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Originally posted by hisshadow
If you saw some of these drunk hillbilly teapartyers n birthers on tv lately you'd see why we have to deem them gangs
Originally posted by piddles
reply to post by blood0fheroes
edited: this is actually going to cause more argument and thread derailment
[edit on 27-4-2010 by piddles]
If you saw some of these drunk hillbilly teapartyers n birthers on tv lately you'd see why we have to deem them gangs
Originally posted by hisshadow
If you saw some of these drunk hillbilly teapartyers n birthers on tv lately you'd see why we have to deem them gangs
That sentence is as poorly written as many of the signs those drunken hillbilly teapartiers carry.
Was it fear of hypocrisy that kept you from calling them racist too?
Originally posted by boondock-saint
it will be a sad sad day
if this passes
before u know it, I'm gonna have
to fill out a request to go take a cr@p
and then my toilet paper is limited
cuz I'm harming trees.
what a crock !!!
here's a hint big brother
u cannot micromanage
300 Million people
Originally posted by orangetom1999
Name calling and labeling is the bailiwick of left and socialist type thinkers.
Originally posted by kozmo
They've been demonizing patriot groups for the past 2 years. Remember the SPLC's list of "Hate groups" and "Domestic terrorists"? Under the Patriot Act one could only be arrested for violating a standing law. This attempts to codify that even being in a militia is illegal.
The Brown Shirts aren't coming, they are already here - we call them "Progressives"!
sorry but that happened in the early 90's, more than 4 people in a group considered a gang, gives the police the right to detain.
The Civil RICO Action Against PETA
The RICO suit levelled against PETA resulted from PETA's eight-month undercover investigation of the Huntingdon Life Sciences contract research laboratory. Our investigation revealed evidence of sickening cruelty to animals in tests conducted for leading makers of household products and pharmaceuticals. Workers routinely slammed monkeys into cages, suspended monkeys in mid-air while pumping test substances into their stomachs, and screamed and shook their fists in frightened monkeys' faces when they were strapped down for electrocardiograms. One technician stuffed a lotion bottle into a monkey's mouth as a "joke."
Upon completion of the investigation, PETA filed a 36-page complaint with the U.S. Department of Agriculture and went public. We gave the USDA our investigator's videotape of the conditions and procedures at the lab. Because of the settlement, I cannot show you that videotape. Fortunately, it was widely disseminated before the lawsuit ensued. We turned over photographs of lab conditions. I cannot show you those photographs, but they too were distributed before the lawsuit was filed. But I can tell you that conditions were deplorable and the animals suffered greatly. One Huntingdon supervisor's internal memo, dated January 30, 1997, tells technicians to look at the injuries they caused the animals and adds: "Just think how YOU would feel to be put into a cage and physically abused?" One of the lab's customers to whom we submitted our investigation results immediately suspended all testing with Huntingdon and conducted its own investigation, saying: "The attitudes and behavior shown by lab technicians on the tape are unacceptable to us."
At approximately the same time as PETA's investigation, a British television station was conducting its own undercover investigation of Huntingdon's British parent company. Huntingdon's British employees were filmed punching a beagle dog in the face and simulating a sex act during test procedures. Members of Parliament and British citizens were outraged. Not only did the company not sue the television station, it fired two employees who plead guilty to charges of animal cruelty. It then scrambled to keep its business license by complying with sixteen stringent requirements under Home Office scrutiny. We find it ironic and distressing that a similar investigation of animal cruelty against the American subsidiary was met with an onerous RICO suit rather than immediate and sweeping corrective action.
Despite the compelling facts, the lawsuit threatened our ability to hold Huntingdon accountable for its actions. The suit was filed by the largest law firm in Boston, with 360 attorneys. It was 80 pages long and contained 20 separate counts. These included three RICO counts which alleged that PETA's earlier animal cruelty investigations dating back to 1989 constituted a pattern of racketeering activity, including mail and wire fraud, transportation of stolen property, and extortion through the creation of a climate of violence against Huntingdon and the other subjects of our investigations. Huntingdon sought damages and legal fees exceeding $10 million.
Early in the case, we were slapped with a gag order which precluded us from further disseminating our findings to the public, and which even prohibited us from cooperating with the USDA investigation of our own complaint, despite USDA requests for our cooperation. Therefore, from the outset of the lawsuit, we faced the dilemma of fighting vigorously at great expense and great risk to our financial security, or knuckling under to Huntingdon's strongarm tactics. We chose to fight at every turn during the ensuing six months of intense litigation.
Ultimately we were vindicated when, as a result of our complaint and its own subsequent investigation, the USDA charged Huntingdon with 23 counts of violating the Animal Welfare Act, including:
o failure to maintain a program of adequate veterinary care;
o failure to ensure that animals used in toxicology tests received pain killers and anesthesia during procedures that caused pain and distress;
o failure to notify a veterinarian when animals needed medical care;
o failure to explain why dogs used in painful procedures were not provided with any relief from pain; and
o failure to construct and maintain cages that protect animals from injury.
Even though we fought hard, did not back down and obtained a satisfactory result in the end, some of the realities of civil RICO actions against nonviolent social advocacy became all too apparent. First, opponents of advocacy groups are permitted to make sweeping allegations of criminal conduct "upon information and belief" with no evidence to support such charges. Second, those broad allegations may permit those plaintiffs to engage in a discovery "fishing expedition" into virtually every aspect of every prior investigation or advocacy campaign. And third, the cost to properly defend against such charges and discovery, and the risks inherent in any litigation create profound impediments to aggressive advocacy work which is so vital to social activism. Thus, the civil RICO plaintiffs are able to extort silence concerning or termination of aggressive activism and research into allegations of misconduct by manipulating and misusing civil RICO actions. The impact of these effects is increased as the size and financial resources of the targeted advocacy group decrease so that the smallest and often the most active groups are most seriously imperiled.
Have you EVER turned on your tv or watched the news? Being petty is a universal thing, all political parties are guilty of it, the right in particular.
What is also happening as a byproduct of this is that Americans are beginning to lose confidence in their news media. They are recognizing them as shills for the various political parties....while "appearing" to be for the public interest.
And I mean ..."all" the media.
oh and the freedom to be indulgent is a freedom that you still have, along with all your other freedoms.
I also feel I should add that I am not ignorant of history, I kind of already understood the militia's importance like 200 years ago, and my initial question was more what they done recently.
I find absolutely everything you've been saying to be total BS. You say labeling, name calling, and stereotyping is a Leftist, Socialist action? Have you EVER turned on your tv or watched the news? Being petty is a universal thing, all political parties are guilty of it, the right in particular. The fact that you even describe name calling as socialist already discredits you considering what does that have to do with giving the gov't more power? Any idiot can call things they don't like "socialist", I see it everyday on fox news.
Ok, so name calling is only done by leftists and socialists?
Yeah you're right, the Right wingers are very mature individuals...
Originally posted by piddles
reply to post by kozmo
alright, they were needed to help establish this country. what about now? how are they relevant now? How have militias helped since the 1900s?
I fail to see the relevance of militias nowadays when they aren't even half as armed as the gov't they would seek to overthrow. It was different when everyone just had muskets and cannons.
Also do you acknowledge that militias have made their presence more well-known since Obama has been elected? Do you think it's feasible that a great deal of these people are band wagon jumpers, not dissimilar to the tea party members, rather than people who truly care?
edit: I also feel I should add that I am not ignorant of history, I kind of already understood the militia's importance like 200 years ago, and my initial question was more what they done recently.
[edit on 27-4-2010 by piddles]
The militia has NOT made itself more well-known since OBama's election - the media has! The militia has always been there. What you are witnessing now is pure propaganda AGAINST the militia in the hope that the government can villianize them to the point of shaming anyone involved and turning public sentiment against them. For an example in world history, take a look at what Hitler accomplished when disarming the German citizenry and the propaganda that accompanied his progroms.
And NO... I believe that these ARE people who truly care!
Originally posted by boondock-saint
I wonder if their true intent with this
bill is to distinguish between regulated
militia and a gang criminal element
like the bloods and crips.
I mean they might have a point
even if it is a very weak one.
I mean would you want the Crips
or Bloods to start recruiting
mass memberships just to
threaten citizens and commit
crimes of violence???
just a thought
Next, how have they helped since the 1900s? Well, so far, they have managed to keep the government scared and thus, in line. So scared in fact, that they are now looking for ways to make them illegal. The government knows full well that an armed and organized populace pose a grave danger to their plans to implement a global government and surrender our sovereignty.