms that we hold dear? Why is it that unlike most of the world they act out in violence and threats?
Many fail to understand or realise that the greatest test of freedom and liberty is not agreeing with what we find favorable, rather it is that which we do not agree with and are willing to back, no matter what, that is the true test of freedom and liberty. That is what the sacrafice is made for and that is what we should be protecting. We must not let the extremist hold us hostage, or even be willing to back down, but stand up, and be willing to take the place of those who are going to put themselves in the line of fire.
What worries me the most of all things, about this incident, is the failure of those who are suppose to be protecting us, are not able to, or refuse to divert the very manpower to keep us safe. It sends a strong message around the world, that we are vulnerable and will back down if some group makes a threat and that puts the US in a weaker postion than it currently is.
The policies set by the prior adminstrations that we will not bargin or deal with terrorist have been set, that the very principles of justice and fairness are around, and we should uphold on such. Those who are making these threats should be afraid and cower in the shadows, that the US will no longer pull punches or censor its people cause it might offend a few people. We are in an open conflict against the terrorist, it is time we start offending them more and more, if anything to bring them out into the light, to stop giving aid to countries that harbor said individuals, and be done with the entire matter, or this will continue to drag on for years.



posted on Sep, 16 2010 @ 12:26 PM
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reply to post by john_bmth
 


Okay so a few moderates have spoken out against Radicals, So they may not be Fairytales after all, but what are they doing to stop the radicals? Speaking is one thing stopping is another? In your Newsweek article it stated that Saudi Arabia had control of the Radicals. But have they really? I mean there are still Radicals in high positions in the Kingdom, even Jordan a supposed Moderate nation you have radical Imans adding fuel to the fire, and the only reason al-quida in Iraq lost hard, was because they targeted Muslims civilians. Islam does not compute with freedom of speech or expression its are way or the highway....



posted on Sep, 16 2010 @ 02:21 PM
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Islam as it stands now is a barbaric, throwback "religion" which is not a religion at all in the normal sense of the word - it's more of a complete sociopolitical belief system, masquerading as "only" a religion.

I detest islam itself, and I don't say that lightly or flippantly. With that said, I don't hate muslims. Some of them, as individuals, I'd just as soon x-out as look at but not all by any means, nor even most. They are people, and as such are subject to all the same failings as humanity in general, as well as the same strengths as humans in general. They live, they die, they love, they hate, same as the rest of us.

The religion on the other hand, is quite another matter. There truly are those classed as "moderate" muslims, who in all actuality are "liberal" muslims. people make the mistake of classifying them as "moderates" because they stand for moderation, islam as a TRUE religion without all the sociopolitical trappings. But islam, in it's original incarnation, is barbaric in extremis. The "fundamentalists" are practicing the system as it was originally intended, and as it is written in the Qur'an. The so-called "mioderrates", however, see a better way, a way which allows islam to take it's place in the modern world, to live and let live. THEY are the future of islam, if it is to have a future at all.

If they don't prevail, and make of islam a religion in fact as well as word, then islam as a sociopolitical system will go the way of the dinosaur - just as any rabid dog must be put down for the good of the community.

They're trying, but they're being shouted down with threats and intimidations from the fundamentalist crowd. Many, perhaps MOST of them, the peaceful folk, are in as much or more threat of their lives as "the west". I say more, because they are closer to the source of the threats. They live in it. It's hard to go against the gun when it's pointed right at your temple.

I don't have a problem with muslims practicing Islam - as a religion. I DO have a problem with those who would impose it on the rest of us as a sociopolitical system, or use it as an excuse to ignore our own laws already in place in favor of their cultural traditions, passing as laws. I don't even care any more if they ban me from their Two Holy Cities - but I think they ought to be respectful enough, if that's to be the case, to stay out of the holy sites of others. Can't have it both ways, or else it's simple oppression.

Islam is just stuck in what Christians went through in the middle ages, and what Jews went through before that. I believe most religions will go through that barbaric phase, and come out the other side wiser and more temperate, or not come out the other side at all. You'll notice, if you pay attention, some muslims beginning to expound a "different" interpretation of the Qur'an these days, one that harmonizes it with a peaceful nature, emphasizing and rationalizing those parts, and minimizing and explaining away the more violent parts. I've seen it even here at ATS, and you can see it to. You have only but to look.

The persecutions of the Spanish Inquisition are a good example, but not a precise parallel. They were ALL ostensibly "Christians", yet one barbaric faction made life ever so unpleasant for the others, what with all that killing and torture going on, over the new "interpretation", the Reformation.

See, you have to be able to separate the people from the system. Not all are separable. That would be the "extremists" or the "fundamentalists". The rest - they have a religion, and they can get by without all the other trappings that have been tacked on by the fundamentalists. Their numbers appear to be growing, but very, very quiet. That gun to the temple thing. Some have found their voices, many are still in subjugation.

A lot have died at the hands of their fellows, so the threat to them is not an idle one.

Islam WILL evolve, or else perish, as all the others have had to do. What WE ought to be doing, instead of flinging tar at all muslims, is to seek out and support what are so euphemistically called the "moderates". Assist them, amplify their voices, defend them with your own dear body if need be. Help their numbers grow and flourish. Help them get above the fear. Fear of their fellows AND fear of us.

No, I detest their religion, but I'll damn well go to bat for their right to practice it - as a religion. No skin off my back if they want to follow a different god. It only becomes problematic when they insist I follow their sociopolitical system. Then, it becomes VERY problematic.

But you have to be able to separate the wheat from the chaff.

When you see me railing against Islam, I mean every word of it - against the sociopolitical system. When you see me defending Islam, I mean every word of that, too - in favor of the religion. The curious thing is that I come under attack from both sides for my stance(es). So what? So be it, and I'm still standing. I'll keep on going as I go fro as long as I'm allowed to stand. I'm a racist, and a bigot, and an islamophobe to some, and I'm an islamic apologist and a "muzzie lover" to others, and all that wrapped under the very same skin.

I may not be a renaissance man, but I can tell the difference in people, individuals, and don't have a penchant for lumping them all into the same camp sight unseen, character unevaluated. I don't evaluate ONE because I may have had to shoot another. Muslims are not superfolk, all zombiefied under the same banner, any more than any other group is - Americans, Christians, Buddhists, Book of the Month Club members. They're just as individual, AS individuals, as you or I.

The touchstone seems to be the "Sharia" issue. That is the interface, the crossover, between Islam the Religion, and Islam the Sociopolitical System. Proponents of Sharia in areas where it isn't already in place are those I view with suspicion. How strongly they lobby for that is what determines whether I see them as "friend" or "enemy". Imam Rauf said recently that America is "Sharia compliant". Bad. A recent poster at ATS said "America could stand some islamization - the founding fathers would appreciate it". No they wouldn't. Bad. Neither of these folks are strong enough proponents for me to class them as "enemy" yet, though. Just watchful.

CAIR? Enemies. Islamic Brotherhood? Enemies. Individuals? On an individual basis.

As the Christians say, and it's true whether your Christian or not, "by their fruits shall ye know them".

Now, regarding the Cartoon Lady, she's got as much right to offend as anyone. It's the American way. Don't like it? Stay at home in Sharia Land, then. No problem. Threaten death over an insult (and only a perceived insult at that!) to a guy long dead? Problem. Sharia is not here yet, so there are whole ranks of us you'll have to go through in order to enforce it where it doesn't exist.

"Ground Zero" mosque? They've got as much right to offend as the cartoon lady. Don't like it? Stay out of New York. No problem. Threaten death over a building? Problem. US law has not been dismantled yet, so again there are whole ranks of us you'll have to get through to dismantle it.

I'm done rambling now.


edit on 2010/9/16 by nenothtu because: of bad tags.



posted on Sep, 16 2010 @ 03:38 PM
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Originally posted by john_bmth

Originally posted by poedxsoldiervet
reply to post by john_bmth
 


BS, we always hear the same old story over and over again. Are you serious, Moderates could hold a press confrence or issue statements on there websites. They dont though, thats why Moderate Muslims are fairy tales like Santa and the Easter Bunny. (sorry Slayer
)

Utter rubbish. Lots of moderate Muslims have condemned extremism, Unfortunately it doesn't make front page news because it doesn't sell papers.


Lots eh. Where?

Would I be wrong in assuming they are like, you know, a minority?

And you are quite wrong. In the face of all this anti-islam press, there would indeed be a big hullabaloo should 99.99% of the islamic world stand up and say STFU you extreme morons..

but...

*chirp chirp chirp*



posted on Sep, 16 2010 @ 03:46 PM
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I reckon I wasn't quite done rambling...


I direct your attention to this post:
post by computerwiz32

and in particular the scene in the ice cream store.

That ticks me off. I put my own precious ass in a sling for folks like that "American", and this is what he does with it? That is how he honors the memory of the dead, who bought their own little 3x6 farms on his behalf? To deny others rights that were purchased for all there, with hot blood?

I kid you not, that post brought shame on ME. So much so, it brought a tear to my eye, and that's not an easy thing to do.

And folks wonder why I want to get off of this crazy train and go live by myself in the woods?

Deny ignorance my ass. COMBAT ignorance. That's the only reason I haven't hit the woods yet.

Edit to add: I have to wonder what this jackass would do if he had to face a muslim woman in a full out burka grinning at him and flat out stating "I could be hiding an AK under all this, and you'd never know it" - right here in America. I did. In Greensboro, NC, in front of a bank. I laughed at her, or maybe WITH her - depends on your viewpoint I reckon.

This jackass? He'd piss his britches right there on the spot. I've got no doubts.


edit on 2010/9/16 by nenothtu because: (no reason given)



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