Israeli - Palestinian conflict through photos (pictures are worth a thousand words)

reply to post by Eliad


Eliad, it's good to see that your patrolling the Mid East section of the board. Anyway, as far as one side looking worse than the other, that's what happens when one side is worse than the other.

First of all I'd like to say your commitment to the matter is almost admirable.

At first I wondered why would anyone want to show any of the violence that goes on here? I admired the fact that you chose to show pictures from both sides, but still, why would anyone want to show the horrors of war..

Why would anyone want to show the horrors of war? Trust me, I don't want to and I would rather not, however the sad truth of the matter is that the American people are financing this. I show these pictures and give this data because the American people are paying for something to which they have no idea. All they know about the issue, is what the MSM shows them, which is none of the Israeli abuses or terrorism. If an IDF is injured, we will hear about it for days, plastered all over the news, yet we hear nothing about the many, many more acts of terrorism on behalf of Israel. My guess is that it's due to the pro-Zionist owned media, along with the massive lobbying effort on behalf of Israel, the likes of which has never been seen before on the planet. If Nazi Germany had the same lobbying effort, I could guarantee that they would have had our support too. It looks like the Zionists have learned the lessons from the short-comings of the Nazis.

Again, I show these pics because it is America who is financing and supplying this terrorism. I feel, as do many others, that the American people would no longer support such things, if only they knew about them, instead of being fooled. Just as the American people looked at the Nazi actions with disgust, so would they with the same tactics presented by Israel.

Because we can't count on the media to tell the whole truth, we have to do it through the grass-roots.

There many families, struggling to put food on the table, working two, three jobs just to pay taxes, yet their tax dollars are going to Israel, one of the strongest economies in the world. Then, to know what's happening with those tax-dollars, just adds insult to injury. All of this terror is being done in their names, yet they are being kept from truth.

Trust me, there are many things I would rather be doing. If America, my country, didn't back these terrorist acts, I probably would care so much. Sure, I would care about all of the innocent life living in terror, but that happens in many other places. The hook for me, is that it is being done in our name. At a time when Americans can't afford it, we are shelling out billions of dollars directly and even more indirectly for the twisted terrorism of Israel. Then, our own security is called into question because of the terrorism being done in our name by Israel. Most Americans don't know it, but Muslims hate our country because of our support for Israel.

"Our liberty cannot be guarded but by the freedom of the press, nor that be limited without danger of losing it." --Thomas Jefferson to John Jay, 1786

I show these pictures because it is my duty, since the American media fails to do so.

"The most effectual engines for [pacifying a nation] are the public papers... [A despotic] government always [keeps] a kind of standing army of news writers who, without any regard to truth or to what should be like truth, [invent] and put into the papers whatever might serve the ministers. This suffices with the mass of the people who have no means of distinguishing the false from the true paragraphs of a newspaper." --Thomas Jefferson

I don't know if you've noticed, but you hardly show any of the hardships of the Israelis in this struggle.. This is what is missing (off the top of my head):

Uh, there isn't much evidence or photos that display the hardships of the Israelis and most likely because there is little to none.

- Palestinian violence against settlers

Care to share any photos? Furthermore, they are illegal settlers. Also, if there was nearly the amount of violence to the illegal settlers, I'm sure that there would be plenty of photos, but then again they are settling illegally and bullying the people that they steal land from.

If I move onto someone's land, abuse their children and terrorize them, I'd expect to have violence against me, well that is if I didn't have an army backing me up.

- Palestinian shootings and sniping against settlers

Again, pics or it didn't happen. See above.

- Road mines and explosives used against soldiers and settlers

Again, see above.

- Israeli victims of mass lynchings

This one almost made me laugh. Any pictures or evidence to support such a claim?

- Israeli victims of rock throwing
- Damage of rock throwing to cars
- Size of rocks
- Age of throwers (Under 18 I can assure you that)

I don't doubt the rock throwing, however what do you expect them to do. Think for a minute and put aside any bias, what would you do if your people were being terrorized every minute of every day? Would you just accept it, "yessah masta". That's what happens when you terrorize people, you get rocks thrown at you, if of course that's all they have.

- Victims of terrorist bombings (The ones that survive are usually missing a few limbs)

I did put photos of the bombings, though as you can see, it really hails in comparison to the terrorist attacks happening everyday against the Palestinians.

- Roadblock bombings
- Methods used in those bombings
- Arab violence against Israeli citizens (if you really want to perpetuate the hate)
- Soldiers shot down by civilians with guns whom they didn't suspect
- Soldiers shot down by terrorists dressed in women's clothing

You are free to post any photos that you have. Until then, it doesn't jive.

- Children sent into battle to collect weapons off of dead bodies

That's probably the propaganda used to justify child murder. The Nazis did the same kind of thing.

- Children sent out with a gun in hand

Now this I can see. A child just watches his home demolished, sees his mom beat and his dad murdered, after the child suffers his whole life behind Israeli terror. I don't think the child is being sent out so much as he is being yoked out.

- Houses rigged around innocent families by terrorists

You mean the houses that the greedy and illegal settlers are stealing? Could you be talking about the homes of evicted Palestinian families?

- Terrorists standing behind civilians, shooting

Yeah, I posted those, you can clearly see the terrorists (IDF) standing behind civilians shootings. Might you have more?

- When kids are sent into a battle field so they can run into Israeli patrols and allow for an ambush they will be taken by the patrol and get blindfolded and cuffed with plastic cuffs, they are usually placed at the back of the force as they would slow down a force, and might yell to inform anyone of its location.

Kids aren't "sent" into the battlefield, rather it is the Zionists coming to the children. Remember, the Palestinians can't really go anywhere as the Israelis hamper movement. If you send a shooter to a school yard, you can't really use the excuse that children were sent to the battlefield. Nice try at the spin.

I get it though, you're not pro Israeli, why should you put any effort in making them look any better...
I'm not even being cynical, it's just the way it is..

I'll be the first to admit that I have a bias, just as anyone with a conscious would. It's hard not to have a bias against terrorism, oppression, tyranny, genocide and abuse. Why would I try to make anyone lok "better"? I have done nothing to alter the pics, nor have I done anything to glorify one side over the other. If one side looks worse than the other, it's probably because one side is worse than the other.

--airspoon

reply to post by oozyism


I don't have time to give you history lessons, I really want to go to bed.. Let's just end this debate by me saying- Bring on the pressure, if that's what it takes and let's be over with this..

And believe me, it's not true that Israel has not tried to bring peace.. Israel has been the initiator of all peace talks, and in return got the guns they gave the PA turned against them..

The real change only happened when arafat died and abu mazzen replaced him.

You need both sides to be sane in order to have peace- On one side you have a sane leader, and peace talks, on the other side you have an insane party, and terror, even after we got out of Gaza...

Trying to portray Israel as the devil in this aspect is only going to backfire..
Sure, it hasn't always made the best move, but it's always wanted peace, and done much more than the Palestinians have for it to happen.

reply to post by Eliad

You need both sides to be sane in order to have peace- On one side you have a sane leader, and peace talks, on the other side you have an insane party, and terror, even after we got out of Gaza...

There ya go, that is the Israeli side of the story we hear on the propaganda machine everyday.

You just exposed yourself

For anyone wondering about Eliad and his motives, just take a look at this: www.abovetopsecret.com...

Every single post of his has been defending Israel. He has not posted in any other threads. He signed up on ATS for the sole purposes of defending Israel and its policies of terror. If his posting history doesn't make it clear enough, then I don't know what will.

Why else would someone sign up on ATS and only post in Israel-themed threads, spewing the same propaganda that we hear in the media? Someone just got exposed.

I'm sure that another account will be made soon.

--airspoon

[edit on 18-7-2010 by airspoon]

reply to post by airspoon


That's an eyeopener lol.

Thanks for the investigative technique used to expose ...

Most Americans don't know it, but Muslims hate our country because of our support for Israel.

This is why we got 911, during the time, US citizen asks "Who" we forgot to ask "Why".

To airspoon, you are enlighten, good luck with your future journey.

Conspiracy Sidetrack:
and yes, things you said about elliad is really an eye opener, LOL
Quiz:Why Elliad is on ATS.
Hint: Find the word that exist on every line.
airspoon: I see new account coming soon too, LOL.

[edit on 19-7-2010 by RainCloud]

These pic's, whilst horrendous, are very tame. I appreciate that you stated that they are only 10% of the photo's you could print, but the attrocities committed are much more horrific in reality.
I know that there are many who jump on the bandwagon of 'Israel = zionists = genocidal maniacs' which is untrue.
In that case, the UN, antagonised by the Israeli government into action, is afraid to as the powers that be in the US is very well known to be, and has been proven as such, a puppet of pro-semitic extremism. If the UN loses the US, the UN ceases to be. Appreciated, they have more bark than bite, but the alternative is unthinkable. Mugabe gets more say in their affairs than his victims!
So, the people of Israel, the voters, the ex-pat's, the pro-judaaistic media, and the other four 'superpowers' must enforce stricter directives. If that means alliance against the US as well, then they have to.
The situation can't continue. It will mean putting the past behind all parties concerned, as happened with the UK and Irish Republican terrorists(Note how the British government would NOT indulge the IRA and Ulster terror groups as an 'army status'? They were regarded as terror organisations... reducing their cause, yet covertly fighting a 'war on terror'!)
An agreement was reached. Both sides were outright in their hatred for one another, but the people of EIRE were not labelled. Time for us to stop classing all jews as aggressors, and all Palestians as potential terrorists... then take the next step forward?

Some Palestinians get carried away in their anger and cause some suicide bombings in Israel, although the photos of their attacks shown by Israel are always the same ones, which shows it hasn't often happened.

On the other hand, in Israel it's the actual IDF army that is attacking the poor Palestinian civilians - not just some crazy radical groups and their suicide bombers, but the actual GOVERNMENT.

A home made missile blown into a house that only destroyed the roof or hit a single car is a great reason for an massive Israeli air strike that completely demolishes innocent people's homes across a wide area. People who are just waiting for this killing to be all over.

Israel is the modern version of the SS, and just like with the SS they are supported by the US and their influential allies.

[edit on 19-7-2010 by MightyAl]

reply to post by Varified Guesswork


When I label a country as one, as in "Americans", I'm generally talking about the government, as opposed to the actual citizens. With that being said, it is much different with Israel. Not only is the government doing these things, but such is the case with settlers and others too. I generally use the term Zionists to classify all who are the main instigators. The Palestinian people are seen as an obstacle to an end goal and until people are educated on the facts, this will continue to happen.

--airspoon

reply to post by airspoon


You have to understand, when you call a country as one, it actually does mean one.

Heck why isn't there mass civil disobedience?

Think about it, do you think America, as an entity, as a conscious entity would function if people didn't obey?

If people stopped working for couple of days to show their might in the face of the controller?

That being said, the innocent people shouldn't be blamed, because they are not to blame, people are forced, they are entangled in a web, where they can only feed themselves and their family by obeying the spider.

Even if they disagree to what the spider is doing, they can't do much, or fear for their livelihoods if they do.

That should put it to perspective.

reply to post by airspoon

I couldn't agree more, airspoon. I knew what you meant, it's just that some either obstinately oppose, or emphatically appease 'them', as in the jew's. That's wrong, as you quite rightly state, 'they' are the government, the extremist zionist groups, and many, many 'middle-of-the-road' jew's, israeli's, sympathisers, uneducated, and 'as long as it's NIMBY, I'm alright, Jack!'.

The 20% who do understand are in a minority, too brow-beaten to make a difference, 30% who neither know, nor care, and 50% who are treated like mushrooms... kept in the dark and fed BS!

Personally, I wouldn't have believed the on-going situation feasible, before I looked much closer at it. The british press is owned, absolutely, by the pro-semite media. Until the internet gained freedom of many US constraints and muzzles, it was hidden pretty well online.

I don't know if you're aware, but there are programs scanning the web, and mainstream forums, which alert israeli groups to swamp, disinform, mislead, or 'over-play' any opinion harms their cause. It's very famous... but not unusual. However, it is extremely effective!

Most governments and/or causes have the same bots trawling for 'keywords', and harmful fractions. In the case of the UK, mobiles, emails, instant messages, faxes, etc... are all scanned for possible security threats. I certain the US has the same policy.

All I meant by my previous post was, it's time that the Israeli's, and nations in a position to, who claim that it's not their fault/problem that the extremists are carrying out the attrocities in Gaza... stopped claiming to be unaccountable, and actually resisted, protested, and showed contempt for the Israeli governments terrorism, instead of reacting to it in shock-horror, when the obvious is beyond their denial of knowledge.

Enough is enough. The jew's sided with the Germans during the early stages of WWI, yet were aided by the allies when they were turned upon. The zionist nazi's were in cohorts with the nazi's during WWII, again until their people were almost annihilated. Each time, bygones were let be just that.

Isn't it time we gave the Palestinians a break? Afterall, they aided us via intelligence, safe-harbour, millitia led raids, during both wars, and then had their land handed to the 'new state of Israel' when no other country could tolerate their 'Master Race' prerequisites any longer!

reply to post by Varified Guesswork


Yeah, I know about their internet and blogger tactics. I believe we had one posting in this very thread. Also, as far as the media being pro-semite, they aren't. They are however pro-Zionist and Zionist themselves. Remember that Arabs are semites and there is nothing pro-Arab about them.

We are so used to hearing the term "anti-semite" used as a defense mechanism so naturally people associate that word with Jews, when it reaches much further than that. In fact, one could easily argue that Zionism is in fact an anti-semitic movement.

--airspoon

reply to post by airspoon


First I'd like to say I feel sorry for you guys that you have to put up with this stupid lobby.. Over here when a soldier gets injured it's reported for one day, and that's it..

And I tend to agree on the whole settlers issue, they have no right being there in the first place, so it's kind of weird for me to say Palestinian violence against settlers..

Anyway photos:

- Violence against settlers:

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/3e158973bf1c.jpg[/atsimg]

JERUSALEM (March 27) Palestinian snipers shot 10-month-old Shalhevet Tehiya Pass in the head as she was in her mother Uriya's arms and moderately wounded her father Yitzhak, 24, in the legs as they stood at the entrance to the Avraham Avinu neighborhood early yesterday evening.

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/19660346b605.jpg[/atsimg]


[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/9b333d7c4654.jpg[/atsimg]

One of the slogans daubed on Efrat's Tifferet Avot Synagogue

- Road mines used against soldiers and settlers:

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/39c69a40bc3b.jpg[/atsimg]

Israeli soldiers search for the body parts of troops in the Israeli controlled area between the Southern Gaza town of Rafah and the Egyptian border on Thursday. Five soldiers were killed when a Palestinian rocket blew up their APC on the Gaza-Egypt border.
— Reuters

- Lynchings:

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/80d22b2c9857.jpg[/atsimg]

Blood on his hands, a Palestinian savage waves to the crowd after lynching innocent Israeli FATHER to death

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Beaten to death, one of the soldiers is thrown to the crowd

- As for the rock throwing, I'm just saying would have been appropriate and balanced to slap on a few photos of that while you're at it..

- Suicide bombings and shootings and massacres: (Let's see if it really does pail in comparison)

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/b622297baaf3.jpg[/atsimg]

The Mercaz HaRav massacre, also called the Mercaz HaRav shooting, was an attack that occurred on 6 March 2008, in which a lone Palestinian gunman shot multiple students at the Mercaz HaRav yeshiva, a religious school in Jerusalem, Israel, after which the gunman himself was shot dead.


[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/4b228bde2f8c.jpg[/atsimg]

On March 24, 2004, one week after capturing a bomb in the bag of 12-year-old Abdullah Quran, Hussam Abdo, a 16-year-old Palestinian (who initially claimed he was 14), was captured in a checkpoint near Nablus wearing an explosive belt. The young boy was paid by the Tanzim militia to detonate himself at the checkpoint. Hussam explained that he was offered 100 NIS and sex with virgins if he would perform the task. He said his friends mocked him in class.

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/07414b95162d.jpg[/atsimg]

This is an x-ray taken after one of the recent suicide bombings on a Saturday night in Jerusalem. The patient lungs were invaded by 5 bolts.
(If you don't know they put nuts and bolts in their bombs)

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/bb39340a5d59.jpg[/atsimg]

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5-month-old Shoshana Nathanson recuperates in the pediatric intensive care unit at Jerusalem's Sha'arei Tzedek Hospital on Thursday, August 21st, 2003. She was injured in the suicide bus bombing Tuesday in Jerusalem.

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/0f6033f854ed.jpg[/atsimg]

Palestinian child holds up paint-stained hands, resembling blood, in Gaza Strip nursery school graduation ceremony.

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/2364fb56a172.jpg[/atsimg]

Naama Didovski weeps at the funeral of her mother,
a Jewish school teacher who was killed in a Palestinian terrorist attack..

This is stupid.. I don't know how you fell this sense of rightousness while doing this, I'm not feeling it, I'm just getting more and more sick as I continue.. Sick of the situation, sick of suffering on both sides, sick of having to defend myself with posts like these..
As I said, why would anyone want to post these pictures?

What's most annoying is that it's easy for you to forget things that had happened that don't fit your cause, it's easy for you to forget the shootings, the sniping, and the bombings. But I live here, I remember, and just because I can't find news snippets and digital photos from 10-20 years ago, because the internet full of more recent news, doesn't meant they never happened..

Anyway, all of these pictures, and more, should have been in this report of yours, right?

Really, I don't see the point of these, you clearly put no effort into showing the Israeli side of things..

Maybe I'm wrong, maybe you just couldn't find it, I'm sorry if so, you clearly put a lot of effort in this.
But I don't think anything justifies your opinions of Israel.. Clearly you have no understanding of what went on here through the years..

With respect,
Eliad.

Oh, and yeah, I'm a Zionist ninja robot assassin propaganda agent sent from the future to stop you all from figuring out the truth.

No, I won't open a second account, firstly because there's no reason for me to open a new account, most users I debate with find me to be quite fair in my views, and many have said that while I'm not objective, and I defend my country (which is understandable), I'm not brainwashed or one sided in my opinions.
Oh and secondly because Eliad's my name, and I only have one name.

reply to post by Eliad


Eliad, they call that resistance, you come to my house, rape my family, block my family from their basic human rights, murder my kids, assassinate my father, destroy my house, continue occupy it, continue invade it, continue blockade it, continue building a huge wall around yourself, continue expanding your area of the land claim it is yours and your family's, continue harassing, continue humiliating, dividing my family, refusing to give my family material needed to rebuild the same places of my house you destroyed, take thousands of my family members hostage, etc

Let me tell you what I would do in that situation, first I will ask for peace (the Palestinians asked for peace), then I will say stop all your aggression (the Palestinians asked for Zionist aggression to stop), then if neither one worked, I will resist your aggression by force, by taking up arm (and yes, both didn't work, because Israel's refusal to stop the occupations, and settlement expansion).
Israeli - Palestinian conflict by the numbers (numbers don't lie)
Make sure you click the link, it is very interesting read, especially for Zionist lobby in ATS who will continually refuse to accept the case that Palestinians are resisting Israeli aggression, not the other way around.

I'm middle brained, so either or both work for me. Nope, the numbers don't lie and neither do the photos or the videos or the first-hand accounts or common sense and decency. Thanks for posting this reminder. All for a stupid piece of land.

Peace.

[edit on 7/20/2010 by ~Lucidity]

reply to post by Eliad


Eliad, while I appreciate the posted pictures, some of them don't really mean anything. You have one of what appears to be the IDF looking for land-mines, though American soldiers do the same thing in Georgia, California and New York to name a few. It's called training and doesn't really say much.

Also, the pictures of the boys with guns. What's that supposed to mean? For reference, I'll post a series of pictures with both Israeli and American youth with much more powerful weaponry.

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/3fe986027097.jpg[/atsimg]

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/f58fc748057a.jpg[/atsimg]

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/efc315886b26.jpg[/atsimg]

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[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/b1b395b03b85.jpg[/atsimg]


Are we to believe that any country, ethnic group or political group that arms their children are "terrorists" that need to be indiscriminately killed? If that's the case, then both America and Israel are right on par with the Palestinians.

Now, as far as the suicide bombers, I believe that I posted many pics of that in the OP. We can sit here and post photos until we are blue in the face, as there are many, however that does not do anything to take away from any of the photos yet posted. At some point, you (not you, but others) have to ask themselves why do these photos even exist? Why is it that the scenario of each photo took place? When people look into it enough to be able to answer this question, that's when the truth becomes crystal clear. However, you have to be able to cut through the indoctrination, propaganda, spin and ignorance that surrounds this issue before that question can be answered truthfully.

--airspoon

It's true the Jews have done terrible things. However the Palestinians are more than equal partners in the WAR that they are waging.

Click the link, read the article, and watch the video and see if you can really defend the Palestinians after watching the propaganda they feed their kids. Can you really blame the Jews for striking back?

www.haaretz.com...

As of right now the 2 system are completely incompatible and eventually one or the other will win out.

It's terrible knowing that both sides are under a curse.

reply to post by oozyism


So you think this conflict started 30 years ago with the first intifada, do you?
While the point you're all missing is that we can argue who's got it worse, and who's the baddie and why all day long without ever reaching a conclusion that satisfies both sides, and usually I won't bother with this, but your lack of perspective baffles me.. For someone who seems to care so much, you seem to know very little.

Wait are you even going to read this?
Oh, whatever...

I don't call it resistance, I call it terrorism, you come to my house, you blow my buses, you make me live in fear, our body parts lay bleeding in our streets, while you celebrate by burning our flag, you attack my schools, you kill my children, women and elderly to get to heaven, you refuse peace, you were promised we would be slaughtered and thrown into the sea, you were promised 42 virgins in heaven for every child you kill, for every mother you slaughter.
And then you tell me it's resistance, you tell me the Israeli people are afraid for no reason, hate for no reason, say what you will, a resistance is fueled by ideology, this one is fueled by religion, and nothing good ever came out of anything fueled by religion.

As for your comment-
- We never raped any family (the Israeli army doesn't rape, in contrast to many other armed conflicts around the world).
- We block because we're scared, we never blocked you before, until you started exploding in our streets.. Before that you were free, even when you "resisted" it took us a while to put a block on you, so this isn't why you started resisting.
- We murder your kids by accident, misfires, whatever the morbid and horrible cause is, we never target them.
- We destroy your house.. First to punish families of terrorists, and now because of a government of idiots.. But this wasn't always the case, and can't be why you resist.
- Can't justify occupying your land with these settlements, I can only try to correct my mistakes, but is this really your reason for resisting? We got out of Gaza and still you continue attacking, all the while we continue #ing things up in the west bank, yet no one's doing anything.. Why is that?
It's our right to build a wall. What do you care anyway?
- We're not expanding, these settlements will be given away sooner or later, we don't need the land, it's stupid religious ideology.. They want to return Israel to biblical times, but that'll never happen..
- We harass and humiliate, I know, some of it has a good reason, some of it doesn't.. But again, is this the reason?
- I will divide your family if one side is full of terrorists and the other is stable.
- I will not give you building materials if you use them for bombs
- I will take prisoners if they try to kill me, be thankful I let them sit in prison, wasting my money to keep them alive, and not execute them in front of cameras like you do to my people.

This war is not good vs. evil, or oppressor vs. oppressed.. It's evil vs. evil, it's religion vs. religion.
The conflict will stop, but you people aren't helping.. This isn't helping. Blaming Israel for everything, thinking this is all black and white..
This only fuels the fire...

We've got no more terror on one side, while the other side is quiet for the meantime..
This is a good time for peace.. It is a good chance..
We finally have leaders talking to us, we finally have a chance to make a change...
My government had better not # this up.. Theirs too.

But it's amazing how people outside this region have opinions that are so much more extreme than the ones most people here have..

Sorry if the post was a bit a rude..
With respect,
Eliad.

P.S, the numbers do lie when you put civilians and terrorist together on the same body count, I think the fact that out of the 1200 dead, 700 are terrorists is something worth noting..

edition.cnn.com...

The numbers lie when you have no idea what it's like fighting in an urban environment where everyone might be a killer..

The numbers lie.
As they say: "There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies, and statistics."

[edit on 21-7-2010 by Eliad]

reply to post by airspoon


They weren't looking for land mines they were looking for their friends' body pieces that were blown by a mine or an explosive of some kind while.. This is a very famous photo, I'm surprised you don't know it.

Yeah, boys with guns is meaningless, I agree..
There is something to be said about the indoctrination they give to their children, you may say the same for us, but in our case you only get directly influenced when you reach 18. I'm talking about normal people, not crazy gun toting settlers..
Oh and the army indoctrination doesn't teach you to hate, it teaches you the purity of the weapon and for example in the west bank we weren't allowed to shoot even if we think we were fired upon.. You had to be completely positive that someone is shooting directly at you.. In most cases the officers would just tell us to not shoot, no matter what..
That's just one example, I know, but still, goes to show that we're not indoctrinated to kill Arabs..

I think any nation that puts guns in the hands of children is doing something wrong, don't you?
Anyone that puts a real gun in their child's hands and teach them to point it at certain people is an idiot.

My focus wasn't on the suicide bombing themselves, it was on its targets, its methods, its brutality..
I'm sure you think the Israeli army is as brutal as that... That's where you're wrong- There's a difference between walking up to a restaurant full of unarmed civilians who don't suspect you, and shooting the place up, and being in a warzone for of civilians with guns, ambushes on every corner, a very dense urban environment, where the walls are booby trapped, and sometimes the only way to tell civilian from terrorist is waiting to be shot in the face...
See, Israeli soldier don't kill in cold blood.. Fear, maybe, pressure, maybe, making a mistake, or a bad call, maybe, going crazy, maybe.. Wouldn't you?
But never in cold blood.. When you're in a war there's no room for cold blood.. There's fear of death on one side, and a guy with a gun on the other side.. And what if you think that guy has a gun and he didn't? And what if you saw that person standing there and suddenly you're hit by an RPG?
I'm telling you, there's no cold blood, there's just fear of dying.

And in Cast Lead all these people weren't even supposed to be there.. The IDF tried to tell people to move out of the fighting zones.. How can we fight Hamas when they insist on fighting within their people, instead of trying to prevent any harm from coming to them?

And on your last point we finally agree..
There's no point. No point in these photos, no point in this bloodshed, no point..
Just more fuel to the fire of hate that surrounds this land.
There is only one truth to this conflict- We're all only human. When you take that away from either side, you start doing more damage then good.

As always, with respect,
Eliad.

[edit on 21-7-2010 by Eliad]