In An Infinite Universe...

In an infinite universe, does it not follow that there must be infinite possibilities?

If the universe is truly infinite, then within that universe, everything that CAN happen, MUST happen.

In an infinite universe, there must be a creator (or god if you prefer) and there must also be an anti-god, there must be an after-life, and yet (bizarrely) there must also be none.

In a universe of infinite possibilities, every single theory which has been put forth, must exist at some level - whether that is through the possibility of other universes within our universe, multiverses, brane theory etc etc

There is so much we do not know - we are like a newborn whose eyes are just beginning to focus, and yet we arrogantly over-estimate our knowledge.

Our minds cannot even begin to fathom infinity, and yet we blithely throw the word around as though we have some form of understanding.

We are nothing, but at the same time we are everything - we are each (in a way) our own universe because that is as far as our individual understanding extends.

reply to post by budski



As I read this post of yours, I couldn't stop visualizing
your Avatar as being the one typing this amazing ____.

S & F

It's funny how this really does make sense, when thought about.
I mean truly thought about. Yeah, I could've read this and easily
been like, "what the hell is this guy smoking?"

But thats not my way. Many of my "friends" who consider me to be
"deep" would choke on their own tongue after reading that.




Nice Thread!

[edit on 23-2-2010 by Tek-Neek55]

I think this follows the same logic that in an infinite universe an infinite amount of possibilities have already happened an infinite amount of times. Im no scientist, but i have always wondered if thats meant to be taken literally.

[edit on 23-2-2010 by Solomons]

reply to post by Solomons


Whilst this is intended more as a metaphysical discussion, there remains an element (or perhaps more) of reality.

If our universe truly is infinite, then every possibility must exist - including the possibility that I am/was/will be a billionaire

It's just that as I type this, I am not...

Yes, in an infinite universe. Its all just theory though. If its not mind boggling enough to comprehend infinite events in an infinite universe, I'll let Douglas Adams ease your pain.

“It is known that there are an infinte number of worlds, simply because there is an infinite amount of space for them to be in. However, not every one of them is inhabited. Any finite number divided by infinity is as near nothing as makes no odds, so the average population of all the planets in the Universe can be said to be zero. From this it follows that the population of the whole Universe is also zero, and that any people you may meet from time to time are merely products of a deranged imagination.”

You know it makes sense.

reply to post by serbsta



I shall reply in kind...

There is a theory which states that if ever anybody discovers exactly what the Universe is for and why it is here, it will instantly disappear and be replaced by something even more bizarre and inexplicable. There is another theory which states that this has already happened.

reply to post by budski


This is where I separate the brain and mind. The brain might not be able to handle the infinite, yet the mind is able to handle the infinite possibilities.

One method to handle such infiniteness is use logic existentialism. Mathematics is finite, so to use math in any infinite sense ultimately fails. If people continue to argue that everything has to be proven by math, then how would they ever prove the infinite?

One should be at least wise enough that we would run out of physical resources to try to prove what is not physical because of the infinite possibilities of what isn't physical. Just think of the size of the chalkboard needed to write all the equations of the infinite proof of everything.

There are obviously impossibilities.

I can I am alive, so there is the impossibility that at any time right now I don't exist.

We also can prove the impossibility of infinite death, which would be beyond... way beyond an Earthenly burial. We can prove this by logic existentialism. Infinite death then becomes... something like jail, or what some relate as hell.

Out of all these infinite possibilities, don't you find it at least beautiful to be alive?

reply to post by dzonatas


That's the problem - are we alive in the sense you mean, or are we just a figment of our own imagination?

A dream within a dream if you will...

To all intents and purposes, we are each alive, because we think/feel/touch/see etc but to others we are merely a projection of their senses, and in that sense we are no more alive than an interactive virtual reality programme (abeit a very advanced one) character.

This is what I mean when I say we are each our own universe, because although people may claim to understand others, they have absolutely no comprehension of that other persons existence and how that existence affects them.

In an infinite universe, does it not follow that there must be infinite possibilities?

No, because the universe is not really infinite. It's "practically infinite" in our terms simply because of our limited ability and existence to see, explore, and know everything on the scale of the universe. Further, we can say that space is infinite in terms of never being able to get to the edge, as the rate of expansion in the collective distance between us and the observable edge of the universe is the same rate as the speed of light. Beyond the observable universe, into what lay beyond, the space between a point there and us is expanding faster than we could ever reach. Further, depending on the shape of the universe, there may be no "edge" to reach.

However, the laws of physics have yet to make allowances for magic or selective/alternate application of them. Even the most distant galaxies known have forms described by known physics, and are comprised of stars and gas clouds which follow known patterns described by physics.

So even if the universe can be described as "infinite" in a useful manner, a universe which is restricted to causality (as it appears to be) would not contain infinite possibilities. I could go on here to describe chaos theory and how it describes how a very small variety of deterministic interactions occurring on a massive scale does give rise to complexity. Sensitivity to initial conditions can cause systemic collapse of emergent trends in higher level interaction. I.E. A fine tuned universe is only fine tuned so long as it stays in tune. Fiddle with the properties of initial conditions, and the whole thing can collapse as ripples of that interaction spread via causation.

So no, there are not infinite possibilities in an infinite universe. Rather, there is only ONE possibility. However, since we do not and cannot flirt with LaPlace's Demon (absolute causal knowledge), it's impractical for us to say there is only one possibility. It's not true, but more useful, to say there are infinite possibilities so as to account for new information and observations.

Ultimately, the entire universe and everything ever in it can be summed up as the result of a phenomena that can be described as the execution of a relatively simple, though highly elegant, mathematical equation. The answer isn't "42", but such thinking is pretty much on the right track. This is why physics equations favor elegance and simplicity the further you refine and expand them.

Murray Gell-Mann, in his TEDTalks speech "The beauty and truth in physics" described it as such:

Now, it's often said that getting closer and closer to the fundamental laws by examining phenomena at low energies, and then higher energies, and then higher energies, or short distances, and then shorter distances, and then still shorter distances, and so on, is like peeling the skin of an onion. And we keep doing that, and build more powerful machines, accelerators for particles. We look deeper and deeper into the structure of particles, and in that way we get probably closer and closer to this fundamental law. Now, what happens is that as we do that, as we peel these skins of the onion, and we get closer and closer to the underlying law, we see that each skin has something in common with the previous one, and with the next one. We write them out mathematically, and we see they use very similar mathematics. They require very similar mathematics.

That is absolutely remarkable, and that is a central feature of what I'm trying to say today. Newton called; "nature conformable to herself" -- personifying nature as a female. And so what happens is that the new phenomena, the new skins, the inner skins of the slightly smaller skins of the onion that we get to, resemble the slightly larger ones. And the kind of mathematics that we had for the previous skin is almost the same as what we need for the next skin. And that's why the equations look so simple. Because they use mathematics we already have.

If Dr. Michio Kaku and colleagues are correct about the implications of string theory vis multiple parallel worlds in which whatever can happen does happen...

in another parallel world, you were born one minute before you were born in this one; you were born one minute later than you were in this one... extend this out for who knows how many millions/billions/trillions minutes in both directions on "timelines"...

which means, in another parallel world, you died one minute after being born, then in another world you died two minutes after being born and so forth...

in this way, you can die and still be alive somewhere...

and...

you can be born, but have already been born somewhere...

the implications are staggering, obviously.

P.S. --- In some alternate reality, in some parallel world, I married Drew Barrymore and in another world, Jodie Foster, and so forth and so on. This kind of thinking is true according to Kaku and serious string theorists advocating the multiverse concept.

[edit on 23-2-2010 by switching yard]

Originally posted by Lasheic
No, because the universe is not really infinite.

Or, in the sense that you have only realized and allow, that the universe is your brain.

I got this video from this other thread: New theory of before the big bang(article)

reply to post by budski


In an infinite universe...it means there are infinite possibilities...but it also means there is an infinite amount of any one possibility...that means there are an infinite amount of beings exactly like you in every single way, meaning the exact same history and memories down to every last detail...and then also an infinite amount of beings differing from you in an infinite amount of ways...wrap your mind around that...

Also, I don't think absolutely anything is possible...anything that is entirely impossible, meaning it breaches the cosmic laws of reality, will not happen, simply because it can not happen....but there are still an infinite amount of possibilities...no matter how small the chances of that possibility becoming a reality is...somewhere, somehow, it will become a reality...or more precisely, in an infinite amount of different places, in an infinite amount of different ways it will become a reality.

[edit on 23/2/10 by CHA0S]

One of the main things I focus on is the supposed certainty that our universe is NOT infinite.

This is why I likened our species to a newborn just starting to focus its eyes.

We may THINK we know the universe is not infinite, but it's just as likely that we don't understand enough to make that statement.

this is funny, i've been thinking about this recently as well. I don't believe that an infinite universe would mean infinite possibilities. Why could an infinitely big universe not just be completely empty?

Maybe an infinite number of planets with life on them has been infinitely bombarded with astroids and subsequently baronized. Therefore there wouldn't be infinite number if possibilities, there would be in infinite number of hardly any life planets.

There surely can't both be a god and not a god in an infinite universe, just because it is infinite doesnt alter the fact that there either is a god or not a god....it just means that god either exists in an infinite universe or he doesn't.

reply to post by Frakkerface


An infinitely large universe would actually be MOSTLY empty.

And in an infinite universe, everything that could happen, would happen, or will happen, simply because of its nature.

reply to post by budski


This subject also becomes an epiphany when there is one that says the universe is finite and the other says it is infinite, yet the one that says it is finite doesn't allow the one who says it is infinite the freedom of choice. It is obvious the one that says it is infinite allows the one who says it is finite that possibility.

Originally posted by budski


And in an infinite universe, everything that could happen, would happen, or will happen, simply because of its nature.

why though? An infinite universe is a description (is that the right word?) of size, it doesnt have to mean that there is an infinity of possibilities happening within it, it could just go on forever with nothing at all happening in it. Forever.

[edit on 23-2-2010 by Frakkerface]

reply to post by Frakkerface


Because by the nature of infinity, there MUST be infinite possibilities, otherwise it wouldn't be infinite - in other words, literally anything could and would be possible.

Nothingness is just ONE possibility

Why do you say that in an infinite universe there has to be a creator?

If the Universe was infinite, there wouldnt be a creator, because something that always WAS, can not have been created.
Hence the only creator that i can think of, is the one that was always there, the Universe.
Creation came AFTER the Universe, because itself it has no beginning and no end. (sounds familiar?)

[edit on 23-2-2010 by Dynamitrios]

[edit on 23-2-2010 by Dynamitrios]

reply to post by budski


Infinity is the Creator. It is the plenum for all possbilities. In the begining there is Infinity. Infinity is Creation.

Due to Infinity's decision to explore many-ness and the plenum for an infinite array of possibilities it is free to continue untill an eternal present (indefinitley).

Meaning you, me, and everything else is indefinite or Infinity.