It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

Committee confirms:Comply With Pelosi Care or Go To Jail

page: 1
12
<<   2  3  4 >>

log in

join
share:

posted on Nov, 6 2009 @ 03:53 PM
link   

Committee confirms:Comply With Pelosi Care or Go To Jail


biggovernment.com

Today, Ranking Member of the House Ways and Means Committee Dave Camp (R-MI) released a letter from the non-partisan Joint Committee on Taxation (JCT) confirming that the failure to comply with the individual mandate to buy health insurance contained in the Pelosi health care bill (H.R. 3962, as amended) could land people in jail. The JCT letter makes clear that Americans who do not maintain “acceptable health insurance coverage” and who choose not to pay the bill’s new individual mandate tax (generally 2.5% of income), are subject to numerous civil and criminal penalties, including cri
(visit the link for the full news article)



Related AboveTopSecret.com Discussion Threads:
Pelosi Breaks Pledge to Put Final Health Care Bill Online for 72 Hours Before Vote

 

mod edit,. to fix spelling in title for clarity

[edit on Fri Nov 6 2009 by DontTreadOnMe]




posted on Nov, 6 2009 @ 03:53 PM
link   
Prosecution is authorized under the Code for a variety of offenses. Depending on the level of the noncompliance, the following penalties could apply to an individual:

• Section 7203 – misdemeanor willful failure to pay is punishable by a fine of up to $25,000 and/or imprisonment of up to one year.

• Section 7201 – felony willful evasion is punishable by a fine of up to $250,000 and/or imprisonment of up to five years.” [page 3]

I wonder if the jails will be able to handle all the US citizens who refuse to buy their silly insurance?


biggovernment.com
(visit the link for the full news article)



posted on Nov, 6 2009 @ 04:18 PM
link   
You know are jails are full. They are going to have to build more jails because right now half of America would be going into it. Maybe that is how they want to create more jobs that way.



posted on Nov, 6 2009 @ 04:27 PM
link   
People without health care are

1. The largest source for bankruptcy.

Bankruptcy is good for the individual, but I'm sure you would not like people to keep the money they owe to you. It affects your life, future, etc.

2. The largest source for increased health care costs.

You pay a lot for health insurance because hospitals are caring for those who have no insurance.

3. Suffering when life changes occur.

They have sleepless nights, worried about what can happen to their own lives when something goes wrong in their family. Will they lose everything? I have know people who had medical debt over $1 million dollars. It devastated them.

4. Don't find out about preventive medicine.

Health care providers can do preventive measures, like routine exams, to keep medical problems small and inexpensive, compared to the full-blown costs of major problems, like cancer and heart disease. Nip it in the bud, so to speak.

For these and other reasons, it is a great idea to have universal health care. It makes for a healthier family, and a more stable economy. Makes sense for us all to chip in. I think it will actually cost less for all of us in the long run.



posted on Nov, 6 2009 @ 04:32 PM
link   
I guess this is the reason why they are going to legalize Marijuana... Make more room in the jails for people that don't have health insurance...

Now when they pull you over they are going to ask for your drivers license, proof of insurance for the car and HEALTH along with your registration. God forbid you don't have your seat belt on too...

But, If your an illegal alien... a whole different story I'm sure.



posted on Nov, 6 2009 @ 04:32 PM
link   
I, for one, will NOT be buying into any so called "mandated" health insurance. I will go to prison 1st.



posted on Nov, 6 2009 @ 04:36 PM
link   

Originally posted by Elostone
I, for one, will NOT be buying into any so called "mandated" health insurance. I will go to prison 1st.


What, so I'll be forced to pay for your vacation in prison now?



posted on Nov, 6 2009 @ 04:37 PM
link   
So with U 6 estimates of around 53 million unemployed Americans, currently, and more to come, the Government is now going to require their broke and penniless citizens, many of whom are living out of tents and gathering food from Aid Centers, to pay the Insurance Companies their promised blood money or go to Jail? I dont think so. This is should be called the Insurance Lobby Care Plan.

If you think this is in the best interests of the US population, you need to have your head examined.

[edit on 6-11-2009 by Angiras]



posted on Nov, 6 2009 @ 04:40 PM
link   
Does this sound like liberty to anyone? I will not stand for this, I will fight this with all I have. They just can't decide that it is ok to send people to jail if they don't buy health insurance. This is unamerican and I can't believe that this is even being considered. Live free or die.



posted on Nov, 6 2009 @ 04:40 PM
link   

Originally posted by mythatsabigprobe

Originally posted by Elostone
I, for one, will NOT be buying into any so called "mandated" health insurance. I will go to prison 1st.


What, so I'll be forced to pay for your vacation in prison now?


Thank Pelosi Care...
Club Pelosi, Here I come! (Foam the Runway)



posted on Nov, 6 2009 @ 04:45 PM
link   

Originally posted by Erasurehead
Does this sound like liberty to anyone? I will not stand for this, I will fight this with all I have. They just can't decide that it is ok to send people to jail if they don't buy health insurance. This is unamerican and I can't believe that this is even being considered. Live free or die.



It's not? Think about it. I have to work to pay for the health care of others now. Doesn't that affect my liberty? When the uninsured go into a hospital, it comes out of my taxpayer pocket. I would rather see them pay something, personally.



posted on Nov, 6 2009 @ 04:47 PM
link   
reply to post by plumranch
 


The government is brilliant. Absolutely brilliant. The whole point of having a fine is to cover the costs of non-compliant citizens. But what do they do with those citizens who choose not to pay? They throw them in jail...at a cost to the taxpayers of $40,000 or more per year, which is about 40 times what it would cost the health care program itself if the government did NOTHING to punish that non-compliant citizen.

Yep, this is a great plan. If Congress is that dense, how stupid is the rest of this bill?

[edit on 6-11-2009 by vor78]



posted on Nov, 6 2009 @ 04:47 PM
link   
reply to post by Jim Scott
 


...and if they cannot pay?

Are we seeing the re institution of a debtors prison?



posted on Nov, 6 2009 @ 04:48 PM
link   

Originally posted by Angiras
So with U 6 estimates of around 53 million unemployed Americans, currently, and more to come, the Government is now going to require their broke and penniless citizens, many of whom are living out of tents and gathering food from Aid Centers, to pay the Insurance Companies their promised blood money or go to Jail? I dont think so. This is should be called the Insurance Lobby Care Plan.

If you think this is in the best interests of the US population, you need to have your head examined.

[edit on 6-11-2009 by Angiras]

You have to be real, here. Penniless citizens will have health care insurance, like they have welfare now. 95% of the uninsured are not the penniless, as you note. They are people who elect to avoid having health insurance because they feel they won't have anything go wrong with them. When it does go wrong, they wind up bankrupt, and receiving health care. Debts are dissolved to others (would you like it if they owed you?) and you pay for their health care. That plan is not working. We need to get people covered to reduce the cost to the rest of us. We are paying for them now.



posted on Nov, 6 2009 @ 04:49 PM
link   

Originally posted by Angiras
So with U 6 estimates of around 53 million unemployed Americans


U6 numbers are a percentage of the workforce, not the total population. The workforce is around 120 million, so about 20 million unemployed/under employed/not looking.


the Government is now going to require their broke and penniless citizens, many of whom are living out of tents and gathering food from Aid Centers, to pay the Insurance Companies their promised blood money or go to Jail?


No, they're going to provide health insurance to all those people.



posted on Nov, 6 2009 @ 04:52 PM
link   

Originally posted by Seiko
reply to post by Jim Scott
 


...and if they cannot pay?

Are we seeing the re institution of a debtors prison?


Love your avatar.
Not going to be a debtors prison unless Americans pass a law that says there is a debtors prison. We rule.



posted on Nov, 6 2009 @ 04:53 PM
link   
For those that actually read the Letter and the Amended Draft of the Legislation, the Blog posted by the OP takes some liberties with their reporting of this issue.

It is true that according to this Draft, you must either maintain Private, Group, Employer, or State provided Health Care, or face an additional 2.5% Tax Liability over your current Net Adjusted Federal Income Tax, pro-rated for the amount of time that you were uncovered.

However, there is no immediate penalty, Criminal or Civil, for choosing not to have Health Care or choosing not to pay the additional Tax when filing your Federal 1040 with the IRS.

However, if you are audited by the IRS and determined a Tax Evader for refusing to file a 1040 with the IRS, or if you knowingly file a false 1040 with the IRS then the IRS can take you to either Criminal or Civil Court, exactly the same as they do now. (The extreme majority...almost all of the 600+ cases that the IRS files in Court a year, go to Civil Court...primarily because the burden of proof on the IRS is significantly lower in Civil as opposed to Criminal Court.)

So, it is a non-sequitor that this Amended Bill will require you to take Universal Health Insurance or go to jail. It makes no such changes to Criminal or Civil Code. However, you do face an additional 2.5% Penalty to your Adjusted Net Tax Liability for every year that you choose not to.

Whether you choose not to pay the IRS through evasion or to attempt to defraud them is another situation and subject entirely...and that is entirely what any potential punitive decisions made in Criminal or Civil Court would come from. Not from take Health Care or don't. If you evade the IRS or attempt to defraud them and happen through luck of the draw to be Audited, then you should have known the risks before doing such. It's not unlike speeding and eventually being the one getting pulled over.

Chalk this up as another scare tactic on part of the anti-Universal Health Care lobbyists.

However, if you want to complain about the provision that you either have to have Health Care or pay a Tax Penalty of 2.5%, then you've got a valid argument. That rather blows although I understand the reasoning behind it.



posted on Nov, 6 2009 @ 04:56 PM
link   
reply to post by fraterormus
 


You seem fairly balanced in your responses, what do you think of the legality of it?

This differs in car insurance as you can choose not to drive, but this seems like a living tax?



posted on Nov, 6 2009 @ 05:00 PM
link   
Jail? Michigan alone is about to release 5000 inmates, with 52% of those inmates convicted of serious crimes. How in the World are they going to house everyone who won't join on to this illegal program?

Hmmm, maybe that's where fema camps and forced labor will come in. Or maybe privatize prisons is the answer. I'm sure that's on the horizon and will be real lucrative.

I guess we will find out.



posted on Nov, 6 2009 @ 05:02 PM
link   

Originally posted by Jim Scott

Originally posted by Erasurehead
Does this sound like liberty to anyone? I will not stand for this, I will fight this with all I have. They just can't decide that it is ok to send people to jail if they don't buy health insurance. This is unamerican and I can't believe that this is even being considered. Live free or die.



It's not? Think about it. I have to work to pay for the health care of others now. Doesn't that affect my liberty? When the uninsured go into a hospital, it comes out of my taxpayer pocket. I would rather see them pay something, personally.


Way to parrot the liberal-democrat party line. Individual liberty is what America is all about. The Federal government has no right to force people to do anything.

If I lose my job and can't afford to pay for health care it should be my right to choose not to get health insurance. I would take my chances. Right now I have great affordable health care for my family and I don't feel that I am paying very much for the uninsured.

BTW.. Who do you think will be paying for the millions of people that don't work and can't afford health care if Pelosi-care passes?




top topics



 
12
<<   2  3  4 >>

log in

join