Vonspurter great find Bach
S+F from me, Cwmru Am Byth!
As long as we win the first game eh
Being of 100% Celtic and mainly Welsh Heritage and living in God's own great land itself I do, as a famous Pop Song stated recently "Wake up every
morning and Thank the Lord I am Welsh"
I am sure sometimes too the long grammatical and very padded out posts I sometimes contribute may hint at this rich and flowery and indeed poetic,
past rising in my genes
I am also a bit of an Arthurian and Glastonbury Obsessive etc.
So for those who don't know just to briefly explain the Mabinogion in a very light sketch, and give some Facts I am sure many don't know to dovetail
with your OP.
The Mabinogion or Mabinogi name given was actually penned by an English Lady of literary research who seems to have made a Mistake, the name is only
in the four branches of such said works, or the rest of the Welsh Romances, comprising the Eleven Stories collectively known as the Mabinogion, or
even their allied Irish ones just Once and seems to have come from the said such lady called Lady Guest I think its Charlotte.
She created it from an misunderstanding of the phrase as a plural of mabogi, which is spoken as Mabynnogyon. This was a descriptive way or grouping
together the Four Branches you mention in your Op in folklore, but as the Mabinogion in a modern understanding contains the welsh Romances as well as
the four Branches you mention, it is infact an middle ages error that has never been resolved!
So what does the Mabinogion contain, well for many who know Arthur and the stories it is the seed of this myth, and Geoffrey of Monmouth is the man
who added the rounded tables and merged other things such as one of the romances of the Lady of the lake into one medieval Romantic novel that, swept
Europe, and is truly the font of the Arthur as understood by the masses and described in hollywood fiction.
The true Mabinogion, and therefore containing as well the Arthur stories as a part of it is sourced by Lady Guest from two books called the Red Book
and the White Book which were the laying down of ancient oral stories told and recounted, acted out in communities well before being written down.
This is keeping with the traditional Welsh custom of passing information on in an Oral manner from the Druidic roots, when entire schools and centres
of learning, levels of recognition were taught, and conveyed with no Written material. When the Normans and Romans invaded the UK well before these
books were written, even though Wales never fell like England to the invaders, when parts of the south were occupied, a favourite genocidal habit of
both the Romans and Normans was to find the Druids of the community, that is the Shaman, Keepers of knowledge, tradition , History and healing and cut
out their tongues.
This practise obviously had a massive impact on the Welsh and Druidic culture and much knowledge was lost. There is even some evidence that the
original Welsh tongue, is one if not the oldest official language in the world, though it is open to conjecture.
So back on topic, lol see what I mean this Lady Charlotte took the two welsh collections of "The White Book of Rhydderch" (Llyfr Gwyn Rhyddersch)
& "The Red Book of Hergest" (Llyfr Coch Hergest) written about 1310 & 1400 respectively. The Red one is in Jesus College Oxford still intact and the
White one in the Library of Wales if anyone would like to see them.
It appears that they were definately being spoken at Least 1100 AD or before but were only written down as shown above.
Now some of these works are grouped together with stories and romances that have no mention of Arthur , who I will show archeological evidence as
being a real person later, and seem to have come from the earliest days of the Celtic World, certainly in Wales and indeed could predate Christ in
their oral origin of storytelling!
So I will be a little more on topic now, and to just explain the grouping of the Mabinogion into it's collective parts. The White Book and Red Book
as shown were major parts but the eleven sections are as follows:
The four Branches of the Mabinogi
Pwyll prince of Dyfed (this is the part/who Gwyn Ur Upp swaps with from the underworld)
Branwen Daughter of LLyr
Manawydan Son of Llyr
Math Son of Mathonwy
Then there are four separate stories, just folklore not Arthur Dominated
The Dream of Macsen Wledig
Lludd and LLefelys
Culhwch And Olwen
The dream of Rhonabwy
Followed by the Three Romances, and this is heavily Arthur Dominated, infact it is sort of agreed within the framework of this that it is a souped up
or romanticised account of the Arthurian Facts, though much much closer to any truth you will read from anyone after Geoffrey of Monmouth, himself
The Lady of the Fountain see fountain romanticised to lake and add sword from I think Llud!
Peredur son of Efrawg
Gerient son of Erbin
That is what has become known as the Mabinogion or Mabinogi.
Now all of these storie, folklore and renditions are massively laced with the Following, The Warrior (quest), The Maid/Princes virgin and lots and
lots of Magic, magic and the otherworld abounds, with spiritual sub plots, and tests at all parts of the tale, much like modern welsh life in the
The book opens as follows and is the first introduction to the underworld with the rogue pack of Dogs and the Prince Hunting with his:
Pwyll prince of Dwyfed(state/county) was lord over the seven Cantrefs(districts) of Dwfed, and once upon a time he was at Arberth, a Chief court of
his, and it came to his head and heart to go hunting. The part of his domain that pleased him most to hunt was Glyn cuch. and he set out that night
from Arberth, and came as far as Pen Lllwyn Diarwya, and there he was that night.
On the morrowin the young of the day he arose and came to Glyn Cuch to loose his dogs into the woods. And he sounded his horn and began to muster the
hunt, and followed after the dogs and lost his companions; and whilst he was listening to the cry of the pack, he could hear the cry of another pack,
but they had not the same cry, and were coming to meet his own pack.
These are the hounds of Gwynn ap Nudd and almost immediately as you can see in the opening book the hero is on a quest against the dark forces.
Star wars is really a rewrite of Hound wars in Wales millenia before
The classic romance. Though there are parts that may hold, or hide certain welsh and druid secrets, especially as I alluded to earlier in the post,
many of the druidic magic and spiritual teachings are meant to be hidden in this work, much like nostrodamus hid his work, for fear of prosecution,
the remaining druids at the time of Christ were meant to to have interwoven Real Knowledge and secrets, the mysteries of stonehenge and such within
works, and folklore like these.
In South Wales you will find a town by the sea with many many old smugglers coves nearby, and a Church in the town called Llantwit Magor.
It is about 20 minutes drive from the Cardiff Airport and around 30 minutes from cardiff the capital itself.
Now this place/curch and the surrounding town is the place of the Oldest university in the western World, though there is none there now. It was a
Monastical College and was pioneered by none others as St Patrick, Patron of Ireland, and St Illtyd & St David, Patron of Wales.
Not many people know that or that St Patrick is also a WELSHMAN who went and converted the Irish
Anyhow these guys visited and studied, prayed and spread the Christian faith in the area. If you go to that church you will see inside some stones,
and celtic crosses from differant ages and parts of Wales.
One of them that has been confirmed as being of the correct time alluded to in the Mabagonion and the romances, together with other historical
anecdotes and stories, has Arthurs Name on it, in fact it states that Arthur was there with hsi son, and was found in I believe West Wales.
It is obvious from the date and importance of this Character that he was very very powerful and is alluded to as a Prince in the text.
So unlike again popular misconception, there is Physical evidence of him, his stature and correct date, you can go and touch it and see, its not
locked away, just at the back of said church close to the door.
I have spent quite a bit of time meditating there, and dowsing as such by this stone and I must say it has a very powerful energy, if you are open and
believe in that sort of thing, and funny enough sometimes more powerful than Stonehenge and Glastonbury Tor itself, but much more earthy, grounded,
strong, warrior like, more human.
When the true Britain's really need him he is said to return to lead, and protect us, and maybe just maybe now is the time with the world as it is,
you guys in the US think Obama is something, he would shade into comparison lol... just kidding, but true lol
Will dig some of my books out on this subject over weekend and add some interesting aspects for all interested. I do know from a old friend I used to
know who is a Druid practising as such, that to hear the hounds in the woods alone, or the wilds mountains, and not to see any is a forebearing or
warning that misfortune is about to manifest in your life, and you are by your benelovent guides or, or the light being allowed access to that realm
of Gwynn ap Nudd very briefly as a warning, to change your ways, last chance as the hounds are on their way and baying for your blood.
Only redemption and massive change can then stop the Justice/death card of the Tarot being played out in your life.
[edit on 23-1-2009 by MischeviousElf]