Ahmadinejad Demands U.S. Stance on Israeli Arsenal

reply to post by SLAYER69

Why?

It's a good thing the US isn't running the planet. Why don't they ask the French or South Africa how Israel got those supposed nukes in the first place? Maybe they should work a deal with them for their own projects.

This reminds me of a spoiled child who stomps their feet whines and points their finger at somebody else instead of copping to it's own activities. What bearing does this have on their own program? Nothing, that's right absolutely nothing.

Yes in fact it has everything to do with this issue and your accusations regarding the concerned party of Iran of being a child in its insistence of applying, even, transparent and above board standards that all parties must equally abide by is in fact the exact type of behavior that you decry.

It is because of that desire to impose dual standards that 48% of the annual budget goes to maintaining gunboat diplomacy and military empire that appeals to some people’s warped sense of vanity and false sense of superiority as they try to justify the imposition of a might makes right mindset, that leads to nothing but acrimony and war, as all people want to be treated equal and deserve to be treated equal.

All your comments are is a brutish attempt at emotional manipulation by insisting the immature thing to do is the mature thing to do, and that mature thing to do is an immature thing to do.

It is that type of thinking that creates the vacuum that allows our tax dollars and military and the lives of our children to be squandered on acquiring resources for corporations who only then further extort us and profit off of their hording of them.

Pitiful, truly pitiful.

reply to post by DEEZNUTZ


I'm thinking the U.S.'s influence is already weakened, but not in the way you meant, though one will soon follow the other.

We simply cannot afford...straight up...more war in another country., not financially and not public opinionwise. Afghanistan is sucking it up and so is Iraq still. Once upon a time Bush had a plan where the coalition nations would pitch in for that cost. I'd wager we haven't see a penny.

I don't know what kind of pot of gold is hidden there that could possibly ever be worth all this or could possibly ever recoup all this cost. If it's to prop up a failing economy somehow, wow. Because there is nothing on the horizon, at least that they will speak of, that will keep this afloat forever.

We just can't get into Iran militarily. But Israel might and that might drag us in, and this will not be good for anyone because you're right, Russia and China and probably even India would secretly be gleefully clapping their hands. People can deny that all they want, but it's not a question of them backing Iran...it's a question of what's in it for them. And Slayer is also right to a degree in that Iran is prime real estate and controls some major chokepoints both over land and via the strait. And their ally Venezuela very nearly controls another near our Gulf of Mexico.

Just some thoughts...

reply to post by ~Lucidity


We simply cannot afford...straight up...more war in another country


This I dont agree with....

The US has been broke for years, surviving on more and more debt..

Do you really think TPTB would care if they had to burden the, still inborn taxpayers, with even more debt so they could start another war for good ole Israel??

The US will do as Israel demands, as usual....

reply to post by SLAYER69

This reminds me of a spoiled child who stomps their feet whines and points their finger at somebody else instead of copping to it's own activities. What bearing does this have on their own program? Nothing, that's right absolutely nothing.

What knowledge of the activities in Iran do you have? None, that's right, absolutely none.

Cancer cases are skyrocketing in Iran and guess what you need to treat cancer patients? Not nuclear weapons.

Power outtages are not rare, even in the capital of Iran. Three guesses as to why.

He is not pointing a finger, he doesn't need to. He's pointing out the obvious. Iran is not in the wrong here, Israel and the US are.

(I didn't even bother explaining why the cancer rates are skyrocketing along with several other crippling diseases the Iranian population has been bombarded with, along with the massive heroin addiction, you know, the heroin US forces help protect and distribute in Afghanistan - along with huge jobless rates including students that have graduated because SANCTIONS prevent businesses from operating).

Here's an interesting bit of reading about Iran's reactor history if anyone is interested. Gives a little perspective on how long this has been going on and how complicated it has gotten. Bushehr

This is some of what Halliburton was doing work with Iran on. Link, work that went on well past the date where they were not to have been dealing with Iran.

Here's a video of the Halliburton hearing. Pretty interesting stuff.


Contrast this to what's beginning to look like a very similar set of issues arising with Jordan.

There have been many interesting points discussed here. I just have one other thing to say on this for now. What has Iran done to anyone? Oh, they have a leader with a big mouth? I'm sure we could all fill a page or two for that list to be complete, as there are many leaders who have big mouthes and like to imitate the alpha male gorilla and pound their chests and act threatening.

I'm sure we all can remember these recent headlines

NPT forum approves steps to disarm

Source

Obama: Singling out Israel wrong

Source

This was when the NPT member States documented that they wanted a nuclear free ME and for Israel to abide by the same rules as everyone else. Israel and Obama cried foul even after Obama has called for a nuclear free world.

Why are the rules only applicable to certain players? I think that is the question many are asking of this situation. The hypocrisy in this is sickening.

No one in their right mind wants to go to war, least of all those who are tasked with carrying it out for some ill conceived agenda to further some selfish or greedy end.

Originally posted by DEEZNUTZ
Love him or hate him, you have to admire his willingness to expose the hypocracy of Western Nations. Hilary Clinton just last month expressed that there is a desire to have a nuclear weapons free Middle East.

Evil always outsmarts itself.

The US will refuse to answer his question - they have no choice.

reply to post by Wayne60


We all know the answer to the question. They've done nothing wrong. They're simply in the crosshairs for a number of reasons, none of them having to do with nukes.

And their crazy leader really isn't that crazy if you observe him for 5 years or so and really try to understand what he's doing. He's quite the opposite of crazy. He's a man willing to challenge the world (although we all know it's not really the entire world) and call the world's attention to this situation...anyway he has to. And he doesn't care how crazy he looks doing this.

I'm sure there are many who would love to see his statue toppled and a noose around his neck. But I don't think that's going to happen...this time.

reply to post by NuclearPaul

Do you really think the U.S. can? Of course they have no choice. There's no real graceful way out of this mess.

Originally posted by SLAYER69
Why?

US is spearheading the sanctions and indirect talks that's why I believe Iran's President is calling out United States.

It's a good thing the US isn't running the planet.

On the contrary US is running the planet or so it thinks. For eg. ignoring the world body like United Nations and invading Iraq does prove that United States thinks it's running the planet and can do anything without any repercussions and so far it has proven to be correct. Several vetoing of UN resolutions aimed at Israel by United States again proves that United Nations is running it's own game rather than being a team player.

Why don't they ask the French or South Africa how Israel got those supposed nukes in the first place?

Simply stating I believe you already are aware of the answer but I'd reply you anyway. United States President Barack Obama has called for nuclear free world not France or South Africa. Again repeating the same thing United States is spearheading sanctions and other activities aimed at Iran's nuclear program.

Maybe they should work a deal with them for their own projects.

Iran did discuss new nuclear deal with Brazil and Turkey only to be ignored, resisted and sanctioned by US.

This reminds me of a spoiled child who stomps their feet whines and points their finger at somebody else instead of copping to it's own activities. What bearing does this have on their own program? Nothing, that's right absolutely nothing.

I would not reply to this as it's simply a mindless rhetoric.

Originally posted by SLAYER69
What bearing does this have on their own program? Nothing, that's right absolutely nothing.

[edit on 9-7-2010 by SLAYER69]

Do you truly believe the words you wrote and I quoted, pro or anti Israel you surely have to accept that their nuke weapon stockpile has a bearing on the issue in question.

I think everyone on this board is missing something critical here.

WHAT HAPPENED TO THE PEOPLE WHO HAVE TO LIVE WITH NUKES ON THEIR SOIL? HAVE THEY NO SAY AT ALL??????

So far, it had been a bunch of leaders and illegitimate leaders spouting rhetorics, but had any of the Iranian People a say, more so with a gang of hoodlums at the helm, representing only senile old men but NOT the other generations?

Some, like Lucidity, had constantly supported the puppet Ahmad and even praise this proven mad man. Who is he but a nutcase who would willingly murder and torture his own unarmed people for protesting and seeking a cleaner democracy by vote? Are such leaders worthy of praise and worship? It sure does tell on the character of his followers.

America, France, Israel, and a dozen other democratic countries had nuke. So far, by the evidences of the vote, non of such citizens are complaining about nukes on their soil even when faced with the reality of such powerful weapons.

The reality of nuke is that NO country will just fire one nuke, then sit down and negotiate for better terms over tea. IT WILL BE A MASSIVE MULTIPLE SIMOUNTANEOUS LAUNCH OF EVERY NUKE IN THE NATION'S ARSENAL TO WIPE OUT THE ENEMY!

That means that when even just one nuke is sensored to have launched, within seconds both nation sides of humanity will cease to live for thousand of years and become a radioactive wasteland affecting even neighbouring countries as the radioactive isotopes lingers in the air, move with the winds as our planet revolves.

This is something the soveriegn People of Iran must live with if it accepts nukes, PROVIDED they are given the choice. But had they? Nope. Only the puppets, the senile old masters and Lucidity who support such animals here made that choice for the Iranian People.

And this is more critical than who owns what before and in the future. The PEOPLE of ANY nation, must be allowed to make such critical choices, and with it, take that responsibility, come hell or highwater. Any other political onemanship talk or rhetoric is just PURE DISTRACTION!

Have a heart for the people please, even if the senile old men soon to die of old age anyway don't.



[edit on 10-7-2010 by SeekerofTruth101]

reply to post by SeekerofTruth101

Have you asked the people of Iran if they would prefer to have power or continue living with the rolling brownouts and blackouts? I'm almost certain there are some surveys out there somewhere.

Oh, so Ahmadinejad is now turning into a killer? Are we recycling that story too now?

And to be very clear, I do not support either Ahmadinejad or nuclear weapons. I am attempting to remain impartial and objective and look beyond the rhetoric and propaganda.

And remember this. You may or may not know my real stance at all. I could very well be doing this as 1.) a way to further and stimulate the discussion, 2.) learn to be objective, or 3.) play the ole devil.

Nice try, though.

reply to post by ~Lucidity


I call your hand now and say it's BS. Please do not take anyone for a fool here. Is admitting what you had written which is clear evidence of where your support lies so difficult? Call a rose by any other name and it smells the same, same with BS too.

But you and I don't matter, for we both are insignificant and nobodies here, just annonymous nicks. IT'S THE SOVERIEGN PEOPLE OF IRAN that matters, and it will be them, with the truth, that can solve the conumdrum of war today.

And the truth are based on facts, logic and realities of what is actually happening in Iran today, not propagandas, and the most critical fact is that it is ruled by illegitimate rulers today, whitewash what you will. Try nice or not is immaterial.

Failing to resolve it...there is nothing more to say....except sit back and say your last goodbyes in every nation as new terrors are unleashed by senile mad dying old men...

I was just reading this Most Israelis could live with a nuclear Iran: poll. Pretty interesting. Seems the vast majority believe that even against a nuclearly armed Iran, their own nukes would be a deterrent to outright annihilation.

This was interesting too...I learned a lot. And it seems to have been thoughtfully administered. I'm linking to a blog because the actual poll and analysis is a PDF that I can't figure out how to link to from here. Poll : Iranians Willing to Forego Nuclear Weapons in Return for Normalizing Relations

When you get there, click full report in the first paragraph.

[edit on 7/10/2010 by ~Lucidity]

Originally posted by SeekerofTruth101
reply to post by ~Lucidity

 

I call your hand now and say it's BS. Please do not take anyone for a fool here. Is admitting what you had written which is clear evidence of where your support lies so difficult? Call a rose by any other name and it smells the same, same with BS too.

But you and I don't matter, for we both are insignificant and nobodies here, just annonymous nicks. IT'S THE SOVERIEGN PEOPLE OF IRAN that matters, and it will be them, with the truth, that can solve the conumdrum of war today.

And the truth are based on facts, logic and realities of what is actually happening in Iran today, not propagandas, and the most critical fact is that it is ruled by illegitimate rulers today, whitewash what you will. Try nice or not is immaterial.

Failing to resolve it...there is nothing more to say....except sit back and say your last goodbyes in every nation as new terrors are unleashed by senile mad dying old men...

Call away. I'm confident in my goals and my actions. More likely, the real terrors will be unleashed if the U.S. and Israeli governments, not people, continue perpetrating these sanctions and this campaign on the people of Iran and the world.

[edit on 7/10/2010 by ~Lucidity]

Originally posted by SeekerofTruth101
had constantly supported the puppet Ahmad and even praise this proven mad man. Who is he but a nutcase who would willingly murder and torture

Please show me the certificate from some medical institute declaring him to be mental. Can you show some police report or charges filed against him for murder and torture to backup your claims?

his own unarmed people for protesting and seeking a cleaner democracy by vote?

Can you prove the elections were not fair and Mahmoud Ahmadinejad rigged the elections?

Are such leaders worthy of praise and worship?

Don;t know but it's not illegal to praise someone good deeds and fair call.

It sure does tell on the character of his followers.

Does that mean it would also tell about the character of people who voted a President who illegally invaded Iraq on pretense of nuclear weapon? oes it also tell about the character of people under whose presidency prisoners were abused and tortured in Abu Gharib and other such facilities?

America, France, Israel, and a dozen other democratic countries had nuke. So far, by the evidences of the vote, non of such citizens are complaining about nukes on their soil even when faced with the reality of such powerful weapons.

The reality of nuke is that NO country will just fire one nuke, then sit down and negotiate for better terms over tea. IT WILL BE A MASSIVE MULTIPLE SIMOUNTANEOUS LAUNCH OF EVERY NUKE IN THE NATION'S ARSENAL TO WIPE OUT THE ENEMY!

That means that when even just one nuke is sensored to have launched, within seconds both nation sides of humanity will cease to live for thousand of years and become a radioactive wasteland affecting even neighbouring countries as the radioactive isotopes lingers in the air, move with the winds as our planet revolves.

Irrelevant to this discussion.

This is something the soveriegn People of Iran must live with if it accepts nukes, PROVIDED they are given the choice. But had they? Nope.

You seem pretty sure about it. I love to call you on this and prove you wrong on your face; From
Iranian Public Opinion on Governance, Nuclear Weapons and Relations with the United States

Nuclear Weapons

Both the TFT and WPO polls show the vast majority of Iranians want their country to develop nuclear energy. TFT found that 89 percent of Iranians favor (including 78% who strongly favor) "the Iranian Government developing nuclear energy." [TFT, Q 12a] WPO found that 90 percent of Iranians believe it is important (including 81% very important) for Iran "to have a full fuel cycle nuclear program." [WPO, Q 28]

Both polls also show that the Iranian public's support for the development of nuclear weapons is considerably less than that for nuclear energy, but how much less depends considerably on how the question was posed. TFT asked about Iran's government developing nuclear weapons immediately after its question on nuclear energy and found a slim majority in favor (51% vs. 39% opposed). [TFT, Q 12b] WPO asked several questions about Iran foregoing nuclear weapons in the context of different international proposals that did not limit Iran's nuclear energy program. Each of these questions found a clear majority willing to accept the proposal. For example, 58 percent favor (vs. 26% oppose) the following offer:

"Suppose the U.N. Security Council were to say that it would accept Iran having a full fuel cycle nuclear program limited to the enrichment levels necessary for nuclear energy, if Iran agrees to allow the IAEA permanent and full access throughout Iran to ensure that its nuclear program is limited to energy production." [WPO, Q 34; also see QQ. 27 and 74]

TFT found large majorities of Iranians saying they would be willing to forego developing nuclear weapons in return for "trade and capital investment to create jobs" (70% support vs. 22% oppose) and "technological assistance for developing peaceful nuclear energy" (71% vs. 20%). [TFT, QQ 13a, 13d]

Only the puppets, the senile old masters and Lucidity who support such animals here made that choice for the Iranian People.

Add me to that list as well, because so far you have not been able to prove anything except calling other senile, animal, mad blah blah blah

If that makes you mad, good.

And this is more critical than who owns what before and in the future. The PEOPLE of ANY nation, must be allowed to make such critical choices, and with it, take that responsibility, come hell or highwater. Any other political onemanship talk or rhetoric is just PURE DISTRACTION! Have a heart for the people please, even if the senile old men soon to die of old age anyway don't. [edit on 10-7-2010 by SeekerofTruth101]

I advise you to follow your own advise!

Originally posted by SeekerofTruth101
reply to post by ~Lucidity

 

Is admitting what you had written which is clear evidence of where your support lies so difficult?

So let me see you have not proven anything to be lie yet and still calling it a lie. Prove anything written here is a lie, if you cannot, why there's always my hand you can talk to

reply to post by ~Lucidity


If Saudi Arabia has nukes they purchased them on the black market. I am sure no one gave them to them. Most probably they do not as Israel has not cried about them. Iran, it seems to me is well within their treaty rights to build reactors for electricity. To my knowledge the IAEA has never found any nuclear fuel diverted for weapons. Their only "crime" seems to be ignoring a UNSC resolution prohibiting enrichment. Israel has ignored 160 resolutions without any penalty.

Iran has said their their reactor will be ready to produce electricity in September. It is not possible to destroy it after the fuel is introduced without tremendous loss of life. Not that Israel seems to care about loss of life.

Originally posted by ~Lucidity

Call away. I'm confident in my goals and my actions. More likely, the real terrors will be unleashed if the U.S. and Israeli governments, not people, continue perpetrating these sanctions and this campaign on the people of Iran and the world.

[edit on 7/10/2010 by ~Lucidity]

I've called, and now for all to see your stained hand, its goals and actions through your posts. It is up to them to consider.

My opinions means nothing anyway, more so for those who are blind to realities even in the face of facts they themselves put up, such as the poster after your post.

I do not live their lives. They and you and I will have to live with the consequences of what we say and write to others. We do not live each others' lives.

One more thing for clarity sake which must be disputed least others presume I am blind, those 'sanctions and campaigns' you written are meant only for the illegitimate leadership of the Iran, and not the world.

Certainly some suppliers of sanctioned goods from other some parts of the world, bet certainly not the entire world as you wished to hoodwink others in your inimitable style.

Peace be unto you and may the politically motivated murdereds' cries in Iran let you and your kind sleep well at night.