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Freemason Knights Templar meeting here in Italy 2 days ago, changed my life...

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posted on Apr, 22 2010 @ 07:09 PM
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reply to post by muzzleflash
 


So we certain that your finding is a seperate confrence? I call bs on Vinny for changing his mind if he said you wouldn't believe who was there than that magnitude of persona surely reflects the confrence you found muzzleflash! I would try to
cover may A&@ if I were him
too!!




posted on Apr, 22 2010 @ 07:13 PM
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reply to post by YourPopRock
 





That too is the wrong term. My guess is this... our OP here read and gathered information on what the degrees were called from other threads. When wrong info was posted there, he simply parroted it... more proof of his spreading of nonsense.


It is entirely rediculous to engage in a conversation with those who deliberately keep secrets to the extent that there is no way to tell what is correct and incorrect, except to take there word as what is incorrect, simply because they say it is incorrect, without ever saying what is truly correct, because they keep secrets.

No credibility, so all we have because of that secretive nature, is people with no credibility, claiming someone else has none!



posted on Apr, 22 2010 @ 07:27 PM
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Originally posted by trusername
There are normal and crazy and rich and poor masons, just like there are normal and crazy and rich and poor dentists.

The only reason people are freaked out by them is because they trust each other and a lot of people have problems with trust.


That's what being brothers is all about right ?

I trust you to shut up. Don't break the trust. If you do talk, better carry a rucksack for them bowels.


Some folks really know how to live it up! And masons sure add new meaning to common words such as trust. Their word for God is cool too: Lucifer. I think I'm going to make sure my dentist isn't a mason. Especially as his brothers know I'm not on their side but on the side of humanity. They just might trust their brother to drill some sense into me?



posted on Apr, 22 2010 @ 07:31 PM
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reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler
 


You could always join Freemasonry and see for your self? But then again.. there are two types of men in this world. Those who talk and those who do. Those who scream about the injustice of 'secrecy' are almost always never the type to put a foot forward and step into the unknown.

You can speculate, you can make your outrageous claims, and you can pretend you know that which you're afraid of. The rest of us.. we once found the same mystic aspects of Masonry that you deem so frightening to be welcoming, a chance to venture into something for once without being disclosed what is to happen.

Masonry isn't for everyone.. but it's really a shame to see such an organization as Masonry to have such hateful libel and slander thrown at it by the few to ignorant to truly investigate its "secrets".

In my opinion anyways.. I don't pretend to speak for all of Masonry.



posted on Apr, 22 2010 @ 07:34 PM
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Another i was told a huge secret but can't share it thread

why even bother posting?



posted on Apr, 22 2010 @ 07:36 PM
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There is nothing to prove. Go to any website for the grand lodge in your state. You will see it is entered apprentice. It is all there.

Secondly, WHAT MAKES THIS MAN SPECIAL ENOUGH to fly from the United States to Northern Italy during a time when a gigantic volcano was spewing hot ash into the sky and grounding ALL air traffic in Europe arriving from the United States.

Those MUST have been powerful Templar men if they could part the ash cloud to allow the jewelry sales guy from Chicago to suddenly (and without any background check) fly through the suddenly filtered skies to arrive safely in Northern Italy only to be pulled away unexplicably from the real reason his company paid him to go there to become a clandestine diplomat interpretor for dark secret evil italian knights templar where he learned something so neat, he wished he could tell us.

News for you, we masons on this thread could easily identify each other based on the words that we use. You can tell us the secret since we are bound to an even stronger oath than you and if you are aware of evil, you are bound by your obligation to warn a master mason or a brother of your degree so as to prevent harm or inconvienence to a brother mason's self, family or property.

So, identify us brothers here in the thread through your signs, tokens and words of an entered apprentice and then tell us. Otherwise, you are dishonest and need to be remove from the craft or (more likely the case) a liar obsessed with all things masonic that you saw in da vinci code, angles and demons, from hell, national treasure and others.

So, in the most polite way possible to aid in your reformation, put up or shut up!



posted on Apr, 22 2010 @ 07:42 PM
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Originally posted by Rockpuck
reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler
 


You could always join Freemasonry and see for your self? But then again.. there are two types of men in this world. Those who talk and those who do. Those who scream about the injustice of 'secrecy' are almost always never the type to put a foot forward and step into the unknown.

You can speculate, you can make your outrageous claims, and you can pretend you know that which you're afraid of. The rest of us.. we once found the same mystic aspects of Masonry that you deem so frightening to be welcoming, a chance to venture into something for once without being disclosed what is to happen.

Masonry isn't for everyone.. but it's really a shame to see such an organization as Masonry to have such hateful libel and slander thrown at it by the few to ignorant to truly investigate its "secrets".

In my opinion anyways.. I don't pretend to speak for all of Masonry.


RockPuck,

You replied to another member but made blanket statements which can be construed as destined to a wider audience.

So I ask you to PROVE that there has been libel or slander here.

You can't because you are helplessly bound by ridiculous oaths of secrecy which are of no object. They should just forbid you from speaking at all - period. That way you would avoid the ridicule of making claims you are in no position to back up, even if you think you know the answers.

That's the unit you suggest we all join ?


I'd rather be one of those who talk (unlike you I can say everything I think) than those who do (ridiculous rituals and odious deeds I will have no part of).

Your imagery shows you to be a 32nd degree Mason, so maybe you are at the last level which isn't as deeply compromised as those above. Trust me, you don't want to be there. How do I know if I'm not one? Hell is something transmitted through family lines, and above your rank there are inductions at a very young age of their offspring. Some where that apron is sorely needed.

Call it slander, call it libel, and hope you never find out if you aren't already part of it.



posted on Apr, 22 2010 @ 07:47 PM
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reply to post by Rockpuck
 





You could always join Freemasonry and see for your self? But then again.. there are two types of men in this world. Those who talk and those who do. Those who scream about the injustice of 'secrecy' are almost always never the type to put a foot forward and step into the unknown.


To boldly go where every Mason has gone before? Too funny! That must have taken some real courage, and at least a funny looking hat! Does someone hold your hand?

I didn't say injustice, I said lack of credibility!




You can speculate, you can make your outrageous claims, and you can pretend you know that which you're afraid of. The rest of us.. we once found the same mystic aspects of Masonry that you deem so frightening to be welcoming, a chance to venture into something for once without being disclosed what is to happen.


Who says I am speculating or making outrageous claims? You would actually have to reveal all the things you are AFRAID to, in order to prove that it is speculation and or outrageous!

Further who says I am afraid of Masonry?

I face the unknown everyday, it just is not generally because someone is withholding information because of FEAR I might not show an interest, or to manipulate me towards a not fully disclosed goal.

This is called discretion, also known as the better part of valor!




Masonry isn't for everyone.. but it's really a shame to see such an organization as Masonry to have such hateful libel and slander thrown at it by the few to ignorant to truly investigate its "secrets".


Once again another unsubstantiated claim that can't be proven, because you can't meet the threshold you would require in others to meet their assertions.

In reality I very might well know secrets Masons will never learn, because they are stuck within a self contained enclave, encapsulated with circular information, ruled over by others using carrots and sticks.

There are many types of Masters in the World, yet the path to becoming any one of those requires first mastering oneself and ones own fears.

Isn’t it odd that all your contentions, invitations, and condemnations are based on various forms of fear?



posted on Apr, 22 2010 @ 07:47 PM
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None of the content of that post is verifiable.



posted on Apr, 22 2010 @ 07:49 PM
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reply to post by YourPopRock
 





Secondly, WHAT MAKES THIS MAN SPECIAL ENOUGH to fly from the United States to Northern Italy during a time when a gigantic volcano was spewing hot ash into the sky and grounding ALL air traffic in Europe arriving from the United States.


I debunked that foolish and dubious claim back on page 11, the OP never said when he arrived in Italy, but did say he was there to take part in a Jewlery Convention that did in fact start before the Volcano!

Can you say desperate, poorly researched, clutching at straws?

I bet you can!



posted on Apr, 22 2010 @ 07:53 PM
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reply to post by Getsmart
 


Indeed.. it is a general, blanket assertion of "anti Masons" as they are called..



You can't because you are helplessly bound by ridiculous oaths of secrecy which are of no object.


Well, it would be Libel, directed at those who ridicule and fabricate lies to demonize Masonry.



They should just forbid you from speaking at all - period.


I can tell you anything and everything except: Wording of the rituals. Handshakes. Passwords. Modes of recognition.

I have no problem telling you any of those even, as it's nothing spectacular, nor anything you cant easily find in a used book store.. but it's "taboo" to talk about it.. hmm .. another word, though you may not understand it.. would be respect of the institution.



I'd rather be one of those who talk (unlike you I can say everything I think) than those who do (ridiculous rituals and odious deeds I will have no part of).


Exactly. I know.




Trust me, you don't want to be there.


Trust based on what? Have you been there? Are you a 33rd degree Scottish Rite Freemason? numbers above 3 mean nothing in Freemasonry. And to say the 33rd is the highest is a deep insult to the hundreds of thousands of York Rite Masons who have no interest in the Scottish Rite. But what do I know.. I'm only a 32 (which isn't a huge accomplishment either) .. I'm woefully ignorant of what those 33rds get up to!



posted on Apr, 22 2010 @ 07:57 PM
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reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler
 


You childish remarks (as I have seen in another thread) simply show you have no idea what your talking about, and cannot back it up with actual evidence (as in another thread) .. when ever you do post anything you would consider "evidence" you have a tendency to be 100% wrong in your interpretation ..

You don't like Freemasonry.. because you don't understand it. You cannot understand it because you fear it. Whether you've come to terms with that or not is neither here nor there. You fear simply not understanding something, so when you don't understand you fabricate intricate beliefs to mask your ignorance. It's interesting to watch.



posted on Apr, 22 2010 @ 07:57 PM
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reply to post by VinnyboyXI
 


I myself am not a mason.
But I do alot of speculating and research and discussion about Masonic subjects.. 'the grand plan' etc.. world events...
and that's fine by me to discuss because to me it's the most fascinating subject in the world and encompasses all aspects of reality..

but man.. if I was a mason, like you claim to be... and swore allegiance to brotherhood and secrecy??...

I would never divulge anything... that's just common decency and word of law... word is bond.

you hypothetically (you claim) .. are a mason.. you in my eyes are lucky..
I haven't been able to be one.
but someone like you gets to be?
why abuse something that is such an honor?
you get to be part of something that has such honorably high goals and standing in world affairs..
and you discard it just like that?

you just don't do that. .. to your fellow brothers, or for the sake of endangering potential outcomes.

Although I clicked and initially found it interesting.. I don't respect you for divulging things like this.

I think you made a very poor decision in hopping on a public internet message board and blabbing for the sake of blabbing.

-



posted on Apr, 22 2010 @ 08:02 PM
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Congratulations, you are in an evil secret society that lords its information over others for power and threatens and kills former member that speak out against it. Nice! Good job! I would tell you that Jesus wouldn't support your choice of friends but I know you don't believe in him at this point in your life. Most Masons think Lucifer is their God, the Light Giver! Do the research. Anybody that denies Lucifer doesn't have any links with the Masons is a foo Look at Bush, that fool thinks he is a Christian even though he's a member of Skull and Bones! lol

Only evil needs the cloak of secrecy, but keep on thinking it's cute and fun to be the "chosen" elite so you can rub shoulders with the other sick elites that have screwed up the planet. You have a big surprise coming on judgement day if you don't let God guide you. I hope for your sake you take Jesus Christ as your savior before then. It's never too late to repent, but if you die before you repent, you are doomed! Since you never know when you die, you are risking your soul for being part of the Masons or any secret society for that matter.

Go read the book "23 Minutes in Hell" for a preview of your next not so secret society you'll be joining if you don't repent. You'll get the lifetime membership if you don't have a come to Jesus meeting before then. I will pray that you will let God into your heart before that fateful day. The days of secrets are over. This planet is doomed until we stop playing the secret society "priest" class games and start doing good works out in the open. Please grow up and quit being a child. Be a man of God and be open about what you are doing. There's no need for secret handshakes and decoder rings when you do God's work. God will welcome you back into his arms at any time, all you have to do is ask forgiveness and of course rebuke your secret society membership. Nothing you will attain on this Earth no matter how powerful the Masons are is worth what you are risking.

What secret society would Jesus be in?



posted on Apr, 22 2010 @ 08:06 PM
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reply to post by Rockpuck
 




  • null




Well, it would be Libel, directed at those who ridicule and fabricate lies to demonize Masonry.


Yes if evidentiary standards could be met, which they can’t, because there is no definitive legally recognized description of Masonry because it is a secret society.

I could tell you this, and I could tell you that, or you could find this out here, or there, are not exactly the kind of things a discerning and critical mind like that of a Civil Court Judge would require in establishing all the facts as to whether a particular statement is libelous.

So all we have is a whole lot of deflection and double talk that amounts to nothing but smoke and mirrors, alternately for recruitment, and also for blanket denials.

What is clear is there was no hesitation on the part of many Masons to slander the OP from the onset and make a wide range of unfounded assertions and condemnations.

So we are seeing incredible double standards employed.



posted on Apr, 22 2010 @ 08:08 PM
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Originally posted by YourPopRock
News for you, we masons on this thread could easily identify each other based on the words that we use. You can tell us the secret since we are bound to an even stronger oath than you and if you are aware of evil, you are bound by your obligation to warn a master mason or a brother of your degree so as to prevent harm or inconvienence to a brother mason's self, family or property.

So, identify us brothers here in the thread through your signs, tokens and words of an entered apprentice and then tell us. Otherwise, you are dishonest and need to be remove from the craft or (more likely the case) a liar obsessed with all things masonic that you saw in da vinci code, angles and demons, from hell, national treasure and others.

So, in the most polite way possible to aid in your reformation, put up or shut up!


Well, dear aggressive brother and fellow ATS member overwhelmed with human charity for mankind ? What's eatin' ya ?

We non masons on this thread can also easily identify you, thanks to the words you use. They are disparaging, demeaning, disrespectful, disheartening, disinformative and tend towards the disgusting. Does that code suffice to trigger the hand signs and itchy witchy salutes?

Spewing hatred towards a visibly young and candid poster here at ATS is by no means acceptable behavior but an abuse of position and power. Please note that it is not something I like to follow suit in, but will if needed to defend one of your innocent victims from such predatory attack. Just ask your pal Augustus Maximinus and he'll let you know when to back down. You guys don't relish revelation, and I've got some in reserve for days like this.

So cut this kid some slack, and spare him the secretive self-impressed sneaky co-conspirator "reveal your marks of obedience" spiel. Mason or not, he doesn't owe you anything. This is an example of an abusive SECT which uses totalitarian hierarchal pressure to dominate men and destroy their souls. You should be too ashamed to post here among decent human beings. Remember your grandma, from where she is she can see you now, and knows how compromised you've become. Knocking down a young man for posting his new insight in a forum which destines itself to exactly that - it that such a crime? In whose world?

That of the Free
Mason ?!?

You aren't defending your cause, you are irremediably discrediting it. Brothers, brothers, quick! Such harmful misconduct calls for grave sanctions: No blood tonight before bedtime.



posted on Apr, 22 2010 @ 08:09 PM
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reply to post by Rockpuck
 





You childish remarks (as I have seen in another thread) simply show you have no idea what your talking about, and cannot back it up with actual evidence (as in another thread) .. when ever you do post anything you would consider "evidence" you have a tendency to be 100% wrong in your interpretation ..


Ah some would say this is slander, and others would say this is unsourced, since you provide no specific references, and others would claim you were in fact 100% wrong in your interpretation.

Yet the thread isn't about the fear and esteem that the Masons on ATS reserve for me!

The thread is about Vincent! And what occured to him in Italy, at a Masonic Lounge!

Typical tactics, that if you actually read the thread you would see the bulk of ATS members frown on!

Can you provide any intelligent discourse regarding Vincent's Post, and what the thread is about?



posted on Apr, 22 2010 @ 08:15 PM
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Originally posted by ProtoplasmicTraveler

To boldly go where every Mason has gone before? Too funny! That must have taken some real courage, and at least a funny looking hat! Does someone hold your hand?



I feel I have to step in here. You sir, have been very misinformed. Masons receive an apron on their 1st degree. Nothing more is conveyed to the brother in the blue lodge until he becomes master. then he gets to use hos own hat. (if it's silly, it's his own damn fault)

Silly hats are reserved for the Scottish Rite and the Shrine. It's a toss up as to which one is sillier. I feel better now that I have shed light in a dark place.



posted on Apr, 22 2010 @ 08:17 PM
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Originally posted by ProtoplasmicTraveler
reply to post by YourPopRock
 





Secondly, WHAT MAKES THIS MAN SPECIAL ENOUGH to fly from the United States to Northern Italy during a time when a gigantic volcano was spewing hot ash into the sky and grounding ALL air traffic in Europe arriving from the United States.


I debunked that foolish and dubious claim back on page 11, the OP never said when he arrived in Italy, but did say he was there to take part in a Jewlery Convention that did in fact start before the Volcano!

Can you say desperate, poorly researched, clutching at straws?

I bet you can!


OK, let me get this straight...

You want me to document something to disprove it when we have never even gotten shred 1 of proof from the OP of his fairytale that you are wanting to see me disprove?!?

It is that kind of dizzing intellect you posess that makes it impossible to please you. You bring me proof he was there to support his claims. I will happily disprove him simply based on the silly things that he didn't realize he was saying. A semi interesting story, but as my momma always said... Crack don't smoke itself.

The whole poorly conceived fib the OP told demonstrating his involvement in Masonry was a whole lotta stupid wrapped in a crispy shell of crazy! I mean that in the best way possible!



posted on Apr, 22 2010 @ 08:22 PM
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reply to post by Rockpuck
 




You don't like Freemasonry.. because you don't understand it. You cannot understand it because you fear it. Whether you've come to terms with that or not is neither here nor there. You fear simply not understanding something, so when you don't understand you fabricate intricate beliefs to mask your ignorance. It's interesting to watch.


I actually have the equivalent of a 35th degree understanding of the Masonic Craft, 3 levels above your own, and 3 levels above what is widely purported to exist.

Obviously armed with such information I have nothing to fear.

Nor do I fear the unknown!

Like the Mason's fear a unknown quantity in someone like Vincent that sent them all flocking to the thread, to talk about posters instead of the subject!

In reality what I do is investigate the unknown to share with others, that which they don't know, which many people truly appreciate.

That some of these things are secrets that Masons are tasked to guard, would be the reason some would like to say they are invented, instead of just exceptional observation and dillegent research and critical analysis.

If you recall your last attempt to debunk them exposed your own lack of general knowledge regarding plainly obtainable government documents in black and white, you didn't even know the extent of which existed!

Don't tell me that's still upsetting you????

Naturally Vincent's story intriqued me, and I can't tell you how dissapointed I am, he wasn't properly encouraged to share it in depth!

I wonder why?




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