The age of the soul. Abortion.

reply to post by Republican08


Ah, here it is, I may of misquoted.

No, that is really my opinion of your mother theresa thread. I think it sucks. Nevertheless Im appreciative of it because it proves a point about atheists.

No offense though. You`re entitled to your view.

Originally posted by Skyfloating

Originally posted by Republican08
I apologize SkyFloating, I know you have been, unappreciative of my threads...eek.

On the contrary. I have been most appreciative of your threads because they were instrumental in pointing out the shortcomings of the atheist-mind in threads of my own.

I ultimately feel, this is a indirect attack. Mostly is.

I'd like to have a theist, atheist, debate if you could orchestrate one.

It'd be neat fun and riveting.

I can support my views with time to think and provide sources and evidences and have time to rebuttal others, then the quickness that the regular forums provide. If this can be done, I'd love to be apart of it.

Originally posted by Skyfloating
No, that is really my opinion of your mother theresa thread. I think it sucks. Nevertheless Im appreciative of it because it proves a point about atheists.

No offense though. You`re entitled to your view.

LMAO!!!! I appreciate your brutal honesty!

reply to post by Republican08


I´ll arrange a Debate for the two of us in a Debate Forum. As not to stray off-topic, all else by U2U.

Hey that's a very interesting question, but like one of the first comments i read that sometimes the soul doesn't inhabit a body after days or months of a human being born.

well my cousin hes new to this religion i can't remember the name, anyways he told me that before you're born, your soul goes through this kind of like a cave i think it was and there is this god that shows you the good things and bad things you did in your previous life. I don't know how accurate im being cause he told me this a while back.

So this god shows you the good and bad you did, but while during this process your soul gets caught up in some kind of trance (the god is sort of evil) and the god keeps you there until your soul releases itself from this trance (i was told that you can't let him fool your soul, cause you can be there forever)

After that you keep walking through this cave you'll see a place where humans are having sex, this is the place where you choose your parents, and your entire life, you get to see who you will meet throughout life, what kinds of things are gonna happen to you and depending on the things you did in your past life is how good your next life is going to be.

After you pick your parents, you will walk towards a light, which im guessing is the moment you are out of the womb.

Sorry if i wasn't very accurate, i tried to explain as much as i could by memory.



[edit on 14-8-2009 by ^anubis^]

Originally posted by Republican08


What would be the moment that, a embryo, or the pack of cells harbour a soul?

The moment you give it a name.

I don't really get into the abortion debate, cuz it's really none of my business whether someone decides not to have their child.

Personally though, I would not be able to terminate a pregnancy after about 15 weeks. Having carried 2 children myself, I feel like that's the turning point where there's no going back.

There's usually some confusion and anxiety after you learn you're pregnant (especially if unplanned), but after about 15 weeks the baby (or fetus, if you like) begins to move and the woman can feel it.

For me, that's the turning point... a point of awareness of something that is an individual separate from myself. I can't imagine making the choice to terminate a pregnancy after that point.

Yeah, I know I'm not really on-topic about when a "soul" enters the situation, I'm just sharing my personal experience and the conclusion I came to myself.

I've read that the soul enters the body when the crowning stage occurs.

Buddhists believe it enters 49 days after conception.

I dont know if everything has a soul eg a fly

I've had an abotion and I refuse to feel guilt about it, in fact I dont feel anything at all about it- apparently the soul just goes back and comes in again having at least half a dozen avenues worked out before hand in case something happens like it did with me.

reply to post by Republican08


This thread made me wonder --- didn't see this addressed yet, but have heard others speak of it elsewhere.

This concept of the "soul"....there are currently more than six billion Humans alive on Earth. Assuming they all have 'souls', that means simultaneously there are at least that many 'entities', or whatever term we use.

Point is: Never in the history of Mankind have this many people been alive at the same time. Is there an inexhaustible supply? IF we 'recycle', what did the approximately three billion 'souls' do back 100 hundred years ago, or so, while they 'waited' for all of these current bodies to be born?

I'm not intentionally being facetious, but it is a puzzlement, no?

Originally posted by Republican08

Originally posted by Wyn Hawks
..."the soul" is a romantic notion, myth, folklore... i would give it no consideration in an abortion decision or anything else - except maybe philosophical discussions...

Well it's been trespassing on science for quite some time. From human cloning, etc etc etc I could go on.

So it could use some discussing.

...well, okay, lemme see how weird i can be, lmao...

...you brought up cloning humans, so lets go with that... whats the big deal?... if its 100% human "stuff" being cloned, then the clone is 100% human, right?... so, if "the soul" is a human thang, then the cloned human will have a soul, right?...

Mother Teresa and so on, have been extremely against this, and many, "BLINDLY" follow her, thinking she was God's toenail, and must be licked and praised. Without any research other then following the crowd.

...i just stuffed my face with polsa kielbasa, sauerkraut and homemade bread worth dying for and you're tryin' to set off my gag reflex - tsk, tsk, tsk...

Why the hate for science, why?

...that ilk didnt hate science when it created atom bombs to drop on japan... they loved science then... yep, called those a-bomb scientists hereos, even though many were nazi criminals...

I really don't know, but my guess is when the sperm and egg join, they "catch" a soul and life begins right at that point.

however, the soul does not fully awake until later, if ever. I mean do ADULTS ever fully awake?

I think abortion should be legal but I personally don't like it. I think adoption should be less complicated, and I'm not sure it really helps a woman recover from rape either.

Originally posted by Donnie Darko
however, the soul does not fully awake until later, if ever.

Sad but true..

I remember reading a religious opinion that the soul enters at the moment of conception. The logic was that meat that is left out will spoil very quickly, supposedly because the soul has left it - the life essence. Since the fertilized egg, and then later the fetus, doesn't spoil or decay, the life essence must already be in it. So it already has a soul.

I don't say I buy that, but it does seem to make sense.

However, the legal question isn't when the soul enters the fetus, but whether a fetus has legal rights as a human being. That is an entirely different question, and it need not rely on any spirit, or spiritual opinions. The fertilized egg is human in nature - but is it a human being? It has human genes, human cells, etc., to be sure. However, so do all the cells in my body, but I'm not killing a human being if I have, say, an appendectomy. When does this human tissue (the fetus) gain rights?

It seems to me that the answer really depends on what humans decide. Yes, there may be some Divine opinion about this, but not everyone even believes in any sort of God; and when they do, they seldom agree abut what this God wants.

As Badmedia pointed out, Dr. Strassman believes that the 49th day is quite important to our spiritual development (it being the day our pineal gland is fully formed).

The Tibetan book of the dead is also about the 49 day interval between death and rebirth.

Also Buddha meditates for 49 days beneath the Bodhi tree until he reaches enlightenment.

Keep in mind that the Tibetan book of the dead is not about dying in the physical world, it describes the psychedelic phenomenon known as "Ego Death".

'___' is chemically very similar to Psylocibin, '___' and Serotonin. L-Tryptophan is found in a multitude of plant and animal life on earth.

Head over to youtube and listen to Joe Rogan of "Fear Factor" talk about his experiences with '___'.. Hes a lot more interesting than his "UFC" alter ego lets on.

Good post Badmedia..

reply to post by weedwhacker




Weedwhacker, I don't believe we come in as individual souls. I'm more apt to believe we define our individuality throughout our lives.

Its more of an "Energy in/ Energy out" dynamic, with there being a set amount of archetypes that we may start our journey with, being defined by our astrological alignment at our 49th day.

By archetype I mean. Some people may display "Motherly" characteristics throughout life, or "Warrior" like leaderships skills and curious "Scientist" traits.

We live and learn, and we die and teach. Through our deaths we enter the Akashic records and deposit our life's lessons to share with all our brothers and sisters.

[edit on 15-8-2009 by SevenSevens]

reply to post by Republican08


From reading the book "Embraced by the Light" by Betty Eadie...

it seems that at the moment of conception until the moment of birth, a soul can choose to enter it's mother's womb. The soul can go back and forth from the ether, if it wishes.

I'm not sure if that's the case, but that seems like it could be true, and Ms. Eadie seems to be a very credible experiencer of an NDE. During her NDE, she gained a lot of knowledge about humanity and the afterlife.

I've also heard that when women have miscarriages, that sometimes it is because the soul changed it's mind about incarnating at that time. Maybe the parents' financial situation changed, or a lot of stress is suddenly put into their lives.

I believe it was Ms. Eadie who said that if a woman aborts her fetus, that the fetus is sad for the mother, who will most likely go through psychological trauma from it. The soul may choose to incarnate in that same woman's womb at a different time. Aborting a fetus is kind of like a broken contract, from what I've heard. Now partial birth abortion, that really seems like a whole different ballgame. I don't have any comment on that, other than it just is not good in any way, shape, or form. I hope that the soul of the baby that is being aborted in that way can leave early and not feel any pain.

Originally posted by weedwhacker
reply to post by Republican08

 

This thread made me wonder --- didn't see this addressed yet, but have heard others speak of it elsewhere.

This concept of the "soul"....there are currently more than six billion Humans alive on Earth. Assuming they all have 'souls', that means simultaneously there are at least that many 'entities', or whatever term we use.

Point is: Never in the history of Mankind have this many people been alive at the same time. Is there an inexhaustible supply? IF we 'recycle', what did the approximately three billion 'souls' do back 100 hundred years ago, or so, while they 'waited' for all of these current bodies to be born?

I'm not intentionally being facetious, but it is a puzzlement, no?

Who is to say that souls from other planets don't decide to reincarnate here or vice versa?

I'm sure Earth would be able to provide some unique experiences!

This is strictly just an opinion, which I'm not sure wether or not you wre looking for opinions or facts, but regardless.

I believe that the soul enters the fetus within a 30 to 40 days. I'm partial to 39 to 40 however. There is conclusiveinformation out there about certain glands and systems, I believe the pineal gland is one of them, that become active roughly 39 days after conception. Likewise, there is aso informaton regarding auras and other bodily systems which still manage to "function"(use that term lightly) for a period of about 30 to 40 days after "death".

There's not a wicked amount of research to be done in this subject area. I do still find it interesting though. Good thread


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Um I think it takes up to about a week after fertilization for an egg to split (identical twins) so I would assume that unless twins share the same soul (which I guess some people think they do. . . ) anytime before then is probably uninhabited.

But I also have read many things about souls not entering until the final month or two of pregnancy and entering and leaving the womb at will. But what someone says, or "remembers" is hardly proof. . . but it is a nice idea.