Originally posted by Imago Dei
I never said anything about denying the commandments or doing away with the commandments.

Again, you are stating that I am saying things, believing things, doing things, that I am not. Thats called lieng. if you would cease and desist form doing that we may be able to have a useful debate, until then, your a waste of time and clearly only interested in insults and inuendo. If you can resist the temptation to give into your flesh on every post (which is obvious to all and sundry) then I will consider responding directly to your posts again, until then, I request that you honour your word, because you are demonstarting that you cant be trusted.

Christ said to do the whole works of God is to believe in Him who He sent. The law is designed to lead us to Christ, yes He didnt do away with the law, we are to obey the law, but the fact is, we have all broken the law which deems our need for a redeemer saviour.

Matthew 9

13But go ye and learn what that meaneth, I will have mercy, and not sacrifice: for I am not come to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.

Originally posted by badmedia

Originally posted by Imago Dei
I never said anything about denying the commandments or doing away with the commandments.

You said:

Christ said to do the whole works of God is to believe in Him who He sent. The law is designed to lead us to Christ, yes He didnt do away with the law, we are to obey the law, but the fact is, we have all broken the law which deems our need for a redeemer saviour.

This is saying that it is impossible to not break the law, and that Jesus needed to do it for you. That is not true. Proof of this is that he says those who believe will do all that he does and more. So if they believe, then they will not sin. Yes, people sin. But they can repent for sins, aka fix their mistakes. And Jesus is saves them, because if they believe in him and follow his example, then they will be fixing their mistakes, and repenting his sins.

Jesus did not even come for the righteous. He came for the sinners. To call them to repentance.

Matthew 9

13But go ye and learn what that meaneth, I will have mercy, and not sacrifice: for I am not come to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.

Pretty much says it all right there in a single sentence. It's not about the sacrifice, it's about sinners repenting.

Sin = mistake
Repent = fix.

How do we do that? By his life and example. He shows the way to live. He fulfills the laws, and brings understanding on the proper way to follow them.

This whole business of treating him as a sacrifice where you can do whatever and be saved by believing he is the son of god is a manipulation designed to keep people from actually walking the path. An excuse to keep walking the path.

You shouldn't trust me anyway, I believe the saying is - let no man deceive you. It's the fact that people "trust" what other men tell them that is the problem in the first place. If someone "accepts" what I say as "truth" because they trust me, then they have missed the entire point and they are a fool. There is only 1 true teacher, and it's not me.

I'm not even sure what "trust" has to do with this discussion at all. You are just using it as a way of dismissing me, rather than what I have said.

Once again I notice you have ignored the part about the rich man. If what you say is true, then why does Jesus tell the rich man otherwise?

Originally posted by badmedia

Just can't bring yourself to answering that question about the rich man can ya?

THE RICH MAN YOU LOVE SO MUCH - EXPLAINED HERE IS THE TRUTH OF THE MATTER.


Mark 10:17-31
How to receive *eternal life
Now a very impressive man came to Jesus. This man was young and rich. And he was a ruler. He also wanted to know more about God. He knew something about ‘*eternal life’ and he wanted it. People might have thought that he would be a very good *disciple. He came to Jesus in public with his question.

Mark 10:17 'Good teacher,' he asked, 'what must I do to have *eternal life?' [He wanted to know how to please God.]

Jesus first wanted to be sure that the man understood his own question. The man said that Jesus was 'good'. But only God himself is 'good'. Only God himself can give anyone *eternal life. Jesus made the young man think about who Jesus really is. (IE GOD)

A common error
But what the man believed is a common error. He believed that he could get this *eternal life by his behaviour (SOUND FAMILIAR?). He thought that he would be able to get it by himself. Many people today make the same mistake.

The *commandments
The usual Jewish answer to the man’s question would have been 'You must obey the *commandments.' [The commandments were the rules that God gave to Moses.] Jesus reminded the man about the *commandments. Then the man made another mistake. He said that he had always obeyed the *commandments. He thought that the *commandments were only about his actions. But the *commandments are also about our thoughts.

In Romans 7:8, the *apostle Paul (OR AS YOU BELIFE< PAUL THE FALSE PROFIT) described how he made the same mistake. Then he realised that his evil desires were also *sin. This showed him that the *commandments were about thoughts as well as actions.

When Jesus spoke to the young man, Jesus did not list all the *commandments. Jesus only mentioned the second part of the *commandments. He had not mentioned the duty to love God. Elsewhere, Jesus mentioned all the *commandments together like this:

Matthew 22:37-40 ‘Love the Lord your God:

· with all your heart

· and with all your *soul

· and with all your mind.’

This is the first and most important command. And the second command is like it:

‘Love your neighbour as you love yourself.’

This is what the Law and the *Prophets really mean.

The young man had obeyed the *commandments by his behaviour. But his questions showed his mistake. He was a wealthy man. He did not steal anything. He did not kill anybody. But he was very selfish. His liked to please himself. Thousands of Jews were very poor, and this man had great wealth. He loved his great possessions very much, and he was not going to give them up. He would not even give them up for Jesus. He would not even give them up for *eternal life.

Jesus tested the man's true character
Jesus’ last words to this man tested the man's true character.

Mark 10:21 Jesus looked at him and loved him. 'You need one thing,' he said. 'Go and sell all your possessions. Give the money to poor people. Then you will have real wealth, in *heaven. Then come! Follow me!'

If the young man did this, he would show his love for God. It would be greater than his love for his possessions. This would please God.

But this man loved his wealth. And he loved the way that he lived. He was not going to give it up and follow a poor teacher. So, the young man sadly walked away.

Jesus' words about the camel, the needle, and rich people
Jesus then said something else which surprised the *disciples.

Mark 10:23-25. Jesus looked at his *disciples. He said, 'It is very hard for rich people to belong to the *kingdom of God!' The disciples were surprised at his words. But Jesus said again, '*Children, it is very hard to belong to the *kingdom of God! It is easier for a camel to go through the small hole in a needle than for a rich man to join the *kingdom of God.'

The disciples thought that rich people had everything in this world. They thought that it would be the same in the *kingdom of God. But this is not so. All those who obey Jesus are equal. Nobody is better than someone else because he is richer or clever. By themselves, nobody can achieve what Jesus wants. We can only achieve this by the help of the *Holy Spirit. We need the *Holy Spirit to give us a new way to live. We need the *Holy Spirit to teach us God’s ways. We need the *Holy Spirit to give us new desires and hopes. He will help us to be free from the love of money and possessions.


So in conslusion badmedia, you are like the rich man, you deny that Jesus is God and you trust in you own ability to follow the commandents as your rightouseness, and in this fatal error, you think you are saved. You don't know Jesus, like the rich man, you walked away from Him.

I hope you give up following and trusting yourself, and find salvation through Christ Jesus, then you will be able to follow the commadments out of love and gratitude to God instead of a self sufficient pride full trust in your own ability to earn salvation.


By the way Im not attacking you, so stop wingeing. If you can't handle the heat get out of the kitchen especially when your the one lighting and stoking the fires. Further more I am not oblidged to respond directly to every meanigless peice of drivle you come out with am I? If I did, I'd be here all day every day.

The following is a quote from you from you days ago, so I tell you what, how about you honour your word or I will just have to continue mopping the floor with you. It has not gone unnoticed that I am not the only christian who you intentionally antagonise with self rightous pious judgemental attitude in these threads.

"Tell ya what. I'll drop it, and the next time you start with the personal attacks and name calling, I'll just start reporting you rather than replying"










[edit on 3-7-2009 by Imago Dei]