Women banned from flight for refusing scan

Hmm, so let me get this straight, and please correct me if i'm wrong on my assumptions...seriously.

It appears to me that you're saying "damned if they do, damned if they don't"

If they're lax on security, it's not safe.
If they're tight on security, they've violating rights (that you don't have against private business, just the US Government, by the way)

If you want to fly their air planes, you have to abide by their rules.

Don't like it?

I hear Grey Hound still doesn't check your baggage.

Next weeks breaking alternative news headline :

Islamic Fundamentalist Blows up Greyhound bus in Boise, Idaho.

I say GOOD. They DESERVE to be banned.
When you go to 6-Flags to ride the Batman, would you get all pissy because they MAKE you wear a strap-in harness? Should they HONOR your request to not wear one?


When will idiots in this Country grow the hell up and realize that the bill of rights does not apply to private business

they do NOT have to honor your religion
they do NOT have to let you ride for free
they do NOT have to honor your "freedom of speech"

God damnit, did you fall asleep in Constitution Class or something?

[edit on 3-3-2010 by Snarf]

reply to post by telfyr


You can't blame a citizen of a country criticizing its system, after all everyone has their belief, and you are right, if you don't like it use another way of transportation.

But criticism is and should be allowed. What people can do, is not travel, but we are in a position now a days that certain things are a must, an example would be visiting relatives, the sick, the old etc etc. These are a must, therefore in order to resist something you disagree with, you either fight, or do what Ghandi did, passive resistance.

Originally posted by oozyism
But criticism is and should be allowed. What people can do, is not travel, but we are in a position now a days that certain things are a must, an example would be visiting relatives, the sick, the old etc etc. These are a must, therefore in order to resist something you disagree with, you either fight, or do what Ghandi did, passive resistance.

To all those who find these body scans conflict with your beliefs.

Boycott airlines. Refuse to give them your business.

Please.

Originally posted by Snarf
I say GOOD. They DESERVE to be banned.
When you go to 6-Flags to ride the Batman, would you get all pissy because they MAKE you wear a strap-in harness? Should they HONOR your request to not wear one?

We have the harness and we are ok with that. It is called metal detectors. The difference is when we are told that the harness is not good enough because there is still a little bit of fabric between the skin and harness that could cause a little give. Now you need to remove your clothes before getting on the ride.

I would choose not to ride that attraction, HOWEVER, it's because i have a choice to and i can ride something else.

Flying there is NO OTHER CHOICE.

Originally posted by Crito
You apparently don't know the meaning of the word liberty. You don't have the right to infringe on my liberty so you can feel safe and secure.

I do know the definiton...hence why I am NOT misguided like some. I have the right as a private business owner to run my buisness how I want, not how YOU want me too. You want to talk about infringing on someones rights, hello, your demanding people to do what you say when you want to use THEIR service...HELLO MCFLY...it has nothing to do with safe and secure...it has to do with YOU not having a say in how someone else runs THEIR show....

This is a free society. That means freedom, not security, reigns supreme.

Are you sure, cause right now in your book YOUR way is the only way and business owners and private companies are NOT free to do what they want.

When one infringes on the other freedom always trumps security.

What? In that case your saying to private companies, F your rules, fly me now and if anything happens to these people I will take the blame, since it has to be MY way that triumphs...why, because I am free...free to tell everyone else, especially the OWNERS of this private business, I AM FREE you must listen to what I say....give me a break man.

Sorry if you don't like free societies and wish you lived in a police state where the authorities deem everything to be a government-granted privilege. You're free to leave at any time, however, and the sooner the better for all the rest of us.

This rant makes you look....well stupid. Your free to travel, ain't noone stopping you...well except those who provide the service. As I said, whats stopping you from buiding your own boat or plane? NOTHING...oh except you feel your entitled to comforts and not hard work. Funny, the guys who built the aviation industry WORKED hard to get it to where it is today...how, because they were free to do so....so WTF are you to demand they cater to you? And free to leave...perfect sign of someone who has NO CLUE what freedom really is...sorry but my service to this nation pretty much means I can stay here as long as I like...

Originally posted by SilentShadow
Flying there is NO OTHER CHOICE.

BOATS..people use them EVERYDAY to cross the ocean.

Other aviation outlets..there are other pilots out there willing to fly people privatly without all the BS.

SWIM... .. kidding of course.

Originally posted by SilentShadow

Originally posted by Snarf
I say GOOD. They DESERVE to be banned.
When you go to 6-Flags to ride the Batman, would you get all pissy because they MAKE you wear a strap-in harness? Should they HONOR your request to not wear one?

We have the harness and we are ok with that. It is called metal detectors. The difference is when we are told that the harness is not good enough because there is still a little bit of fabric between the skin and harness that could cause a little give. Now you need to remove your clothes before getting on the ride.

I would choose not to ride that attraction, HOWEVER, it's because i have a choice to and i can ride something else.

Flying there is NO OTHER CHOICE.

Errr no in your example it would actually be a case of them going oops this harness actually isnt very safe at all and will still lead to your death in most cases, heres a new improved harness that will actually save your life.

As for there be no other choice to flying, the naval, rail and automotive industries would like a word with you. Oh you mean theres no other choice when you want to go on Holiday for two weeks to a foreign country, well you could probably still drive to some, its not as convienient as flying sure but then you wont have to worry about someone you wont ever see again getting a glimpse of your not very attractively replicated body on a digital screen.

Originally posted by SilentShadow
Flying there is NO OTHER CHOICE.

Yes there is, you could walk, or drive, catch a bus, a train, use a pushbike, rollerskates, rollerblades, skateboard, or a boat, even ride a horse!

So you have many other choices. Mind you, they may take a lot longer, be more expensive etc, but if you want to fly with a private company, you follow their rules.

Originally posted by gYvMessanger
you could probably still drive to some, its not as convienient as flying sure...

I live in Australia... no way of land travel to another country

Originally posted by dereks
Yes there is, you could walk, or drive, catch a bus, a train, use a pushbike, rollerskates, rollerblades, skateboard, or a boat, even ride a horse!

See above.

Originally posted by rcwj1975
SWIM...

.. kidding of course.

LOL i better get training.

Someone needed to actually do the research. All this talk about Airports being privately owned...

Q: Who owns airports?

A: Most U.S. commercial service airports are typically owned by local or state governments, either directly or through an authority (a quasi-governmental body established to operate the airport). While Congress established a "privatization program" in 1997 under which the airport ownership would be transferred to a non-governmental entity, no airports currently participate in this program. However, The Branson Airport (in Missouri) became the first privately financed and operated commercial service airport in the United States when it opened in May, 2009.

Source: Air Transport Association

Unless i read that wrong... ONE airport in the US is privately owned.

[edit on 4/3/2010 by SilentShadow]

Originally posted by stumason

Originally posted by ModernAcademia
As mentioned women should hold these jobs only, but even then it's not good enough

Quite. Women as as likely to be dirty perverts as men are, so claiming women would be any better at these jobs is rather silly.

As for these scanners, don't bother me one bit as I dont mind showing anyone my hunky body, although I agree with a posters sentiments about the actual "threat" terrorist pose.

I could, with £1000 a an afternoon prepare a terrorist attack that would have no warning whatsoever and kill hundreds.

In my job, I could cut the entire nation off the National Grid, or take the BBC off the air. I could turn off the Police National Network and disable the Police Airwave communications system. I could cut off Downing street or Parliament from the outside world. I could even shut down the entire comms network in the UK if I was that way inclined.

All in a building with one old man on security and a bunch of geeks in a large room. If terrorists were such a threat, they would have kicked in our door long ago and done the deed and no-one could have stopped them.

thats true, and were is this that you work

Originally posted by SilentShadow
I live in Australia... no way of land travel to another country

You can always buy a boat... www.sydneypowerboat.com.au...

and www.boatpoint.com.au...

reply to post by SilentShadow


Hmm, you aren't required to be scanned before entering an AIR PORT

you are required to be scanned before entering an AIR PLANE

and last time I checked - those are owned by private business.

So like i said earlier :

You wanna ride their planes? You gotta play by their rules.

Otherwise - call Grey Hound.

[edit on 4-3-2010 by Snarf]

For all you freedom haters out there...so...is the Government going to promise the public 100% safety and security in exchange for humiliating and degrading them with these machines? Didn't think so.

Security my a**. It's all about making big bucks for the same dirtbags who have been manipulating and striking unwarranted fear into the hearts of the people.

It's also about invading people's privacy and compiling a large image database of everyone who goes through these machines. The people behind this plan give perverts a good name.

Funny how only one person in this entire post mentioned the possible adverse health effects, especially long term, associated with these machines. They don't give a crap. If you get ill in the future as a result of continuously going through these perv machines, there is no way you will be able to link it to these units.

Originally posted by Snarf
Hmm, you aren't required to be scanned before entering an AIR PORT

you are required to be scanned before entering an AIR PLANE

and last time I checked - those are owned by private business.

Airport security has NOTHING to do with the airlines. They are all run by the airport AND in the US by the TSA.

Originally posted by rcwj1975

Originally posted by Crito
You apparently don't know the meaning of the word liberty. You don't have the right to infringe on my liberty so you can feel safe and secure.

I do know the definiton...hence why I am NOT misguided like some. I have the right as a private business owner to run my buisness how I want, not how YOU want me too. You want to talk about infringing on someones rights, hello, your demanding people to do what you say when you want to use THEIR service...HELLO MCFLY...it has nothing to do with safe and secure...it has to do with YOU not having a say in how someone else runs THEIR show....

This is a free society. That means freedom, not security, reigns supreme.

Are you sure, cause right now in your book YOUR way is the only way and business owners and private companies are NOT free to do what they want.

When one infringes on the other freedom always trumps security.

What? In that case your saying to private companies, F your rules, fly me now and if anything happens to these people I will take the blame, since it has to be MY way that triumphs...why, because I am free...free to tell everyone else, especially the OWNERS of this private business, I AM FREE you must listen to what I say....give me a break man.

Sorry if you don't like free societies and wish you lived in a police state where the authorities deem everything to be a government-granted privilege. You're free to leave at any time, however, and the sooner the better for all the rest of us.

This rant makes you look....well stupid. Your free to travel, ain't noone stopping you...well except those who provide the service. As I said, whats stopping you from buiding your own boat or plane? NOTHING...oh except you feel your entitled to comforts and not hard work. Funny, the guys who built the aviation industry WORKED hard to get it to where it is today...how, because they were free to do so....so WTF are you to demand they cater to you? And free to leave...perfect sign of someone who has NO CLUE what freedom really is...sorry but my service to this nation pretty much means I can stay here as long as I like...

Good grief. You are still on this whole "airports are private entities" "airlines are the ones willingly subjecting their customer base to a virtual proctological exam" etc...

Do you simply ignore the posts that you cannot answer? I asked you to name ONE airline that has purchased and deployed a body scanner? Are you still researching the question? Refer back to page 2 of this thread since you conveniently skiped over it.

Sorry but you're the one who looks utterly anc completely stupid here. Just ignore what you cannot answer.

Originally posted by stumason
reply to post by (C2C)

 

Huh?

How would it be made? Fuelled? Flown? Maintained?

Communism is nice on paper, but it just doesn't work in real life. People have to pay for planes because operating planes cost money. You have no more a right to use another persons plane without submitting to their conditions, than someone does if they want to use your home or car.

Or would you agree that, as your house is "of this earth", anybody can use it freely as they see fit?

I like your thinking. So, if i have a property to rent, the prospective renters should be willing to submit to cavity searches, or millimeter scans for my own personal amusement...er security. After all, it is my property, care to take a ride in a cab? or a Bus? At what point does it end?

Now in your earlier post, you say you don't mind people seeing your body because you claim it's "hunky", but what of the day you are going on your honeymoon with your sweet young wife? Would you mind her nudes traded as hockey cards? Or When the day comes you take your 6 year old daughter to disneyland, would pedo's trading her image bother you so lightly?

There is no reason that these kinds of scanners are necessary. Considering that there is no scan, no security in the area prior to entering the secure zone within an airport it seems an easy target for a would be suicide bomber. Just wait until 2 or 3 planes are getting ready to start boarding, or wait by the arrivals until a large crowd is available. Luggage area anyone...

..Ex

reply to post by rcwj1975


The problem with your analogy is the TSA is run by the Federal Government, not the private companies who contract with the airports to use their facilities. Most Airline employees can't stand the TSA agents (not all), because they have to deal with them everyday and much like people in your industry their are power trippers who get off on their temporary yet very powerful authority. Like your profession, they cite their ever changing rules which often differ from agent to agent airport to airport.

Just like a driver who avoids certain roadways or towns because the posted speeds might be a little slow and the revenue collectors are always out they bid their trips to avoid certain airports. It's natural human behavior.

We can and do dictate to companies everyday by choosing or not choosing to use their business. Kind of funny how the crappy ones eventually go away. Americans have chosen to fly less and it has hurt the American economy including the airlines, travel destinations, Hotels, aircraft builders and everyone else down the line.

Do the scanners make us any safer? Only time will tell - wont it? Is it that big of deal? Not for me at the moment, but to some people it is and I respect that. How safe are prisons and jails? Is that how we wanted be treated everyday?



[edit on 4-3-2010 by verylowfrequency]

Reply to post by SilentShadow

Unfortunately it is not a right to be able to get on an airliner and have it take you to your destination--it us a privilege. If people don't want to deal with full-body scanners then those people do not fly, simple as that.


Posted Via ATS Mobile: m.abovetopsecret.com

reply to post by stumason

Please do Stu, the revolution could start at yours, You could become a hero for the oppressed people of the world.

Yes i get what you're saying, it would be much easier to leave a bomb in any mcdonalds or burger king(both symbols of american capitalism) than to book a flight. It would be cheaper and you might get a free toy.

The "stupid" terrorists would never think of that would they?