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DNA vs Melting Aircraft Metals: Who Wins?

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posted on Apr, 8 2010 @ 01:48 PM
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reply to post by REMISNE
 


Oh, my. More disinfo?

Whwen will it stop?



GORHAM, Maine — Maine officials say they believe the two people who were found dead in a vehicle that was engulfed in flames were a mother and her son.

Two bodies that were burned beyond recognition turned up Wednesday morning in a vehicle that was discovered on fire in a parking area at a gravel pit in Gorham.

Maine State Police said Thursday that the victims are thought to be a mother and her preteen son, from Windham.

Police said the burned vehicle has been identified as a 2006 Toyota Highlander that was registered to the family.

The cause of death has not been established.

Police said positive identification will likely come from DNA testing that is under way at the state police crime lab.


www.bangordailynews.com...

Just a simple Google search, and I found this example....




posted on Apr, 8 2010 @ 02:09 PM
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reply to post by REMISNE
 


Again, do you think your body has like one string of DNA? In order to complete destroy 2000 trillion examples of DNA the material would have to be subject to heat under highly controlled labratory conditions.



posted on Apr, 8 2010 @ 02:14 PM
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reply to post by weedwhacker
 



Please understand: All I am saying is there is resonable doubt, to trust what they are saying.



posted on Apr, 8 2010 @ 02:16 PM
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reply to post by weedwhacker
 


Yes, "whwen" in deed. The blatant lies and disinfo around here make it very hard to have an honest discussion about the facts. It reminds me of the poster that runs around these threads playing expert and pilot every chance they get stating that the penthouse of WTC7 pulled the rest of the building down. Then a couple of pages later denied it even though it was too late to go back and edit it out. Crazy things people will say to push an agenda around here, eh?

WW, wouldn't you admit that if people at least admitted they made a mistake, they might have a little credibility?

You tell me



posted on Apr, 8 2010 @ 02:24 PM
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Originally posted by theability
reply to post by weedwhacker
 



Please understand: All I am saying is there is resonable doubt, to trust what they are saying.



How so? There are a pletora of real examples were DNA was extracted from sources much more exotically challenged, so why is it reasonable to think that DNA from human remains could not be isolated, extracted and tagged just because the host was subjected to something as common as crash and fire?



posted on Apr, 8 2010 @ 02:29 PM
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reply to post by hooper
 



How So?


Hooper, please understand, that I made this thread to make a statement, not to convince people.

One of the cool things about free will, is I don't have to agree with you.

Sorry.



posted on Apr, 8 2010 @ 02:43 PM
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reply to post by K J Gunderson
 


Could you please do us a big favor? LET IT GO!

Sorry, but that dog don't hunt no more...and it's wrong thread, anyway.

But, to clarify, because I fail to choose words, oh so carefully sometimes, and it can then turn into total misunderstanding, which leads to whatever is going on here....

We are in the proper forum, even IF this isn't exactly what the thread title is about, however...

...Apologies to OP for responding, here, since there was no DNA to investigate in WTC 7, but this video below is kinda sorta what the whole 'argument' about the Penthouse reflects. It mirrors what I see in every WTC 7 collapse shot. So, although my pattern of word selection was not precise, and has been interpreted in a way other than my thought processes at the time of writing (anyone else ever do that?) my INTENT should have been obvious, to most people who don't care to nitpick:


(It is somewhat near the end, examining the "free-fall" claims)---



posted on Apr, 8 2010 @ 02:52 PM
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reply to post by weedwhacker
 


Weedwacker, just to let you know, no worries about the video. I do expect some off topic issues, I have been guilty of this myself.

Btw I am reading that pdf you link me.

Interesting stuff.

Now the Title of the OP was chosen for the 'WHO WINS?' part mostly because this has been a serious question for me.

Who won?

Nobody I believe. Is the world a better place because of the reactions we had? Is the economy here doing wonderful; because of the 100's billion spent in months to supply these 'wars', made america a better place?

Well? What do you think?



[edit spelling]

[edit on 8-4-2010 by theability]



posted on Apr, 8 2010 @ 02:53 PM
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Originally posted by theability
reply to post by hooper
 



How So?


Hooper, please understand, that I made this thread to make a statement, not to convince people.

One of the cool things about free will, is I don't have to agree with you.

Sorry.



Fine. It was just that the opening line in the OP ended with a question mark and therefore mistook this to mean a question for resolution. You don't usually see the preamble to an affirmative statement open with an interogatory.



posted on Apr, 8 2010 @ 02:56 PM
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Originally posted by weedwhacker
reply to post by K J Gunderson
 


Could you please do us a big favor? LET IT GO!

Sorry, but that dog don't hunt no more...and it's wrong thread, anyway.


You want to talk about disinfo, then talk about it honestly. You brought it up.


But, to clarify, because I fail to choose words, oh so carefully sometimes, and it can then turn into total misunderstanding, which leads to whatever is going on here....


Ummmmmmm.... no. Failing to use words perfectly is one thing, coming back as a defense with "LIE LIE LIE" is something else now, isn't it?


We are in the proper forum, even IF this isn't exactly what the thread title is about, however...

...Apologies to OP for responding, here, since there was no DNA to investigate in WTC 7, but this video below is kinda sorta what the whole 'argument' about the Penthouse reflects. It mirrors what I see in every WTC 7 collapse shot. So, although my pattern of word selection was not precise, and has been interpreted in a way other than my thought processes at the time of writing (anyone else ever do that?) my INTENT should have been obvious, to most people who don't care to nitpick:


(It is somewhat near the end, examining the "free-fall" claims)---




If you do not want anyone to address such off topic things as people that spread disinformation, do not bring it up. You said something and then spent oh so many posts flat out DENYING you ever said it. Saying you chose words poorly would have been nice but that is not the issue. The issue is a poster who frequents 9/11 threads, has been caught blatantly lying, and has the nerve to call anything anyone else posts "disinfo." There is nothing genuine about what you post and you want to address credibility then here I will be to remind you where yours went.



posted on Apr, 8 2010 @ 03:04 PM
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reply to post by hooper
 


If you'd referred to the barbara olsen thread you'd understood the pretense of which the thread was started.

In fact me and weedwacker were off topic in another thread, discussing our disagreement.

Thus in respect of the OP I started this thread to continue the discussion under the right thread.

Of course I am open to all evidence. Yet I was trying to define my stance in the OP by stating why I had created this thread.

Here is the olsen thread I was talking about.

www.abovetopsecret.com...








posted on Apr, 8 2010 @ 03:11 PM
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Actually I stated this all, derailing the olsen thread: not meaning to but is was going quickly to many directions.





a reply to weedwacker
AND, of course, both Recorders.

And the Data recorder for Flight 77 took off from what: a helipad, so said the recorder?

Just like the fires destroyed the Plane, yet DNA identified everyone....

uhhhh....

the crud mainstream news puts out....



right?


I give due credit to weedwacker, for definitely defending his position.

[edit on 8-4-2010 by theability]

[edit on 8-4-2010 by theability]

[edit on 8-4-2010 by theability]



posted on Apr, 8 2010 @ 03:32 PM
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reply to post by theability
 



Now the Title of the OP was chosen for the....

....Who won?


No simple, pat answer there.

In terms of DNA, and identifying victims, I guess there is a "win" in terms of meager consolation to family, friends and loved ones of the victims.



Is the world a better place because of the reactions we had?


Well, no. Certainly not for people who travel by airplnae, nowadays.

But, seriously, I firmly think that the operaations in the Middle East were going forward, once the Bush administration came to power, regardless.

So, it's possible, in an 'alternate reality', to make the claim that just maybe, even without a 9/11 occurence, things would be just about the same, anyway. (Except maybe we'd still be wearing shoes going through magnetometers....)



Is the economy here doing wonderful; because of the 100's billion spent in months to supply these 'wars', made america a better place?


The economy WAS doing pretty well, as I recall...late 1990s, even into early 2000s. But, what we have now (recession?) is complicated, and not solely because of Iraqi invasion, and occupation (and Afghanistan)...

On a longer view, economies DO tend to be cyclical. I'm old enough to have seen the horrible late 1970s, and then the S&L crisis in the 1980s....something tanked in the early '90s, too...energy prices, or some other trigger? I forget....

This (and other) Nations have wasted money before, and I daresay will continue to. But, as example, we had an administration that inherited an economy in the bottom of the outhouse, and turned it into a huge successful budget surplus, before he left office.

So, it could happen again....money is alwyas available, to be made. Just get creative (carefully creative, unlike last time!)



posted on Apr, 8 2010 @ 03:42 PM
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reply to post by weedwhacker
 


See we do agree on things:


But, seriously, I firmly think that the operaations in the Middle East were going forward, once the Bush administration came to power, regardless.

So, it's possible, in an 'alternate reality', to make the claim that just maybe, even without a 9/11 occurence, things would be just about the same, anyway. (Except maybe we'd still be wearing shoes going through magnetometers....)


The whole issue with me is this: I am not saying things didn't happen, and people didn't get identied somewhat. I am saying that the plan to have an EXCUSE was in effect and definitley used this to their advantage.

[the excuse to stiff-arm the middle east]

This is one reason why I am unable to believe the result they obtained.

If they have an outright agenda, then any info the release will fit exactly what they need it to, right?

This makes sense to me.



posted on Apr, 9 2010 @ 03:59 AM
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Originally posted by weedwhacker
Just a simple Google search, and I found this example....



Originally posted by hooper
Again, do you think your body has like one string of DNA? In order to complete destroy 2000 trillion examples of DNA the material would have to be subject to heat under highly controlled labratory conditions.


So are you saying that that NIST lied when it stated they needed new testing for 9/11? YES or NO.

[edit on 9-4-2010 by REMISNE]



posted on Apr, 9 2010 @ 06:34 AM
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Originally posted by REMISNE

Originally posted by weedwhacker
Just a simple Google search, and I found this example....



Originally posted by hooper
Again, do you think your body has like one string of DNA? In order to complete destroy 2000 trillion examples of DNA the material would have to be subject to heat under highly controlled labratory conditions.


So are you saying that that NIST lied when it stated they needed new testing for 9/11? YES or NO.

[edit on 9-4-2010 by REMISNE]


Please expand on the relevancy of your question. How does the NIST employing better test methods for DNA extraction from suspected human remains collected from the World Trade Center site relate to the matching of DNA samples from the event at the Pentagon and how does either proposition detract or disprove the simple axiom that every cell of the human body contains DNA?



posted on Apr, 9 2010 @ 06:42 AM
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Originally posted by hooper
Please expand on the relevancy of your question. How does the NIST employing better test methods for DNA extraction from suspected human remains collected from the World Trade Center site relate to the matching of DNA samples from the event at the Pentagon and how does either proposition detract or disprove the simple axiom that every cell of the human body contains DNA?


If you do not know the relevancy then you are just proving how much you live in a fantasy world and do not accept and admit to facts and evidence shown.

Lets look at some facts.

1. NIST had to come up with new testing because of the fact that DNA can be destroyed by such things as heat.

2. It proves that the DNA methods in 2001 were not good enough to ID bodies and needed to be upgraded.



posted on Apr, 9 2010 @ 07:49 AM
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Originally posted by REMISNE

Originally posted by hooper
Please expand on the relevancy of your question. How does the NIST employing better test methods for DNA extraction from suspected human remains collected from the World Trade Center site relate to the matching of DNA samples from the event at the Pentagon and how does either proposition detract or disprove the simple axiom that every cell of the human body contains DNA?


If you do not know the relevancy then you are just proving how much you live in a fantasy world and do not accept and admit to facts and evidence shown.

Lets look at some facts.

1. NIST had to come up with new testing because of the fact that DNA can be destroyed by such things as heat.

2. It proves that the DNA methods in 2001 were not good enough to ID bodies and needed to be upgraded.


OK, so then you are officially saying the DNA identification was not possible in September of 2001?



posted on Apr, 9 2010 @ 08:23 AM
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Originally posted by REMISNE

Originally posted by TrickoftheShade
Two posts ago you said ALL the bodies were identified.


ALL ON AA77
Investigators have identified remains of 184 people who were aboard American Airlines Flight 77 or inside the Pentagon, including those of the five hijackers.

[edit on 8-4-2010 by REMISNE]


I'm sorry, this is just completely bizarre. Your response to being shown - in your own source - that five bodies were too badly burned for traditional DNA testing, and that those were therefore most likely the bodies that required the "new" testing is simply to edit out the part of the quote that you don't like?



posted on Apr, 9 2010 @ 09:47 AM
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Originally posted by hooper
OK, so then you are officially saying the DNA identification was not possible in September of 2001?


No i am stating that not "ALL" DNA identification was possible. Thats why NIST had to come with new testing.

The new testing was not ready untill 2002 AFTER MOST DNA identification was done.



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