Whatever happened to FDR's second bill of rights?

Originally posted by Someone336
reply to post by JonInMichigan

 

Um, lazy stoners? I have payed for everything I have ever owned, including my education.

I have a healthy respect for the markets; they are the force that allows us to be something other than a stone-age society.

However...

When 1% of the GDP is executive bonuses, something is wrong.

When mega-corporations get ridiculous tax-breaks and bail-outs at taxpayers expenses, we are working in a broken system.

When our government destroys small business with sanctioned monopolies (corporations), wealth cannot and will never be properly distributed according to the whims of the market.

With our defense budget, we could alleviate world hunger.

With a universal currency to do business end, we could end our necessary trade deficit and rebuilding our economy.

With tariffs, a progressive income tax, and no imperialistic designs, we could build towards the ideas displayed in the Second Bill of Rights.

When 1% of the GDP is executive bonuses, something is wrong.

The Second Bill of Rights is not a Utopian, pie-in-the-sky dream. It could easily be reality, if we only saw past the lenses of greed.

yeah. The system is borked. I'll give you that. Take it back to the constituion as it was intended. It's not a sin to be rich

(if you do it honestly)

I make about $14 US an hour at a 40hr week. I have insurance. You talk about ending world hunger? BS. The countries that are in that state are keeping the food from their people.

Remember Live Aid? Most of that food rotted on the docks.

But ooooooh how the bleeding hearts felt soooooo good about doing it all.

86 the defense budget? they would only take what you could see and that would put us in a bad position.

Respect only comes with Strength. Period. Thats why were laughed at since Reagan.

Tariffs? Good idea. Progressive taxation? Bad idea. They pass the cost to the consumer and the price goes up to compensate.

How about a 2% tax across the board. period.

Mega corps (walmart) are the bane of capitalism. That is predatory capitalism and every bit as bad a communism.

The answer is a constitutional government and 80% reduction in the size and power of the fed.

reply to post by felonius

yeah. The system is borked. I'll give you that. Take it back to the constituion as it was intended. It's not a sin to be rich

(if you do it honestly)

Oh, I agree entirely that it is not a sin to be rich. I hope to be rich someday! Pretty odd for such a big leftist, but I do believe in the market, incentives, etc.

You talk about ending world hunger? BS. The countries that are in that state are keeping the food from their people.

The reason third world countries are in such a crap-hole is because we keep pushing the idea, via neo-liberal organizations such as the World Bank, et. al., that free market economics are what builds economies out of poverty. This was not true for America, nor was it true for any proclaimed "free-market miracle" (Chile, South Korea, Japan, Taiwan) out there. What we should be doing is investing in temporary state-planned economics in these countries; it is the most efficient way to build a nation.

86 the defense budget? they would only take what you could see and that would put us in a bad position.

Respect only comes with Strength. Period. Thats why were laughed at since Reagan.

I'm not for eliminating the entire defense budget; however, it is bloated and easily eclipses all other aspects of our spending. The majority flows into the coffers of corrupt defense contracting corporations, in the sinister system that Eisenhower dubbed the 'military-industrial complex', a quasi-capitalist system that defies free markets due to government selection for contracts based on undeniable cronyism. You may complain about your tax dollars going to public healthcare, but I will damn well complain about my tax dollars funding civilian deaths in the Middle East, dead American soldiers in foreign lands, and swank summer destination homes for CEOs.

Reagan's policies turned the entire world against us and made us lose so much respect on the world stage. That is what happens when you topple countries with reckless abandon just because your God-given system of democracy works against you. We have no business funding, training, and running networks of assassins, drug smugglers and death squads. Utter nonsense.

Tariffs? Good idea.

Progressive taxation? Bad idea. They pass the cost to the consumer and the price goes up to compensate.

In a system where corporations are reduced in size, competition would still maintain lower price regardless of the innovation of the progress income tax. Progressive income tax would also serve to even the playing field, so to speak, which is really what is also essential for a functioning market.

It is the great equalizer, if we allow it to be.

Originally posted by dreamseeker

Originally posted by ZuluChaka
reply to post by dreamseeker

 

What is next?
A right to internet and cable tv and hand lotion?

So we have all that we need, then who is going to actually work to provide it to us?

Now that sounds ridculous. Everyone has a right to live. Having shelter and food is not a luxery. I really thought most people on ats would agree with this. Most people on here are about rights; or is it just "their" rights?

REPLY: Whether one believes in a creator or not, the idea of God in our Constitution and Bill of Rights is a legal one. Our rights come from God, not man. people have no rights other than those enumerated in the Bill of Rights. No more, no less. Remember, the rights given to you by man can be taken away overnight.

No-one has a "right" to a job or house or education or government-run health care. They are not luxuries, either; they are privileges which must be earned.

All of you who agree with the guy who gave us the great Depression.... read the Bill of Rights, and let me know, or please list in a reply, all of the rights mentioned there which place a burden on other citizens. I'll help you out; there aren't any!!

reply to post by zappafan1

All of you who agree with the guy who gave us the great Depression.... read the Bill of Rights, and let me know, or please list in a reply, all of the rights mentioned there which place a burden on other citizens. I'll help you out; there aren't any!

That could be because the bill of rights isn't a list of rights we have, it's a list of things the government can't do.

www.archives.gov...

But back to the topic, for those of you that hold onto the conservative viewpoint of "ME first and [snip] YOU!" Unless you are already rich, guess what? You aren't going to be. It's a game, a sham, that if you work hard or invest right someday you are going to be a multi-millionaire.



Sorry to tell you, life doesn't work that way, never has, never will.

If you make a good living, good for you, you probably work very hard for what you have earned and it should make you proud.

If your like me, barely making it working a full time job. Well, for us, this is as good as it gets. Especially if you listen to the conservatives, the conservatives will tell you that you aren't working hard enough, you aren't worth enough, you aren't smart enough and you don't deserve to do any better. Conservatives will tell you that if you want to better yourself through education that you can't afford you aren't worthy of it anyway.

Conservatives will tell you that you don't deserve the opportunity, because you were born poor, and somehow, that is your fault and your only real option is to go into the military to fight wars and die on foreign soil for their benefit. If you survive, you might get the opportunity to go to school, get an education and then and only then will you have earned the right to make a decent living.

On the other hand, liberals will tell you that the government will take care of you, they tell you that all you have to do is get on SSI and you will be taken care of for the rest of your life. They want you to feel insignificant and think you can't do better, they want you to be on the government dole.

Liberals will tell you that everything can be handed to you on a silver platter as long as you fill out enough forms.

But make too much money? Forget it, you are too rich to get on any sort of assistance program. These programs are for those that WON'T work, these aren't for those of us that work dead end jobs and still barely make it.

reply to post by whatukno
you are not alone. I to barely get by, i work when i can, for with no one to back me for there is me my self and i yes i do have a gf she does what she can to help me in these tough times, use of her car for job interviews, or to go to work which in my field home repair, landscaping is hard to come by, hears a laugh had one come to my door, barely spoke a word of English willing to do the same work for 6.50 per hour per person there was 4 of them! i get 10$ by my self there is no way i could do it for $6.50. per hour not with out a bus. lin. Ins, work mans comp, ect. ect. Lately i have been waiting for the other shoe to drop, the stock market to hit rock bottom, the price of gas to hit 10$ a gal, and lastly the the real estate market to take a plunge a $100,000 home will be worth $10,000 and that is on a good month, so laugh now you rich yucks for your day will come and see how fast you yell FDR were are you know, i can see it now old Rush yelling into mic "Some one find me a copy of FDR's bill of right's" i bet then it will be done. BTW when it does ,tell Rush he can find a copy here on ATS.

reply to post by dreamseeker


Excellent Thread Dreamseeker BTW !


And why I said that is because everything that we have today in the USA is a result of the NWO coalition having succeeded in displacing what FDR had intended which was Equality for ALL Americans.

I have mentioned USMC Major General Smedley Butler and his book War is a Racket before here on ATS. Major General revealed to Congress the Business Plot which he being a true Patriot and in adherance to his military oath of defending the Constitution could have no involvement in.

Many here fail to realize that the Business Plot, a coup to takeover the US Govt by force, displacing FDR and institutionalizing the NWO order agenda as well as siding with the Fascist regimes in Europe was squashed as a result of Major General Butler and his testimony.

The same individuals behind the Business Plot were also commensurate in the financing of Adolph Hitler, BTW.

Who was involved with this financing as well as the Plot itself ?

None other than Prescott Bush. Yes, the GrandFather of George W. Bush.

Bill Cooper points out the bigger picture as far as the NWO agenda is concerned as well as the secret societies behind them in his book:

Behold a Pale Horse

For as we see the US Constitution further subjugated to the waste bin.
That is Exactly the intent of the NWO agenda, which is to abolish more and more of the few rights that we'd had , collapsing govts , as we know them creating chaos and dissent until they're inevitably ruling the entire world.

So in a nutshell that is what happened to FDR and anything he had attempted do in order to provide a semblance of equality for ALL Americans.
FDR was an obstruction to the Agenda as later too was JFK who was assassinated soon after signing his Executive Order 11110, which would have removed the power of the FED to coin our money and returned this Constitutional power to the U S Treasury.

So our biggest enemy to freedom IS NOT Communism, but Illuminism which is in essence a Fascist agenda originating with the secret societies of old who run this country as the Ruling Class today.

Originally posted by Someone336
reply to post by felonius

 

yeah. The system is borked. I'll give you that. Take it back to the constituion as it was intended. It's not a sin to be rich

(if you do it honestly)

Oh, I agree entirely that it is not a sin to be rich. I hope to be rich someday! Pretty odd for such a big leftist, but I do believe in the market, incentives, etc.

You talk about ending world hunger? BS. The countries that are in that state are keeping the food from their people.

The reason third world countries are in such a crap-hole is because we keep pushing the idea, via neo-liberal organizations such as the World Bank, et. al., that free market economics are what builds economies out of poverty. This was not true for America, nor was it true for any proclaimed "free-market miracle" (Chile, South Korea, Japan, Taiwan) out there. What we should be doing is investing in temporary state-planned economics in these countries; it is the most efficient way to build a nation.

86 the defense budget? they would only take what you could see and that would put us in a bad position.

Respect only comes with Strength. Period. Thats why were laughed at since Reagan.

I'm not for eliminating the entire defense budget; however, it is bloated and easily eclipses all other aspects of our spending. The majority flows into the coffers of corrupt defense contracting corporations, in the sinister system that Eisenhower dubbed the 'military-industrial complex', a quasi-capitalist system that defies free markets due to government selection for contracts based on undeniable cronyism. You may complain about your tax dollars going to public healthcare, but I will damn well complain about my tax dollars funding civilian deaths in the Middle East, dead American soldiers in foreign lands, and swank summer destination homes for CEOs.

Reagan's policies turned the entire world against us and made us lose so much respect on the world stage. That is what happens when you topple countries with reckless abandon just because your God-given system of democracy works against you. We have no business funding, training, and running networks of assassins, drug smugglers and death squads. Utter nonsense.

Tariffs? Good idea.

Progressive taxation? Bad idea. They pass the cost to the consumer and the price goes up to compensate.

In a system where corporations are reduced in size, competition would still maintain lower price regardless of the innovation of the progress income tax. Progressive income tax would also serve to even the playing field, so to speak, which is really what is also essential for a functioning market.

It is the great equalizer, if we allow it to be.

We see pretty close to the same way, a few differences.

Conservative Indepedent here.

I dont agree that Reagan caused us to be hated NEAR as bad as we have in the last 8 years or so.

Reagan made them some respect us and others FEAR us. I'm cool with that.

I'll take fear or respect any day of the week. It gets the job done either way.

I dont know how we would shrink businesses short of using our monopoly laws or maybe RICO statutes. At least not constitutionally.

I would be pleased as punch if walmart was cut in half! Crooked and bad for America.

reply to post by nh_ee


I think you give FDR way too much credit as a "good guy".

Great society? Socialism

Do you remember the gold confiscation?

How about the extended depression that the rest of the world made it out of EIGHT YEARS EARLIER?

He was no hero, he was a traitor.

There are two arguments that really get my blood boiling:

1. “If you aren’t born rich you’ll never get rich.”
2. “I don’t like the idea of the haves and the have nots.”

My story:
My parents were poor. Dirt poor. My dad was 18, and my mom was 19, when I was born and we didn’t even have a place to live. My dad took any odd job he could to put food on the table and we lived in the back room of my cousins house.

I went to public school and had poor grades. When I was 15 (in 1983) I started working for minimum wage and saved it all hoping to dig my way out of being poor. I enrolled in a local college as it was all I could afford. Several of my friends went too but quickly dropped out. They all said “this is BS. I can make $15 and hour working with my uncle in a plant” or similar stories. I had another friend who had good grades and got a paid scholarship to college. After one year he dropped out to start a landscaping business so he could “get rich quick”. They all thought I was a tool that I didn’t have a nice car, but drove a beater. They all thought I was a tool that I wasn’t buying boats and ATVs like them.

After managing working full time and going to college full time for the next 6 years (making a jump into the electrical engineering program after my grades came up from hard work in the first two years) I earned a BS in electrical engineering. Within one year of graduation I had a job paying $30k a year. I still didn’t make what my friends made that dropped out and got good factory jobs but I was on a path… a long methodical path… a mission if you will to succeed. It does NOT come over night. I saved the first year’s income and bought a modest house. Now things were beginning to change. The get rich landscaping business had topped out my friend’s income at about $30k. The factories were also somewhat dead-end for those friends who chose that route. About 4 years later after hard work and dedication I made about $45k and now I was having the toys that my friends laughed at me for not having just 5 years before.

Now it has been 25 years since I took that first part time job for $3.35 / hour and I make about $125,000 a year. I have a masters in electrical engineering now that I was able to easily pay for. I’m only 41 years old. All those old friends still live in the trailers in the trailer parks or in the modest apartments they got 5 years before me when we were only 20 years old. They all wish they had taken the smart path but were either greedy to have what they wanted right then without a long term effort or just too lazy to see any long term plan though. I wasn’t born yesterday. I have seen people succeed where others failed and it had nothing to do with me being born with any more affluence then those around me. In fact many of them, like the one with the scholarship or the ones who had more well off families, just chose to take a road that made their lives easy. But some of them feel it was unfair. Unfair they had made stupid decisions when they were young. Unwilling or unable to face their failures in life they choose to blame others for there failings.

“Give me what you have!” “I should have what you have!” “I worked really hard all these years at a plant and my life is going no where.”

Sorry!? What do you want me to say? I told them and they never listened.

Now, as I sit here in my office looking out my window over a beautifully landscaped corporate courtyard and of course you folks want me to feel guilty about what I have achieved. Why should I?

You want to take all that I have sacrificed in my life to get here and just take it because you feel you are entitled to it. Well I’ll tell you something, you’ll get it over my dead body.

“But don’t you care about people?” As I already stated earlier, I adopted two children out of the social services program that I am raising. My sperm works just fine, it was a choice to give back to society. I don’t just contribute to some scammed government system… I AM the system for a 12 year old boy and an 11 year old girl. I provide what every parent provides, plus my kids will have money to go to college when they get older. I teach them work ethics and the importance of self determination.

I didn’t go out an buy a dog, I got an abused Rottweiller from the animal shelter. Why? Because it’s the right thing to do!

Most people who know my family have no idea that my kids are adopted or any of that stuff. I only mention it here because you libtards may think I’m just another evil cold hearted conservative.

What I am is a person who worked hard to make it in a tough world and all I see is people who mirror the friends I once had who did nothing to help themselves in life… people who now blame me as the problem in the world. People who see people like me as the enemy… the “haves”. The evil “have” people.

What part about my story makes me evil? If you walked in my shoes for the last 41 years, how would you react if someone said “ya know what would be fair…let’s split your money between us so we can both have the same…”

NO. I refuse. I worked for it and I’m keeping it for me, my wife, my kids, and my dog, and if you don’t like it try to come and take it, because I own plenty of guns. For every one of you, there are plenty of people like me that won’t give up the country we believe in without a fight. I was taught that this country was founded on the principle that every person has an opportunity to try to make it and if you worked really hard and really smart you would make it. I did and I won’t apologize for it and I will only give up my liberty for those I choose to, like those two kids that I got out of the system. I’m working for 3 humans right now (plus my wife who works) plus all the leaches that are sucking off my tax money and you are all still looking for more. Screw you!

There I said it. Screw you! Rather than explaining why you're idiots I'll just give you the cold hard facts. Work harder. Work smarter and quit being a whiney cry baby about your shortcommings.




[edit on 8-7-2010 by JonInMichigan]

reply to post by JonInMichigan


First off, you aren't rich, you are top end middle class don't kid yourself.

Nobody wants [snip] from you. You have worked hard for what you have, and no one else is entitled to that but you.

What these liberals are talking about is the super wealthy, those people whom you have no hope of ever being. You know, those people who run their multi-billion dollar multinational businesses into the ground taking the entire economy with it, then have the audacity to ask the taxpayer for a handout? THEN, once they get it, they turn around dare to call themselves "talent" and give themselves million dollar bonuses.

Like I said before, when that whole mess was going on, if that's "talent", I can do that, I can run a multi-billion dollar multinational corporation into the ground and expect a million dollar bonus out of it, probably could do it with my eyes closed.

THAT'S who the liberals are after, not JonInMichigan who pulled himself up by his bootstraps and made something of himself.

No one want's anything from you.






[edit on 7/8/2010 by whatukno]

reply to post by whatukno


I never said I was rich. I wouldn't say I have no hope of becoming weathy but I'm done with trying to attain more than I have. I have all I need and I am satisfied with what I have. The VP of engineering at my company makes about 5 million a year. I could get there if I wanted but I have no desire. (No point in working my whole life away!)

So back to the point. In order to institute what FDR proposed, I most certainly will have to give up a substantial portion of what I have have.

Check the writings of Marx and Alinsky, the middle class getting wiped out is the first thing they want to do to set up a socialist / communistic state.

The middle class' days are numbered.

Edited to add:

I really have no problem with those that have worked their way up to CEO positions. The point I was trying to make was that it takes a lot of work to get there, and I get that. Those people work their whole lives for thier level and if they came from rich families then they worked to get there at some point along the way.

I can't stand the fact that some stupid actors get like $30 million a movie. At my pace I'll only make about 3M for my whole entire life's struggle.

The bankers are evil. The NWO as being designed by the fed, the Bilderburgs and the rest of their cronies are the true evil in this world. I want to audit the fed and am a big supporter for campaign for liberty and yes, I am a "Paul-tard". Go Ron Paul! Let's end the fed or there will be no middle class to shoot for in this world. The solution is not to steal from the middle class to give to the poor and those of you think it will come from the richy riches on the top are sadly mistaken. They will structure everything to levelout the middle and underclass so we all have nothing but a minimal existance in the end. They will do that to control us and make us surfs to them. You guys are just buything the propaganda. They are demonizing themselves in hopes that we will all be on the bottom while they stay on top. I just want to keep my middle and say to those who think they can't get there...they can. But not they way FDR suggested. What he suggested just plays perfectly into their plan.

I'm tired of this thread. Sorry to jump in with such long and passionate input. I saw the OP watched Zeitguist. I am a big fan of that, as well as "money masters", "capital crimes", and "loose change". But what the OP does not understand is that supporting the FDR thing is playing into the money masters hands. Support polititions who want to abolish the fed, support flat tax structures, get us out of these retarded wars (Obama has not), then we will have real CHANGE. Real change does not come from social programs that will break the backs of people like me who played by the "rules" all their lives, it will just lead to a class war. People like me have been preparing for that eventuality and it's becoming less of a joke every day. We agree on the ends, just not the means to that end. I think the socialist thinking will just get you the opposite of what you think it will. Just read history and stop believing the propoganda.


[edit on 8-7-2010 by JonInMichigan]

reply to post by JonInMichigan


The middle class in this country has been under attack for a LONG time.

It's not a recent event. Middle class jobs in this country have been shrinking and shrinking and shrinking. Look at the amount of education you had to get in order to get where you are. Now is that right? Many years ago, one wouldn't have to have a masters degree in order to make it in life. A high school diploma used to be someones ticket to middle class life. Not anymore.

Right now, I could be working as a park ranger in RMNP, (I took a class at a community college in high school.) unfortunately for me, they wanted me to intern with them for a period of time, at the time, I was finishing high school, and living on my own with a full time job, and I couldn't just not get paid and expect to live.

I don't do the welfare thing, I don't even do food stamps, I don't make a lot of money, but what I have I have earned.

Your right however, the FDR plan wouldn't work. Even if you took from the highest money makers in the country, it would simply not work. Right now, however, most anyone can afford a house in south east Michigan, you won't like the neighborhood at all, but you know what? Maybe if enough people bought those $400-$500 homes that weren't complete criminals the land value would go up and the neighborhood would improve.

reply to post by whatukno


I just added some content to my post above.

You are right. My dad did ok in the end with just a GED. In fact, by the time I was making my first college income he had everything I have now and he was my age. I mean he only made like $50k a year when he retired a couple years ago, but you could save and buy more with that money if you were careful. Those days are gone.

I'm just saddened that they have people believing that social justice is plan to turn this country around. Hasn't anyone read history? This is how it starts... complete and total dictactorships start with the promise of free crap.

We need to abolish the fed. It should be our #1 priority. HR1207 was supposed to audit the fed. Even though it had over 200 sponsors in the house it somehow failed. I think we all know how...they bought the votes. We are doomed from what I can tell. But by god do not help them along by believing in this socialist crap. This is part of the big plan the wealthy bankers have in mind. I think we are doomed on that too. They are trying to put everyone in a position where we have no choice.

Once my kids are adults (if we make it as a country that long)... I'm done. I'm quitting corporate America and just moving into a shack way up north. I don't need this crap any more. I just cash out what I have and live on peanuts. Grow and hunt my own food. We have been practicing for the last few years. My kids think hamburger tastes funny because I have been feeding them venison for so long.

reply to post by dreamseeker


Well hon, you sound A LOT younger than 35. I figured you were at most 23.

Originally posted by undinemyth
reply to post by dreamseeker

 

Well hon, you sound A LOT younger than 35. I figured you were at most 23.

I always loved this quote:

"If you are 20 and not a liberal, you have no heart. If you are 40 and still a liberal, you have no brain."

When I say liberal, I mean in the context of the FDR 2nd bill of rights. Modern day neo-liberal / socialist types. Not a real liberal who believes in liberty and freedom from big government.

reply to post by dreamseeker




If they are fully capable of working, and they choose not to work; then no, they do NOT have a right to food and shelter on my back or my neighbors back.
...back to your right to “happiness" argument. We all have the right to “PURSUE HAPPINESS”. Meaning you have the right to find the measure to OBTAIN HAPPINESS YOURSELF.

Even if a person does not have a job they should still have food and shelter

This has got to be the quote of the year.

Even though a person has good health, all thier arms and legs, and can walk upright... they should have the right to stand on the road median with a cardboard sign that has a quote on it that supposedly is directed towards capturing my humanity, to the point to where it then motivates my human emotion to routinely open my wallet, open the window, and hand the sign a 20 dollar bill, right?

The OP endorses extortion via the name of humanity.

No wonder, he's someone obviously in his thirties or fourties who has been brain washed to believe that he is owed something for nothing. He collects ~ MY ~ social security, and works two theoretical jobs.

Tell me OP, how much effort have you put into supporting social security through the efforts of verifiable employment? oh, but wait, you're collecting social security... why? are you disabled? missing arms and legs? you say you have two part time jobs, so you can obviously work, right?

let me ask you this, do you feel that someone who makes 50 thousand Dollars a year is rich? you must, since you live off of other people's hard earned retirement via the Social Communist Security plan.

COMMUNISM... everybody puts into the pot everything they produce, so that the commune can exist as a whole... I'm a lazy f***k, i provide a sack of Sh****t every other week for the pot... in return I am given food, clothing, and shelter! what a deal....

And to really be honest, when they're not looking I'll sneak into one of my comrad's properties and take theirs too...

But wait, it gets even better!

My job is to stand on the side of the highway with one of my children at my side and hold up a cardboard sign that will command the psychological mind to initiate the emotional nerve to cause those comming into contact with me and my sign to physically approach me and divulge a portion of thier ration from the commune for our impoverished benefit...


WOW, this whole OP, and the concept of the so called "second bill of rights" is a con job, meant for one purpose only, to rob me of my intellectual, and physical properties.

NO THANK YOU. IF YOU WISH TO LEECH OFF OF ME - YOU CAN GO TO BLAZINGS!

From my understanding of this thread, the left-wingers want everyone to have the right to live, and the right-wingers want everyone to fend for themselves in the current system.

I'm very liberal, but I see good points on both sides. Any good plan to improve the lives of America's poverty-stricken will have to take the points of both sides into consideration.

How about this. Establish public housing complexes. Make the disabled, the unemployed, and the homeless (most of whom are in their current situations through no fault of their own) eligible to apply to be fed and sheltered in these complexes, under the condition that they do some public volunteer work according to their abilities. Kind of like Marxism, except voluntary, and only for people who would benefit from it. These facilities would obviously be regulated in order to prevent abuse. Provided that adequate funding exists, I think this could make productive members of society out of the unfortunate, as well as raise the morale of their communities.

[edit on 7/8/10 by skooper1895]

[edit on 7/8/10 by skooper1895]

reply to post by JonInMichigan


Star and flag for the

MAN... who acted like a man, by MANNING UP... and being a MAN!

I'm SO SICK AND TIRED of these self proclaimed pitances who feel that I have to work hard, so they can have food to eat.

If you "people" don't know how to man up, and do what's required of you to not only survive, but to actually work to make you life secure and comfortable, That's your problem... NOT MINE.

WHY DO YOU WISH TO MAKE IT MINE, BY COMPELLING YOUR STATIST POLITICIANS TO ENACT LEGISLATION THAT TAKES FROM ME BY FORCE, TO GIVE TO YOU?!

To me, Obamacare was an act of war - because now I have to pay a tax on the employer paid healthcare plan that I WORKED HARD FOR TO ENJOY so that my stolen money can now give people like the OP free health care too...

I'm of the mind to start picking mushrooms... I'm tired of all the fungus growing on my country!

reply to post by Megiddodiddo


EXTORTION! Wow you are reading way way too much into this. I still can't believe these answers. Aren't most people on ATS either more open minded, liberal or indepedent? I became a member of this site in part to get away from the far right winged conservative judgemental people who were for the rich.