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Teapartiers: What an outrage!

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posted on Apr, 21 2010 @ 03:31 AM
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reply to post by Southern Guardian
 


I knew it. And dont tell me what to do you are not the author of this thread and I have been having a good argument with the OP.




Were is your proof that I am a revolutionary? I challenged you to show just one post were I said I was in favor of it. Are you going to put up or shut up?



I am truly sick of nut jobs trying to pin being a radical on speaking out. You make me sick you truly do. I am against any kind of violence and have posted probably 100 posts to that fact. But yet you still try to play your little game I am sick of it. I think your a agent I truly do why else would you play this game over and over again?



To all readers please look at my posts and this other authors posts you will see the truth.

[edit on 21-4-2010 by Subjective Truth]

[edit on 21-4-2010 by Subjective Truth]

[edit on 21-4-2010 by Subjective Truth]




posted on Apr, 21 2010 @ 03:36 AM
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Originally posted by Southern Guardian

Originally posted by Subjective Truth
reply to post by skunknuts
 


It sad when you need a test to show you your place in the world. And all of pie charts does nothing to change the simple and utter truth Hitler was a progressive and this is from him not me. So take it up with him if you think he is a liberal.


This still has absolutely nothing to do with the point of the thread. Why do you keep running away from it? Are you afraid to actually address the OP directly? How is this not an infringement? Forcing americans to constantly show identification based on their appearance, how is this right? If this was based on gun rights would you be derailing this thread as you are now?






I was addressing the OP?
He posted a chart?
Maybe it is you trying to derail the thread I called you out in?



I have never had to put someone on ignore you are getting close. Like I said I am pretty sure you are agent it has nothing to do with the issues with you only a agenda I see the truth about you and I hope readers will look at your posts to help them see the truth also.



posted on Apr, 21 2010 @ 03:37 AM
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Originally posted by Subjective Truth
reply to post by Southern Guardian
 


I knew it. And dont tell me what to do


I'll tell it like it is. For all your posts in the this thread so far not once have you actually addressed the bill or the point of the OP. All you have done is derail. You continue to run away from actually addressing the topic. Why?





Where is your proof that I am a revolutionary?


I am well into that vai u2u. Im not interested in derailing this thread through your petty personal issues. Address the OP.


[edit on 21-4-2010 by Subjective Truth]

[edit on 21-4-2010 by Subjective Truth]

[edit on 21-4-2010 by Subjective Truth]


Are you capable of actually addressing the OP?



posted on Apr, 21 2010 @ 03:39 AM
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reply to post by Subjective Truth
 


Show me where in this thread did you address the bill?



posted on Apr, 21 2010 @ 03:47 AM
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Originally posted by Southern Guardian
reply to post by Subjective Truth
 


Show me where in this thread did you address the bill?





I honestly think you might have screw loose no offense but you made a accusations saying I was a arm chair revolutionary in this thread how is that on topic?


Please provide proof and the threads you sent me show nothing I read them and I suggest other do as well so they can see you for what you are a liar and a coward.





And just like I said in my u2 I am done with this poster I am putting them on ignore and this is a first.


For all the debates I have had on ATS this is a first this poster is Troll plain and simple and I am not going to waste my time with Trolls on ATS anymore. It gets old very fast go and push your agenda to someone else I am sure you will find many sheep here on ATS I am not one of them.

[edit on 21-4-2010 by Subjective Truth]

[edit on 21-4-2010 by Subjective Truth]

[edit on 21-4-2010 by Subjective Truth]



posted on Apr, 21 2010 @ 03:51 AM
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In my opinion, there are two main points to consider:

1.If the federal government was actually enforcing the (federal) laws that already exist, the state of Arizona wouldn't even have to consider this measure. Seems like Congress wants to push the constitutional envelope to the extremes on so many things these days, yet the primary reason the Fed was established (protect our borders) is in many ways ignored.

2.The Tea Party is not protesting this bill, and they're not going to, because they support it. The primary focus of the Tea Party movement lies in the size and expense of the government--the majority of the people just don't want our country to go broke and continue to lose jobs. Illegal immigration is not only a national security issue--it's a huge financial issue. Border states are in massive debt right now, and they're looking for ways to cut costs. This isn't about liking or disliking immigrants--it's about not being able to foot the bill anymore. When the economy was good, everyone was a lot more willing to look past some of these issues, but now that everybody and their brother (state governments included) is reaching the point of actually bending over to pick up a penny off the sidewalk, these things are going to matter. And it's going to stay that way until the Feds decide to focus on job creation and turn the economy for real.

As a side note, I would look for other states to start following suit in the near future, assuming this all works out. Arizona has kindly volunteered to be our nation's guinea pig. Thank you, AZ



posted on Apr, 21 2010 @ 03:52 AM
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Originally posted by Subjective Truth
I honestly think you might have screw loose no offense but you made a accusations saying I was a arm chair revultionary


Ofcourse you are, which was exactly in relation to the bill. People like you going around insisting this government is unconstitutional and yet you keep shut over bills like this. Even now you keep silent about the bill and instead continue to derail the thread. You came in here hurling all sorts of names, derailing, and that was the exact way I responded back to you.

If you dont want me to label you anymore, stop attacking and actually address the issue bill


Please provide proof and the threads


You know full well the threads I u2u'd back to you. If you want to continue to derail this thread with your personal petty issues thats your choice, by all means you go ahead and do what you like. Im not interested in derailing this thread.

Now show me where in this forum did you address the issue of the bill?


coward


Im not the one derailing and avoiding the the topic in this thread.



posted on Apr, 21 2010 @ 04:16 AM
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reply to post by skunknuts
 


Whats your solution in Arizona and along the Mexican border where there is a state of near lawlessness?



posted on Apr, 21 2010 @ 04:22 AM
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reply to post by johnny2127
 


I dont believe infringing upon constitutional rights is the solution to any issue. Do you? All this bill does is infringe the rights of americans merely over the way they appear. This bill singles out americans, forces them to constant be profiled merely over some assumption or generalization.

If we were talking about gun owners and that they had to carry permits and present them merely because they dont look right, would you be so quick to defend the bill?

I believe that we should sort out the borders, that we should move some of our troops from Afghanistan to the borders, I believe we should extend the border wall. I know it is costing this country over $1 billion a year. It is a serious issue, but surrendering the constitutional rights and equality of certain americans merely over looks and assumptions will not solve the issue.



posted on Apr, 21 2010 @ 04:33 AM
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reply to post by Southern Guardian
 



you dont believe in infringement of constitutional rights, but your FINE with all the infringement on our rights by the Obama administration?

No i think youre just against the Tea Party movement, and since the OP drew a comparison, where actually there is none, you are AUTOMATICALLY against this.

BTW what constitutional rights are they infringing upon , to ask for identification again? which part of the constitution is that in?

Hypocrisy at its best, your bias is showing



posted on Apr, 21 2010 @ 04:44 AM
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Originally posted by Jenna
How exactly are they going to determine who to ask about their immigration status? By appearance? That'll never work. Not all illegal immigrants are from Mexico, nor do they all look like they are. There are plenty of people who are of hispanic descent who were born here or immigrated legally as well. Talk about a sure-fire way to tick some people off. I don't see any reasonable way they could go about enforcing this without forcing Americans to prove they are American.



All true but Arizona is having some problems right now that are particular to the area.

Durring the civil war in certain areas of the country the union forces rounded up as many military aged civilians they could and put them in camps. Many were taken from behind the plow so to speak. They suspended rights as well. And no I dont like the sound of this. Just pointing out that long before the Japanese internment camps whites were doning this to whites under war condititons for no other reason but living in a certain area.

The problems facing Arizona right now should be fully looked into before making a final decision on this for anyone that cares.



posted on Apr, 21 2010 @ 05:01 AM
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Originally posted by skunknuts

Originally posted by Chicken_Bone
reply to post by skunknuts
 

I think we should all have to carry proof of citizenship and anytime we are stopped, get a job, or go for government services we should have to show them.

That way there is no racial profiling. It is just straight up the same for everyone.


Thank you for your response. It's fine. It just means you are more of an authoritarian than a constitution-loving libertarian. Keep that in mind so you don't sound hypocritical when discussing other issues.

Best,
Skunknuts


But really Skunknuts thats why you opened this tread was it not? To bait someone into saying something like "round up all them thar Mexies" or some thing. "And whiel your at it send the blacks back to africa".

The fact is right now in Arizona they are going to have to do a little "racial profiling". And not so much for whats going on between say brown and white folks but between brown and brown. Have you seen what these illigals are doing to US citizen of thier own race? Very much like what inner city blacks are doing to thier own in these gang/drug wars.

So this isnt at all like pulling hard working Pablo with wife and kids over because "Hay there goes another car load of Mexies".



posted on Apr, 21 2010 @ 05:10 AM
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Originally posted by skunknuts


Can you imagine if a similar bill was passed in Wisconsin w/ regards to Canada? How would you react if the government could harass and demand proof of citizenship if they determine that you reasonably appear Canadian??

Best,
Skunknuts



Here we go, your true crux. Race baiting.

The Canadians are not engaged in a full scale shootem up kidnapping and drug smuggling action friend.

You probably injoy hearing about white farmers being killed in South Africa.



posted on Apr, 21 2010 @ 05:19 AM
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EPIC thread. Yes, a lot of these so-called defenders of the constitution will throw it out the window the moment a brown person is involved, or it doesn't suit them to treat people as free and having rights.

A lot of genuine citizens who just happen to look a little dark are going to end up being harassed repeatedly by laws like this.

WHERE ARE YOUR PAPERS? ACHTUNG JUDEN/MEXICAN.

[edit on 21/4/2010 by harpsounds]



posted on Apr, 21 2010 @ 05:32 AM
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Originally posted by Xtrozero
But they can't...you need to prove you live in the school district..i.e. gas bill etc but they cannot ask you if you are a citizen. Why do you think there is over a million children in the California school system that should not be there, bad workers?


No, lazy parents or cops makes more sense. You seemed to completely miss the point because you are so busy using every deflection tactic you can find to not discuss the actual bill and its implications. So, now cops can stop every brown person and ask for proof of citizenship. That is going to help the problem with the schools how? If these people are in school and have documents to prove they live in the district, then chances are pretty good they will have a fake birth certificate to carry around as well.

Meanwhile, brown AMERICAN CITIZENS who do not spend daily life prepared to fake who they are will also be forced to take the time to prove they belong where they belong.

How are the schools benefitting from this?


They can and do all the time.... If they live in that district they can go to that school...doesn't matter if they are illegal or not.


That sounds like a completely different issue unless you can explain to me how this bill will help. Please see the above before you go into another slightly off topic rant.


And WOW this bill doesn't affect you at all and if you get a chance to vote on it one day then vote no...it’s that simple.


If it does not affect me then why are you telling me how I should value my tax dollars vs. money lost to illegal aliens in the context that this bill will somehow help?


So maybe if you think a little you will realize that just maybe there are a lot of illegals in Ariz that abuse all the services there and cost that state a ton of money and high crime rate that maybe you in rural NY do not have?


Yeah, so maybe you should realize how little sense it made to tell me about MY money going to illegals.


They voted on it and so they need to live with it, and they need to pay for it.


Well yeah. I truly look forward to your explanations as to how this bill is going to solve any of the problems you have tried to use to argue in favor of it.



posted on Apr, 21 2010 @ 05:47 AM
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Originally posted by Xtrozero
And so you also have a few million Illegal Canadians also causing havoc?
I live in Washington state so I guess we are the same too....not.


You will do anything you can to miss the point, won't you? I live near a foreign country and yes, there are illegal immigrants that come in from Canada. Do you really think all illegal immigrants are Mexicans that come from Mexico? There is a big world out there. Perhaps you should look into a place called New York City sometime. It is kind of a big place where international flights and ships come and go fairly often. Guess what comes on many of those vehicles?

My point was that the border I share just happens to be with a country full of people that look like me. I am not dark and could never pass for hispanic so I cannot put myself in that literal place. I can however extapolate that law to fit my state, my border, my illegal immigration issue.

Yes, there are illegals that come in from Canada. Many of them look like me but not because they are Canadian but because they come from all over Europe. Please educate yourself sometime about New York state. It will make for a more interesting conversation when you know something.




Yep those Canadians are just streaming across.... hehe


Smart as a pile of rocks, this one.

Let me see if I understand you so I can be so smart too. All illegal immigrants are brown and come to America by land across the smallest physical border? Is that what you are telling me?


It comes down to what is considered reasonable as the bill says.


The bill in itself is unreasonable. It is an illegal search. It violates the constitution. Hard to find a reasonable circumstance that would allow the use of an unreasonable tactic but see if you can try. Given your eloquent display of knowledge and intellect thus far...I can not way.


I agree it is a double edge sword that if it is used as you fear then their courts will be flooded with litigation for the next 50 years. I’m not sure if the governor has line vote ability but it is dangerous in the total freedom it provides authorities if used incorrectly.


Well, again I live in NY and not Arizona so I do not know those cops but let me see if I would trust the Greece NY police department not to abuse something that is already an abuse if implemented on any level. I just want to wait until the 5 top guys on trial for various corruption, drug abuse, and murder chargers get done. Oh, wait some are already in prison, I guess I wont ask those cops.



posted on Apr, 21 2010 @ 06:19 AM
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Well if you're a citizen, you should have nothing to worry about... It's not like they are taxing you to the poor house to support others.



posted on Apr, 21 2010 @ 06:21 AM
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I don’t know about stopping folks on the street and asking them for proof of citizenship. What I do think should be done is before any one can receive any form of state locale or federal assistance they need to show proof of citizenship. Before you can hire an employee they need to show proof of citizenship or legitimate working papers.
We are a very open country and accepting to all but we can’t continue to support, house, feed, employ, and quite possibly provide medical coverage to people that are here illegally.
Just my two cents

Edit for grammar


[edit on 21-4-2010 by murfdog]



posted on Apr, 21 2010 @ 06:44 AM
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Originally posted by Southern Guardian
If we were talking about gun owners and that they had to carry permits and present them merely because they dont look right, would you be so quick to defend the bill?


Hate to break it to you, but they ARE doing just that. It's called a Concealed Carry Permit.
Which depending on what you believe, is already infringing on our constitutionally granted rights. I am still not sure that there is even an issue here. As other people have said, you get carded all the time here in America, why is this any different? Because it will target brown people? The race angle? I still haven't heard any alternatives to finding out who is, or isn't, illegal, except by asking. What do you propose? Do you think 20 million illegal persons are simply going to turn themselves in?


Chrono



posted on Apr, 21 2010 @ 06:46 AM
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Originally posted by murfdog
Before you can hire an employee they need to show proof of citizenship or legitimate working papers.


I thought they were supposed to be doing that already? But then look the other way when someone's SS number doesn't come back right. Isn't that the point here? That people are ignoring, and basically breaking the law?


Chrono



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