Germany to U.S.: Take Away Your Nukes!

reply to post by dooper


Quite true. Europe by in large is very ungratful for all the sacrifices that the US has made, this does not just include WWI and WWII, but also throughout the cold war.

The US extended its military umbrella throughout much of europe. We incubated the EU from soviet domination. Thus, the spoiled brat complex we recieve from the europeans... Im not saying we own them, but they do seem to be an ungrateful bunch for all we have done for them.

reply to post by semperfoo

All the more reason to get out and leave them to their own devices and means.

But when our nukes go, then we go with them.

And that would include our navy. Limit it to serve only US and UK interests. Let the others build their own damned navies.

I know for a fact that Poland would love to host US military bases.

Oddly, they're in a more strategic location anyway.

I am a student of history, not an expert by any means, and there are a few things in transition in Europe as a whole that make me very uncomfortable having our forces there.

No use in them getting caught up in the current trajectory of the upcoming battle of Europe.

And the aggressors won't be German, Russian, or Chinese.

We really do need to get out while the getting is good.

The EU is in a pickle as far as security goes. Their whole concern was a Russian encroachement. 64 years of the US making that sure it didn't happen. They developed no real protective infrastructure for themselves.

One of the reasons they have and may still entertain Turkey being admitted into the EU is because it has such a well developed military infrastructure and operative standing army. But that prospect opens a can of worms. Suddenly it is being realized that asymmetrical warfare from the Muslim world might be their biggest security issue. And Turkey is moving more in the Muslim world camp as it abandons it's secular outlook and hopes of being part of the EU.

With unemployment a major concern in the economic downturn, no one wants to open the door to a poor Middle East country giving new access to scarce jobs.

The EU strategy is appeasement to the Middle East rather than fear of retaliation. But it's not an effective strategy.

Watch for a series of terrorist attacks in Germany, possibly in the next few weeks.


Mike

reply to post by mmiichael

You just identified the same enemy that I'm talking about. A neighbor from Germany worked for Robert Bosch here in the states and he couldn't say enough bad things about the Turks that had 'invaded' Germany.

And yes, fundamentalist Islam increases daily, and in Turkey as well. Just a matter of time.

Appeasement is exactly what started the last world war, and yet many Europeans don't seem to see downrange impact area of their current trajectory.

More enlightened than their American cousins, they see us as intolerant and violent.

It is with this nearsighted view of their future that I agree that we should pull our nukes out, along with our men.

We're going to need every man-jack when the balloon goes up.

I dont really care about the 20 pieces laying here and there [Germany/Holland/Belgium/Turkey and so fort] most important thing is that they remain safe.Means during peacetime the American munition support squadron keeps them safe. Come to think about it, i dont hope these sites -which are quiet common in most countries- become a target for terrorists[since we are also talking about the muslim "invasion" of Europe]..Cause we are not going to use them on our own soil on muslim terrorists.
Since Russia still has them at most [random]places so should we, although most countries of the Commonwealth of Independant States had already got rid of them [Ukraine, Belarus etc.] so i understand Germany point of view.
But i remember Putin somewhere around 2000 frighten us with putting the targetcards back in the missiles and scare us once more... as long as they are safe..

Originally posted by mmiichael

The EU is in a pickle as far as security goes. Their whole concern was a Russian encroachement. 64 years of the US making that sure it didn't happen. They developed no real protective infrastructure for themselves.

One of the reasons they have and may still entertain Turkey being admitted into the EU is because it has such a well developed military infrastructure and operative standing army. But that prospect opens a can of worms. Suddenly it is being realized that asymmetrical warfare from the Muslim world might be their biggest security issue. And Turkey is moving more in the Muslim world camp as it abandons it's secular outlook and hopes of being part of the EU.

With unemployment a major concern in the economic downturn, no one wants to open the door to a poor Middle East country giving new access to scarce jobs.

The EU strategy is appeasement to the Middle East rather than fear of retaliation. But it's not an effective strategy.

Watch for a series of terrorist attacks in Germany, possibly in the next few weeks.


Mike

The Turkey question is very interesting, remember they still remain good allies also with Israel. It could also be that when they join the EU and should become more democratic/checks and balances [losing the grip of the army] muslims parties could grow bigger, the army loses control and the army is exactly the most important factor for defending the separation between Church/State[everything Ataturk fought for].. we should keep the status quo on that one...



[edit on 1-11-2009 by Foppezao]

reply to dooper

I spent a lot of years in Europe. It's now a continent full of aging people and a confused younger generation. They had it easy but didn't prepare for a future that is catching up to them.

The British government benefits for acting as the middle man for Middle Eastern money. But the price is high. The Saudi royals, thousands of them, are preparing for their eventual new home in the UK when their monopoly finally falls to Iran and the extremist movement. It's only a matter of time. The US and Britain supply assurances and protection. For now.

The Russians meantime benefit from all the squabbling and tribal conflicts. A weakened US makes them appear a better alternative.

Meanwhile the extremists and Iran make new inroads in places governments are weak and the people hungry.

Pakistan is vulnerable. And not to be forgotten, it has nukes. It has a soft totally corrupt government, an increasingly powerful intelligence service (ISI), a growingly frustrated military, all competing for control.

It's going to crack. Not just my opinion, based on observations of a Pakistani friend who worked as a journalist there most of his live. Volatile is the operative word.

What happens when the West is confronted with nukes in the hands of hostile Pakistan and Iran - who have no hesitation about pulling the trigger?

Something everyone has to worry about. And those closest to the Hot Spot have the most to worry about.


Mike