Paul ~ Inventing a new saviour

Originally posted by justamomma
reply to post by Simplynoone

 

You basically did say that simplysomeone. If G.d can change His character at any time, than that is saying that He can be anything ... How would you trust that?

As I stated above, you are lining up G.d to fit your perception rather than lining up your perspective to see Him as He is... was... will be.

He does not change his character ...
His character has many facets ...like we have ...even more so possibly (we are only partially in his image because we are also in the image of the whole creation and elements and of the Earth ...(we are a creation within a creation) ...


He gets angry
He gets provoked
He shows wrath
He gets jelous
And he CREATES NEW THINGS He is constantly creating .....NEW THINGS.

I thought you said you knew the OT ...if you did you could find many many scriptures to every single one of the emotions that GOD HAS >>

Originally posted by TheMythLives
reply to post by justamomma

 

Why would I trust man? I trust God, but if you want to believe that you hold the entire truth of the word, be my guest. I am having a hrad time understanding because it makes no sense..lol.. If you have the clarity that you claim to have, awesoem for you, but I respectfully doubt it. Only by the nature of the words you write and how you write them.

Excuse me, but I'm pretty sure it goes as "let those with ears hear". Everyone has ears, but not everyone has ears that hear the understandings being shown. Those without ears focus on the literal word as the word of god because they do not hear the true word for themselves.

This is also described by people as needing to have the holy spirit before you can actually understand the bible. And as I already showed you, there is a process involved in that, and if you have not experienced the day/moment where you see that the father is in you, then you have not yet been given the holy spirit. John 14, from the words of Jesus.

IF you have "eyes and ears", then you will see and hear the understanding. That which the rest of the world, while having physical eyes and ears, are unable to accept or see. Just as you plainly claim you can not see the understanding being shown here in this thread.

John 14:17 Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you.



[edit on 22-1-2009 by badmedia]

reply to post by justamomma


Your describing a man, by saying that God does not change. God can do as he pleases, he's God and to say that you know who God is, is highly impossible, while we may have an idea we do not know God, because of our fallen state.

Originally posted by TheMythLives
reply to post by justamomma

 

Why do you continue to quote the biblem if the bible does not hold the word of God?

Because I didn't say that the Tanakh did not have the Word of G.d. I believe it is G.d's Word in order to help us align ourselves in the true knowledge of G.d.

What I said was His Word is not bound to a book, even the Tanakh. I said it was not bound to a man... not that His Word *couldn't* speak from the mouth.

I am so sure of His knowledge and His character that it is easy for me to say that the message at the end of the book is not G.d's plan for mankind. I can say that I do not place my trust in Jesus but I do believe the message that is attributed to coming from His mouth.

It is why I can tell who here is being spoken to by my Father and who is believing the lies.

It is a blessed place to be ... to be this sure and to know that I can not be led astray. It was worth every minute of uncertainty when I let go of the false perceptions/securities that I was holding on to.

Kind of like a child letting go of the old teddy bear as she realizes that it can do little to protect her against the boogy man.

Edited to add: and from this view, the boogy man is nothing but a weak puff of smoke that can not touch me.

[edit on 22-1-2009 by justamomma]

Originally posted by TheMythLives
reply to post by justamomma

 

Your describing a man, by saying that God does not change. God can do as he pleases, he's God and to say that you know who God is, is highly impossible, while we may have an idea we do not know God, because of our fallen state.

Man does not change?? About the only thing that DOESN'T change about most men is that they can't let go of their teddy bears.

You are basically saying that man can be trusted over G.d.. thus, I see why you believe your salvation rests with someone you have never met and why I can say with sad assuredness that you have not seen the Father. If you had seen Him, you would not put Him below the level of a man.

Originally posted by Simplynoone
He gets angry

No doubt.. because man says man is more trustworthy than Him.

He gets provoked

ditto.. and it is for our good.

He shows wrath

Just like a good parent does when their child hears their parent say "don't go out into that street" and the child sticks there tongue out and defiantly disobeys.

He gets jelous

I am jealous for Him. It is sad that people believe the lie over His truth.

And he CREATES NEW THINGS He is constantly creating .....NEW THINGS.

Like? Or is that your perception? Wow! could you imagine having parents that were like the god you all are describing.. that would make for a very insecure child.. oh.. wait.. santa clause, changed rules, ... i suppose this might account for much.

I thought you said you knew the OT ...if you did you could find many many scriptures to every single one of the emotions that GOD HAS >>

I don't know the *OLD* testament. I know Him NOW. I call it the Tanakh because the OLD is a deception. He is testified in there NOW.. but you don't believe Him. You deny Him.

[edit on 22-1-2009 by justamomma]

Originally posted by justamomma

Originally posted by Simplynoone
He can BREAK anything he wants to break ...you better stop putting God in a box ....he is so outside of the box that even he says ..

This is just sad... that you believe in something that you don't know if it will be the same tomorrow as it is today.

So.. it is no wonder that you don't believe Him when He said He does not change.

I did not put G.d in a box. He lovingly shared key elements of His character with us.. and I for one believed what He said. When I believed it, and let go of the false perception, I became sure of Him.

G.d is not like a man Simplysomeone. What you described there is a characteristic of a man.. not G.d. Thus why you put your trust in a man and not G.d.

No he is not a man ....he is GOD ...he is way beyond man ...
We are a mere image of him ...Jesus was more than a mere image actually scripture says he is the EXPRESS IMAGE of God ... ..and more than just a man .......

reply to post by justamomma


[And he CREATES NEW THINGS He is constantly creating .....NEW THINGS.]

I got it from the word ...the tanakah (OT) .which you did not read on the last page ..so I will repeat it ..

Num 16:30 But if the LORD make a new thing, and the earth open her mouth, and swallow them up, with all that [appertain] unto them, and they go down quick into the pit; then ye shall understand that these men have provoked the LORD.
Isa 43:19 Behold, I will do a new thing; now it shall spring forth; shall ye not know it? I will even make a way in the wilderness, [and] rivers in the desert.
Jer 31:22 How long wilt thou go about, O thou backsliding daughter? for the LORD hath created a new thing in the earth, A woman shall compass a man.
Gal 6:15 For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision, but a new creature.
1Jo 2:8 Again, a new commandment I write unto you, which thing is true in him and in you: because the darkness is past, and the true light now shineth.


So the word you think you recieve and know ....has no witnesss to verify what you say is true ......and in fact your own tanakah (as you call it ) Or the OT >.. proves YOU do not know the truth ..as you contradict Gods spoken word >the word of which you say we must GO BY >......

Originally posted by Simplynoone
No he is not a man ....he is GOD ...he is way beyond man ...
We are a mere image of him ...Jesus was more than a mere image actually scripture says he is the EXPRESS IMAGE of God ... ..and more than just a man .......

Jesus was a man.

The father who speaks though him, that is the father. So the words you hear are the fathers, but Jesus is not in himself the father. When Jesus is speaking, he refers to God as the father. Jesus even tells you this directly, these are not my words, these are the words of the father.

Originally posted by Simplynoone
[And he CREATES NEW THINGS He is constantly creating .....NEW THINGS.]

I got it from the word ...the tanakah (OT) .which you did not read on the last page ..so I will repeat it ..

Num 16:30 But if the LORD make a new thing, and the earth open her mouth, and swallow them up, with all that [appertain] unto them, and they go down quick into the pit; then ye shall understand that these men have provoked the LORD.
Isa 43:19 Behold, I will do a new thing; now it shall spring forth; shall ye not know it? I will even make a way in the wilderness, [and] rivers in the desert.
Jer 31:22 How long wilt thou go about, O thou backsliding daughter? for the LORD hath created a new thing in the earth, A woman shall compass a man.
Gal 6:15 For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision, but a new creature.
1Jo 2:8 Again, a new commandment I write unto you, which thing is true in him and in you: because the darkness is past, and the true light now shineth.


So the word you think you recieve and know ....has no witnesss to verify what you say is true ......and in fact your own tanakah (as you call it ) Or the OT >.. proves YOU do not know the truth ..as you contradict Gods spoken word >the word of which you say we must GO BY >......

God does not actually change. It appears new and like change to you because of the way this reality is. As all is known, there is nothing to change into. Of course, god can obviously take on other limited perceptions that do include change, such as your own as a way of doing things which appear "new". But truly, god doesn't actually "change". Change is a product of time, god is eternal and knows no time.



[edit on 22-1-2009 by badmedia]

Originally posted by badmedia

Originally posted by Simplynoone
No he is not a man ....he is GOD ...he is way beyond man ...
We are a mere image of him ...Jesus was more than a mere image actually scripture says he is the EXPRESS IMAGE of God ... ..and more than just a man .......

Jesus was a man.

The father who speaks though him, that is the father. So the words you hear are the fathers, but Jesus is not in himself the father. When Jesus is speaking, he refers to God as the father. Jesus even tells you this directly, these are not my words, these are the words of the father.

Did you even read my post .....above that ...you see yall do not even read the posts ..you just take the first thing that upsets you and start rambling on it ..missing the whole picture ..just like you do the bible ...Jesus ...etc etc ..

Ok here it is again ..
Jesus is the EXPRESS IMAGE of GOD (Fully God as in all things are through him by him and because of him ) ...and fully man (born of a women through an earthly birth) ....We are just FULLY MAN >..with the mere breath of him in us ...Jesus was the EXACT EXPRESSION PRECISE REPRODUCTION in every respect ..(we only partially ) .....

Express
1) the instrument used for engraving or carving

2) the mark stamped upon that instrument or wrought out on it

a) a mark or figure burned in (Lev. 13:28) or stamped on, an impression

b) the exact expression (the image) of any person or thing, marked likeness, precise reproduction in every respect, i.e facsimile

Col 1:15 Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:

Col 1:16 For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether [they be] thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:

Col 1:17 And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.


NOtice he was the FIRSTBORN of EVERY CREATURE ..(So he has been here WAY BEFORE US >>>)

Originally posted by Simplynoone
He does not change his character ...

You say this.. but you deny it too. If He breaks the Laws that He promised would be eternal, perfect, and sufficient to convert the soul and instead opts to let man off the hook from learning via human sacrifice, then His character has most assuredly changed and it is understandable why you call the Tanakh the "old" testament.

I could *not* accept that. It seemed to be either that G.d was lying or man was lying. Once I saw that it was man.. I felt great relief and great joy. It is unlike anything I could ever express in words to you.

The Truth of G.d far outweighs the lies of man. I would rather take the chastisements and continue to grow in my Father than settle for the way that seems right, but leads to death.

I trust Him because He is trustworthy. How do you trust your god when you are never sure if he is going to change his mind tomorrow? Where is the security of in your blind faith that maybe *this* time he means it?

My security rests in my knowledge of Him and that He meant it when He said that He does not change. Now I know how to distinguish lies from the truth and it isn't bound to the knowledge in a book.. The Truth is bound in Him... He is Truth.. He is True to what He says!

Originally posted by badmedia

God does not actually change. It appears new and like change to you because of the way this reality is. As all is known, there is nothing to change into. Of course, god can obviously take on other limited perceptions that do include change, such as your own as a way of doing things which appear "new". But truly, god doesn't actually "change". Change is a product of time, god is eternal and knows no time.

[edit on 22-1-2009 by badmedia]

Guess you did not read my post again ...it is the very first one on this page where I said ...
QUOTE [He does not change his character ]
He CREATES ...I write different poetry every single one is different and NEW >>
God is a creator and he creates constantly .....I dont stop at just a few poems because I am a creator of poetry ...it comes like a river when I sit down to write them (I have over 300) ..
God is a creator of LIFE ..and is constantly creating ...and he creates NEW THINGS (According to scripture ) ............

Originally posted by Simplynoone
Did you even read my post .....above that ...you see yall do not even read the posts ..you just take the first thing that upsets you and start rambling on it ..missing the whole picture ..just like you do the bible ...Jesus ...etc etc ..

There is a reason God says not to make an idols out of him, because they would all be false. To say that gods image is complete in Jesus is just a flat out lie. To say the father was shinning through Jesus and speaking directly to the people themselves through Jesus, then yes I agree with you.

Again, the problem boils down to the fact that you can not accept or see the father that is in you. And so because of this, you deny it in others.

It's like the song "In Bloom" by nirvana.

She's the one, who likes all our pretty songs,
And she likes to sing along, but she knows not what it means.

In Bloom.

I see you like a flower before blooming. All wrapped up in a tight bud for security. Only accepting whats there, and nothing else. Afraid to blossom yourself. Saying "Whom am I to bloom and claim to be a beautiful flower". But as those around you start to blossom, you will as well. And you will realize - who are you not to! And a bright and beautiful bloom you will surly be. Bigger the bud, bigger the bloom.

Originally posted by Simplynoone
Num 16:30 But if the LORD make a new thing, and the earth open her mouth, and swallow them up, with all that [appertain] unto them, and they go down quick into the pit; then ye shall understand that these men have provoked the LORD.

yes.. good point. I know that I have been created anew! And I also know that the earth cannot swallow me up.. thus I don't buy the lies. I am that sure of Him and His work in me.

Isa 43:19 Behold, I will do a new thing; now it shall spring forth; shall ye not know it? I will even make a way in the wilderness, [and] rivers in the desert.

Also very true! Picking the serpent up by the tail and turning it back into the staff to show who is the One True G.d, just as He promised.. and not breaking one Law in the process nor acting outside of His character.. thus, keeping His promise to not change.

Jer 31:22 How long wilt thou go about, O thou backsliding daughter? for the LORD hath created a new thing in the earth, A woman shall compass a man.

Funny.. this is sooo very true and the truth completely escapes you... yet you talk to such a one even now. and all w/out breaking one single Law.. He is amazing!

You do know what it means by compass, no? Wow.. it amazes me when I see these things that He is fulfilling so literally.. and again, w/out breaking one Law.. thus picking that deception up by the tail and turning it back into the Truth.

Gal 6:15 For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision, but a new creature.

errr... well, considering..

1Jo 2:8 Again, a new commandment I write unto you, which thing is true in him and in you: because the darkness is past, and the true light now shineth.

Yes.. all while maintaining His character and His promise to not change.

So the word you think you recieve and know ....has no witnesss to verify what you say is true ......and in fact your own tanakah (as you call it ) Or the OT >.. proves YOU do not know the truth ..as you contradict Gods spoken word >the word of which you say we must GO BY >......

I am not trying to prove anything to you. I can not do so.. if I could, then you would not know that it was G.d. You will be trusting man and not Him. G.d will prove Himself to those who seek with an upright heart.

Looking for a human sacrifice to get you out of the learning process is not upright.. it cheapens what He is about and Who He is.

[edit on 22-1-2009 by justamomma]

reply to post by justamomma


There is no human sacrifice ..
The sacrifice has been done and I did not require it neither did I ask for it ......actually those who killed Christ did the human sacrifice .....they sacrificed the Messiah and did not even know it ......maybe if they had not gotten so upset and killed him ..that maybe it would not have had to happen like it did ...(man also made that choice to kill him ...like Abraham was really going to sacrifice his son too ... ...God could have intervened again with Jesus (but Jesus said it is written that he must die) ....And God allowed it for a reason (according to scripture he has many reasons) ....Who knows if man would not have killed him then God may have had another way ..man chose to kill him ..not even knowing they were the ones making a human sacrifice to their god of this world ..(they flat out murdered an innocent man ) ....that part of it was indeed from satan if you ask me .
Or did God make them kill him ? I think not ................


And that sacrifice is ALIVE FOREVER MORE ...death had no HOLD ON HIM ...and he ROSE FROM THE DEAD ....and went to sit at the right hand of GOD >....>.and he is coming back ..to gather us to him and take us to the place he said he has prepared for us .....
..(He will not come as a man like the Antichrist will ) ....Jesus already came as a man and as a divine God ....Jesus will come as an ANGEL from heaven with an innumerable company of Angels ...And no one will doubt that he is indeed not the Antichrist ..because the Antichrist will be the one ruling when Jesus comes ................. .

Originally posted by justamomma

Originally posted by TheMythLives
reply to post by justamomma

 

I just showed you that he broke your "laws of nature". God is God and he can do whatever he wants, if he wants to break a law he created he can do that, because he created it and in essence everything has an end, including us. God is too powerful to say that he does/will/has not break(or broken) his laws.

Because your *eyes* are not open.. and so you only believe what is physical. Again, do you believe that a duck complained to everyone about how ugly he was?

Do you believe that pinnoccio was really a puppet that was turned into a real boy?

Do you believe that a big bad wolf told 3 little piggies that he was going to huff and puff and blow their house down?

Or do you accept the truths in the pictures rather than the actual picture? Same concept.

It's just an allegory.
Do you really believe GoD created the heavens and the earth?

There's a difference between point and *hype*.
Why hype up the law of separation as if it were the Law of One?

Christ!

Originally posted by justamomma

Originally posted by TheMythLives
He caused Moses cane into a snake,

And don't forget, took that snake by the tail and turned it back into the staff... see, you leave out what makes Him distinguishable from the false gods

The staff of Moses is allegorical.
It stands for the Law of One.
You stand for the law of separation.
This is why you hide behind hype.
Hype is hypnotic.
Hypnotism cannot break the staff of the Law of One.
But you are trying hard with hype.
Keep trying.
You won't be able to do it.
The law of separtion, which you hype, is the law over deception.
Under this law, anyone who wants to be decieved can, and will be.
There is no one to blame.
Its just an experience of deception.
What the eyes of man sees is a delusion of consciousness.
What you are seeing is another delusion of consciousness.

You do not point.
A twisted staff cannot point straight.
You hype.
Why?
What are you hiding?


Christ!

Originally posted by TheMythLives
Jesus was born of the virgin and all like God told him it would be done...[edit on -06002009-01-22T21:19:14-06:00312009bAmerica/ChicagoThu, 22 Jan 2009 21:19:14 -0600, 1 by TheMythLives]

Hmmm... I don't remember G.d saying that a Jesus or even the Word would be born of a virgin.

Now, there is Isaiah 7: 14 that the author of Matthew tried to use to make it *appear* to be a prophecy fulfilled, but honestly, a little logic applied will show you that it is not so.


"Behold a virgin shall conceive and bare a son and shall call his name Emmanuel."

But for the Jewish reader who knows Hebrew, this also raises problems. The Hebrew word in Isaiah 7:14 that the KJV translates as virgin is almah.

In Hebrew almah means girl, young woman, that can be, or not, a virgin. Therefore the word virgin in Isaiah 7:14 is a wrong translation. The Hebrew word for virgin is betulah, that word is used for instance when the Torah speaks about Rebecca in Genesis 24:16: "…a virgin, neither had any man known her"

The KJV recognizes this fact too. When we look at Exodus 2:8, and at Proverbs 30:19, there the Hebrew text also uses the word almah, and there the KJV translates it to maid, which is a girl or young woman, whose state of virginity is unspecified. And in psalm 68:25 the King James translates almah as damsel, whose meaning is similar as maid.

So the New Testament is here misquoting the Tanakh. Nowhere in the Tanakh can a prophecy be found that says a virgin will give birth and in fact, nowhere can it be found in the Tanakh that a virgin DOES give birth... know why? Because virgin births are pagan mythology.

The angel goes on quoting the prophet Isaiah saying: "And *they* shall call his name Immanuel". But this is not what is written in Isaiah 7:14; there it clearly says in the Hebrew and in the King James translation, that she, the mother, shall call his name Immanuel. So, this prophecy is never fulfilled in Jesus since Mary named him "Jesus" or Yeshua.. whatever floats the christian's boat these days.


This verse also cannot apply to Jesus because it says in verse 16: "For before the child shall know to refuse evil and choose the good, the land that thou abhorrest shall be forsaken of their kings." It says here that there will be a time period that the child will not be able to refuse the evil. And since Jesus is, according to Christianity, without any sins, this verse cannot apply to him.

And in fact, put back into context, we can see this is not even referring to the coming messiah because it was a sign to King Achaz. The LORD had told him to ask for a sign so that King Achaz would trust in the LORD rather than in the false gods. King Achaz refused though and thus, the LORD decided on a sign for him and when he would see this sign, he knew there would be tranquility in his days.

We see from this two things: the whole chapter speaks about the days of Achaz, about 700 years before Jesus; verse 14: "Therefore the LORD himself shall give you (King Achaz and his house) a sign." G.d would not give him a sign by having a baby born 700 years after his death. The second thing that we see is that the baby that is talked about is only a sign, not a redeemer. G.d is the redeemer, as it is written in verse 17: "The LORD shall bring upon thee…"

This is exactly what I am talking about when I say.. search and study for yourselves. It is all there and there will be no excuse, especially living in a day and time when knowledge is but at your fingertips....

Unless you know of another place where a Jesus was prophesied to be born of virgin. You were duped my friend.

Originally posted by TheMythLives
He broke them to prove that he is not restrcited by it and that everthing is possible in God!

and Seriously?

I am scared to know if some of you are raising children. Is this how you deal with them?

Here you go Johnny and Betsy.. the list of rules that we as a family will abide by. If you break one, you will receive *such and such* punishment. Now, I am going to break rules #5, #8, and #3 just because I am bigger and can do such things.

No wonder kids have so many problems these days. No wonder there is so much lack of trust and genuine respect for one another these days. No wonder pastors have been able to blatantly take advantage and abuse their congregations ever Sunday. No wonder people dole out all their money, time, efforts, and dignity in the churches.

This is sad. Not for you all.. G.d gave you a brain and the ability to use it and you just blatantly disregard all that is good, right, just, holy, pure, and loving about Him and throw it in HIs face to worship a false god that is just as untrustworthy and stupid as... well, I'll be nice.

It is no wonder He is jealous. I would have to say that is very much a holy jealousy that is afforded to Him considering this stupidity that is spewing forth even on this thread.

If He can break the laws to prove how powerful He is.. how is it that you can't believe that He can prove Himself w/in the confines of the Laws He gave so that we would have a reason to put our trust in Him.

[edit on 23-1-2009 by justamomma]