'There definitely is a God': Christians hit back at atheist buses with own adverts

Originally posted by converge

Originally posted by Frankidealist35
It's spreading religion... if something happened like this here in the USA it would never fly.

You mean like the "so help me God" at the end of the Oath of Office that Presidents like to say even though it's not part of the oath?

Buses aren't Presidents.

I guess they're striking back but it's bad I don't want to see 21st century religious wars.

I would say it's too late for that - we've been going through progressive religious wars. One only has to think about what religious organizations, institutions and people, have done to derail Evolution being taught in schools, stem cell research, and science in general.

I'm upset at that too. I'm tired of all of these religion people trying to hate on science and derail our beliefs. I think that we should all just get along.

edit: Oh, and social equality. (e.g. Prop 8 etc)

[edit on 5-2-2009 by converge]

Yes, the hypocritical argument against gay marriage... I wish that gays weren't discriminated against as much as they are now. I equate the treatment they're getting to the treatment that blacks got in the 60s.

Originally posted by converge


The statement that "there is probably no God" is a deductive one...... It is a logical statement.

Saying that there is a God, on the other hand, is in fact an illogical one

I agree that this recent christian campaign is False Advertising and I'd like to see how it stood up in Court.

Originally posted by Frankidealist35
Buses aren't Presidents.

Heh well, I hope you know I'm aware of that

Anyway the point I was making is that if we go by that definition of 'spreading', then there are numerous things happening in the United States that could be considered as "spreading religion", and that was just one example.

How about the "in God we trust" in money, and even worse, being the official United States national motto?

What I'm saying is that you have plenty of "spreading of religion" in the US if we go by your definition, that's all.

reply to post by converge


Yes. There are some things that our society does to promote religious organizations but we don't force the belief on God on others.

There's a difference from aiding religious faith based groups and shoving the belief of God on someone else's throat.

Presidents do that because they choose to.

They aren't spreading religion per say.

Putting the slogan, as someone else mentioned, that there is a God, is false advertising, because religion cannot really be proven.

Originally posted by MyXlog
I agree that this recent christian campaign is False Advertising and I'd like to see how it stood up in Court.

I hear you, but I doubt there would be any judge that would touch that case with a 10-foot-pole.

Also, I'm not really sure what the legal basis would be to sue for false advertising. The ad itself isn't trying to sell anything, although the organizations behind the ad (Trinitarian Bible Society and Russian Orthodox Church) do sell things and/or take donations. It's an interesting question.

I wouldn't have such a problem with that slogan if it didn't have a Christian agenda behind it.

The first line isn't that silly, because the idea of God is open to interpretation. Pantheists describe God as being natural law, existence and the universe. In this case, I guess you could say "there definitely is a God".

The first line can even be humorous. Imagine if there was an image of a Budweiser under "there definitely is a God."

But this advertisement is clearly for Christian recruitment. Worst yet, it is false advertising since they are selling an invisible product.

Well, they did this because of the Atheist message of "There probably isn't a God, enjoy your life"


I don't see anything wrong with either of these ads.

They both have very valid points...

To the religiously oppressed, the concept that there probably isn't a God is very liberating and can allow someone to enjoy there life much more than that which oppressed them.

To the person seeking answers and looking for order, the concept that there is a God kinda makes everything feel better.

Personally, the psychonaut in me wants to see both of these ads on the SAME bus. Hopefully that would cause a paradox to occur in the minds of the readers which would allow for some real enlightenment.

Real enlightenment, as I phrase it, is a place where you can move beyond the need to establish or tear down the concept of a God.

Oh, I've got it...


They should advertise in return the following...

"There definitely is a god" - Christian Advertisement.

Oh right...
You mean this guy?



[edit on 5-2-2009 by johnsky]

I'm sure those "athiests" will be overpowered by their outstanding display of Christ's love


Judge not, that you be not judged.


For with what judgment you judge, you will be judged; and with the measure you use, it will be measured back to you. And why do you look at the speck in your brother's eye, but do not consider the plank in your own eye? Or how can you say to your brother, 'Let me remove the speck from your eye'; and look, a plank is in your own eye? Hypocrite! First remove the plank from your own eye, and then you will see clearly to remove the speck from your brother's eye.


Do not give what is holy to the dogs; nor cast your pearls before swine, lest they trample them under their feet, and turn and tear you in pieces.


Ask, and it will be given to you; seek, and you will find; knock, and it will be opened to you. For everyone who asks receives, and he who seeks finds, and to him who knocks it will be opened. Or what man is there among you who, if his son asks for bread, will give him a stone? Or if he asks for a fish, will he give him a serpent? If you then, being evil, know how to give good gifts to your children, how much more will your Father who is in heaven give good things to those who ask Him!


Therefore, whatever you want men to do to you, do also to them, for this is the Law and the Prophets. Enter by the narrow gate; for wide [is] the gate and broad [is] the way that leads to destruction, and there are many who go in by it. Because [fn] narrow [is] the gate and difficult [is] the way which leads to life, and there are few who find it.


Beware of false prophets, who come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravenous wolves. You will know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes from thornbushes or figs from thistles? Even so, every good tree bears good fruit, but a bad tree bears bad fruit. A good tree cannot bear bad fruit, nor [can] a bad tree bear good fruit. Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. Therefore by their fruits you will know them.

- Jesus Christ (Matthew 7:1-20)

[edit on 6-2-2009 by nnpkjkrv]

reply to post by converge


Well, first - assumptions do not always work. I am not "religious" - since there is no religion i sign myself into. However - i do believe that there is God. And i do not push this idea to anyone - it is private,personal matter to consider.
However - atheist does not equal fighter for "no God" idea. At least by definition. Atheist is simply person who does not believe in God. Which is his God-given right.
As for validity of "definetly-God" campaign - it is as valid as previous one. Science cannot prove that there is a God - but it also cannot disprove it. Once principle of freedom of choice is applied, nothing can prove or disprove existence of God. And since God-idea was here before scientific approach, until proven otherwise it is not misleading to claim that there is God on advertising. Pointless, bad taste - maybe(even probably ). And there can be no proof. Alas - catch 22.
By the way - i do not feel hurt by "probably-no-God" campaign. Every one has the right to decide for himself on that question, surely.
But it is just as pointless and bad taste.
However - a lot of people who do believe in God were hurt. And if something was pointless ,but it hurt people feelings - then its point is to hurt someone.
Atheists on the other hand should not be hurt by "pro-God" campaign. Since they do NOT believe, they think that there is no God. And if nobody forces opposed opinions on them - then there is no reason to be offended.
Unless of course it is type of atheists who have faith that there is no God. Which is illogical. And again a faith question. There were religious crusades, and there were atheist-ones not so long ago.
By the way - to think that someone else faith,especially in this matter is childish - is arrogant and ignorant approach. I respect other people opinion, faith or ideas (of course if i know what they are - and you even do not know what my is, but you let yourself assume things for me) - if they respect mine and do not force their view on me. Now you just tried to do it, to force your opinions (or is it faith?) on me. Not vice versa.

[edit on 6-2-2009 by ZeroKnowledge]

Originally posted by karl 12


As I said before I think they should prove it or remove it.

If they were advertising that in the US, I suppose someone could take them to court for false advertising.

That "definitely" would require proof, and I would love to see how that would play out in a court of law.

Maybe the UK has different advertising standards.

reply to post by johnsky


Lol. Can you imagine if some smarty pants did get large pictures of Gods other than the Christian God and plastered them in close proximity to that message on those busses?

A flying spaghetti monster here, Thor there, a little Zeus and Apollo on some others? Maybe add an -dess to the God and with a little picture of Pele or Kali?

Not that I am advocating defacing buses. Lol. It would be just as funny if a pagan group entered into the fray and bought their own advertisements.

Originally posted by Illusionsaregrander
Lol. Can you imagine if some smarty pants did get large pictures of Gods other than the Christian God and plastered them in close proximity to that message on those busses?

A flying spaghetti monster here, Thor there, a little Zeus and Apollo on some others? Maybe add an -dess to the God and with a little picture of Pele or Kali?

Not that I am advocating defacing buses. Lol. It would be just as funny if a pagan group entered into the fray and bought their own advertisements.

Funny?!

I think it would be down right hilarious!

OH!!!! Add Chuck Norris' picture next to it as well!!!!
"There definitely is a god: Chuck Norris."
...and on the seventh day he round-house kicked everyone and they slept.

Quick! How can I contact this group of Atheists?


The Atheists message was supposed to get you to question your beliefs... hence why they said "probably isn't a god".

The Christians on average usually can't come to terms with the fact that others think differently.

I think twisting their "definitely a god" message by showing images of gods that they deem to be those of heathens would be utterly priceless.

To me, it's a big joke. Religions have been waging wars since they've been founded... I think it's high time we were able to take a step back and laugh at it all.

If there's a point to life, it's to enjoy it while you've got it, and help others enjoy it as well... laughter is a wonderful thing.

[edit on 6-2-2009 by johnsky]

I thoroughly applaud this response from a couple of christian churches.

The first message from the atheists made me smile, this one made me laugh out loud.

I do hope other groups and religions join the fray and this saga continues, as it is bringing much needed humor into my world.

I like your ideas Illusions.

"There really is a Goddess, in fact there are many. Kali is my favorite. Now stop worrying cos she'll destroy everything whether you enjoy your life or not"

Hi, I'm from the church of "We're all going to die, get over it."
Our stance is simple.
We believe that we're all going to die, get over it.

... something I said to a door to door bible pusher.
He didn't stick around long.


I'm glad to see other members realizing the Atheist advertisements are intended to be a laughing matter. I just hope the Christians putting up the rebuttal advertisements realize it as well before they wind up becoming the butt of the joke.

reply to post by karl 12



"Aren't signs that say 'there definitely is a god' just misleading and very presumptuous? "

There are better odds that the existence of God will be proven - more so than the odds that his existence will ever be disproven.

I'm just sayin' ... You can prove that sort of negative ;-)

It's amusing to me that the "There probably isn't a God" adverts prove that their originator is actually admitting that they don't know for sure!

The Christians, on the other hand - DO know. That is one of the gifts of true faith - assurance.

So I would say that this advertising battle has already been won.

Of course, non Christians will obviously continue to suggest otherwise!



Just because it's relevant in the context of this thread, here's a quote from that much misunderstood and attacked book - the Bible:

For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who by their unrighteousness suppress the truth.

For what can be known about God is plain to them, because God has shown it to them. For his invisible attributes, namely, his eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly perceived, ever since the creation of the world, in the things that have been made. So they are without excuse.

For although they knew God, they did not honor him as God or give thanks to him, but they became futile in their thinking, and their foolish hearts were darkened. Claiming to be wise, they became fools, and exchanged the glory of the immortal God for images resembling mortal man and birds and animals and reptiles.

Therefore God gave them up in the lusts of their hearts to impurity, to the dishonoring of their bodies among themselves, because they exchanged the truth about God for a lie and worshiped and served the creature rather than the Creator, who is blessed forever! Amen.

So the Bible itself tells the Christian that no one has an excuse for not believing in God. But because believing in God requires an individual to come to terms with what God's existence means to them and the way that they live, people decide to believe other things. Hence we end up with websites like ATS where theories such as aliens seeding life on earth are given serious consideration. Not that I'm saying that it's wrong for such ideas to be considered... if the searcher is genuinely searching for the truth, the Truth will be found.

My advice is to be like the honest atheists who came up with that first advert. DON'T make the ultimate mistake of telling yourself that there is DEFINITELY no God, because THEN you are in the position of rejecting a possibility without fully researching it. And as the classic argument against atheism goes, it's IMPOSSIBLE to gain all the knowledge in the universe, therefore it's IMPOSSIBLE to say that there is no God....

Just like so much "science" these days turns the scientific method on it's head by throwing out one or more of the possibilities before even starting to try and put the pieces together....

No wonder they keep having to redesign the puzzle.

Originally posted by illimey
It's amusing to me that the "There probably isn't a God" adverts prove that their originator is actually admitting that they don't know for sure!

Of course we don't know for sure. What kind of silly thing to say is that? All we can say is, if there is a complete absense of evidence of any kind of deities at all, then it's a fairly safe assumption that they either aren't there or don't care.

Originally posted by illimeyThe Christians, on the other hand - DO know. That is one of the gifts of true faith - assurance.

I wish I was as ignorant as you. The Christians know that they have an ancient text called the Bible, written by Jews under the pagan Roman yoke, who needed to justify why their single, "all-powerful" god wasn't as hard as Jupiter or Mars.

They have faith that what is contained within the book is real. This is not knowledge, this is assumption, and therefore the Christians, like every other cult on earth, really know nothing more than the contents of their favourite bedtime fairytale.

Originally posted by illimeySo I would say that this advertising battle has already been won.

Translation: cultists don't understand that faith does not equal knowledge.

Originally posted by illimeyOf course, non Christians will obviously continue to suggest otherwise!

It's not just non-Christians, it's non-cultists, because we believe in something called empirical evidence. I'll put that in inverted commas for you, because I feel you'll miss it otherwise.

"EMPIRICAL EVIDENCE"

What this means is you have to prove something for it to become fact. If I assert that there is a chocolate teapot orbiting Mercury (the planet, not the god), then a normal person will probably ask "wouldn't it melt?" (I assume that you may take it on faith that it's there, but you shouldn't).

This means, that the burden of proof is on me to show that this un-melted chocolate teapot is really there. You do not have to disprove me, because it was me who claimed the teapot was there in the first place.

If I cannot prove it, it isn't true.

THE SAME GOES FOR ALL RELIGIOUS BELIEFS.

Tell your god to take the stage and give us some tunes, or shut the f*** up and sit down.

Originally posted by illimeyMy advice is to be like the honest atheists who came up with that first advert. DON'T make the ultimate mistake of telling yourself that there is DEFINITELY no God, because THEN you are in the position of rejecting a possibility without fully researching it. And as the classic argument against atheism goes, it's IMPOSSIBLE to gain all the knowledge in the universe, therefore it's IMPOSSIBLE to say that there is no God....

Genius.

I postulate that we are both agnostics, I am merely a pessimist and you an optimist.

To claim there definitely is a god, then you are rejecting the possibility without researching the subject by joining other cults like your own, and since they all have mutually-exclusive dichomies, then it is IMPOSSIBLE to say there might even be one of these invisible friends.

Originally posted by illimeyJust like so much "science" these days turns the scientific method on it's head by throwing out one or more of the possibilities before even starting to try and put the pieces together....

No wonder they keep having to redesign the puzzle.

No. If you have to put inverted commas around the word science, you do not understand science, and you are clearly looking for a simple "well, that's settled then" answer, but the truth is our universe is not simple, or easy, and there is no easy answer to the question.

Just because you don't like it, and would prefer a nice, comfortable "God did it" answer, doesn't make it true, and just because you don't understand it doesn't mean you have the right to take all the hours of painstaking work and research humanity has achieved over the millennia and consign it to inverted commas just because it doesn't comfortably sit into your world view!

Originally posted by The Last Man on Earth

Originally posted by illimey
It's amusing to me that the "There probably isn't a God" adverts prove that their originator is actually admitting that they don't know for sure!

Of course we don't know for sure. What kind of silly thing to say is that? All we can say is, if there is a complete absense of evidence of any kind of deities at all, then it's a fairly safe assumption that they either aren't there or don't care.

.......

Well if athiests knew that there wasnt a God for sure then the sign might have read something like this:

"There definatly isnt a God ...."

Probably: In all likelihood; in a probable manner (wikipedia entry)

The use of probably implys that who ever made the sign doesnt know definatly that there isnt a God. This would be due to the fact that no one can disprove the idea of God - on the flip side no one can prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that there is a God.

Originally posted by funky monk
Well if athiests knew that there wasnt a God for sure then the sign might have read something like this:

"There definatly isnt a God ...."

Probably: In all likelihood; in a probable manner (wikipedia entry)

The use of probably implys that who ever made the sign doesnt know definatly that there isnt a God. This would be due to the fact that no one can disprove the idea of God - on the flip side no one can prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that there is a God.

Er ... yeah.