Do women have a human right to taxpayer paid abortions? I don't think so!

Originally posted by HotSauce
reply to post by OhZone

 

Forced Pregnancy is Slavery. And since you expect the Mother to care for the child that makes her an indentured servant for some 20 years.

****THey are if they are FORCED to stay pregnant because YOU want them to be.****

You have got to be kidding. So now mothers are indentured servants. Hell I must be one two, because I have been raising two kids by myself the last 5 years.
****Good for you. Did you save them from being aborted?****

Hotsauce, how many babies have you adopted?
Just wondering if you are willing to walk the talk.

[edit on 11-11-2009 by OhZone]

Hot Sauce...good question and a tough one. I still believe mother has the ultimate choice in the matter. Thanks btw for not getting overdramatic and sticking to the topic at hand...rare in these parts

snusfanatic...bit dramatic for me and you're putting words in my mouth a bit. I never said this entire thing was about control of men over women and no my argument does not ONLY make sense if we dehumanize what YOU call a child. It only seems so because you are stuck in your specific stance. What is hilarious to me is you and others calling me anti-life and pro murder. That is way over the top and very emotional. Now you did ask me a valid question. do I consider the fetus a life. No I do not. I consider life to be something that can exist outside of the mother. True a baby will last all of a few hours if mother simply throws it away but I am talking about viability here. If the mother gives birth 10 weeks after conception the baby simply isn't going to make it no matter how hard mother tries. Now in the third trimester...few weeks out then yes I now consider it a child because we've seen early third trimester births become successful. Hence why I am against third trimester abortion. I am trying to stay civil...instead you and others decided to whip out derogatory terms for my wise of the argument.

At least the OP was very VERY civil to me

-Kyo

reply to post by OhZone


I don't know can you save a baby from being aborted without going to jail in the process? Honestly, I would say no I probably did not save them from being aborted unless the mother was choosing between adoption and abortion, which I don't know if that was the case.

I do know that my friends that adopted the cutest little down syndrome kid ever actually did play a role in the teenage mother not aborting it.

Also, I would gladly adopt another kid, so if anyone you know is choosing between abortion and adoption tell them there is someone willing to adopt in order to give that kid a chance at life.

[edit on 11-11-2009 by HotSauce]

reply to post by KyoZero


Well I cannot say I have totally stayed on topic or that I have not been dramatic at times on this thread so I am not so sure I deserve your accolades but thanks.

I am really not trying to be dramatic as much as I am trying to help bring the truth to light. People try to say it is just a choice, but the truth is that it is a choice that ends a life, sometimes in the most horrific ways. So I take offense to people trying to make it out to be a medical procedure. The equivalent would be taking your kid to the doctor and having it get a medical procedure thats goal is the childs death by any means necessary.

In the words of bill hicks " If your pro-life, why are you not blocking the entrances to graveyards?!"

Hahaha. I will NEVER see the logic of Anti-Abortionists. I just dont think your view serves a useful purpose. In a perfect world everyone would be able to take care of their children but sadly that is not the world we live in. Until that world comes into existance i'm all for abortion.

reply to post by SearchLightsInc


Well usually by the time you get to the graveyard you are already dead. My issue with abortion is that I don't think a woman should have a choice to let a doctor suck her baby's brain out through a straw just because she finds it to be inconvenient that she finds herself with child.

Originally posted by SearchLightsInc
In the words of bill hicks " If your pro-life, why are you not blocking the entrances to graveyards?!"

Hahaha. I will NEVER see the logic of Anti-Abortionists. I just dont think your view serves a useful purpose. In a perfect world everyone would be able to take care of their children but sadly that is not the world we live in. Until that world comes into existance i'm all for abortion.

Wow it's good to know that you are for the killing of an innocent life.

I don't think women should be allowed to have an abortion unless they were rape or they got pregnant by incest or if you have a medical problem that puts your life in danger. If you get pregnant and know for a fact that you can't support a child then you better find a way to support that child by getting a job. Adoption is also an option as well....but abortion that's just wrong unless you have to.

[edit on 11-11-2009 by Rocketgirl]

Originally posted by HotSauce
reply to post by gwynnhwyfar

 

Well I think you may be wrong. The bill just doesn't let government funded insurance cover abortions. Women can still get them they will just have to pay for them instead of the tax payer.

If some people are such huge fans of paying to end kids lives before they even get a chance why don't they start a non-profit where people can donate to pay for abortions. Then the blood can be on their hands for paying for something they love and have a commitment too.

interesting that a glob of fetal material attached by an embilical cord inside a womans womb insides a womans body...is now regarded as a kid.
if my tax money can fund tax breaks (welfare) for religous organizations, then you as a taxpayer WILL fund abortions. it's very simple

Women should be allowed 1 abortion by the taxpayer in the UK, and only when it's obvious that it was a tragic mistake.

Some British women have dozens of abortions on the NHS, and it's pathetic.

I don't think it's fair in some cases for those women who cannot afford an abortion, or a child, to tell them tough luck you're having the kid. As human being's make mistakes, but most learn from these mistakes. Those who don't learn, nobody can help them, but preventing taxpayer abortions will only lead to more kids in care.

Some comments here say that the fetuses that are aborted deserve a life, but that's a contradiction when proper contraception is used - these kids would have never existed! How can they deserve an existence, yet should never have existed?

Originally posted by HotSauce
reply to post by SearchLightsInc

 

Well usually by the time you get to the graveyard you are already dead. My issue with abortion is that I don't think a woman should have a choice to let a doctor suck her baby's brain out through a straw just because she finds it to be inconvenient that she finds herself with child.

what? is a woman now your slave, and you will tell her what she can do with her body? is a woman your dog or pet? you control procreation? you think you are a god? maybe jim jones? he controlled women. maybe an arab sheik? they control women

Originally posted by john124
Women should be allowed 1 abortion by the taxpayer in the UK, and only when it's obvious that it was a tragic mistake.

Some British women have dozens of abortions on the NHS, and it's pathetic.

I don't think it's fair in some cases for those women who cannot afford an abortion, or a child, to tell them tough luck you're having the kid. As human being's make mistakes, but most learn from these mistakes. Those who don't learn, nobody can help them, but preventing taxpayer abortions will only lead to more kids in care.

Some comments here say that the fetuses that are aborted deserve a life, but that's a contradiction when proper contraception is used - these kids would have never existed! How can they deserve an existence, yet should never have existed?

really??? some british women have had dozens of abortions??? show us this government statistic, and not something from some right wing or christian website.

reply to post by Rocketgirl

Wow it's good to know that you are for the killing of an innocent life.

I agree with most of your post, and personally I disagree entirely with abortions, but I don't feel any of us have the right to make these decisions for other couples/women. Even in cases that aren't rape, nobody is in a position to judge a girl that makes a mistake. Pregnancy does occasionally happen even when they're on the pill and using condoms. It's very rare, but it can happen! I think we should at least give them one chance under those circumstances!

I don't think you can justify a fetus as a equivalent to an innocent life.

reply to post by jimmyx


Of course it's about control, along with a side order of misogyny. Women should function as incubators and be happy about it. It's all a wonderful, rich tapestry. I get the feeling a lot of these anti abotionists couldn't get laid if their lives depended on it. So why should they complain about something they won't have to worry about.

reply to post by jimmyx


Are you insane or just stupid? Of course a woman is not my slave or my pet, unless we both agree that it would be fun to try.

I don't control women. Ask any woman I have ever been with, she would say I treated her like a princess.

What I am saying is that womenshoul not have a government funded abortion except in cases of rape, incest, or where it is life threatening.

Originally posted by HotSauce
reply to post by canadianmouse

 

Killing a live child is murder, that child is living and breathing. Abotion isn't murder because abortion is legal and not the murdering of life. Life is when the person can live and breathe on their own. In a mother's womb they can not.

Where are you getting your information of why women had an abortion? Because I can start pulling out records to that will prove you are wrong. And these records are unbiased unlike the ones you are probably looking at.

Just because the government says killing an unborn child is legal does not mean it isn't murderl. Murder is legal in at least two other ways in this country. War and captal punishment. I actually support those two forms, though I am a tad squeemish about capital punishment.

According your logic then it would be ok to kill a child that needed to be put on a ventillator or hearth machine for life support right after it was born, even if there is 100% chance it would live given the right treatment.

Your logic is so flawed it is almost insane. You support war and capital punishment but not abortion? So children in war torn countries have no right to live?

Not once to my logic have I stated that it would be okay to kill a child on a ventilator so keep trying to read between the lines that aren't there in what I am typing. In a womb a baby can not survive outside of it. It requires the mother. It can not sleep in a bed, have a ventilator or an iv to keep it alive. The baby would die without the mother.

An abortion is the woman's right to choose if they are ready to have the child. This choice protects the woman from taking her life in her own hands. I would rather a professional doctor preform an abortion and save a woman then a mother, sister, daughter that is already living die at the hands of some alley doctor who knows nothing about abortions. You can twist my words any way you want but those women are more important then a fetus that has never seen the light of day.

The reasons they have an abortion is unimportant, and really what does it matter that someone you don't even know had an abortion? You should be more concerned of stopping wars that kill children already.

reply to post by jimmyx


Here it is: Women having multiple abortions reaches record high

Repeat abortions have reached a record high, figures released today reveal.

One third of women who had an abortion last year were on their second, third or even eighth termination, new figures show.

The statistics will fuel the debate over whether some women are using abortion as a form of contraception.

7 or 8 is still a lot, and I'm sure I read somewhere else about a woman having dozens. I'll post the other story as soon as I find it.

Originally posted by jimmyx

Originally posted by john124
Women should be allowed 1 abortion by the taxpayer in the UK, and only when it's obvious that it was a tragic mistake.

Some British women have dozens of abortions on the NHS, and it's pathetic.

I don't think it's fair in some cases for those women who cannot afford an abortion, or a child, to tell them tough luck you're having the kid. As human being's make mistakes, but most learn from these mistakes. Those who don't learn, nobody can help them, but preventing taxpayer abortions will only lead to more kids in care.

Some comments here say that the fetuses that are aborted deserve a life, but that's a contradiction when proper contraception is used - these kids would have never existed! How can they deserve an existence, yet should never have existed?

really??? some british women have had dozens of abortions??? show us this government statistic, and not something from some right wing or christian website.

he wont show the statistics, I already asked him to show it for his previous statistics but he has yet to do so. I am more certain that he is getting his information from some right wing, or christian website.

Why I became an ‘abortion addict’

It took me close to a decade to write my book, Impossible Motherhood: Testimony of an Abortion Addict. I had been driven by the need to understand and explain my destructive actions. Though my story was a terrible one, I had broken the cycle and mended a torn self. I was a writer who had overcome a serious neurosis.

My neurotic behaviours were extreme, my pathology difficult to identify with, yet in the almost grotesque extent of my destructive actions as I forgot to take my Pill time after time to indulge in the fantasy of potential motherhood, I was convinced I had put my finger on something. Fifteen pregnancies, most of them in one romance gone sour while married to a college professor 34 years my senior, were 15 “highs” charting an imaginary path of control and empowerment that resulted in 15 despairing terminations.

This is an extreme case though probably involving mental health issues.

reply to post by canadianmouse


I already posted it once - www.timesonline.co.uk...

Does the time count as non-christian and non-right wing. It's usually a tory paper, but they don't print propaganda on these kinds of issues. This is not American and fox news.

Repeat abortions have reached a record high, figures released today reveal.

One third of women who had an abortion last year were on their second, third or even eighth termination, new figures show.

The statistics will fuel the debate over whether some women are using abortion as a form of contraception.

In total, there were 64,715 repeat abortions in 2008, 33 per cent of the total and up from 64,230 the year before.

Now this is definitely unacceptable, but it's wrong to tarnish every woman who have had 1 abortion with the same brush as these women.

[edit on 11-11-2009 by john124]

reply to post by canadianmouse

Your logic is so flawed it is almost insane. You support war and capital punishment but not abortion? So children in war torn countries have no right to live?

Not once to my logic have I stated that it would be okay to kill a child on a ventilator so keep trying to read between the lines that aren't there in what I am typing. In a womb a baby can not survive outside of it. It requires the mother. It can not sleep in a bed, have a ventilator or an iv to keep it alive. The baby would die without the mother.

I never said children should be killed in war. It is one thing for a kid to die accidentaly in a war vs a kid dying because his mother was worried her ass would get fat. Do you really think the USA purposely targets children who are not a threat to its troops?

So what happens when we can keep a fetus alive outside the womb, then will you admit that its baby murder?