The Abomination of Desolation

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posted on Nov, 5 2008 @ 07:12 PM
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What is it? Did this happen already? Did this occur in the first century?
Did this occur in th 90s? What is the Abomination of Desolation?

In the OT there are 3 main passages that refer to the Abomination of Desolation.


The wording in this passage is rather confusing, but the other two passages clear it up.
Dan 9:27 (RV)

Dan 9:27 And he shall make a firm covenant with many for one week: and for the half of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease; and upon the wing of abominations shall come one that maketh desolate; and even unto the consummation, and that determined, shall wrath be poured out upon the desolator.



This second passage is more clearer, here are 3 translations of it

Dan 11:31 (BBE)

31 And armies sent by him will take up their position and they will make unclean the holy place, even the strong place, and take away the regular burned offering and put in its place an unclean thing causing fear.

Dan 11:30-31 (ASV)

31 And forces shall stand on his part, and they shall profane the sanctuary, even the fortress, and shall take away the continual burnt-offering, and they shall set up the abomination that maketh desolate.

Dan 11:31 (KJV)

31 And arms shall stand on his part, and they shall pollute the sanctuary of strength, and shall take away the daily sacrifice, and they shall place the abomination that maketh desolate

Note what we have:

1) Army comes by force

2) Daily Sacrifice forcibly stopped (this does NOT require a Temple, it is possible, but it is unlikely)

3) An abomination of desolation is set in place.



Some definitions are in order....

Abomination - is a Hebrew synonym FOR AN IDOL.

Abomination is from H8262; disgusting, that is, filthy; especially idolatrous or (concretely) an idol: - abominable filth (idol, -ation), detestable (thing)

See this verse as well...

Isa 44:19 And none calleth to mind, neither is there knowledge nor understanding to say, I have burned part of it in the fire; yea, also I have baked bread upon the coals thereof; I have roasted flesh and eaten it: and shall I make the residue thereof an abomination? Shall I fall down to the stock of a tree?









The words holy place / sanctuary / sanctuary of strength is from H4720

From H6942; a consecrated thing or place, especially a palace, sanctuary (whether of Jehovah or of idols) or asylum: - chapel, hallowed part, holy place, sanctuary.

(pronounced) mik-dawsh, meaning a consecrated place or thing,

In the OT this can refer to the Tabernacle, or the Temple, or a Holy Room, or something consecrated like the alter.

From above passage it should be clear which it is referring to...

...And shall take away the continual burnt-offering, and they shall set up the abomination that maketh desolate. ..

They (the army) will by force, back some MAN who will come in...and halt the sacrifice and he will place an idol on the alter to desolate and desecrate it.

(as BBE translation puts it..)

"Take away the regular burned offering and put in its place an unclean thing causing fear. "



Abomination = An Idol

The Desolator = Army + Leader of that Army

The Desolation = Desecration of Alter of Sacrifice





This is another passage, a key passage, becomes it time stamps this occurrence, WE CAN KNOW WHEN THIS HAPPENS exactly in the framework of prophecy.

Dan 12:11 And from the time that the daily sacrifice shall be taken away, and the abomination that maketh desolate set up, there shall be a thousand two hundred and ninety days.

Dan 12:12 Blessed is he that waiteth, and cometh to the thousand three hundred and five and thirty days.

Dan 12:13 But go thou thy way till the end be: for thou shalt rest, and stand in thy lot at the end of the days



Most people quote and read Dan 12:11, which discusses the 1290 days, THIS IS THE TIME THE ARMIES DESOLATE JERUSALEM.

But they sort of glance over the next verse and miss an important clue! It time stamps this event! Do you see how?

In other words THIS EVENT HAS NOT HAPPENED YET. This IS NOT a reference to the destruction of Jerusalem and Temple in 70 A.D. (although that was a type of what will happen).



NOTICE! "THOU SHALT REST"...This is bible language for "sleeping" or simply put DEATH.

Daniel will sleep in the dust of the earth, AFTER which he will "STAND IN THY LOT", that is BE RESURRECTED,

Here is an overlooked verse, because it TELLS YOU WHEN THE "RAPTURE" (first Resurrection) OCCURS.

Not at the beginning of the Tribulation BUT THE END.

Note again....

Both the 1290 days, and the 1335 days...BOTH END AT THE SAME TIME....and this is at the first Resurrection, which occurs at "THE END OF DAYS".



So to review...

1290 days before Christ + First Resurrection

1) Armies surround Jerusalem.

2) They halt daily sacrifice

3) A man comes in and desecrates altar by placing on idol on it.

But we have 2 other dates....the 1335 days (45 days before the 1290 days), and the 1260 days (30 days after the 1290 days)

For more information on the 1260 days we proceed to the NT.

[TO BE CONTINUED...tomorrow]

:-)




[edit on 5-11-2008 by SirPaulMuaddib]




posted on Nov, 5 2008 @ 07:14 PM
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Yeah, but the thing is, the Christ said that no man knoweth the time, except the Father.

And he isn't talking.



posted on Nov, 5 2008 @ 07:36 PM
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It's the first Morbid Angel record too, not bad, pretty raw, but a fairly good document of the US/Florida scene of the time.



posted on Nov, 5 2008 @ 07:43 PM
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Weird. If you divide that 1335 it comes to almost 4 years. 2012 ?



posted on Nov, 5 2008 @ 07:48 PM
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I know all the prophecies and sayings and hopes and dreams and blah blah regarding the tribulation and the rapture and all of that jazz...

however...

one thing i know as well is... there are no sacrifices being held anywhere, and until that time comes, i sure as heck am not going to live in a fear mode thinking that things are going to happen any day.

Just have to point that fact out to people who think that we're somehow living through the trib or that this is all right now this moment and all of that. There's no sacrifices, no plans FOR sacrifices, and frankly, according to Christian belief, NO NEED for sacrifices. Why are people flippin out?

well written, i will admit, but the logic is flawed at the base of things, and that doesnt preclude the fact that other things show the errancy of the bible, as well as scholars coming to terms that the book of Daniel was actually written after the time that has been claimed it was written.


Here's a quote from www.religioustolerance.org...

Many Liberal Christians believe that the book was really written many centuries after Daniel's time, during the Maccabean revolt against the Greek occupying forces in 168-164 BCE. They regard the book as pseudepigraphic - written by an anonymous author or authors and attributed to Daniel. They conclude this for a number of reasons:


The text contains a number of Greek words; yet the Greek occupation of the area did not occur until the 4th century BCE.

One of the musical instruments mentioned in Daniel 3:5 and in subsequent passages did not exist until developed in 2nd century BCE Greece.


Daniel 1:4 refers to the "Chaldeans" as a priestly class in Babylon. This term did not attain this meaning until much later than the 6th century.


About 180 BCE, Jeshua ben Sira listed the heroes of the Jewish faith, including "Enoch, Noah and Abraham through to Nehemiah;" 2 Daniel is not mentioned - presumably because Jeshua is unaware of him. This would indicate that the book of Daniel was written after that time.

Chapter 12 discusses the dead being resurrected, judged, and taken to either heaven and hell. At the time of Daniel, the Jews believed that all persons went to Sheol after death. The concept of heaven and hell was introduced centuries later by the Greeks. It did not appear in Israel until the time of the Maccabean revolt.


Daniel 11:31 (and elsewhere) refers to "the abominable thing that causes desolation." This appears to refer to the erection of a statue of Zeus in the Jerusalem temple in 167 BCE, and would indicate that the book was written later than that date.

Prior to Daniel 11:40, the author(s) has been recording past events under the Babylonian, Median, Persian and Greek empires. In Daniel 11:40-45, he really attempts to predict the future. He prophesizes that a king of the south (of the Ptolemaic dynasty) will attack the Greeks in Palestine, under Antiochus. The Greeks will win, will lay spoil to all of northeast Africa, and return to Palestine where Antiochus will die. The end of history will then occur. The author(s) appeared to be a poor psychic because none of these events actually happened. Antiochus did die in 164 BCE, but it was in Persia. Thus, the book was apparently completed before 164.



These things, which really, one cannot deny if one takes an open minded viewpoint on things, makes the whole prophecy regarding the "end of days" stemming from Daniel a falsity, and one which has been perpetuated for years to keep people in fear.

Just one example of the problems with trying to use Daniel as prophecy for our times.



posted on Nov, 5 2008 @ 07:48 PM
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reply to post by ohioriver
 


The "Abomination that makes Desolate" will probably be one of those prophecies that has dual fulfillment.
The first fulfillment was The Dome of The Rock being placed in Israel.



posted on Nov, 5 2008 @ 07:54 PM
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On August 3, 2006 it was the bloodiest day in the war with Hezbollah. I also believe President Bush was in Israel with Ehud Olmert discussing the exchange of military help for cooperation with Israel.

Abomination of Desolation
I think this has something to do with the mosque in Jerusalem.

Also a while back I counted back 1280 days from December 21, 2012, though I think I miscounted and landed on July 16, 2009, I happened to notice that on July 22, 2009 there will be a full solar eclipse. You might want to take a look at that. Hope that helps.



posted on Nov, 5 2008 @ 09:03 PM
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reply to post by Jomina
 



one thing i know as well is... there are no sacrifices being held anywhere...

Excuse me... Orthodox Jews Slaughter Swinging Chickens After Sin Transfer Ritual
Here is a PETA version of Kaparot
Every year, devout Jews around the world engage in an age-old ritual called kapparot,
Check out this NY Times article with accompanying video...
Chicken Swinging for the Soul



posted on Nov, 5 2008 @ 09:17 PM
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{one thing i know as well is... there are no sacrifices being held anywhere, and until that time comes, i sure as heck am not going to live in a fear mode thinking that things are going to happen any day.
Just have to point that fact out to people who think that we're somehow living through the trib or that this is all right now this moment and all of that. There's no sacrifices, no plans FOR sacrifices, and frankly, according to Christian belief, NO NEED for sacrifices. Why are people flippin out?}

Christians dont need or want this(the only reason they get excited about it because prophecy is being fulfilled before their eyes)but Orthodox Jews and the Temple Mount Faithful do want it and are preparing for it ....
Priests preparing the symbolic Pesach sacrifice after it was killed on the Mt. of Olives. The Temple Mount and the Dome of the Rock seen in the background (287 KB)
www.templemountfaithful.org...
www.templemountfaithful.org...
*(The link above has all of their pics and what they are doing and will do etc)

And they have the Newly formed Sanhadren that wants it too ..
www.traditioninaction.org...

Mock Passover Sacrifice Slammed by Pro-Animal Group
www.israelnationalnews.com...
(A snippet)
Public sacrifices are allowed
Making the Paschal sacrifice is part of the religious freedom which is a basic human right and a cornerstone of democracy."

Glick told Ynet Monday that according to Jewish law, abstaining from performing the sacrifice is an extremely serious offense, comparable in its severity to avoiding a brit (circumcision ceremony) for one's newborn boy. He explained that although Jewish law forbids Jews in an impure state (which all Jews are in as long as the Temple rites are not renewed) from entering the Temple area, an exception is made for public sacrifices like the Pesach sacrifice.

The Temple movement recently sent a formal request to Prime Minister Ehud Olmert and Minister of Public Security Avi Dichter, to allow them to conduct the sacrifice on the Temple Mount. "Making the Paschal sacrifice is part of the religious freedom which is a basic human right and a cornerstone of democracy," they wrote.

Glick said, however, that the organizers "have no intention of trying to ascend to the Mount without permission from the police."
www.israelnationalnews.com...

Here are all of the Artifacts that already exist
Bible Prophecy in the News : Rebuilding of the Jewish Temple
www.youtube.com...

{Daniel 11:31 (and elsewhere) refers to "the abominable thing that causes desolation." This appears to refer to the erection of a statue of Zeus in the Jerusalem temple in 167 BCE, and would indicate that the book was written later than that date.

Prior to Daniel 11:40, the author(s) has been recording past events under the Babylonian, Median, Persian and Greek empires. In Daniel 11:40-45, he really attempts to predict the future. He prophesizes that a king of the south (of the Ptolemaic dynasty) will attack the Greeks in Palestine, under Antiochus. The Greeks will win, will lay spoil to all of northeast Africa, and return to Palestine where Antiochus will die. The end of history will then occur. The author(s) appeared to be a poor psychic because none of these events actually happened. Antiochus did die in 164 BCE, but it was in Persia. Thus, the book was apparently completed before 164.}

These were only partial fulfillments .
I agree with most of this....It explains several things as to why they were not ALL fulfilled in that time period ...(even skimming it over will show you what I mean)This is just dealing with a few of them ..
Seven Unfulfilled Prophecies
www.ucg.org...

Also read this
Below are reference web sites that successfully defend that the book of Daniel appears to have been authored in the 6th BCE.
www.harvardhouse.com...

(The link above does not go into what has been fulfilled and what hasnt .but it at least gives us a possible date of when it was written)




[edit on 5-11-2008 by Simplynoone]



posted on Nov, 5 2008 @ 09:28 PM
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Maybe they really meant the OBAMA-nation of Desolation?
Maybe it's when America gets wiped off the face of the earth?



posted on Nov, 6 2008 @ 01:58 AM
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Originally posted by SirPaulMuaddib

This second passage is more clearer, here are 3 translations of it

Dan 11:31 (BBE)

31 And armies sent by him will take up their position and they will make unclean the holy place, even the strong place, and take away the regular burned offering and put in its place an unclean thing causing fear.

Dan 11:30-31 (ASV)

31 And forces shall stand on his part, and they shall profane the sanctuary, even the fortress, and shall take away the continual burnt-offering, and they shall set up the abomination that maketh desolate.

Dan 11:31 (KJV)

31 And arms shall stand on his part, and they shall pollute the sanctuary of strength, and shall take away the daily sacrifice, and they shall place the abomination that maketh desolate

Note what we have:

1) Army comes by force

2) Daily Sacrifice forcibly stopped (this does NOT require a Temple, it is possible, but it is unlikely)



1) The word translated above as armed forces is zrowa, it doesn't always mean arms as in weapons or even an army, it literally means arm or shoulder, it is symbolic of strength, which doesn't have to be an army. It could be a people with religious or political power.

www.blueletterbible.org...

2) The word translated as Daily sacrifice is tamiyd, which means daily, evermore, perpetual, always, continuance, it doesn't have to mean a sacrifice, it could be (and I believe is when talking of the end-time fulfillment of this prophecy) the perpetual covenant of the Sabbath and the Holy days.

www.blueletterbible.org...




Some definitions are in order....

Abomination - is a Hebrew synonym FOR AN IDOL.

Abomination is from H8262; disgusting, that is, filthy; especially idolatrous or (concretely) an idol: - abominable filth (idol, -ation), detestable (thing)


Anything lifted up in front of God or something you place more importance on than God can be considered an idol, it doesn't have to be a statue or anything of that nature, it could even be your family, or your partner. Worshiping on Sunday for example is placing something else before God, and what his word says about what day the Sabbath should be observed, the seventh day, Saturday.



The words holy place / sanctuary / sanctuary of strength is from H4720

From H6942; a consecrated thing or place, especially a palace, sanctuary (whether of Jehovah or of idols) or asylum: - chapel, hallowed part, holy place, sanctuary.

(pronounced) mik-dawsh, meaning a consecrated place or thing,

In the OT this can refer to the Tabernacle, or the Temple, or a Holy Room, or something consecrated like the alter.

From above passage it should be clear which it is referring to...

...And shall take away the continual burnt-offering, and they shall set up the abomination that maketh desolate. ..


As I showed above "the continual burnt offering" is not exactly what is being said, the translators simply implied this, and the physical temple was the sanctuary before the sacrifice of Jesus, but now the temple, the sanctuary, the dwelling place of God is the church, so any prophecy concerning the temple or sanctuary in the end times is referring to the church. Talking to the church, Paul said...

1Corinthians 3:16 Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you?
17 If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy; for the temple of God is holy, which temple ye are.

19 What? know ye not that your body is the temple of the Holy Ghost which is in you, which ye have of God, and ye are not your own?

2Corinthians 6:16 And what agreement hath the temple of God with idols? for ye are the temple of the living God; as God hath said, I will dwell in them, and walk in them ; and I will be their God, and they shall be my people.




They (the army) will by force, back some MAN who will come in...and halt the sacrifice and he will place an idol on the alter to desolate and desecrate it.

(as BBE translation puts it..)

"Take away the regular burned offering and put in its place an unclean thing causing fear. "

Abomination = An Idol

The Desolator = Army + Leader of that Army

The Desolation = Desecration of Alter of Sacrifice


The words used in the prophecy leave it open to be fulfilled twice. Once concerning the physical temple in 70 AD, and also concerning the spiritual temple. I believe this is what Paul was talking about when he said....

2THESSALONIANS 2:3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;
4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshiped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, showing himself that he is God.

Note that Paul elsewhere in his writings as I showed above refers to the temple of God as being the church, so it is a no-brainer what he is talking about above. He is talking about a man that would sit (kathizo - to be set, appointed) in the the church, who would lift himself up above God (which is what idolatry is) and would cause a falling away (apostasia - apostasy, defection from the truth). This is what the abomination of desolation was to be in the end times. It was not concerning a physical temple or altar, or physical idol, it is a spiritual event. He would be a person set in power (zrowa - leader of the church) who would take away the tamiyd (continual or perpetual covenant of the observance of the Sabbath and Holy Days), which would be the apostasy (defection from truth) and desolate/defile the church (the spiritual temple of God).

Continued below....


[edit on 6/11/08 by doctorex]



posted on Nov, 6 2008 @ 02:34 AM
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Originally posted by SirPaulMuaddib

This is another passage, a key passage, becomes it time stamps this occurrence, WE CAN KNOW WHEN THIS HAPPENS exactly in the framework of prophecy.

Dan 12:11 And from the time that the daily sacrifice shall be taken away, and the abomination that maketh desolate set up, there shall be a thousand two hundred and ninety days.

Dan 12:12 Blessed is he that waiteth, and cometh to the thousand three hundred and five and thirty days.

Dan 12:13 But go thou thy way till the end be: for thou shalt rest, and stand in thy lot at the end of the days



Most people quote and read Dan 12:11, which discusses the 1290 days, THIS IS THE TIME THE ARMIES DESOLATE JERUSALEM.

But they sort of glance over the next verse and miss an important clue! It time stamps this event! Do you see how?

In other words THIS EVENT HAS NOT HAPPENED YET. This IS NOT a reference to the destruction of Jerusalem and Temple in 70 A.D. (although that was a type of what will happen).



Though it may well be destroyed during the tribulation, this prophecy is not talking about the destruction of Jerusalem at the 1290 days mark. Why? because the prophecy is concerning the sanctuary, the temple, which is the church. Not Jerusalem. God calls it like it is, and here is what God says about the current state of Jerusalem....

Revelation 11:8 And their dead bodies shall lie in the street of the great city, which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, where also our Lord was crucified.

Do you think a city God calls spiritually "Sodom and Egypt" he would also call his sanctuary? God can not dwell in sin, that is the entire reason he gave his Son as a sacrifice for our sins, so that he could dwell in us, his spiritual temple, the church.

The 1290 days is talking about the taking away of the effects of the abomination of desoaltion. If you notice that the word translated as "set-up" in this verse has many meanings, many of them referring to the exact opposite of what is implied by the translation:

5414 nathan naw-than' a primitive root; to give, used with greatest latitude of application (put, make, etc.):--add, apply, appoint, ascribe, assign, X avenge, X be ((healed)), bestow, bring (forth, hither), cast, cause, charge, come, commit, consider, count, + cry, deliver (up), direct, distribute, do, X doubtless, X without fail, fasten, frame, X get, give (forth, over, up), grant, hang (up), X have, X indeed, lay (unto charge, up), (give) leave, lend, let (out), + lie, lift up, make, + O that, occupy, offer, ordain, pay, perform, place, pour, print, X pull , put (forth), recompense, render, requite, restore, send (out), set (forth), shew, shoot forth (up), + sing, + slander, strike, (sub-)mit, suffer, X surely, X take, thrust, trade, turn, utter, + weep, + willingly, + withdraw, + would (to) God, yield.



posted on Nov, 6 2008 @ 03:46 AM
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The following is my opinion as a member participating in this discussion.

In my experiance, prophecy is recognised as such in the aftermath. Prophecy is usually worded too vaguely to be of any great use prior to the event.

I've wondered, not very often mind you, but once in a while; why these prophets/soothsayers can't be a bit more precise in their choice of language...I mean, how hard would it be to say "Look out on such and such a spring day, something bad is going to happen." Worded correctly and you'll always be right...

This is very interesting, though, keep right on, keepin' on.




As an ATS Staff Member, I will not moderate in threads such as this where I have participated as a member.



posted on Nov, 6 2008 @ 04:03 AM
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Originally posted by SirPaulMuaddib
What is the Abomination of Desolation?


It is when a ruler, king or otherwise, declairs they are to be worshiped as the One True God.

Though this can be phrased differently.

[edit on 6-11-2008 by Incarnated]



posted on Nov, 6 2008 @ 04:24 AM
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New 'Sanhedrin' plans rebuilding of Temple

www.worldnetdaily.com...

www.templemount.org...

The Jews believe that the rebuilding of the temple will cause the return of their Messiah.

I believe however another tumultuous event must take place before this can occur because from what I can ascertain, the actual place of the original temple is on the Muslim side.

More here www.godtube.com...





[edit on 6-11-2008 by Nonchalant]



posted on Nov, 8 2008 @ 04:50 PM
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Here are the NT passages that discuss the Abomination of Desolation.

Matt 24:15-21 (KJV)

15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand
16 Then let them which be in Judaea flee into the mountains: 17 Let him which is on the housetop not come down to take any thing out of his house: 18 Neither let him which is in the field return back to take his clothes. 19 And woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck in those days! 20 But pray ye that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the Sabbath day: 21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.






Mark 13:14-20 (KJV)
14 But when ye shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing where it ought not, (let him that readeth understand,) then let them that be in Judaea flee to the mountains: 15 And let him that is on the housetop not go down into the house, neither enter therein, to take any thing out of his house: 16 And let him that is in the field not turn back again for to take up his garment. 17 But woe to them that are with child, and to them that give suck in those days! 18 And pray ye that your flight be not in the winter. 19 For in those days shall be affliction, such as was not from the beginning of the creation which God created unto this time, neither shall be. 20 And except that the Lord had shortened those days, no flesh should be saved: but for the elect's sake, whom he hath chosen, he hath shortened the days.




Luke 21:20-25 (KJV)

20 And when ye shall see Jerusalem compassed with armies, then know that the desolation thereof is nigh. 21 Then let them which are in Judaea flee to the mountains; and let them which are in the midst of it depart out; and let not them that are in the countries enter thereinto. 22 For these be the days of vengeance, that all things which are written may be fulfilled. 23 But woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck, in those days! For there shall be great distress in the land, and wrath upon this people. 24 And they shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led away captive into all nations: and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled. 25 And there shall be signs in the sun, and in the moon, and in the stars; and upon the earth distress of nations, with perplexity; the sea and the waves roaring;



Notice the common factors.

1) (Matt 24:15, Mark 13:14)There is an Abomination of Desolation

Christ is specifically referencing the passages in Daniel previously mentioned.

2) Standing In Holy Place (consecrated place)

3) Those in Judaea are to flee to Mountains

4) Great Tribulation Begins soon after (the 1260 Day Countdown to End of Age + Return of Christ)





Now notice : Christ INTERPRETS DANIEL'S MEANING IN LUKE.

Christ interprets all these key prophecies. We don't need to fall prey to every wind of doctrine flying about.

Notice His interpretation in Luke 21: 20, which agrees completely with the previous passages mentioned in Daniel.



In verse Luke 21:20

20 And when ye shall SEE (with the eyes, it's something you will see, it is a physical event) Jerusalem compassed with armies, THEN KNOW THAT THE DESOLATION THEREOF IS NIGH.



Armies come in to DESOLATE JERUSALEM / HALT SACRICE / DESECRATE ALTER











We have



A) Armies come in and surround Jerusalem



Dan 11:31 (BBE) And armies sent by him will take up their position...

Luke 21:20 (KJV) And when ye shall see Jerusalem compassed with armies, then know that the desolation thereof is nigh.










B) Sacrifices halted (as mentioned in Daniel)



Dan 11:31 ... And shall take away the daily sacrifice...

Dan 12:11 ...And from the time that the daily sacrifice shall be taken away....






C) There is an Abomination placed and stood in the Holy Place Desecrating the Alter of Sacrifice


Dan 11:31 (BBE) ... And put in its place an unclean thing causing fear.

Dan 11:30-31 (ASV) ...and they shall set up the abomination that maketh desolate.

Dan 11:31 (KJV) ... And they shall place the abomination that maketh desolate

Matt 24:15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place..

Mark 13:14-20 (KJV) But when ye shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing where it ought not....

Luke 21:20-25 (KJV) And when ye shall see Jerusalem compassed with armies, then know that the desolation thereof is nigh






D) This Event occurs at the 1290 Day mark, when it occurs those in Judaea are commanded to flee to mountains

Dan 12:11 And from the time that the daily sacrifice shall be taken away, and the abomination that maketh desolate set up, there shall be a thousand two hundred and ninety days.

Matt 24:14 But when ye shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing where it ought not, (let him that readeth understand,) then let them that be in Judaea flee to the mountains:

Luke 21:20 (KJV) And when ye shall see Jerusalem compassed with armies, then know that the desolation thereof is nigh. 21 Then let them which are in Judaea flee to the mountains




To rephrase / summarize this point...

1) 1290th Day / Countdown arrives

2) this is when Armies surround Jerusalem

3) Sacrifices Halted

4) Idol set stood/placed in sanctuary

5) AT THIS SIGN ON THIS DAY : Christian in Judaea ARE TO FLEE.





E) Great Tribulation Begins

30 DAYS LATER after the 1290 mark, the Great Tribulation BEGINS.


Matt 24:21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.

Mark 13: 19 For in those days shall be affliction, such as was not from the beginning of the creation which God created unto this time, neither shall be

Luke 21:22 For these be the days of vengeance, that all things which are written may be fulfilled.



(at 1290 Day mark, Christians are allotted 30 Days to give them time to arrive at their location, after which, at the 1260 day mark the Great Tribulation begins as mentioned in Revelation)



posted on Nov, 8 2008 @ 05:17 PM
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To Summarize...

The Abomination of Desolation : IS AN IDOL PLACED IN A HOLY PLACE / SANCTUARY. It is also a reference to the Desolation of Jerusalem by armies. (they would not be able to desecrate the alter otherwise)

The timing : at the 1290 Days mark.

Note...NO TEMPLE IS MENTIONED IN ANY OF THESE VERSES.

What IS MENTIONED is a Sanctuary...or Holy Place, this is simply a place that is consecrated for Holy Use...from the context we know it's not a Tabernacle or Temple, but AN ALTER, because it is PLACED AND STOOD THERE.

All New Yorkers are Americans but not all Americans are New Yorkers...

All Temples are Sanctuaries, but not all Sanctuaries are Temples.

IT IS POSSIBLE that there will be a Temple, but it is not required by the verses. The verses discuss a Holy Place, again, this is simply an area or room that has been sanctified for Holy Use such as with an alter.

It goes without much saying that for Sacrifices to be halted, they MUST BE RE-INSTITUTED. This has not happened yet.



[edit on 8-11-2008 by SirPaulMuaddib]

[edit on 8-11-2008 by SirPaulMuaddib]



posted on Nov, 8 2008 @ 05:21 PM
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I will try and touch on and respond to some of the points raised....

As well as Ronald Weinland's appallingly twisted interpretation. Which makes no sense even in its own framework.



posted on Nov, 8 2008 @ 05:25 PM
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I personally believe that the 70 AD events was a foreshadow of things to come in the very end ...

I also believe those passages about the temple being in us is true ..(spiritual temple belongs to the Lord) but satan is physical and everything he does will be a literal event ...and the Jews will build another Temple ...and the abomination of desolation will happen again .............in the LITERAL ...

Also what has been before will be again ..nothing new under the sun ..
King Neb was a foreshadow of the end ..
70 AD events also a foreshadow ..
There were many other events in the OT that were a foreshadow of the things to come ..which was why it was written and we are supposed to read for an EXAMPLE ...what has been before will be again .....



If as some believe that the abomination of desolation happened already in 70 AD ..then that means we have already went through the tribulation ..then that would mean satan was chained up for a thousand years after that (Cant see it ..nope he is alive and well and still roaming around ) ..and we would be just now getting out of the thousand year reign of Christ (Which I fail to have seen yet ) .....Have you ruled and reigned with Christ yet ?
And do you really believe we are right now comeing to Armgeddon (The very last final battle ) ? What about the mark ? Wasnt it supposed to happen midway of 70 AD ? ....I didnt see anyone getting a mark or serving the AC in 70 AD >.

Think about it ...none of that has happened yet ...
70 AD was a foreshadow ...



posted on Nov, 8 2008 @ 05:36 PM
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There were many other events in the OT that were a foreshadow of the things to come ..which was why it was written and we are supposed to read for an EXAMPLE ...what has been before will be again ..


Yes...exactly.

These were foreshadows of what will happen at the end...
Will touch on and discuss that...





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