It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

Germany to U.S.: Take Away Your Nukes!

page: 1
3
<<   2  3  4 >>

log in

join
share:

posted on Oct, 25 2009 @ 03:12 PM
link   

Germany's new coalition government put the finishing touches to its policy program this weekend, promising moderate tax cuts to help support the economy, a reduction in the length of compulsory military service, and the continued operation of the nation's aging nuclear power plants. No big surprises there. But one detail could have interesting international repercussions: the man designated to be foreign minister, Guido Westerwelle, is pushing for the U.S. to remove its remaining nuclear weapons from German soil.

"We want the last nuclear weapons that are stationed in Germany to be taken away," Westerwelle said at the conclusion of the coalition talks on Saturday. The U.S. doesn't disclose the exact number of nuclear warheads it still keeps in Germany, a legacy of its Cold War policy that dates back to the 1950s, and which made western Germany the frontline of its Soviet containment strategy. But German sources estimate there could be as many as 20 nukes still in the country.
(See a profile of Guido Westerwelle.)

The senior partners in the coalition are Chancellor Angela Merkel's Christian Democratic Union (CDU) and its Bavarian sister party, the Christian Social Union (CSU). Westerwelle heads the junior coalition party, the Free Democrats, and campaigned primarily on economic and finance issues. He was forced to scale back his demands for deep tax cuts in the coalition talks, and his demand to turn Germany into a nuclear weapon-free zone may have been agreed partly to assuage the sting of compromise. Merkel said that she would be seeking the withdrawal within the context of NATO, rather than as a unilateral measure. "We don't want to act in this matter on our own," she said.
(See a pictorial history of the rise and fall of the Berlin Wall.)

The coalition agreement took three weeks to cobble together, and is expected to be signed on Monday. Tax cuts were the key area of conflict. In the end, the parties agreed on a reduction totaling 24 billion euros ($36 billion). Among the beneficiaries will be small businesses, families and people inheriting money from their parents. The government is also planning to reform its health insurance system from 2011, shifting more of the financial burden on the public via direct premium payments.
(See a story about Angela Merkel's economic legacy.)

The new designated finance minister is an old government hand, Wolfgang Schaeuble, who long served as a powerbroker in the CDU and was a close adviser to former Chancellor Helmut Kohl. He has been wheelchair-bound since an assassination attempt in 1990.

The man chosen to be defense minister is a rising star of the CSU, Karl-Theodor zu Guttenberg. Unlike Westerwelle, who comes to the Foreign Ministry little known outside Germany and with clunky English, zu Guttenberg is already a familiar, even reassuring, figure in Washington. There's comfort for Washington too in the coalition position on Afghanistan. The agreement explicitly states that Germany's military involvement in Afghanistan is in the German national interest.


Time Magazine

I think it is very strange that Germany would want to start these processes now with everything that has transpired in the economy. Does the US have the time, money and resources to remove all the weapons.

I wonder how many installations are still operational on German soil. And furthermore, is the start of a Germany who is trying to cut military ties with other nations such as the US and UK?

The last line of the article


The agreement explicitly states that Germany's military involvement in Afghanistan is in the German national interest.


That is very interesting, when most other countries are pulling out or attempting to dance around the issue of Afghan support, it seems Germany is willing to continue the fight so long as the US keeps it's end of the bargain.

Any thoughts ATS?

~Keeper




posted on Oct, 25 2009 @ 03:20 PM
link   
Well it is a gd idea really to get rid of them, the less the are in world the better for all

kx



posted on Oct, 25 2009 @ 03:23 PM
link   
Ah Canada is pulling out since we've been left holding the bag in Afghanistan while the US had all it's resources in Iraq. We've had troops in combat operations for 5 years and suffered numerous losses. I think it's time we took a non-combat role and we will in 2011.

Good for Germany. It's time for the world to move on past this Cold-War era thinking.



posted on Oct, 25 2009 @ 03:23 PM
link   
I think that it is less German idea and more EU one. EU is slowly transforming into another independent major player on big board, so having nukes of competing power - even friendly one - is out of the question.
Only guessing though.



posted on Oct, 25 2009 @ 03:25 PM
link   
20 nukes ? Is that all ? They'll fit onto one C-5 quite easily.

A generation ago there were thousands of nuclear weapons on German soil, both sides of the border. If there's as few as 20, they serve only as a gentle reminder to our friends in the East that NATO is still prepared to use nuclear weapons defending Western Europe.

Any move by Berlin to withdraw itself from NATO is extremely unlikely, such a move would provoke considerable alarm in other European capitals ... it won't be allowed to happen.



posted on Oct, 25 2009 @ 03:27 PM
link   
reply to post by tothetenthpower
 


I'm not apposed to the idea of pulling our forces out of Germany. Hell, we should pull all our forces out of Europe to be honest. That sure would save us a hell of a lot of money! Besides, The EU are big boys now. They should be able to handle anything coming down the pike in eastern Europe and whatever threat may or may not come from Iran.

I would love to see us pull out of NATO all together. That would save us even more moola!

Thank You Germany and the UK for standing with us in Afghanistan.



[edit on 25-10-2009 by SLAYER69]



posted on Oct, 25 2009 @ 03:31 PM
link   
Well I'm from Germany and I welcome the removal of American nuclear warheads, in fact I would like to see all American bases here closed down, but that's not going to happen anyways.
There are 11 known american military bases here in Germany:
* Paderborn inkl. Senne
* Bergen-Hohne
* Celle
* Hameln
* Herford
* Mönchengladbach
* Bielefeld
* Münster
* Osnabrück (till 2009)
* Bad Fallingbostel
* Gütersloh

I hope Germany will also cut military ties with UK and USA, but Germany will remain in Afghanistan till the situation cooled down, I heard they are planning to send even more troops for support, but that's fair enough.

I'm glad to see that Germany takes matters into its own hands and tries to distance itself into a more independent country.



posted on Oct, 25 2009 @ 03:32 PM
link   

Originally posted by DEEZNUTZ
Ah Canada is pulling out since we've been left holding the bag in Afghanistan while the US had all it's resources in Iraq. We've had troops in combat operations for 5 years and suffered numerous losses. I think it's time we took a non-combat role and we will in 2011.


I don't know where you get your information.
Source

Coalition deaths in Afghanistan by country

USA: 800+
UK: 221
Canada: 130
Germany: 39
France: 36
Denmark: 27
Spain: 26
Italy: 22
Netherlands: 21
Poland: 15
Australia: 11
Romania: 11
Estonia: 6
Norway: 4
Czech Republic: 3
Latvia: 3
Hungary: 2
Portugal: 2
South Korea: 2
Sweden: 2
Turkey: 2
Belgium: 1
Finland: 1
Lithuania: 1



posted on Oct, 25 2009 @ 03:35 PM
link   
This may be something that was agreed on simply so that CDU and FDP could finalize the coalition. Westerwelle may just be saying this to keep support in his party. Who's to know though.

ETA: Something I forgot to say is that, if Germany makes the US move the nuclear weapons (which could be non-existent since it's not known how many the US has in Germany) they would probably just move the weapons down to Italy and to other bases. It wouldn't be a big deal.

[edit on 10/25/2009 by octotom]



posted on Oct, 25 2009 @ 03:35 PM
link   
reply to post by Clairaudience
 


Thank you for the info. I would too like to see a major country such as Germany stick it to the US in regards to it's military establishments.

Do they not sign contracts for the lenght a base will remain operational in any given country? Or do they just built permanent bases and operate them until the host country denies that right?

Thanks for the replies everyone, and yes a big koodos to germany.

~Keeper



posted on Oct, 25 2009 @ 03:36 PM
link   
reply to post by Clairaudience
 



There are 11 known american military bases here in Germany:
* Paderborn inkl. Senne
* Bergen-Hohne
* Celle
* Hameln
* Herford
* Mönchengladbach
* Bielefeld
* Münster
* Osnabrück (till 2009)
* Bad Fallingbostel
* Gütersloh

I think that some of those may be British bases. Some, such as Bielefeld, are in the British occupied zone. Not to mention that the big bases in Heidelberg and Frankfurt aren't in the list.

ETA: Also, as I remember, many of the bases in Germany are controlled by the United States, but house troops from many nations, including Germany. For example, at Ramstein (Kaiserslautern) Air Field, there are troops from Belgium, Norway, Poland, the US, and Germany. So, if the American military left, the bases would still be used, they would just be controlled by someone else.

[edit on 10/25/2009 by octotom]

[edit on 10/25/2009 by octotom]



posted on Oct, 25 2009 @ 03:36 PM
link   
I think the german's should remember history and be careful about which way they want to go in the future.



posted on Oct, 25 2009 @ 03:37 PM
link   
reply to post by SLAYER69
 


Denmark has under 6 million people, these numbers mean nothing unless done pr. capita.

I'm pretty appalled by what's going on in Afghanistan, and that the US i more concerned about the Iraqi oil, than finding the guy who supposedly started all this War-On-Terror BS



posted on Oct, 25 2009 @ 03:40 PM
link   
reply to post by john124
 


I think the native Americans should do that as well, and kick you guys out as well.

How you managed to spin this into something about Nazism/WW2 liberation is beyond me



posted on Oct, 25 2009 @ 03:41 PM
link   
reply to post by K-Raz
 


Not if they are the actual numbers. A per capita number would not be precise, the ones Slayer posted are.

Those are the ammount of deaths by country suffered thus far, how is that not accurate?

~Keeper



posted on Oct, 25 2009 @ 03:42 PM
link   
reply to post by Clairaudience
 


I don't think other European countries want Germany to be more independent, they'd rather Germany be tied down firmly in the EU & NATO (thank you very much).



posted on Oct, 25 2009 @ 03:44 PM
link   
reply to post by octotom
 


Sry, I have got my facts wrong, there are actually more than 25 American military bases here. 70.000 American soldiers are stationed in Germany.
You could be right with the British occupied zone, I got the list from Wikipedia.



posted on Oct, 25 2009 @ 03:44 PM
link   
reply to post by Ulala
 


I agree, as much as I don't want to say it, I think there is still some WW2 anti germany fear going on in other countries.

Then again I think all the EU countries want to keep a closed lid on any industrialized nation, to prevent any sort of uprising.

Good point
.

~Keeper



posted on Oct, 25 2009 @ 03:47 PM
link   

Originally posted by K-Raz
reply to post by john124
 


I think the native Americans should do that as well, and kick you guys out as well.


I'm part Mescalero Indian descent. Why would I want to kick my own family out?

Next time before you open your big mouth to stick your foot in it, Remember many here have native blood on our veins. We can speak for ourselves.

[edit on 25-10-2009 by SLAYER69]



posted on Oct, 25 2009 @ 03:50 PM
link   

Originally posted by Ulala
reply to post by Clairaudience
 


I don't think other European countries want Germany to be more independent, they'd rather Germany be tied down firmly in the EU & NATO (thank you very much).


Oh yes, sadly you are right. I'm not a fan of the EU, and I welcome any regulation or step that reduces the power influence of the EU over Germany but I don't see that happen in the near future.




top topics



 
3
<<   2  3  4 >>

log in

join