Elderly woman slammed hard by police at Walmart

lol

what the heck should the cops have done...

"talked her down"

sorry but you don't risk "talking" someone down with a knife... if you can grab em...

people have ridiculous ideas... kick the cane lol, talk to her...

She grabbed her in a basic Judo hold

IF they didn't and she got nervous or ran she could have gotten a Knife in her chest by accident falling on it.... the move was executed well... and the woman is okay...


Everyone agrees, the woman was suffering some kind of dementia be it momentary or she is just suffering, you have to take the knife there is no telling what she might have done with it, even accidentally.... she could have got herself killed, anything could happen with a crazy person and a weapon particularly their own death...

good grief...

perfectly executed didn't actually look like she hit the floor too hard either, you can control their weight on the way down...

I'm not fan of govt intervention in most things in life, but even when the cops do their job well they get beat on...

You'd think they opened the car doors and opened fire lol

sorry not one mistake made here, they made sure she was protected from herself, she didn't suffer traumatic injury, they did well...she was calm (the officer) looked like she was talking calmly to her the whole time...

Next time maybe they shoud send out a car with a couple of elderly cops in it to make it a fair fight lol

reply to post by mopusvindictus


Agreed - the next thing we'll start reading on blogs is the fact that she was black, the officers were white. I"m surprised it wasn't overheard in the video.


Mankind is a tool sometimes.

And just for the record, my Grandpa caught a burglar coming through his window around the age of 78...

Grandpa fractured his skull with his cane...

True story so help me...

You can approach anyone brandishing a weapon let alone 2 and not disarm them... doesn't matter what age you are when you fight you have to be prepared to get hurt...

They totally took her down quickly and safely with no major damage or loss of life...

I wouldn't want a nice scratch on my arm talking down a crazy old lady or maybe loose an eye lol... I'd go for the arm lock too...

If the woman fell on her knife that cop would be out a job... and a life for her and her family...

she handled it pretty good...

reply to post by mopusvindictus


Yeah im real sure bud... even if you have the intent to harm doesnt always mean you have the ability ... that woman could only have hurt a fool ... and disarming her would have been simple ...

edit to add, i find it disturbing that she could have disarmed the woman more quickly without the overt throw... it took the officer 5 seconds between grab and completion of the throw, 5 seconds is more than enough time just to control the knife in her hand until she could be made to let go

re edit for , note that the officer took control of the knife hand prior to the throw... at around the 42 second mark the throw being completed at about 47 to 49 second mark
[edit on 9-8-2009 by conspiracyrus]

[edit on 9-8-2009 by conspiracyrus]

Originally posted by jd140
reply to post by KSPigpen

 

I'm a troll huh.

Well I have been called a liberal, coservative, racist and everything in between so I guess I can add troll also.

You don't want to debate my post then dont reply junior. If you want to reply and be a smartass then I will reply in kind.

What a piece of work. You must be a cop.

You are consistently standing up for abusive cops. No amount of force is ever too much is it? Who are you cops going to oppress when there is no one left? When you have us all in jail, who will you beat on then? Oh, yeah, your wives.

I don't think it's necessary to debate your posts. I think they speak for themselves.

Grammas, teenagers, pregnant women, all fair game, right? Maybe we should ask the criminal to just behave themselves. Maybe we should ask the cops to go get a real job. Something geared more towards their aptitudes and training. Hmm...like maybe a wife beater, or dog kicker. I read they are pretty good at surfing porn and stealing money too. They think they are gods and above reproach. Given the corrupt nature of our judicial system, they ARE. They act with impunity and citizens pay the price. Give an idiot a gun, and a tazer and put him on scene with half a dozen OTHER complete freakin ' idiots and aint nobody goin home till somebody get's beat, tazed, shot or pepper sprayed.

While they are at it, they can plant some dope, or make up a story about a cat getting thrown out the window. Barf.

By the way, my name isn't junior, Barney.

reply to post by KSPigpen


Wow you throw out alot of disparagements. I guess you believe all cops are bad huh? Its ok with you that a woman was walking around in a K mart parking lot brandishing a knife. You do realize families go to wal mart they have kids. How would you feel if that old woman cut the throat of a 5 year old that ran up to her to say hello. The police officer did the right thing removed a threat to herself and others quickly.
and prevented a very confused old woman from hurting others.Did you notice even after being slammed on the ground she was still unwilling to drop the knife.

All i can say is i hope when that day comes where you need an officers help you rethink your attitude because you sound like a punk kid.

10 or 110 anyone coming at me brandishing a weapon is going down by any means necessary. I think the police saved her life. If she had kept that up some one would have shot her. Some one here asked what if it had been my mother. Well if my mother had ever came at me with a knife she would have found her self hurt.

Reply to post by dragonridr

Nope. Not a cop hater. Just not going to blindly accept that they always have our best interest or even our safety in mind. In this instance, I agreed that the cop did a good job. Feel free to look back on that.
My contention is with those, one or two in particular that find it necessary to defend any cops actions any time, regardless of how out of line they may be. They're human and make mistakes, yes, they make mistakes. We all do. They got it right this time. Good job cops. Do you have people bending over to kiss your rump when you do your job right every day? I'm guessing not. They belong to a profession that has tremendous responsibilty and in a lot of cases, unchecked and absolute power and control over the population.
They have it tough, I know. I know a lot of cops.
There are valid reasons for the failed marriages, the domestic violence and the high rates of alcoholism. They are under too much stress.
That does NOT excuse them from following the same laws they have sworn to uphold or make them superior to anyone else just because they have the power and the legal 'authority' to kill another human being or make them suffer because they either didn't know the law or didn't care about it when it got in the way of them doing what they set out to.
The consensus among cops seems to be "I'm the one going home tonight." I just wish we could ALL go home tonite.
Bad guys deserve what they get, but cops are not the gods some make them out to be. Ever smoke dope with Sherriff? Ever hear them scheming to make crap up to save their own skin? Ever bust one for sending porn from his office at the high school?
Look, I know that a good 80% of cops are the salt of the earth and we are lucky to have them. I also know, from my own experience that there are cops, with guns and badges and YOUR lives in their hands and absolutely no business being in that position.
You choose to blindly accept the behavior of anyone you so choose. I will NEVER, make the mistake again of ever trusting someone based solely on the fact that they wear a badge.
I have also learned, in my many, many years of punkdome that ninety percent of the time, the cops are too late. The crime already went down. The victim is already robbed, raped or dead. I won't hold my breath worrying if my critical attitude will affect the response from the cops. Chances are, I'd be dead.
I hope your blind faith in the protector servants serves YOU well. I envy your optimism but I just can't share in it.



Posted Via ATS Mobile: m.abovetopsecret.com

Originally posted by Stormdancer777
Dear lord,

Surely someone was capable of taking the knife away without slamming her to the ground,

Obviously she isn't in her right mind, and seems pretty frail to me.

the police don't care who you are, slamming everybody to the ground is standard procedure if you do not obey them. this is how it is done in a police state. if the police come after you, immediately drop flat to the ground, and don't do anything to excite them. this should keep you from having broken bones or your blood spilled, but only when witnesses are around. if there are no witnesses, prepare yourself to be injured.

Originally posted by fixer1967
10 or 110 anyone coming at me brandishing a weapon is going down by any means necessary. I think the police saved her life. If she had kept that up some one would have shot her. Some one here asked what if it had been my mother. Well if my mother had ever came at me with a knife she would have found her self hurt.

you should explain this to your mother and all of your other relatives...that if she or other relatives comes at you with a knife, you will shoot and kill them. this would be an act of kindness on your part, and it will impress on them the power you have and will use.

[edit on 10-8-2009 by jimmyx]

I watched it 5 times (because it's hard to actually see her go down, seems like the guy purposely started moving the camera all crazy at that point)and it really doesn't look as though the cop is intentionally trying to hurt the woman, nor does she appear to be overly rough in the way she handled her. It seems that they handled it the best way they could given the situation, i'm thankful they didn't taser her.

It's sad that she got hurt, but she could've been hurt way worse if they had used a taser on her. I can't really see any other way they could have handled the situation. If no other people were around, then yeah maybe they could have waited it out, but they had to think of the safety of others and themselves. She may have been confused and probably frightened by all the people surrounding her (she probably thought she was in danger) but she had already committed a violent act by hitting somebody's child.

There was a woman that ran up to her yelling at the cops very upset, and someone later says that she is just trying to protect her mother. What i don't understand is if her daughter was there why did she allow her mother to hit a child and then walk around waving a knife around, why didn't she take the knife away from her mother ? If she had gotten her mother under control before the cops got there, the cop wouldn't have had to take her down in the process of disarming her.

Originally posted by conspiracyrus
reply to post by mopusvindictus

 

Yeah im real sure bud... even if you have the intent to harm doesnt always mean you have the ability ... that woman could only have hurt a fool ... and disarming her would have been simple ...

Well yeah ... what's your point , your making mine... "she could only have hurt a fool" yeah Herself, the crazy old fool with the knife

And she did disarm her and apparently didn't do her any harm

edit to add, i find it disturbing that she could have disarmed the woman more quickly without the overt throw... it took the officer 5 seconds between grab and completion of the throw, 5 seconds is more than enough time just to control the knife in her hand until she could be made to let go

re edit for , note that the officer took control of the knife hand prior to the throw... at around the 42 second mark the throw being completed at about 47 to 49 second mark

[edit on 9-8-2009 by conspiracyrus]

[edit on 9-8-2009 by conspiracyrus]

there are thousands and thousands of cops responding to thousands and thousands of calls.... from people that call them

it's not possible that they all be experts, I mean... your right, in theory she could have done it better...

but she did alright, didn't harm the woman, was bright enough to not stun an elderly woman, came away with her and the lady not injured and did it quick...

she's not a trained martial artist, she's a lady with a 32,000 dollar a year job

we could go on and on about what we should do to improve that whole scenario

but that's not the point, she didn't do badly for basically a beat cop... she wasn't abusive, it didn't end ugly

it's honestly more of a sight thing

no one wants to see an old lady brought to the ground lol... it feels sickening

but this shouldn't be a cop bash thread the lady did alright with a crummy situation given the training available to her and the situation

Originally posted by jam321
I personally would have waited her out. At her age she was bound to get tired.

You'd be surprised. I work in the cardiac unit/ICU of a hospital. When a confused elderly person snaps, they can go for hours.
Personally I think of all the options, the quick slam was probably the best. What else was he supposed to do? Walk up to her and take the knife away? Hah, you'd be an idiot to put yourself in danger like that. She could have sliced his jugular. I never thought I'd ever say this but, I think the cop was in the right this time.

This is truly Shocking. I would of just grabbed the frail old womans wrist and took the knife off her, but no.. you know the cops, anyone who looks small and weak is a great chance to show off thier almighty powers. shame on them. No sense in them whatsoever. She was nearly 90. It wouldn't suprise me if she died shortly after that.

[edit on 10-8-2009 by deadoralive]

reply to post by mopusvindictus


well my bad sport go ahead and slam ur great grandmas and i guess youd call a quadriplegic geriatric cancer patient a fair fight if he had a knife.....
apparently bleeding out the back of your head isnt seriously injured to you mr superman... i wouldn't be surprised if shes still in the hospital

could have been handled much more appropriately i.e. not smacking an 87 yr olds skull on the pavement

Originally posted by deadoralive
I would of just grabbed the frail old womans wrist and took the knife off her,

Many people on this thread have made statements similar to this one.

All of these people have obviously never been in situations of elderly people, and/or children using force against them. Nor have they ever been cut with a knife.

Just because someone is elderly/frail does not mean they can't be quicker than you.

With a very sharp knife, you don't need much force to seriously injure someone's hand. Just trying to grab the wrist of someone with a knife can result in a "sliced to the bone" cut. They only have to move their knife hand an inch or two in the amount of time it takes for you to lift both your arms and grab their wrists.

I have an excersice for those people that think they can easily disarm someone else with a knife: Go to your local costume store and buy a fake plastic or rubber knife. Buy some fake blood and put it on the blade of the fake knife. Give the fake knife to anyone you think you can easily take the knife from and try to take it from them. I gaurantee you will end up with fake blood on your hands.


[edit on 11-8-2009 by craig732]

This is a tough one...

Waiting her out is not a realistic option. Whitehall Ohio is literally a stone's throw from Columbus Ohio. I used to live there and am very familiar with the area. Police here are too busy to sit around and wait out some old lady with a knife. You can wait her out if you like, but while your doing it you might want to know that about 5 blocks away, someone just got shot at the car wash while you did it. About 2 miles West on Main street, you have a drug infested, crime filled area. Prostitutes who literally line the street for a several block radius. It is no big deal to drive down that road and see a pimp beating the crap out of the hooker, in the street, broad daylight. Even I was once robbed on this street, several blocks out of the "ghetto" potion of it, when I stopped at the convenience store to get gas on my way home. So while you are waiting out an old lady with a knife, you can better believe your doing it at the expense of people who really do need a cop.

It was in the best interest of everyone to end the situation as quickly as possible. The longer you let a situation like that remain uncontrolled, the higher chance you have of something going wrong.

What I find very interesting is that in the video, she is indeed holding a knife, but does not actually appear to be a real threat to anyone. She just looks like she is standing there and holding a knife. People are walking past her, she is not swinging the knife at them, lunging, or doing anything at all that would indicate aggression. She is simply standing there holding a knife. The officer even gets very close to her, and at no time does the old lady make any move indicating attack, violence, aggression.

In the end it is a judgment call. I do not know what was happening before the video started. Was she showing aggression? Was she a real threat to anyone or just herself? I wouldn't want to be the person who would have had to make that determination, but this officer did. I would not list this as police brutality, but it offers elements of underlying issues worthy of discussion.

I would like to think that any officer would/could be able to remove a knife from an 80 something your old women, who clearly looks like she is 75 pounds at best, without throwing her like a rag doll. In my opinion that would be the way to go, when people get old they act more like children. I would like to think she could have been disarmed much the same way you would disarm a child.

Originally posted by craig732

Originally posted by deadoralive
I would of just grabbed the frail old womans wrist and took the knife off her,

Many people on this thread have made statements similar to this one.

All of these people have obviously never been in situations of elderly people, and/or children using force against them. Nor have they ever been cut with a knife.

Just because someone is elderly/frail does not mean they can't be quicker than you.

With a very sharp knife, you don't need much force to seriously injure someone's hand. Just trying to grab the wrist of someone with a knife can result in a "sliced to the bone" cut. They only have to move their knife hand an inch or two in the amount of time it takes for you to lift both your arms and grab their wrists.

I have an excersice for those people that think they can easily disarm someone else with a knife: Go to your local costume store and buy a fake plastic or rubber knife. Buy some fake blood and put it on the blade of the fake knife. Give the fake knife to anyone you think you can easily take the knife from and try to take it from them. I gaurantee you will end up with fake blood on your hands.


[edit on 11-8-2009 by craig732]

You do make some valid points, but I think people are talking about THIS VIDEO. If the cop is close enough to her to grab her arm and judo throw her to the ground, using the hand which is holding the knife, it would not be too much of a stretch to think she could have disarmed the old lady.

I worked a call several years ago where a 76 yo man, in so-so health, KO'd a burglar with a ball bat! The guy was 19 and had every bit of 50# on the senior. So, yeah, I think seniors can be dangerous. Adrenalin is a weird thing.

Originally posted by MrWendalYou do make some valid points, but I think people are talking about THIS VIDEO. If the cop is close enough to her to grab her arm and judo throw her to the ground, using the hand which is holding the knife, it would not be too much of a stretch to think she could have disarmed the old lady.

She did disarm her eventually. And did so without using deadly physical force. And did so without getting injured. Sounds like a happy ending to what could have been a tragedy.