The "up-to-the-minute Market Data" thread

we’ve also seen a large bounce-back rally in the euro and other currencies. News out of Europe about more forceful actions to alleviate the debt issues, including larger write-downs on Greek debt and moves to push banks to strengthen their capital, caused the dollar to retreat and gold to rally.

You would think that if Europe stabilizes its banking system, gold would pull back as banking meltdown fears retreat. However, it is the way they are pursuing a bailout that will ultimately help gold.

It’s helpful to look back to 2008, when the U.S. bailed out its banking system. Again, you would think that gold would have fallen back as the banks stabilized. However, since then, gold has rallied from under $700 an ounce to over $1,600.

Part of the reason is the bailouts are being funded with taxpayer and newly created (printed) money. Therefore, you are stabilizing the banking system by either borrowing or printing. This dilutes the value of your currency, and because gold is protection against such dilution, it soared on this news.

Now, turning to the European bailouts, knowing they just mean more printed money and more inflation, we can expect higher gold prices over the longer term.

Amidst Downgrades of Banks en masse the last few Days,here are a things that really matter:

Yesterday:

ECB Tells Belgium Not To Backstop Dexia Interbank Deposits, Says Bailout Plan May Be Against The Euro Charter

If anyone is surprised that things in Europe will get massively surreal before this is all over, we suggest finding another thread. In the meantime, for the latest example of the utter chaos and "make it up as we go along" we go to the ECB which has just, in very polite terms, warned Belgium that its bailout-cum-nationalization plan may not be quite feasible. From Bloomberg: "The European Central Bank advised Belgium not to backstop Dexia SA’s interbank deposits and to avoid providing guarantees on debt maturing within three months because it risks interfering with the central bank’s monetary policy." Reading between the lines here, it means that the ECB is effectively telling national governments to not try and become their own central banks under the ECB's umbrella, which would likely result in not only in various sovereign downgrades (that is guaranteed) but in loss of conviction in the European Central Bank, something which the insolvent European continent and the insolvent hedge fund in its core, aka Jean-Claude Trichet Capital et Cie. which holds hundreds of billions of Greek bonds at par, can certainly not avoid. It gets better: "The ECB also said the planned debt guarantees for Dexia may last as long as 20 years, which is inconsistent with European Union guidelines for national support measures to be temporary in nature, according to a statement published on the Frankfurt- based central bank’s website and dated Oct. 13. Belgium sought the ECB’s opinion on draft legislation that would grant state guarantees on Dexia loans." Oops: the ECB may have just scuttled the currently envisioned Dexia bailout plan. Oh well, just like with the Greek 50% bond haircut, so here to it is now back to the drawing board.

Good Bye Dexia...


Its gets better...:

US "Pours Cold Water" On IMF Expansion Plans, Leaves European Bailout To Europeans

It is probably not too surprising that the negative news of the day, namely that the US has decided against expanding the IMF and thus leaving the European bailout to the Europeans (at least for now), was released quietly long after happy hour started on Friday. Yet that is precisely what happened after Reuters dropped a Friday night bomb that with hours before a communique is issued by the G20 in Paris, contrary to previous rumors and representation "U.S. Treasury Secretary Timothy Geithner and his Canadian and Australian counterparts poured cold water on the idea" of injecting $350 billion into the International Monetary Fund. As a reminder, the IMF expansion myth was one of the latest rumors floated today by none other than the tag team of Geithner and Liesman. It lasted less than24 hours but it served its purpose. The full on media onslaught of never ending lies has never been more acute, more relentless, and more blatant: with every central bank and trade surplussed nation all in, the very nature of the global ponzi is at risk.

The second priority is to get the world's solvent countries' future so deeply intertwined with that of the bankrupt ones, that letting Greece, and hence France, would result in a Global Assured Destruction.

DOOOOOOMMMMMM!!111

Still think China is coming to the Rescue? Think again...

The same China which on Monday had to bail out its banking sector, is somehow expected to provide billions to plus briefly an infinitely large European liquidity hole. But those billions are nowhere near as much as what the US taxpayer will have to shovel into the European money pit once Geithner's "cold water" announcement ends up steaming for a few days in a bidless stock market.

Muahahaha

And btw. the whole Shadow Banking System in China seems to be currently collapsing. The illegal one which lends Money to Small- and Middle-sized Companys,that is...

China taumelt dem großen Finanz-Crash entgegen (only a German Link,sorry)

And now the...can´t really find words for that Cluster#

The Biggest Market Headfake Ever: Is A Wholesale French Bank Liquidity Run The Sole Reason For The Euro, And S&P, Surge?

Over the past two weeks, there is one simple thing that has been bugging skeptical macro observers: namely the paradox of i) just how ugly the European funding and liquidity situations have gotten, on the one hand, confirmed by the blow out in French bond yields (the French-Bund 10 year spread just hit an all time record yesterday) as well as continuing deterioration in credit spreads across core European nations, yet, on the other, ii) the euro, especially in that critical pair the EURUSD, has seen one of its most explosive rises in recent history, which as Zero Hedge pointed out yesterday, has totally decorrelated with the French-Bund spread, to which it had been firmly 'pegged' previously.

huh?

In other words, an internal bank run has somehow been interpreted to be stock positive... And there is your explanation for not only the paradoxical surge in the EURUSD and S&P, but why the correlation between the EURUSD and the Bund-France spread has completely broken down. Expect all of this to promptly, and very violently, correct once the market understand what an idiot it has been in the past two weeks.

Ah...Uhm

Naturally, the Eurocrats will be delighted to associate the run up in risk assets and the European currency as a confirmation that the market is interpreting further lies, innuendo, and confusion as a risk on indicator, and is encouraging their behavior, when nothing is further from the truth. However, the biggest beneficiary of the recent move is none other than the insolvent French banking system, whose very own liquidity run has caused asset values to soar, on an epic misinterpretation of underlying market signals, and thus sell even more into market strength, when in fact the market should be selling alongside France...

As for unwind catalysts for this most insidious market move, we are confident that the inability of the G20 to come up with any resolution over the weekend in Paris, nor the Eurozone Summit in one week to actually present any relevant details vis-a-vis the continent's bailout, or the EFSF's expansion into some multi-trillion Bailoutstein monster, will not be met too happily by a market which has just realized it has been thoroughly fooled by the cash-crunched French banking system.

Probably more Promises to solve it later...sometimes...at the next Meeting...for sure

reply to post by Surfrat


Its temporarily see, the Fed has been helping in bailing out the EU since 2008, so far 17 trillion dollars has gone to their banks, now add 3 trillion more, guess what if that didn't help in the last 3 years is not going to help at all, why? because the problem with the EU is linked to the derivative crap that started in the US and is still circulating around, about 600 trillions of derivative crap.

The only reason the EU keep bailing out is because the US doesn't want the derivative crap to come back home, and home it will comeback again.

reply to post by Shenon


So Gehiner assurance of the backing of the fed with the IMF was just hopes so the markets will not take a dive on Friday.

RBS investment arm cancels Christmas parties

Royal Bank of Scotland is cutting back on perks for its investment bankers.

The division's chief financial officer, Chris Kyle, has sent an internal memo telling staff the firm will not subsidise Christmas parties and other end-of-year entertainment.

In addition, it says no-one will be given new Blackberry phones, headsets or other telecoms equipment.

The RBS unit is also refusing to pay for any new magazine or newspaper subscriptions.

People working late have been told the bank will not pay for taxis to take them home until 10pm, an hour later than had previously been the case.

Staff are also reminded that all travel lasting less than four hours must be in economy class, without exception.

Oh, the pain. I only got as far as "newspaper subscriptions" and tears were streaming down my face.


Source

reply to post by pause4thought


Soooo, the irony . . . cut the employees only joys of work, but the dirty and corrupted CEOs still get to ejoy their outrageous bonuses and pays, just for sitting in their comfortable and fancy offices doing the thinking that this days is just about when they are to get another bailout

First we have this,no suprise really.

Deutsche Bank Warns France May Be Put On Downgrade Review Before Year End


And a few Hours later:

Moody's Announces That France's Debt Metrics Have Deteriorated And Are Now The Weakest Of All Aaa-Rated Peers

This is not what Europe needed, 6 days ahead of the G20 ultimatum's expiration for Europe to somehow fix itself, and hours after Deutsche Bank said the rating agencies may go ahead and put France on downgrade review. Just out "Moody's notes that the government's financial strength has weakened, as it has for other euro area sovereigns, because the global financial and economic crisis has led to a deterioration in French government debt metrics -- which are now among the weakest of France's Aaa peers." As for the timing... "Over the next three months, Moody's will monitor and assess the stable outlook in terms of the government's progress in implementing these measures, while taking into account any potential adverse economic or financial market developments."

Still,the Question remains: Will France get downgraded before or after the G20
Meeting?

From ealier today:

So Much For Dreams, Hopes And The European Way: Schaeuble, Merkel Warn EU Summit To Be A Dud

Nobody could have foreseen this, nobody, certainly not the vacuum tubes who took the S&P for a ride for nearly 150 points. As Reuters reports, "the euro fell to a session low versus the dollar on Monday after comments from German Finance Minister Wolfgang Schaeuble saying the EU summit would not present a definitive solution to the euro zone debt crisis prompted investors to sell the single currency." No, that's not true, it's impossible. You mean all those hopes... Dashed? "A Bundesbank report saying the German economic outlook had deteriorated further also curbed some of the market optimism that had helped push the euro to a one-month high earlier in the session. The euro hit a session low of $1.3824 before recovering slightly to last trade down 0.3 percent on the day at $1.3840." And since the EURUSD and stocks trade as one... You know the rest.

Something to consider...If France is downgraded,Germany pays it all...is this "Warning" by Moodys (and soon other Rating Agencys) used to "convince" Germany to give in to the Demands of France/US/IMF/EZB/etc. pp.?

reply to post by Shenon


Yeah they are using scare tactics to push more bailouts.

The fat rats knows that the markets will not survive without their weekly infusion of hopes and fears.

U.S. stocks drop 2%; Dow, Nasdaq lower for year

[e]SAN FRANCISCO (MarketWatch) -- U.S. stocks dropped about 2% Monday, ending near their lows of the session, after German officials tried to lower expectations that an upcoming meeting of euro-zone officials would yield a speedy fix to Europe's debt problems

www.marketwatch.com...

Debt for fiscal year starting October 1 2011 till October 14 2011 : 83.7 billion or 5.9789 billion/day ($19.28/day/citizen) or ($2.18 trillion deficit)
Debt for calendar year 2011 till October 14 : 876.11 billion or 3.0527 billion/day ($9.84/day/citizen) ($1.11 trillion deficit)
Current debt as of October 14 : 14.874 trillion
Current debt ceiling : 14.694 trillion (first phase) 15.194 trillion (second phase) 16.694 trillion (final phase)

At the current average rate of 4.5158 billion in new debt/day (or about $14.57 in new debt per day for every citizen in America...and that is just federal) it will take about 71 days before reaching the second phase of the debt ceiling hike, so around December 24, 2011... but it will be later than that. Probably no later than February 1, 2012.

US GDP : 15.03 trillion
US debt : 14.874 trillion

Total debt to GDP ratio : 98.96%


Edit : Hong Kong stock market closes down 4.23%!

What kind of business deal is this: 1 Israeli for 1.000 Palestinians?

It's a cover up for something as crooked as it looks.

250,000 Israelis protest in Tel Aviv

August 8th, 2011

National upheaval: More than 300,000 protestors hit streets

September 9th, 2011

Israeli Spring

October 6th, 2011

Occupy Wall Street protesters insist their movement echoes this year’s Arab revolutions. A better analogue is the Tel Aviv tent-city protests.

www.tabletmag.com...

As the Occupy Wall Street protest enters its third week, with demonstrations popping up in more than 10 cities, the protesters are aggressively pushing a comparison to the Arab Spring. Some say the movement has channeled the zeal (or perhaps the naivete, others would argue) of the 1960s antiwar demonstrations. But it’s not Tahrir Square or Chicago in 1968 that Occupy Wall Street most resembles. It’s the protests for economic justice that swept Israel this summer.

Wishful thinking

I met a guy named Max, sipping McDonald’s corporate coffee. “I work for the U.N. now, doing geospatial analysis,” Max said. He was more than a little drunk, skeptical of the movement, and may or may not have been telling the truth. “I was watching the Russians today on the Internet. And they are following the protests closely.” Max said he lived nearby and had just dropped by to check out the scene. “The protesters have … no mission,” he told me. “It’s like they are fighting a ghost.”

The same could be said of the Tel Aviv protests, which nevertheless galvanized an apathetic Israeli generation into political engagement.

This is the "forte" of today's corporate journalism...




I thought I could just add this:

Clinton arrives in Libya bearing aid and encouragement

www.washingtonpost.com...

TRIPOLI, Libya -- Secretary of State Hillary Rodham Clinton traveled to the Libyan capital on Tuesday, bringing encouragement and millions of dollars in new U.S. aid to a transitional government struggling to consolidate its control over a country ravaged by dictatorship and civil war.

"Encouragement and MILLIONS of dollars"



Here is a pretty well explanation:

www.cnn.com...

I am beginning to suspect this soldier never really was imprisoned by Hamas...

reply to post by DangerDeath


How easily to disburse Millions of dollars on briberies I mean (aid) when we are having an economic warfare against the tax payer in the nation, incredible, how money is available for everything else but the tax payer in the nation.

Then you wonder. . . .

Treasury Delays Report on Currency

This is hilarious, so the treasury doesn't want to report on global currencies to avoid exposing China currency manipulation for the 6th time.

The decision will allow the Treasury Department to avoid failing to label China as a currency manipulator for a sixth time under President Barack Obama.

"Unfortunately, you can’t delay the truth. And the truth is this, China manipulates its currency, which costs America good-paying jobs,” said Alliance for American Manufacturing Director Scott Paul in a statement.

"I don’t know what’s worse, China’s continued currency manipulation, or the Administration’s apparent unwillingness to confront it.”

As a presidential candidate, Obama regularly slammed the Bush administration for failing to label China as a currency manipulator. However, his administration has followed in the footsteps of his predecessor by ignoring China's extremely undervalued currency.

www.economyincrisis.org...

So Obama is as much butt kisser to china that bush was.

Official UK inflation hits 5.2% in September

Wondering how significant this is? -

The 5.2% rate is the highest CPI measure since September 2008, and it has never been higher since the CPI measure was introduced in 1997.

The Retail Prices Index (RPI) - which includes mortgage interest payments - rose to 5.6% from 5.2%.

The latest RPI measure is the highest annual rate since June 1991...

...Bills for gas and electricity have risen 9.9% in the past month, and are up 18.3% on the year.

Transport has risen 12.8% on the year, and food was 6% higher than 12 months ago...

Source

Nothing to worry about, though:

...many economists agree with the Bank of England that inflation may soon start to fall... "The September figure should represent a peak in the rate of inflation," said Chris Williamson, chief economist at financial information company Markit...

Breaking News: Moody's downgrades Spain's government bond ratings, negative outlook

this is Reuters red background coloured headline right now

www.reuters.com




more

Breaking News: Moody's downgrades Spain on growth slowdown

www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread765824/pg1

Apple is finally getting molested. That whole stock was/is a big bubble.

Beginning of the end?

-6-7% in after hours.

And they are crazy about their expectations for Q1 2012... they are projecting way bigger revenues than Q4 2011...

Looking ahead to the first fiscal quarter of 2012, which will span 14 weeks rather than 13, we expect revenue of about $37 billion and we expect diluted earnings per share of about $9.30

Revenues in Q4 2011 : 28.27 billion.
Revenues projected by analysts : 36.77 billion.
Revenues projected by Apple : 37 billion.

People are smoking good stuff.

reply to post by Vitchilo


Come on, Vitchilo is called "speculation" and it works marvelously with oil prices among other things

In this days and time, anything seems to go when it comes to the markets.

I just realized something...which is absolutely disgusting This whole Farce/Scheme is just so that Banks can steal more Money than ever before...out of the EFSF (and later the ESM).

Think about it. France wants its Banks (who are heavily exposed to Greek Bonds) to be able to take Money out of the EFSF,so it doesn´t lose its AAA Rating if it has to recapitalize its Banks on its own,which would leave Germany as the only Payer.

And Germany can´t,because its financially and political impossible. It is then forced to leave the Euro or risk losing its own AAA Rating.


And if the French Banks are allowed to take Money out of the EFSF,other Banks will follow,to "recapitalize" themselves of course

First they steal Money from their own Nations (2008 -2010),then they steal the Money of an entire Union via EFSF/ESM (2011)...

Should have waited one more day to post the debt numbers... hell the debt jumped 62 BILLION in 3 days!

Debt for fiscal year starting October 1 2011 till October 17 2011 : 146.25 billion or 8.6030 billion/day ($27.75/day/citizen) or ($3.14 trillion deficit)
Debt for calendar year 2011 till October 17 : 938.66 billion or 3.2367 billion/day ($10.44/day/citizen) ($1.18 trillion deficit)
Current debt as of October 17 : 14.936 trillion
Current debt ceiling : 14.694 trillion (first phase) 15.194 trillion (second phase) 16.694 trillion (final phase)

At the current average rate of 5.9199 billion in new debt/day (or about $14.57 in new debt per day for every citizen in America...and that is just federal) it will take about 43.58 days before reaching the second phase of the debt ceiling hike, so around November 29, 2011... but it will be later than that. Probably no later than mid-January, 2012.

US GDP : 15.03 trillion
US debt : 14.936 trillion

Total debt to GDP ratio : 99.37%

reply to post by Vitchilo


I wonder how much of those one hundred and something billions went to bailout the EU banks. Because remember US funded part of the bailout, the rest is on unaccounted funds by the Fed after the IMF quota.