It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

Committee confirms:Comply With Pelosi Care or Go To Jail

page: 2
12
<< 1    3  4  5 >>

log in

join
share:

posted on Nov, 6 2009 @ 05:02 PM
link   
reply to post by Seiko
 


This Health Care Bill, if it passes, will never stand up. Here's why...
www.abovetopsecret.com...




posted on Nov, 6 2009 @ 05:03 PM
link   
 


off-topic post removed to prevent thread-drift


 



posted on Nov, 6 2009 @ 05:05 PM
link   

Originally posted by mythatsabigprobe

Originally posted by Elostone
I, for one, will NOT be buying into any so called "mandated" health insurance. I will go to prison 1st.


What, so I'll be forced to pay for your vacation in prison now?


That's about it to isn't. Jail may be the lesser and easier path to take in life. No bills, three square meals, healthcare, a gym, a education, and a roof over your head.

.....

Man am I losing all incentive in life.



posted on Nov, 6 2009 @ 05:18 PM
link   
Dear Princess "miss piggy" Pelosi,

Please realize that you and all the other sold-out U.S. politicians who have cheated the American people, including Barry “the narcissistic clown” Soetorro and Rahm “the chosen one” Emanuel, will be living out your next incarnated lives as the homeless, without an ounce of hope or a hot shower, on the unforgiving streets of skid row.

Regards,

F.T.G.

P.S. This coming winter, there will be thousands of children sleeping in the streets of America, as a result of your greedy self-serving ways.


[edit on 6-11-2009 by seasoul]



posted on Nov, 6 2009 @ 05:19 PM
link   
Whether people go directly to jail without passing "GO" and collecting $200.00, the bottom line is that eventually if they don't pay this new "tax", they will go to jail. The Bill of Rights continues to be shredded, and one day we will wake up, and there will be no Bill of Rights, only a "Bill of Wrongs" which will lead to jail
EVERY SINGLE ASPECT of your lives is being put under the full control of government.
At what point do people say "Stop. This is enough. The government has lost it's right to govern the people."



posted on Nov, 6 2009 @ 05:21 PM
link   

Originally posted by plumranch


Prosecution is authorized under the Code for a variety of offenses. Depending on the level of the noncompliance, the following penalties could apply to an individual:

• Section 7203 – misdemeanor willful failure to pay is punishable by a fine of up to $25,000 and/or imprisonment of up to one year.

• Section 7201 – felony willful evasion is punishable by a fine of up to $250,000 and/or imprisonment of up to five years.” [page 3]

I wonder if the jails will be able to handle all the US citizens who refuse to buy their silly insurance?


biggovernment.com
(visit the link for the full news article)


Im more interested in when i get arrested for not paying these new taxes, will the jail im in provide health insurance?



posted on Nov, 6 2009 @ 05:28 PM
link   
C'mon liberals, tell us conservatives we are paranoid.

If I had the money to pay this crap I still would not.

This is the shot that will be heard round the world.

The first offensive in the Revolution has been delivered.
What will be our response?




posted on Nov, 6 2009 @ 05:30 PM
link   

Originally posted by Seiko
reply to post by fraterormus
 


You seem fairly balanced in your responses, what do you think of the legality of it?

This differs in car insurance as you can choose not to drive, but this seems like a living tax?


Well, the issue of the legality or Constitutionality of the IRS itself, and our Federal Tax system is an entirely different ball-game. There are many who believe that the Federal Income Tax is both illegal and unconstitutional, however that doesn't prevent the Courts from sentencing those who are caught evading the Federal Income Tax to Federal Prison. So, I won't derail this thread with a discussion of that.

However, as to this Health Care Bill itself...and let me insert a disclaimer that I have always been for Universal Health Care even when I was a card-carrying member of the Y.R.A. (the only sticky-widget in my mind was how it is to be implemented)...I don't believe that it falls within the realm of being illegal or being unconstitutional any more so than any other Federal Income Tax provision.

As the penalty for being non-insured is a 2.5% additional Tax Liability on your Federal Income Tax, it is not a Universal Tax on Living. Those who are already Exempt from Federal Income Tax will not have to pay this penalty. Those who are Unemployed, or are below the Federal minimum Annual Salary, will not have to pay this penalty. Only those who must file a 1040 already, and who have a Net Adjusted Income that is Taxable are liable for the 2.5% Penalty if they do not maintain Health Insurance. In other words, the Retired, Minors, the Poor, the Unemployed, et cetera neither are required to have Health Care or taxed for not having it. Only the Working Class and the Rich are taxed if they don't have it. (Which is the way to do it, as any other way would be grossly unfair to those who can't afford it.)

The reason for it is the same as how Group-Rates for Health Care Insurance works now. In an "Open Market" the higher the demand, the lower the cost is to the consumer (or at least that's how the theory goes). The larger an Employer is, they are able to negotiate proportionately lower Health Care Insurance Rates. The premise of this Amended Draft is that the Government is pooling all of the U.S. Citizens into one super large Group to negotiate an even lower Group-Rate, and subsidizing those who can't afford it with Tax dollars. Since this system depends on every person who has a Taxable Income participating to ensure the lowest possible Group-Rate, basically it has to require that those who can afford it either pay it or are taxed for it if they don't, while not penalizing those who can neither afford to pay it or be taxed for it.

It sucks that any Federal Program ultimately ends up taxing the Working Middle Class and the Rich (who don't have good enough Accountants or Tax Consultants to reduce their Tax Liability to 0 through deductions) have to pay for these programs through increased Income Tax, but this really is no different than any other Federal Program the Federal Government enacts. It was the same with the Bailouts, and it has been the same since the dawn of Federal Income Tax. Alors, c'est la vie.

[edit on 6-11-2009 by fraterormus]



posted on Nov, 6 2009 @ 05:34 PM
link   
In California it is already difficult to survive. Rent is extremely expensive no matter where you live, especially in the areas one would consider "safe". They just tacked on a 10% tax increase that comes out of our paychecks every month, beginning this month (Nov). Our pockets are getting tighter each week, and I find myself eliminating "fun" more and more in order to save some money (yet I still don't seem to be able to put anything away.)

A lot of people around me have lost their jobs. I'm lucky to still be employed, I try to do outside jobs when I get home from work, but sometimes I'm just too exhausted to keep going this way. I'm one of those who don't have health insurance, because between having insurance and being able to eat that month, I choose to eat. I'm still young, healthy, I take care of myself the best I can, and when I do have an emergency I go to the hospital and I pay my bill. The people who cost taxpayers money are those who let the state take care of them from top to bottom, and illegal aliens who go to the hospital and never pay back any of the fees. Legal, hard-working citizens pay their bills.

I am not opposed to paying a little bit of tax money for an insurance plan which would take care of the TAX PAYING citizens when an emergency arises, however I am against the Government forcing me to buy insurance while the slackers and Illegals in this country continue to suck the system (and us) dry, getting the same thing I would be paying for, for free!

I don't think anyone here needs to be worried about those with jobs not paying their medical bills. It's the ones that are chronic leeches and/or Illegal that we should worry about.



posted on Nov, 6 2009 @ 05:35 PM
link   

Originally posted by bigvig316
You know are jails are full. They are going to have to build more jails because right now half of America would be going into it. Maybe that is how they want to create more jobs that way.


Remember all those FEMA camps, they'll just use those for those of us who refuse to play along.



posted on Nov, 6 2009 @ 05:39 PM
link   
reply to post by fraterormus
 


I'm kind of following you. My question was whether it was constitutional to force someone to buy a service they did not want. By using the tax they have circumvented a direct mandatory health insurance line which could be contested easier in court?

Is my thinking on that close?

I am also for true health care for all, but I don't believe this bill gets anywhere close. I would rather they simply did the actual universal health care and got it over with. This is a headache and way too complicated. People will still be without health insurance, and those that have bad employee health insurance are forced to stay with it.



posted on Nov, 6 2009 @ 06:56 PM
link   
reply to post by fraterormus
 





Only those who must file a 1040 already, and who have a Net Adjusted Income that is Taxable are liable for the 2.5% Penalty if they do not maintain Health Insurance. In other words, the Retired, Minors, the Poor, the Unemployed, et cetera neither are required to have Health Care or taxed for not having it.

Well, either you are not retired or are independently wealthy and retired to think that.
RETIRED PEOPLE DO PAY FEDERAL INCOME TAXES on their retirement. I have a 1040 every year to prove it.



posted on Nov, 6 2009 @ 07:39 PM
link   

Originally posted by Jim Scott
It's not? Think about it. I have to work to pay for the health care of others now. Doesn't that affect my liberty? When the uninsured go into a hospital, it comes out of my taxpayer pocket. I would rather see them pay something, personally.


Is it? think about it a bit.... People will be FORCED to have ALL vaccinations, which means, once again, YOU HAVE NO CHOICE..... even when you know vaccinations have mercury, and adjuvants which are detrimental to your health, including mental health.....

Let me ask you this, are you a Liberal/Progressive/Democrat?

I am asking this question because for the most part Liberals/Progressives/Democrats" seem to think that being forced to do things is great, and should be done by the government.

It kind of puts in perspective the claims that "Liberals/Progressives/Democrats" are smarter than conservatives...


[edit on 6-11-2009 by ElectricUniverse]



posted on Nov, 6 2009 @ 08:18 PM
link   
I agree,there is no shortage of places to put the people who don't want to go along with what this government proposes.

hotair.com...

This is a nightmare in progress!



posted on Nov, 6 2009 @ 08:26 PM
link   
Sorry to bring this to you my dearest fellow Americans and tax payer voters in the nation, what congress and that moronic in insurance pocket woman is doing is nothing but treason, forcing Americans to pay mandatory for anything in this nation or be forced to pay penalties is nothing more than unconstitutional and down right dictatorship

How in the hell did the politicians and morons in Washington can even think that we the people have to bend to any private entity in this nation with full backup or our own congress?

Does anybody see that nowhere in the constitution said that congress can force the people in the nation into supporting a private entity because they are like whores sleeping with them for campaign money?

What in the world is happening to America!!!!!!!!



posted on Nov, 6 2009 @ 08:27 PM
link   
reply to post by On the Edge
 


Oops! That said,"Page Not Found"!

You can get to it though...

The Lock up your Opponents bills of 2009 at Hotair.com

And it's getting worse everyday!

What really irks me is when people say things about the "collective conscienceness" or whatever,and this is all happening because we're not all thinking "happy thoughts"! There has always been evil in the world,and thinking "happy thoughts" will not make it go away!



posted on Nov, 6 2009 @ 08:47 PM
link   
reply to post by Jim Scott
 


I don't think anybody has a problem with wanting everyone to have health insurance. But to freaking throw people in jail because they don't have the "proper coverage" - surely, you can't be in favor of that!



posted on Nov, 6 2009 @ 08:51 PM
link   
reply to post by inthesticks
 


No only that but nobody in this nation should support a bill that forces people into becoming servants of a private entity.

Plain and simple we are no slaves and we were not born to belong to some corrupted system, America was build in the notion that we are all humans and individuals with certain rights give to us by free will.

Anything mandatory is not freedom of choice.

Something people are failing to understand.



posted on Nov, 6 2009 @ 08:53 PM
link   
Here is what the United States Constitution says regarding the power to tax:

Article 1, Section 8:



Section 8.

The Congress shall have Power To lay and collect Taxes, Duties, Imposts and Excises, to pay the Debts and provide for the common Defence and general Welfare of the United States; but all Duties, Imposts and Excises shall be uniform throughout the United States;



Note the KEY phrase "Shall be uniform thoughout the United States."
There is NO QUESTION that a PUNITIVE tax for people that DO NOT purchase health care, is in VIOLATION of the US Constitution.

Of course, most members of Congress have never even READ the US Constitution. Of that, I am sure.Ignorance of the law, however, is no excuse. The ignorant Pelosi, Reid, and the other conspirator traitors are GUILTY of attempting to pass "laws" which VIOLATE the constitution.



posted on Nov, 6 2009 @ 09:04 PM
link   
reply to post by fraterormus
 

frater,
Thanks for doing the work of turning bill-speak into something we can all understand.
But, what of those who do not work and are not on any aid whatsoever? Does the government have a way to get their healthcare hooks into these folks?????




top topics



 
12
<< 1    3  4  5 >>

log in

join