Today will mark the end of America

reply to post by K J Gunderson

Actually I came to my own opinion just fine. You know how I did it? I read your words. I asked you questions and read your answers. Your idea is ill informed, ignorant, and a fantasy. You talk a great deal but you do not mean any of it.

This is why I cannot level with some of you on anything. You claim you formed YOUR opinion just fine yet you belittle mine. What in God's green Earth has made YOUR opinion better than my opinion? How is my opinion any more "ill informed, ignorant, and fantasy" than yours is? My opinion on revolution has history backing it up - MULTIPLE TIMES where as the belief that peaceful change will solve everything is led by the rope of blind faith and assumptions. You assume that the system isn't so corrupt already that it can be fixed. You assume that the game isn't rigged so that you can't change it. You assume that eventually the government will listen to you - all with countless acts of history standing AGAINST your claims. AGAINST THEM!

This country was FOUNDED on the beliefs that I hold that revolution was the only way out of a mess where we are ignored and belittled. To deny this is to deny history - and to deny history makes you no better then those who are in charge.



Secondly, you claim that I "don't mean any of it" but I have to ask - how do you know me? Do you know my actions? Do you know what I do off of this site or what kind of person I am?

The answer is NO, you do not. I will not claim to know and belittle who you are, so I would expect the same from someone else. I stand behind every word I speak and I am not afraid to say when I get into something that is over my head. Perhaps I might not know all the answers, perhaps some people might not agree with my views - fine - but I am entitled to those views. At the very least - I am TRYING to breath new life into this republic whereas almost everyone else would try to continue feeding the dying animal.

You are going to stand up for all of us and be the first one to fire or take fire...but not until you see if the world ends in 2012 first. You care so much about this cause you claim to feel so strongly for...but you are going to wait for a few more elections and 3 years to go by first.

Wait? No no no. Waiting would assume that I would be doing nothing. Let us change your wording to more suit what it really is "preparing". Oh sure I could crash a plane into a building, I could attempt to shoot up a government building - but honestly anyone with half a brain would know that it wouldn't accomplish jack.

And what is the point of caring about a cause if the people you are fighting for won't be here when the time comes? What would be the point of freeing American people in a revolution that could take years if something catastrophic would just happen to the world? If I had been given more time, perhaps I wouldn't have set the deadline and perhaps I might have seen the trade off as worth it. Right now, anything short of killing or enslaving American citizens I will be patient so will most of us.

Thanks for implying that 3 people run the opinions on this board but it just is not true.

I'm sorry but I never implied that. I do believe I explicitly states that those three people post in nearly EVERY one of my topics using any tactic whatsoever to discredit me. I believe I referred to them as "stalkers". Never did I mention that they held a monopoly over dissenting opinion against mine, they are just the three who would attack the person rather than what he is saying.

As far as I can tell, you don't even compare to the grief those three have given me over the last year. For that, I appreciate your comments.

reply to post by gwydionblack


Did you ever stop to consider that some may have the same interests as you, hold different opinions, solutions and view of history and not actually be stalking? I for one am not stalking and your sensitivities can not stop me from expressing myself in anyway I see fit within the bounds of T&C.

As I said before I admire your passion, articulation and some of your ideas; I just don't happen to agree with most of them. If you are offended by my participation; the answer is simple....click ignore.

I would miss the debate and there is the distinct possibility that you might educate me even more than you already have. I doubt you could change my core philosophies, but you never know.

Also I would imagine a leader or instigator of a revolution might need more guts than to be given "grief" by a few www. opponents. BTW I don't view you as an opponent or enemy; just someone that has different opinions than I do. Sometimes the exchange may be heated; nothing like what you will encounter if you take to the streets. I've been there!









[edit on 25-3-2010 by whaaa]

reply to post by whaaa

Did you ever stop to consider that some may have the same interests as you, hold different opinions, solutions and view of history and not actually be stalking? I for one am not stalking and your sensitivities can not stop me from expressing myself in anyway I see fit within the bounds of T&C.

And I respect differing opinions and points of view. I have considered this. I consider it stalking because in every topic it always ends in the same questions which I answer to the best of my ability - yet people will tell me I didn't answer them. It is an endless game that I can't win because people won't open their mind to my philosophies. Not necessarily BELIEVE them but actually try to think of them from my perspective.

If you are offended by my participation; the answer is simple....click ignore.

I don't want to ignore anybody although the temptation is there. Albeit occasionally one of you bring a good argument to the table and keep me on my toes, but the majority of the time it is repeats over and over again of the same thing. Whatukno is a great example - unable to talk about the topic at hand, he would instead bring up his skewed interpretations of my apparent "Constitution changes" that he believes I want to make... even though I've never ever brought such to the table. He can't provide proof of those things, yet he continues to try to derail and belittle my character.

Do I ignore him? Very close to as lately he hasn't brought anything beneficial to the table. However, I would probably find it much more appealing to ATS if I could spend more time defending and promoting my opinions then having to spend it defending my character.

Also I would imagine a leader or instigator of a revolution might need more guts than to be given "grief" by a few www. opponents. BTW I don't view you as an opponent or enemy.

Guts are one thing but just accepting ignorance is another. Honestly whaa, you have given me a lot less grief in the past than the other two, and a lot more warranted arguments so it was probably wrong to include you with them. I don't view you as an opponent or enemy either, just two differenct beliefs - two different sides to the same coin.

Thanks for your reply.

Now the hangover is setting in. Questions now about how we are going to pay for it. All you socialized medicine proponents do know that we always intended to pay for this with borrowed money right? Now that its law and no one wants to give us money to pay for it....what ever do we do now?

No body wants to buy our bonds.
Social security is now paying out more than is taking in.

www.realclearpolitics.com...

Were in for a bumpy ride folks.

To quote part of the article:

Barack Obama's project of transforming the United States into something like Western Europe is, according to the CBO, raising the national debt burden on the economy to World War II levels. I see train wrecks ahead -- as the bond market forces huge spending cuts or tax increases first on states and then on the federal government. It will make what happened in the House Sunday look pretty.


[edit on 26-3-2010 by Thirty_Foot_Smurf]

Hey I figured out where our good buddy the OP get's his 2014 deadline for revolution...



GLEN BECK!



Oh And BTW. Didn't you write this?

post by gwydionblack

An epiphany! How grand!

Perhaps I can use the back of my degree to draft a new Constitution or Declaration or Independence...

Bold and color added for emphasis.

Sounds to me as if you want to re write the Constitution.

reply to post by whatukno

Hey I figured out where our good buddy the OP get's his 2014 deadline for revolution...

Last I recall... my deadline was 2013 - in fact, January 2013. You are REALLY grasping aren't you.

And where exactly does he mention a deadline AT ALL in that video?

But hold on a minute... all the Glenn Beck hate... hrm, mind telling me what he said in the video was wrong? All of a sudden because Glenn Beck says it I'm following him?

Let's clear things up - I watch Glenn Beck on occasion, about as MUCH occasion as I watch any other news program. I consider him to have merit but to exaggerate. HOWEVER, when he speaks of a coming revolution and how the military has been preparing - how is he wrong? I have been calling on a revolution since the beginning of last year so please - point out where almighty Beck fostered my opinion then. Was it during his rallies for peaceful protest and against violence?

Oh And BTW. Didn't you write this?

Yes, I DID write that. And you aren't impressing anyone with your heinous stalking.

Perhaps you would do well to look up the definition of the word "new" and realize that the singular meaning you like to place on my statement isn't the only one that exists.

I don't really have to defend myself any further than that because:

A. That topic was a joke in and of itself.

and

B. The "changes" I have proposed to the Constitution are free for all to bear witness to in a number of my posts so you don't need to spout off what you THINK I want to do. For those unfamiliar with my proposed changes - they including adding the original 13th amendment back into the Constitution and thus renumbering +1 all that follow. I can see how whatukno takes this as destruction of the document because he feels anything that questions the system is destruction of America complete with plugged racism and murder.

reply to post by atlguy

Show me proof of this verbal racism.
By the way have you ever been to a teaparty event and actually had the chance to meet any of these people your slurring.

reply to post by antonia

Remember when someone doesn't have a good argument they always resort to name calling.

reply to post by gwydionblack


geez, the OP using the phase " we need to wake up" and "we are losing our freedoms" it's healthcare, not the british sailing into boston harbor.

i'm paying 452 dollars a month to a for-profit insurance company (heathnet bluecross) who said they will be raising my premiums in may 10' by 29%...this is for me and my wife only.

people "woke up" in 2008 and elected Obama...8 million more than McCain. 8 million people would overflow washington streets for miles...that's the "real" tea party that took place. get over it, your guy lost in a landslide. Obama won, and that is our system of government.

you don't preach overthrow of the government, just because a democrat became president. anybody that does is un-patriotic, and does not believe in our way of choosing our elected leaders.

[edit on 27-3-2010 by jimmyx]

reply to post by kinda kurious


This is what is so sick. Pardon the pun. Obama has spent his entire time in office focusing on healthcare while we are in the middle of TWO WARS THAT HE PROMISED TO END. He has not given one speech on those wars and the media has let him get away with ignoring them. Well almost ignoring them. He did spend a little time increasing the war in Afghanistan. And in his first year in office we have had more casualties in Afghanistan in one year (300) than since the war started. And what. Silence! Complete Silence! Where are all you people that screamed and screamed at Bush to end the wars. We hear so little about it anymore it's like we are not in TWO WARS. Obviously stealing money from me and other Americans to pay for healthcare is much more important than ending TWO WARS.

reply to post by jimmyx

Two things
2 and one half % of the population is not a landslide. Sorry to break it to you.
Number 2
Let's say in 2012 Obama for whatever reason doesn't run. But another Democrat wins the white house. He or she wins by 8 million votes. In three months he or she declares marshal law and begins marching people to FEMA camps. According to you it would be unpatriotic to resist because they were elected fairly. WOW!!!

reply to post by jimmyx


You, like so many other would pretend to know me when you don't.

In the beginning I was an AVID Obama supporter and a known independent on the circuit. I remember advocating George Bush when he was first elected and remember turning a complete 180 during his reign.

Obama was no different; it just happened a lot faster. It didn't take but a week for my opinion to change. I, just like many others, were entranced by his speaking and his promises to end the wars and bring about his change. We were all duped in the end, just as we always have been.

The seeds of revolution were already embedded in my mind when Bush was president, and the more the government does against the people - the larger the tree of liberty will grow.

It is not unpatriotic to do what our Founding Fathers had to do to create America in the first place. It is not unpatriotic to do our civic duty as citizens and replace our tyrannical leaders with those who actually care about the people. This is simply our RIGHT.

Originally posted by gwydionblack

This is why I cannot level with some of you on anything. You claim you formed YOUR opinion just fine yet you belittle mine.

I never once belittled your opinion. You seem to be confusing your opinion with who you are and everything you say.

What in God's green Earth has made YOUR opinion better than my opinion?

Nothing, that is why your delusion never happened.

How is my opinion any more "ill informed, ignorant, and fantasy" than yours is?

Your statements of fact are ill informed, etc. Your opinion appears to be based on that though.

My opinion on revolution has history backing it up - MULTIPLE TIMES where as the belief that peaceful change will solve everything is led by the rope of blind faith and assumptions.

Not one thing in history backs up anything happening in 2013. I am not even sure how you can make that kind of claim.

You assume that the system isn't so corrupt already that it can be fixed.

Did you just have so many extra words you wanted to put a bunch in my mouth?

You assume that the game isn't rigged so that you can't change it. You assume that eventually the government will listen to you - all with countless acts of history standing AGAINST your claims. AGAINST THEM!

I hope that after you have slept you will realize that I have neither assumed nor expressed an assumption of any of these things. You are just using my post to rant.

This country was FOUNDED on the beliefs that I hold that revolution was the only way out of a mess where we are ignored and belittled. To deny this is to deny history - and to deny history makes you no better then those who are in charge.

That is great. Maybe engrave that on your gun before you go out shootin'!

Secondly, you claim that I "don't mean any of it" but I have to ask - how do you know me? Do you know my actions? Do you know what I do off of this site or what kind of person I am?

I know what you said. If you really meant it you would not sit back and wait to see if the world ends first. If you truly believed in what you said, you would want to start making that better tomorrow for your loved ones now, not maybe in 3 years if they do not all die first since you know that in 3 years, you might not even be here to do anything if the world does not end.

THAT IS WHAT I KNOW. Show me where I am wrong.

The answer is NO, you do not. I will not claim to know and belittle who you are, so I would expect the same from someone else. I stand behind every word I speak and I am not afraid to say when I get into something that is over my head. Perhaps I might not know all the answers, perhaps some people might not agree with my views - fine - but I am entitled to those views. At the very least - I am TRYING to breath new life into this republic whereas almost everyone else would try to continue feeding the dying animal.

No you are not. You are waiting for several elections both local and federal to occur and perhaps the end of all humanity in 3 years first. You are not doing anything right now but talking about things you know very well you may never live to make happen. Do not delude yourself on my account.

Wait? No no no. Waiting would assume that I would be doing nothing. Let us change your wording to more suit what it really is "preparing". Oh sure I could crash a plane into a building, I could attempt to shoot up a government building - but honestly anyone with half a brain would know that it wouldn't accomplish jack.

That is your fault. You said you were waiting to see what happened first. Need me to find the exact quote for you?

And what is the point of caring about a cause if the people you are fighting for won't be here when the time comes?

What is the point in caring if you are willing to let 3 more years of destruction take root before you act?

What would be the point of freeing American people in a revolution that could take years if something catastrophic would just happen to the world?

Since there is no reason at all to believe anything is going to happen in 2012, what would be the point in waiting? Waiting can only damage your cause. The longer you wait, the harder your fight will be. There is no legitimate reason to think anything is going to happen in 2012 other than you still not fighting any revolution.

If I had been given more time, perhaps I wouldn't have set the deadline and perhaps I might have seen the trade off as worth it. Right now, anything short of killing or enslaving American citizens I will be patient so will most of us.

Patient? So you are waiting or not? Why would anyone endure a self imposed patience for no good reason? You are not making sense you know?

I'm sorry but I never implied that. I do believe I explicitly states that those three people post in nearly EVERY one of my topics using any tactic whatsoever to discredit me. I believe I referred to them as "stalkers". Never did I mention that they held a monopoly over dissenting opinion against mine, they are just the three who would attack the person rather than what he is saying.

OK, as long as we agree that many more than three people think what you are saying is nonsense. Cool.

As far as I can tell, you don't even compare to the grief those three have given me over the last year. For that, I appreciate your comments.

Welcome!

Originally posted by rick1
reply to post by jimmyx

 

Two things
2 and one half % of the population is not a landslide. Sorry to break it to you.
Number 2
Let's say in 2012 Obama for whatever reason doesn't run. But another Democrat wins the white house. He or she wins by 8 million votes. In three months he or she declares marshal law and begins marching people to FEMA camps. According to you it would be unpatriotic to resist because they were elected fairly. WOW!!!

ok, equating passing a healthcare bill, which every other industrialized country has, to marshal law and marches to FEMA camps is rediculous, and you're smart enough to know it. of course, if your scenario developed the way you are saying, i would join a resistance movement, but, it is not.

reply to post by gwydionblack


so, basically when Obama was elected, mean't that it is time for a revolution...i heard this from conservatives when bill clinton was elected.

reply to post by gwydionblack


look, giving 30 million people access to healthcare is helping american people...i don't see how doing this IS NOT beneficial. i guess we agree to disagree.

So let me post this little question.

Since were going to adopt the rest of the civilized worlds healthcare system...Are we going to see our survivability rates to disease:

A) Drop to their level.
B) Stay the same.
C) Increase as a direct result contrary to the inefficiencies of socialized medicine.

Bonus question:

What happens when the 20 million or so illegals get amnesty and hop on in addition to the reported 35 million were now going to cover? 55 million not too burdensome?

reply to post by jimmyx

So it is ok to join a resistance movement for something you believe in but it is not ok for others to resist for something they believe in.
Personally I believe healthcare is much more dangerous than FEMA camps. National healthcare is golden chains. Nobody minds losing freedoms because you know gold is so beautiful.

reply to post by jimmyx

It is theft!!!!! If you want to reach in your pocket and help someone get healthcare who doesn't have it that is fine. But when you reach in my pocket and I say know and you take it anyway that is theft.

Oh BTW.

I just want to let you know, your little plan to overthrow the United States is in fact illegal.

TITLE 18 > PART I > CHAPTER 115 > § 2384

Seditious conspiracy

If two or more persons in any State or Territory, or in any place subject to the jurisdiction of the United States, conspire to overthrow, put down, or to destroy by force the Government of the United States, or to levy war against them, or to oppose by force the authority thereof, or by force to prevent, hinder, or delay the execution of any law of the United States, or by force to seize, take, or possess any property of the United States contrary to the authority thereof, they shall each be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than twenty years, or both.

[edit on 3/30/2010 by whatukno]