Concluding that 9/11 is a Government Conspiracy is Grotesque

Originally posted by impressme
reply to post by Swampfox46_1999

 

I guess you are one of the fools that thinks local businesses are going to pay money for surveillance cameras and instead of pointing them at their businesses, they would point them towards the Pentagon///

I guess you are one of the fools who think intelligent people who refuse to accept the laughable story about 911, that you support, are all idiots. You act as if you have “inside knowledge” regarding classified military intelligence before, during, and after 911. Either you are truly privy to the information, in which case you may well be a threat to our National Security, or you are just another fake spouting moronic lies because you can. I hope that it is the latter.

I have to wonder just who your alleged “buddies” are at the Pentagon and if they have any idea of the way you behave on ATS. Your immaturity would certainly be an embarrassment to any honorable service member or officer in any branch of the military. Name-calling, ridiculing and other forms of personal attack are the only weapons you have to fight with on ATS. Anyone seriously researching 911 would quickly find mass deception in the OS. It lacks evidence and crucial information to support itself. You are either too lazy or too scared to do the 911 research yourself, and I am not doing it for you anymore. You just cannot accept the fact that the OS is nothing more than a cover-up, so you defend it with emotion, not fact. Out of all your 911 posts, very few contain links to credible sources and you categorically deny any proof offered showing the OS is untrue. Enough is enough.

I have too many hours invested in 911 research to play your childish, immature games anymore. Consider yourself on *ignore* as of now so, whatever your response might be, I will never know or for that matter, even care.

yet another excellent post!

and ignoring people like pathos is probably the best policy since this persons ignorance is only matched by his denial and inability to engage in any objective, rational, logical, intelligent debate using basic critical thinking skills or following any basic truth seeking protocol.

Its truly sad people like this exist... whats even more sad and disturbing though, is that these people are in the majority across the planet.

Now you know why the perps have gotten away with it so far and may never be held accountable for their evil.

so you must be proud pathos that your ignorance and failure to do even the most basic investigation into the mountains of overwhelming evidence and contradictions to the OS, helps perpetuates/preserves the disinfo and in essence guarantees another 9/11 can be pulled off without a hitch.

Originally posted by Joey Canoli

Originally posted by Stylez

READ EM AND WEAP AGAIN

......OUR INTELLIGENCE

My irony meter just asploded....

Well, this is typical of troofers, I guess......

Wow isn't just like a an anti truth agent, to deliberately leave out several words in my post then suggest I said such a thing using quotes and all to malign all people having questions regardiing the 911 tragedy.

Even down to the childish method of portraying us as inarticulate dufus's is right out of the Governments own tactic for controlling internet information using ridicule to mock those disclosing information that may hurt or disparage the Government.



Ya know what that is typical of?

LIARS

Originally posted by Joey Canoli

Originally posted by Chevalerous

If you don't have the intelligens.......

.....to spell intelligence correctly, then you shouldn't be talking about other people.

That was quick. I just barely had time to unpack my back-up irony meter, and it asploded too.....

Well! sorry for the spelling mistake! I missed that apparently!

In my native language we write: intelligens that's why I missed my mistake before I posted - sorry guys!

I will try to check better from now on!

And Joey! I suppose English is your only language, right?

I speak four languages so I sometimes slip up with the spelling between them, obviously!

peace!

Top Scientists and Engineers Question 9/11


A prominent physicist with 33 years of service for the Naval Research Laboratory in Washington, DC (Dr. David L. Griscom) said that the official theory for why the Twin Towers and world trade center building 7 collapsed "does not match the available facts" and supports the theory that the buildings were brought down by controlled demolition



www.opednews.com...

reply to post by Chevalerous
Obviously, we have a different educational gap. I am not looking at my country's actions blindly, and I am not rationalizing their negligence. I can tell that you are clearly emotionally affected by the war caused by 9/11; however, that does not mean a conspiracy had occurred. Negative things can be the consequences of good things.

From my research into psychology, I can assure everyone that a small external influence on one individual's life can have an affect on others. Even though there may not be any fact to support an assumption, the larger population can still be affected from spreading it as fact. It does not take long. Since the internet is a massive world-wide instrument, assumptions and false truths can spread and influence people faster.

Delusional? No. Influential? Yes.

[edit on 5-9-2009 by Pathos]

If I have to relate the comments in this section to a specific person, I would have thought they were coming from Mahmoud Ahmadinejad. According to that creep over in Iran, he said that the Holocaust never happened. I see people in these boards saying the exact same thing, but they replaced the Holocaust with 9/11.

I am not sure if some of you get off on this debate. I do not understand how a person could blame a sitting US President for killing 2,000+ of his own citizens. I find it revolting, grotesque, and freakish.

Actually, Iran's president did NOT say that the holocaust never happened. He said that he doubted the official figure of 6-9 million Jews dying in the holocaust, and was perturbed by the fact that this horrible historic event was still being used sixty years later by the "Zionists" (our neocons) who control Israeli foreign policy to conduct their own holocaust against another Arab population while absolving themselves of all responsibility. You wanna guess how the Zionists explain their actions? By saying that Palestinians are dogs, lower life forms, that they (and anyone who isn't Jewish, including you, I assume) are sub-human mud people damned by God. Check out some of the quotes here.

In regards to your being revolted by my view that George Bush was a demonic little weasel who, in eight short years, destroyed any hope America could ever have of pulling itself out of this current crisis by ensuring that every single savable dollar earned by America went down a rathole in the Middle East, I would only say that you believe, apparently, an ignoramous, a liar, and a fool. George Bush lied about what he saw on 911 ("The TV was obviously on..."). He stumbled and stuttered his way through a question asking him, "Did you have advanced knowledge of 911?" He packed his Administration with draft-dodging chicken-hawks (of which he was one) who openly declared in the Project for a New American Century (PNAC) that America needs to, "fight and decisively win multiple, simultaneous major theatre wars." Of course, in order to win a war, you have to actually be competent. They were not, and their whole plan collapsed beneath its own disastrous ineptitude and corruption.

Watch three films about the official conspiracy theory, the most retarded one I've ever been exposed to, of what happened on 911. They are:

Fabled Enemies
Loose Change (Final Cut)
Blueprint for Truth

If after watching these three film you don't realize at least that you've been lied to by Con-gress, the Media, the Bush Administration, the Obama Administration, the American Intelligence community (at the same time, most of the best information about 911 has COME FROM intelligence officials, whom I suppose necessarily are unpatriotic and sympathetic to Iran's foreign policy objectives?) and several government organizations like FEMA and the FBI, then you're a mental midget unwilling to believe that the world is round.

Once it is established that (duh) dirty-ass Arabs in a cave, with a 4th grade education, couldn't possibly have conducted this event, it is down to one simple question asked by any detective. Who had the means, motive and opportunity??

Originally posted by Pathos
Reposting this again.
Here is your missing plane for Flight 77:

Pentagon Camera I
(Frame - 1:27) Visible plane nose.

Pentagon Camera II
(Frames - 0:25 to 0:26) Plane skimming the ground.

Its Pentagon surveillance footage.

Like I previously said. Its grotesque to think that people believe this was a conspiracy.

you know whats really grotesque? not that you've ignored and evaded responding to nearly 15 pages in this thread of posts containing relevant questions to consider, irrefutable contradictions and evidence with links showing the OS to be a total LIE, but you actually believe the links you posted above show any real evidence of a plane let alone flight 77.

tell me you're joking. puhlease?

If you truly are serious, it should be more than obvious to anyone here with a shred of intelligence, that not only have you done no real research and you're in an incredible state of denial and lack even the most basic critical thinking skills, but may be perhaps one of the most brain-washed trolls thats ever posted here.

congratulations

[edit on 5-9-2009 by Orion7911]

Originally posted by Joey Canoli

Originally posted by Chevalerous

If you don't have the intelligens.......

.....to spell intelligence correctly, then you shouldn't be talking about other people.

That was quick. I just barely had time to unpack my back-up irony meter, and it asploded too.....

Jeopardy Clues

- Joey Canoli

LMAO.

You edited out "working structural engineers."

Now, which one of those fools are working SE's again?

None?

Why do you think that is?

Why do you think that none contradict Bazant's papers?

When will troofers ever make the connection that these are the guys that matter,- Joey Canoli" on the "official alibi"


The TM isn't interested in any truth. They're activists. Their motivation varies, but they're all the same. - Joey Canoli" on the "official alibi"


activists will make up any outrageous lie that they can think of in order to further their cause.

Just like bigfoot believers.
Or moon landing hoaxers. "- Joey Canoli" on the "official alibi"


IOW, you know you're dishonest, cuz that's exactly what was ruled out.

Like I said, you're a perfect representation of the TM.

Keep up the good work making it look like a bunch of dishonest fools." - Joey Canoli" on the "official alibi"



In short, it illustrates the fact that 9/11 Deniers have convinced virtually no one that their views about 9/11 is correct, and so, must go "all in" in their gamble.

In the end, it's all a psychological problem. " - Joey Canoli" on the "official alibi"





You were shown the whole video. The plane is moving, period. Let it go. Where do you people come from?

" - Joey Canoli" on the "official alibi"

Now you know what it's like when we try and show ALL troofers just how wrong they are. They do not listen to reason. They believe what they want to, and NOTHING will dissuade them. It is a religion with you guys/gals. " - Joey Canoli" on the "official alibi"

But to answer your question, they come from the same place as all troofers. The world of denial. They just live in another country. " - Joey Canoli" on the "official alibi"

Jeopardy Question = Joey Canoli

Answer = what a dis-info agent says.






[edit on 5-9-2009 by Stylez]

Originally posted by Pathos

So, you are all physics experts with a Doctrine's degree? You know how architecture is affected by an airplane crash?

So, you guys know how an airplane comes apart from hitting a building at high-speeds?

it is obvious that you know less about all things academic, and are in no position to judge others on their research and knowledge.

a DOCTRINE'S DEGREE!!????

oh, the irony.

Originally posted by Pathos

Obviously, we have a different educational gap. I am not looking at my country's actions blindly, and I am not rationalizing their negligence. I can tell that you are clearly emotionally affected by the war caused by 9/11; however, that does not mean a conspiracy had occurred.

you're right it doesnt... but the thousands of flaws, contradictions to the OCT and mountains of evidence including science and math that you obviously aren't aware of or haven't bothered to research, does,,, and has proven 9/11 to be perhaps the most blatant conspiracy ever perpetrated.

The fact you still claim to see nothing, or that no such evidence exists AT ALL thats remotely suspect, proves a previous poster who listed 3 possible categories a person like yourself falls in.

Originally posted by Pathos
Negative things can be the consequences of good things.

From my research into psychology, I can assure everyone that a small external influence on one individual's life can have an affect on others. Even though there may not be any fact to support an assumption, the larger population can still be affected from spreading it as fact. It does not take long. Since the internet is a massive world-wide instrument, assumptions and false truths can spread and influence people faster.

Delusional? No. Influential? Yes.

[edit on 5-9-2009 by Pathos]

what kind of logic is that? what relevance does it have as it relates to your OP and the many responses that have been posted in this thread?

You offer nor attempt to offer any real or indepth refutation to support your claims or disprove any of the facts and evidence others have put forth let alone the literally TENS OF THOUSANDS of pages that exist or are available to research. You also offer no indication that you've done any real research or investigation at all into the evidence or questions surrounding 9/11.

The only thing you've done is continue repeating the same rhetorical bs 17 pages later and still have yet to engage in any intelligent discourse or debate on the evidence for or against what you CLAIM is true or false.

Its truly bizarre to see such astounding ignorance, stubborness and lack of any critical thinking skills.

I can respect someone who has shown a willingness to do some real indepth and objective research and still have the opinion that they believe there's no conspiracy. However, I have yet to find anyone thats actually done this type of indepth research, come back and maintain the same posture and say there's nothing wrong with the OCT/OS.

No rational or reasonable person who examines THE EVIDENCE or does indepth research can make the statements you're standing by. EOS

[edit on 5-9-2009 by Orion7911]

Originally posted by Pathos
reply to post by Chevalerous

 

Obviously, we have a different educational gap. I am not looking at my country's actions blindly, and I am not rationalizing their negligence. I can tell that you are clearly emotionally affected by the war caused by 9/11; however, that does not mean a conspiracy had occurred. Negative things can be the consequences of good things.

From my research into psychology, I can assure everyone that a small external influence on one individual's life can have an affect on others. Even though there may not be any fact to support an assumption, the larger population can still be affected from spreading it as fact. It does not take long. Since the internet is a massive world-wide instrument, assumptions and false truths can spread and influence people faster.

Delusional? No. Influential? Yes.

[edit on 5-9-2009 by Pathos]

Yeah and wouldn't it have been nice to have REAL investigation on it rather than all that garbage tax payers wasted money on when later we come to find that many of them lied, that you and joey cannoli like making a career out of this kind of thing.

I just met Joey, and hehe and he doesn't even know how well.

reply to post by Pathos


Did you not notice that I also talk about the Taiwanese government, UK government, and all other governments involved in wars?

I am an Irish Frenchman born in the Netherlands, and having lived in Germany, the US and the UK, and I don't agree with any country's government that I have thus far lived in.

I lived in Pennsylvania for six years and was only a 2 hour drive away from the WTC on 9/11. I spoke in front of hundreds of students after 9/11 and saw my friends cry.

Back then I was very angry about the attacks and couldn't wait for these terrorists to be hunted down. For all I cared, they could drop a nuclear bomb on Afghanistan back then. Then came the talks about war in Iraq and some weapons of mass destruction.

All I knew back then was that Bush had already been a crappy governor of a state with the highest number of executions in the US. He had signed agreements to execute these people without even thinking twice. He was a cowboy who had injustly beaten Gore.

They also kept saying Bin Laden was behind the attacks - of course I had heard of him and his planned terrorist attacks back in the late 90s. They just said on FOX that they'd be biological attacks...close enough anyway...

It took my at-times naive brain 7 years to think twice about the WTC attacks. Why? Because I'm open minded after having lived in so many countries.

What's the result? The more I read, the more sense it makes, and I only trust reliable sources, especially the many books I have read by respected authors.

I would recommend that you read Jim Marrs' book Ruled By Secrecy, followed by Rise of the Fourth Reich. Jim Marrs was a reporter, so he focuses on facts, such as Pearl Harbor. When he presents theories, he makes sure the reader knows it.

If you can't trust his writings, then I can't help you any further.

You can also find lots of interesting news at Times Online, The Independent, The Guardian, The Telegraph. British mainstream media is quite reliable and very interesting to read.

Originally posted by Orion7911

Originally posted by Pathos
Reposting this again.
Here is your missing plane for Flight 77:

Pentagon Camera I
(Frame - 1:27) Visible plane nose.

Pentagon Camera II
(Frames - 0:25 to 0:26) Plane skimming the ground.

Its Pentagon surveillance footage.

Like I previously said. Its grotesque to think that people believe this was a conspiracy.

you know whats really grotesque? not that you've ignored and evaded responding to nearly 15 pages in this thread of posts containing relevant questions to consider, irrefutable contradictions and evidence with links showing the OS to be a total LIE, but you actually believe the links you posted above show any real evidence of a plane let alone flight 77.

tell me you're joking. puhlease?

If you truly are serious, it should be more than obvious to anyone here with a shred of intelligence, that not only have you done no real research and you're in an incredible state of denial and lack even the most basic critical thinking skills, but may be perhaps one of the most brain-washed trolls thats ever posted here.

congratulations[edit on 5-9-2009 by Orion7911]

Brainwashed? Nope. I have read most of the information in this thread. Second, I come from a generation of individuals who believe the government should have less involvement in our lives. You do not like my opinion because it is in contradiction to the norm in these forums. That is fine. I am not here to be a drone. I am here to be an unique individual, and I see the world from an unplugged state of mind. Not only am I a contradiction to the norm, but I also a conundrum to the whole process. I do not buy into the online commonality of things. Many online do not realize that they are players in a bigger scheme. Someone has put a cloud of cynicism in everyone's perceptions. When I was going through kindergarten and college, I was told by many professors and teachers that I didn't fit the mold. I see the world differently than most. I do it by placing myself outside of the issue, and I examine the evidence on the inside.

9/11 conspiracy theories of this magnitude are grotesque. Not only do they need to be challenged, but they also need to be grounded by logical reasoning.

You can say that I am challenging the whole logic being the conspiracy.

Why not challenge the motivations behind spreading conspiracy theories? It all had to have started form somewhere.

Originally posted by Pathos
Who said I did not believe politicians can lie, steal, or cheat? What I am asking you people is - "Where is the human logic? Why would a non imperialistic society stage such an event?"

where is this non-imperialistic society you speak of? how many countries have US forces occupying them? how many times has the CIA instituted a change in the power structure of a country by sending in agents to oust the government, and set up it's own puppet government?

Originally posted by Pathos

Originally posted by Asmus
I think more than anything you would not want people to judge/condemn you for a different perspective you have on an event. Perhaps this is more important than anything.

What brings out the best in me is the challenge.

so, this 'debate' is a game for you, then? "calling all truthers, calling all truthers, ....you are disgusting and grotesque". (words like that are used by propagandists to sway people's emotions. that was obviously your intent with the OP)

i think it's naive to think that there are not circles of power within the circles of power. not 'everyone' has to be in on it. just a few hundred will do, if they are the right ones, and well coordinated. compartmentalisation and "secret for reasons of national security" are enough to keep people hoodwinked and doing the wrong thing for the right reasons. (for example, an assassin kills jesus, because his superior told him jesus was a threat to national security)

reply to post by Pathos


absolutely brilliant deflection. You can now focus all your posts on the illusion of placing the blame on other countries. By the way, you should ask the other ostriches what they think. If you holler real loud, they will hear you. Sound will travel through dirt. Nice job ignoring other opinions that differ from yours. I can see you are one who can learn a lot. I bet you knew everything in school too. Is this really the discussion you were looking for?

Originally posted by billybobwhere is this non-imperialistic society you speak of? how many countries have US forces occupying them? how many times has the CIA instituted a change in the power structure of a country by sending in agents to oust the government, and set up it's own puppet government?

That is a good question. Can anyone name them? If the United States is occupying countries, what was the motivation behind such act? Were we asked to do so? Was it humanitarian in nature? Are we pumping them with taxpayer money to keep them afloat?

Originally posted by Pathos

Wait. Wait. Financial gain? What did we gain financially?

Owner of buildings made a fortune on insurance and saved a HUGE bill had he gone for normal demolition of buildings that were loosing money

WTC7 housed the Enron records and other companies being investigated... all records destroyed...

2.3 Trillion missing from Pentagon announce the day before with promise to look into it, next day Bush asks for billions more to go to Iraq, who had NOTHING to do with 9/11

Pentagon admits $2.3 Trillion missing and Rumsfeld calls it a matter of "life and death."
9/10/2001: Rumsfeld says $2.3 TRILLION Missing from Pentagon
www.youtube.com...

Congresswoman Cynthia McKinney grills Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld on the Pentagon's missing trillions, DynCorp's slave trade, and the 9/11
McKinney Grills Rumsfeld
www.youtube.com...

Obviously because of people like yourself believing the government can do no wrong, they just keep doing 'business as usual'

Fed Inspector General Claims She Does Not Know Where Trillions Went Rep. Alan Grayson YouTube May 11, 2009 Rep. Alan Grayson asks the Federal
Federal Reserve Steals Over 9 Trillion Dollars
www.youtube.com...

If you can honestly watch those three videos and tell me nothing is wrong... then there is nothing more to say to you

Iraqi Oil will be 'taken' to pay for the war expenses..

U.S. Considers Using Iraq's Oil to Pay for Occupation
Jan 10, 2003 ... Plan: Tap Iraq's Oil U.S. considers seizing revenues to pay for occupation, ... in November on the economic consequences of a war with Iraq, ...
www.commondreams.org...

On March 27, 2003, Wolfowitz told a Congressional panel that oil revenue earned by Iraq alone would pay for Iraq's reconstruction after the Iraq war; ...
en.wikipedia.org...

Seems Iraq is also profiting from this

Iraq budget cut by $171M after oil-profit windfall - CNN.com
The Pentagon has agreed to cut from its budget $171 million to build police stations in Iraq after demands from Congress that the Iraqi government spend
www.cnn.com...

Welcome to The Kicker!: Iraq Runs 79 Billion Dollar Surplus While ...
Aug 6, 2008 ... Iraq Runs 79 Billion Dollar Surplus While USA Runs Record Deficit. Are we the only ones who find this rather bizarre? ...
mcdac.blogspot.com...

The kicker is you are paying for it at the gas pumps...

Halliburton... got huge contracts to supply the troops and rebuild Iraq... no bids required, no other companies got a chance to bid...

Halliburton is moving head office from Texas to Dubai

Dubai... the country we were going to give port control to... (what ever happened to that?)
Dubai... fabulously wealthy and building huge awesome futuristic buildings

The kicker is you are paying for it at the gas pumps...


But I know you won't heed this... though I am certain others will get something of value


[edit on 5-9-2009 by zorgon]

Originally posted by network dude
reply to post by Pathos

 

absolutely brilliant deflection. You can now focus all your posts on the illusion of placing the blame on other countries. By the way, you should ask the other ostriches what they think. If you holler real loud, they will hear you. Sound will travel through dirt. Nice job ignoring other opinions that differ from yours. I can see you are one who can learn a lot. I bet you knew everything in school too. Is this really the discussion you were looking for?

Not a deflection. An observation. I am not placing the blame on any country, but I am theorizing the possibility of a foreign influence. Who am I hurting?

Originally posted by zorgon

Originally posted by Pathos

Wait. Wait. Financial gain? What did we gain financially?

Owner of buildings made a fortune on insurance and saved a HUGE bill had he gone for normal demoltion of buildings that were loosing mony

WTC7 House the Enron records and other companies being investigated... all records destroyed

2.3 Trillion missing from Penatgon announce the day before with promise to look into it, next day Bush askes for billions more to go to Iraq, who had NOTHING to do with 9/11

Pentagon admits $2.3 Trillion missing and Rumsfeld calls it a matter of "life and death."
9/10/2001: Rumsfeld says $2.3 TRILLION Missing from Pentagon
www.youtube.com...

Congresswoman Cynthia McKinney grills Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld on the Pentagon's missing trillions, DynCorp's slave trade, and the 9/11
McKinney Grills Rumsfeld
www.youtube.com...

Obviously because of people like yourself believing the government can do no wrong, they just keep doing 'business as usual'

Fed Inspector General Claims She Does Not Know Where Trillions Went Rep. Alan Grayson YouTube May 11, 2009 Rep. Alan Grayson asks the Federal
Federal Reserve Steals Over 9 Trillion Dollars
www.youtube.com...

If you can honestly watch those three videoas and tell me nothing is wrong... there is nothing more to say to you


Iraqi Oil will be 'taken' to pay for the war expenses..

U.S. Considers Using Iraq's Oil to Pay for Occupation
Jan 10, 2003 ... Plan: Tap Iraq's Oil U.S. considers seizing revenues to pay for occupation, ... in November on the economic consequences of a war with Iraq, ...
www.commondreams.org...

On March 27, 2003, Wolfowitz told a Congressional panel that oil revenue earned by Iraq alone would pay for Iraq's reconstruction after the Iraq war; ...
en.wikipedia.org...

Seems Iraq is also profiting from this

Iraq budget cut by $171M after oil-profit windfall - CNN.com
The Pentagon has agreed to cut from its budget $171 million to build police stations in Iraq after demands from Congress that the Iraqi government spend
www.cnn.com...

Welcome to The Kicker!: Iraq Runs 79 Billion Dollar Surplus While ...
Aug 6, 2008 ... Iraq Runs 79 Billion Dollar Surplus While USA Runs Record Deficit. Are we the only ones who find this rather bizarre? ...
mcdac.blogspot.com...

The kicker is you are paying for it at the gas pumps...

Halliburton... got huge contracts to supply the troops and rebuild Iraq... no bids required, no other companies got a chance to bid...

Halliburton is moving head office from Texas to Dubai

Dubai... the country we were going to give port control to... (what ever happened to that?)
Dubai... fabulously wealthy and bulding huge awesome furturistic buildings

The kicker is you are paying for it at the gas pumps...

What does Iraq have to do with going to war with Afghanistan? You just proved one of my other observations. Thanks. Iraq disappointment anyone?

Let me get this straight. We staged an attack to go to war with Afghanistan, so we can go to war with Iraq?

[edit on 5-9-2009 by Pathos]