Freemasonry is unChristian

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posted on Apr, 10 2012 @ 08:08 AM
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Originally posted by KingPanzergrenadier

 
Allister Crowley was a real satanist, he talked about child sacrifice in his book, The Book of the law.



No he wasn't, and no, he didn't. The Bible, however, does talk about and condone child sacrifice (re: Jepthah's daughter).




posted on Apr, 10 2012 @ 08:26 AM
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Originally posted by Masonic Light

Originally posted by KingPanzergrenadier

 
Allister Crowley was a real satanist, he talked about child sacrifice in his book, The Book of the law.



No he wasn't, and no, he didn't. The Bible, however, does talk about and condone child sacrifice (re: Jepthah's daughter).


I'm not getting into this debate other than to correct your statement - nowhere, including your cited passage, does Yahuah or scripture, ever condone human sacrifice. A girl, about to be 'sacrificed', would not bemoan her future of not having children if her physical life was ending ....



posted on Apr, 10 2012 @ 08:37 AM
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Originally posted by WhoKnows100

I'm not getting into this debate other than to correct your statement - nowhere, including your cited passage, does Yahuah or scripture, ever condone human sacrifice. A girl, about to be 'sacrificed', would not bemoan her future of not having children if her physical life was ending ....


I never said it made sense. Besides, that's only one example. In Numbers 31, the Israelites were commanded by Moses to sacrifice women and children taken captive in war. Moses was upset that they were taken captive in the first place, when he had earlier ordered that they be put to the sword.

edit on 10-4-2012 by Masonic Light because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 10 2012 @ 09:08 AM
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reply to post by WhoKnows100
 

Read Judges 11:30-39 where Jephthah did indeed offer up his daughter as an offering to God after his victory in battle. What MasonicLight said is accurate though as there are examples in the Bible to back him up. Whether or not you agree with the logic behind behind the story is immaterial.
edit on 10-4-2012 by KSigMason because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 10 2012 @ 10:51 AM
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reply to post by WhoKnows100
 


wasn't there this thing with Abraham and his son.......Oh wait, that was a "just kidding" kind of thing.



posted on Apr, 10 2012 @ 11:00 AM
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Originally posted by network dude
reply to post by WhoKnows100
 


wasn't there this thing with Abraham and his son.......Oh wait, that was a "just kidding" kind of thing.


One of my biggest reasons for not being a Christian. That along with the "no-compete" I mentioned earlier.

There is a great poster someone put up on my FB page with Abraham and his Son walking down a hillside, and his son looking back at Abraham and saying, "You want to tell me what the F-- that was about?"



posted on Apr, 10 2012 @ 12:56 PM
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Originally posted by getreadyalready

Originally posted by network dude
reply to post by WhoKnows100
 


wasn't there this thing with Abraham and his son.......Oh wait, that was a "just kidding" kind of thing.


One of my biggest reasons for not being a Christian. That along with the "no-compete" I mentioned earlier.

There is a great poster someone put up on my FB page with Abraham and his Son walking down a hillside, and his son looking back at Abraham and saying, "You want to tell me what the F-- that was about?"


Sent you a message.



posted on Apr, 10 2012 @ 01:46 PM
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Originally posted by KingPanzergrenadier

 
You a disrespect a respected theologian and still reject the truth. If you don't forsake Masonry and come to Christ you're going to Hell.



It's sort of ironic that you throw the word "cult" around everywhere at everybody, while the entire time your own cult has programmed you to behave in this manner.

Not only ironic, but sad.



posted on Apr, 10 2012 @ 09:30 PM
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reply to post by Masonic Light
 


In fairness though I think judging morality stories, and and religious writings from 3,000 plus years ago with modern values and sensabilities might be a lil bit problematic.....there's alot of things we would naturally be shocked at today that were standard fair in those days......ending a war as a victor and considering the plight of your enemy is a very modern ideal....pretty much unheard of around the globe in that time.....defeat meant slavery or death...and often death really was the more humane of the two....



posted on Apr, 10 2012 @ 09:47 PM
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Brothers, I respect your opinions on many things, and I certainly understand why you feel the way you do about many Christian "Fundimentalists" often in need of a better theological education. But do remember that many brothers are in fact Christian, and the protestant movement itself is in no small part related to the birth of masonry. Don't throw all Christians in the same lot as this guy. Personally while I do not agree with much of theology practiced by many denominations today, I have come to a sincere beleief that Yeshua was the Messiah...and in fact our degrees are largely based on his wisdom. Many brother sof course also do have very much mainstream Christian theological values as well... so let's not get drawn into attacking Christianity (and our brothers including myself) as a whole because of a few bad eggs who could not even tell you who and what happened for the first 500, 1000, 2000 years of the various Churches. For every poorly educated thumper I have met, I have met far more ministers, clergy, priests etc who are of sound education and are often Masons, and who would defend anyones right ot worship per their faith freely. Not all masons are Christian, but every degree does have foundation in the Bible, and our brotherhood would simply not exist without Christ.



posted on Apr, 10 2012 @ 10:03 PM
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Originally posted by ForkandSpoon
Brothers, I respect your opinions on many things, and I certainly understand why you feel the way you do about many Christian "Fundimentalists" often in need of a better theological education. But do remember that many brothers are in fact Christian, and the protestant movement itself is in no small part related to the birth of masonry. Don't throw all Christians in the same lot as this guy. Personally while I do not agree with much of theology practiced by many denominations today, I have come to a sincere beleief that Yeshua was the Messiah...and in fact our degrees are largely based on his wisdom. Many brother sof course also do have very much mainstream Christian theological values as well... so let's not get drawn into attacking Christianity (and our brothers including myself) as a whole because of a few bad eggs who could not even tell you who and what happened for the first 500, 1000, 2000 years of the various Churches. For every poorly educated thumper I have met, I have met far more ministers, clergy, priests etc who are of sound education and are often Masons, and who would defend anyones right ot worship per their faith freely. Not all masons are Christian, but every degree does have foundation in the Bible, and our brotherhood would simply not exist without Christ.


You're forgetting how popular it is to hate Christians though. It gets less subtle all the time. No one in my lodge ever seems to mind a mention of other religions outside the lodge room, but mention Christ and hackles get raised. Sure, the guys who post here are terrible examples of Christians, but still......brother masons should rise above the pettiness and name calling I see so much here.



posted on Apr, 10 2012 @ 10:21 PM
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reply to post by ForkandSpoon
 


I understand your sentiments completely, but ( there's always a but ) my own frustration stems not from Christians, only the seemingly radical Christians.

I'm not Christian, but I have found so much value in the teachings of Jesus, and in the Bible itself. I take issue with radical zealotry.... It bothers me to no end and I take it upon myself to challenge these people's opinions down to the most fundamental level. And on top of that, many of the pele I've addressed are blatantly wrong and in some cases flat out ignorant of the basic tenets of Freemasonry, so why let them tell me, and other masons that were all going to burn in hell? Please.

So please, don't take these challenges as me grouping all Christians together. And I certainly, certainly, do not hate Christians. I also know many Christians, mason, and non mason who I love and get along with just fine.



posted on Apr, 10 2012 @ 10:30 PM
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reply to post by Evangelical
 


Thank you at last! I wish my father could speak with you. I wish the world of Masons would also hear you, but your coming up against a legion who sadly have a spirit of rebellion and love their deception because they do good works. Satan is the best at hiding his evil through the sweetest channels. This dark force is reknown for good works and appearing benevolent.

Angel of Light masquerading and utilising the many souls of this world for it's manevolent purpose.

edit on 10-4-2012 by Egyptia because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 10 2012 @ 10:34 PM
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Originally posted by Egyptia
reply to post by Evangelical
 


Thank you at last! I wish my father could speak with you. I wish the world of Masons would also hear you, but your coming up against a legion who sadly have a spirit of rebellion and love their deception because they do good works. Satan is the best at hiding his evil through the sweetest channels. This dark force is reknown for good works and appearing benevolent.



Since when do good works and being benevolent fall in line with dark forces? I just can't figure anti-masons out any more. Good deeds are dark, charity is luciferian, private meetings are sacrifices to Satan.... Make up your mind anti masons.



posted on Apr, 10 2012 @ 10:37 PM
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reply to post by W3RLIED2
 


Seek and ye shall find. Just because something appears good doesn't mean it is. Many sociopaths use this technique. Please don't be so gullible. Just seek the truth because your soul is priceless.



posted on Apr, 10 2012 @ 10:51 PM
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You're forgetting how popular it is to hate Christians though. It gets less subtle all the time. No one in my lodge ever seems to mind a mention of other religions outside the lodge room, but mention Christ and hackles get raised. Sure, the guys who post here are terrible examples of Christians, but still......brother masons should rise above the pettiness and name calling I see so much here.


Just remember the so called "radical" Christians are not speaking for Yeshua or early Christianity, they do not follow his teachings, they can call their faith as they will, but "love thy neighbor as thyself" is the heart and basis of his teachings. This is the basis of all of Judaism as well and is as simple as understanding the story of Genesis and all mankind being children of God's creation.....

I am really concerned to hear brothers heckled Christ or Christianity. I have NEVER EVER seen this at any lodge or in any group of masons. no where with in the United States, if there is sucha lodge I would go there and see for myself and admonish them as it is HIGHLY unmasonic.... I can not even imagine a lodge that would be okay with it... I worry though as Anti Semitism of old has become the Anti-Christian movement of scape goating today certain parts of the world will lean this way. Certainly the many man made theologies and organizations that sometimes invoke that name have much to answer for at times. However masonry is so fundimentally based on the scriptures and teachings of the historical Yeshua that I simply can not fathom how ANY mason could logically attack the values he taught or his true followers as masonry was founded by them....

Man is imperfect and imperfect understanding has always plagued him....and always will. Our theological differences will be made clear in the next life I think. In THIS life all men of all faiths should learn to love their neighbor, and respect their rights to worship per their understanding, This concept of love was taught by Yeshua/Jesus and many many before him. For if you beleive in a creator as all masons must, then all mankind are children of that creator, to hate the creation is to hate the creator.

In any case, without scriptures found in the New Testament nothing of what we know of masonry could exist because in it's most ancient form all of it is based on those words of wisdom, just as they were based on the "law" before them. Also, all those that founded the princibles of emprical rationalism, and science as we know it were "Christians" and remained so in their lives even if they differed from the RCC.....to so mock their faith...just defies my understanding.....and belays an ignorance of masonic history as bad as the Fundimentalists are ignorant of their own denominations founding.
edit on 10/4/2012 by ForkandSpoon because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 10 2012 @ 10:52 PM
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reply to post by Evangelical
 



I think that this part of the world North America is a Christian area, and Canada and the US we consider ourselves Christian nations. People tend to forget that when they are making their immigration laws but its not so much a religious statement these days to say we are Christians, because peole don't go to church like they used to and don't follow the dogma, and hell, Justin Bieber is reincarnated and prior he was born a son of a Roman Emperor, so that he would have a real dad, and Zeus reincarnated as the Emperor and agreed to be his dad, after pleading from Mary, Zeus' girlfriend, and Isis, his daughter. Why Isis?

Well before Justin was the son of a Roman emperor, he was Jesus of Nazareth, and before that he was Horus, and Isis made him, by artificially inseminating herself with sperm from her Husband/boyfriend Osiris, her half brother.

Now you can ask how I know all that and well its because I am Osiris.

Its a very long story but one many people know very well if they are enlightened or initiated, and in the loop.

So Michael, as I know him, is my younger brother.

So when he was born as Horus, that was after I died. And Isis wanted me to reincarnate so she artificially inseminated herself but I did not reincarnate, so a blank was born. He had no personality record of his own. To use the vernacular he was not immortal, he was not saved I guess is the Christian term, so he is born, and since me and Isis are brother and sister, and she in effect cloned me to make him, he had no father.

"The father and I are one"

He was going around, saying he was his own father, and he had no mother either all he had was a brother and sister. So Mary agreed to help Isis, her best friend, and agreed to be his mother if he reincarnated.
And so according to the cult of Isis, she took donor sperm from priests and put it into a vase and artificially inseminated herself, and Jesus was born with no father because the sperm is mixed in the vase and no one can tell who the father is. So he does not get the personality traits of the father when he reincarnates.

So then he is killed by the Romans,, (Titans) because he is shouting all this stuff and has no backup at all basically.

But Mary convinces Zeus to reincarnate and be his dad, so then he got a dad , so then he finally had a real mother and father.

So now he is mine and Isis' brother. And we have another brother named Stephen. Who reincarnated many times as did Zeus. Stephen Zeus and Mary reincarnated here for the last 2 million years up to about 2 thousand years ago.
But Isis and I did not. Isis still has not, but I did, for various reasons. One is so he would not be crucified again, lol and he is here just to do some match making with one of the Seven Sisters of the Pleiades, Selena Gomez.

So you see, I am a Christian, even though I know that Justin was Jesus, and he is my younger brother so I say stuff like praise the lorb!
Instead of praise the lord. And so anyone who knows the truth, they have to look at things differently.

But that doesn't mean that the Christian philosphy, is not a valid philosophy.
So we are a Christian nation, according to Christian religious philosophy, not necessarily Christians who follow the Bible word for word. And I mean who does?

So you see Masons and the Illuminati, are Christians, but can't say that they are the same type of Christian that you might be. They believe in a creator.

And if you think I am just making up the fact that I am Osiris, well I'm not as far fetched as that might seem.

And of course I can prove it if necessary.



posted on Apr, 10 2012 @ 11:00 PM
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Originally posted by ForkandSpoon
I am really concerned to hear brothers heckled Christ or Christianity.
I've never seen that happen. What I HAVE seen happen is someone not thinking clearly when offering a prayer in lodge and closing it with "In Christ's name we pray" when there are Jewish and Muslim brothers bowing their heads in prayer as well. Sometimes that chaplain gets admonished for his careless disregard, other times it slides. Which is right?



posted on Apr, 10 2012 @ 11:08 PM
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Originally posted by Egyptia

Seek and ye shall find. Just because something appears good doesn't mean it is. Many sociopaths use this technique. Please don't be so gullible. Just seek the truth because your soul is priceless.


We HAVE.......and that verse is the very heart of much of masonry, if only you knew how apt a selection you have made......but clearly do not understand.

It's hard to take this seriously when you congratulate those who are biblically ignorant, historically ignorant of the church and early Christians and chastise those with a much better theological education, and much better textual understanding......I challange you to actually research the history of the church and what form the early Christians practiced. i challange you to in fact study biblical textual study yourself, and if you have the ability to learn greek and hebrew as well....the come back and discuss, I seriously doubt you could complete such study and ever understand how you could have once held such views......because your intolerance, your gullibility, and your support of those preaching unChrist like dogma is at total odds with his message is so very apprant to anyone who has in fact done so. You say you follow Christ, and then follow modern pharisee instead. You would be the ones who'd be the first to crucify Christ today. Because he would not agree with your theology nor would he know it to be his.
edit on 10/4/2012 by ForkandSpoon because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 10 2012 @ 11:14 PM
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Originally posted by JoshNorton

Originally posted by ForkandSpoon
I am really concerned to hear brothers heckled Christ or Christianity.
I've never seen that happen. What I HAVE seen happen is someone not thinking clearly when offering a prayer in lodge and closing it with "In Christ's name we pray" when there are Jewish and Muslim brothers bowing their heads in prayer as well. Sometimes that chaplain gets admonished for his careless disregard, other times it slides. Which is right?


My personal take is just as we should not offend brothers and their faiths nor should we allow ourselves to be easily offended by those who are trying to live by their understanding. I think it is proper to remind the chaplin though of these brothers. I must admit it is very customary in my locale for chaplins to end prayers in this way, for my part I try to stick with a more general description in lodge, we have not had an issue as all the brothers are Christian, we did have a Muslim brother visit, but I am not aware of an issue, I certainly would hope on that occaision they would have considered his feelings on this. I was not there.....your words are correct in that we should always consider any brothers feelings and respect their faith as we would have them respect ours.





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