US agrees to Wall Street bail-out!

reply to post by baseball101


I could see Ron Paul doing it; and there are others that take a hard stance on this as well....If they are in a position to do it, I wonder if they are just waiting for the last minute to do this.

This is such a big deal and there is such strong blatantly obvious public opinion on it, it seems hard to believe that someone wouldn't do this.

It would at least give time for more public opinion to come through, I know of several groups that are planning protests..fedupsusa.org is supposed to be having some all over the place (one in NYC today) and big one at DC this weekend.

I admit I don't know enough about how that works tho..time to head to wiki and do some more homework I guess

reply to post by toepick


haha ya i agree ron paul would definitely would stand up against this i.e.

"The issue boils down to this: do we care about freedom? Do we care about responsibility and accountability? Do we care that our government and media have been bought and paid for? Do we care that average Americans are about to be looted in order to subsidize the fattest of cats on Wall Street and in government? Do we care? When the chips are down, will we stand up and fight, even if it means standing up against every stripe of fashionable opinion in politics and the media? Times like these have a way of telling us what kind of a people we are, and what kind of country we shall be."

Source

But.... 1 congressman ... i mean i'm sure there are others but not enough if they've already came to an agreement .... i agree it would be nice if they delayed it a bit and didn't rush things and actually just took a step back and looked at what they were doing and how it will affect the u.s. and the world ... we are probably getting laughed at right now by other countries because we are in such a quandary

I called my senators office here in NJ today and let them know how I felt about this bill. I don't understand how over 80% of the population opposes the bill and yet they still are going through with it. Came across this link and thought it was interesting. You can read letters sent to congress and it seems that 80% against it is an understatement.

www.congress.org...

reply to post by toepick


That fedupusa.org site is pretty good, I noticed this gem on the front page:

Several of us here at Fedup are very well versed in finances and the economic crisis that is going on. We have noticed an alarming trend. The Federal reserve is not renewing loans it has made to banks.

They have repeatedly taken the stance that this is a crisis of liquidity and have injected hundreds of billions into the financial system and they are asking for another $700 billion to do the same.

However in the last several days they have removed over $110 billion dollars; or approximately 1/3rd of all the money they have lent out short term.

Source

Source 2

Looks to me like evidence that this 'crisis' is at the very least being engineered in some way to get this bill through.

This is all I can find on it right now, this is from the 23rd

Fate of Bailout May Rest With Republicn Sen. Shelby

Many members of the U.S. Senate blasted the Bush administration's Wall Street bailout plan Tuesday, but no senator has come forward so far with an explicit pledge to kill the $700 billion proposal. The rules of the Senate, unlike the House, give individual lawmakers substantial power to delay or halt legislation, but three Senate aides said there were no clear signs yet of that power being exercised. As the Senate Banking Committee held a hearing on the plan put forward by the Treasury Department, aides said much would depend on Alabama Sen. Richard Shelby, the committee's top Republican, who was sharply critical at the hearing. The outlook for Treasury's plan would dim greatly if Shelby were to move to block the bill that is expected to emerge soon from congressional debate over the plan, the aides said. Other senators, including Republicans Jim Bunning of Kentucky and Jim DeMint of South Carolina, have expressed strong concerns. But the aides said these lawmakers also have stopped short of warning they would work to block the bill.

So that doesn't look so good either

edit to add: I have been following fedupusa.com since this started, they are AWESOME, highly recommend watching the videos..I can't join their forums however apparently verizon.net email is considered a spam address lol oh well

[edit on 9/25/2008 by toepick]

Can someone answer a question for me?
forgive me, I am severely economically dumb.

But, the banks have to be bailed out, as a result of the mortgage crises, correct?

Now, do these banks make money any other way besides mortgages?
And, I heard a statistic that only 2% (doesn't sound like much but apparently it is) of homes are forclosed and behind on payments.

While this may be a lot, this 2%, what about the rest of the mortgages that are still being paid.

So, if bad loans only make up 2%, how is it that these banks got themselves in such serious trouble?

Thanks for the info!

What I do not like is the fact that they are taking our tax dollars, many of which hold mortgages, then using that to buy out private mortgages. Now, after that, we still owe for the mortgage. Is that double dipping? I am not trying to get my mortgage paid off, but I am trying to piece things together.

Another thought is that once the treasury buys out these debts, for a much reduced price I might add, they will sell them later when the market stabilizes making a substantial profit on our dime. Do you think we will get a kickback for this? Not a chance.

As always, I am of the same opinion as Ron Paul. To have a free market, there cannot be interference from the government. This will only prolong our problems. We need to take our licks and move on. thats just my opinion.

I WILL NEVER *TRUST* MY GOVERNMENT AGAIN.(yes I am angry)

The Constitution is now null and void. I know some form of this bill had to be passed but not this version. TPTB waited until it was so bad "It has to be passed now" so that there wasn't time to try to figure out the good and bad points of this.

AS for the speech by GW, what a crock. He removed all responsibility from Wall St. They over leveraged their positions. Since when is it sound business to say well we can only pay for 10 % of what we hold, but it's all gonna be OK. Guess they knew the gov't would bail them out.

I am also upset about the gov't making money off of this. If they do make money off of it and don't use that money to pay off the national debt, I may move to another country.

I have never been this disgusted with *my* government.

I will spare all of you my verbose monologue on the matter. I just wanted to say that I have informally posed questions to everyone I could, even strangers; NOT ONE PERSON I SPOKE TO AGREES WITH THIS ACTION!

In fact, every single person I spoke to that had communicated with their representative (about 50%) on the matter told them NOT to do this. Granted we are only talking about 50 or 60 people, but, excuse me..., at what point does the American population have any input on this.

Evidently (as I have stated elsewhere on the board);

The gathering of the political brain trust was NOT to make a choice, but to figure out how to pass it despite the people's unwillingness to support it.

Amazing. Any more doubters out there that they aren't actually OUR representatives? They represent the money. That's all.

It would be interesting to see the result if this choice was really given to the people and set up like an election style... hell, add it to the ticket on what we the people want them to do or not to do with our money. Than the people will feel like they really had a say in this crisis.

Seriously, if you all want to crash the system so bad, convince everyone you know to pull their money out of the banks, plain and simple.

reply to post by nixie_nox


Im not sure if this will answer the question you seek. However they proclaim this to be like an auction. They do not know the real worth of the said "stuff" they are going to be buying until it is bought.
So they are in essence throwing all this money into the federal reserve and the reserve is buying up all the unpaided houses! So the fed is going to own alot of homes! Buy low and sell high! They hope to make a profit from the big hole in the housing market.(or otherwise coined as dynamite
in the sytem.) They are going to buy up alot of "stuff". And then in turn own real value! Which equals the homes that where unpaided for. Money means nothing. Its the worthless paper they are throwing into the system to purchase real value. Which this "stuff" equals banks. They want to buy the banks for pennies on the dollar. Which in turn means the bank owns your homes.. Now the federal reserve owns the homes that the banks put out there.. And all the loans that where unpaided.

So they are taking debt, and buying up all the "stuff" people could not afford and in turn make that worthless debt into real world value!
You could pay 250,000$ american dollars for a home. Yet the paper the 200,000$ is printed on is really only debt. The real worth of the 200,000$ is the property is not the debt paper we call money today.
The real worth is the home and they know this.
They will buy everything at such a low cost that its like stealing!
Thats why there is a section in this bill that says, no one can challenge them on this.. No court system or law can step in and monitor what they are doing.. for good reason.. They know if it was monitored.. They would say hey, this is highway robbery!!! Its pretty much the base root of theft!

And that is only a very small fration that I understand about this!
There is so much more to this that I dont understand its staggering!!!

And to me this is just a ploy to cover up something much deeper and much more dangerous to you and I.. To the people all over the world.
This is not about saving anyone, or anything.
This is simply more theft, and more BS to make them more money!!!
And real worth.. They know the paper money we have is nothing but debt!
They dont want paper money.. They are going to print out worthless paper to get their hands on real value! Its wrong.. and its why they want to pass this as fast as possbile!! The less time people have to go over this, the better off they will be.. AS soon as its passed.. game over.. Well game over already..

So why would they want more debt? They dont, they want real value.
They want our homes. And if you couldnt pay off your home. They will now have control over those unpaided for homes. And they will keep that as their value.. They know paper money is only debt.
They are beyond broke.. So they need real value.
This is a ploy to gather resources. And bring us to our knees.

But agian this is what I understand.. And if Im wrong please feel free to correct me, or help me understand just what the hell is going on here..


I really liked this I read here on ATS.

I respectfully request that you send me and my family my bail-up package immediatly. You can start by sending us $7,000. We might request more if we find that you haven't sent us enough money the first time around.

By my reckoning $700 Billion divided by 100 million taxpayers comes to $7,000 each. You are not allowed to ask me how I will use the money. I might use it to buy guns, gold and ammunition or I might use it to pay off some of my creditors. Again it's my damn business.

Seeing as how money is so tight for some of these money lenders I might just hold a reverse auction and let them offer to reduce the balances due them in exchange for a complete payoff.

For example one credit card company might offer me .20 cents on the dollar for a payoff on the balance due and another might only offer me .40 cents on the dollar. Obviously I would offer to payoff the credit card that offered me the 20% payoff first. Let the other credit card company continue to make interest off of my debt but only on 40% of the debt.

BUt then again it would be my call on who I decide to payoff first.

Send every citizen $7,000 - Trickle up economics bail-out plan

[edit on 25-9-2008 by zysin5]

A little sarcasm will appear in my post ...

If I ever lose my job, I'm ready to do whatever it takes to wipe out our government and start fresh.

It doesn't have to be violence.

You see, the problem is that we are all stuck in a rat race. I can't risk losing my job to go to DC and protest in groups of hundreds of thousands. Nor can most other people. I have to keep going to work every day, keep paying my mortgage, keep paying my utility bills, then use what bit of cash I have left to feed my family.

The only option I have left is to try and vote, but we all know what that gets us, you get the puppet on the left, or the puppet on the right. Qeue pretty cool Simpsons episode with the aliens running for president.

We're screwed guys, it's over!

I'm back to trying to figure out ways to reduce the amount of money the gov't gets from me. any suggestions? has to be legal though.

really, I am so sick of this "We don't have a choice" bit..
we do..
my boss keeps telling me this, and well.....I watch what goes on, and I can point out policies in his shop that have helped create this!
the powers that be have used our own shortcommings and flaws against us.
everybody likes to feel better than the next person, right?? so well, we don't really care if that other person in the shop isn't making enough to live on. their contribution isn't deserving enough. well, if they aren't making enough, what is their alternative? credit cards, government programs?? all borrowed money???
it wouldn't have mattered much at all what their trade policies were if we consumers didn't have this insatiable thirst to have more...and more...and more...and better...and newer....and more!!
it is us, not them. all they have to do is open the door, and ya, we'll jump right in!

we do have a choice.
the masses will naturally move in a set direction if given a certain set of circumstances. thus, they can create the circumstances and just lead us around.....
but well, if the masses reverse what they would naturally do,

No deal.

Congress Republicans Unveil Alternative Rescue Plans

WASHINGTON -(Dow Jones)- U.S. congressional Republicans remain reluctant to throw their support behind a $700 billion asset-buyout plan, and instead presented alternative plans Thursday afternoon. One would allow banks to purchase insurance for mortgage-based assets, while another would boost the resources of the Federal Reserve and the Treasury Department to allow them to extend loans to banks. A House GOP working group organized by House Minority Leader John Boehner, R- Ohio, presented the plan, which would create a new entity that Rep. Eric Cantor, R-Va., compared to Ginnie Mae. "We charge them the premiums, they finance the insurance, and they unclog the system and Wall Street bails itself out," said Rep. Paul Ryan, R-Wis., the top Republican on the House Budget Committee and a member of the working group. Separately, Sen. Richard Shelby, R-Ala., presented a plan that would increase the total resources of the Fed and the Treasury Department to enable them to extend loans to banks, rather than grant new authority to purchase assets. Shelby is the ranking Republican on the Senate Banking Committee.

Hey, I have a question.

The latest news has it that WAMU is the next to fail and people are being advised to get their money out before it goes down.

I have a WAMU credit card. If it fails, does it mean I don't have to pay off my balance?

Woo-hoo!!

Ugh.....

People, all this is, is a consolidation of economic power so one small entity can get one step closer to ruling the world. This bailout bill has no bearing on what's going to happen. If it passes, depression is held off for a couple weeks. If it isn't, we start tanking almost immediately. Either way, you must kiss whatever notion of reality you have goodbye. It's over. It truly amazes me that so many bright and intelligent minds on ATS are still thinking inside the box. Get outside of it and stop harping on things that are irrelevant. You need to reserve your energy for what's truly important.

If you look at true history, the Rothschild elite have pulled the same scheme over and over and over. This goes back over two hundred years. The current players are puppets carrying out a regime that isn't close to being their own. They are too far down on the totem pole.

In another thread, someone posted this link. If you want you're eyes opened, read it in entirety. When you see how history truly happened, it will greatly aid your understanding of what's happening at this current moment.

iamthewitness.com...


Here are the two most important things to realize:

1. This is all staged. It is not real. You may feel like what's happening is real but if you detach yourself from your paradigm, you will see that these things are being said and done without anything actually happening.

2. When this is all said and done, they will lose...guaranteed. The light always shines through the dark. The planet is not going to continue on the course for this action to persist.

There is no doubt sh** will hit the fan.....but it will only be faked. Light and love can't be faked, it is real, and will be the very foundation for the overhaul the planet will receive in the next few years. Stay calm, stay rational, be good to others. They will most likely need it much more than you do.

Peace

reply to post by Universal Light


what do you mean this has no small bearing on what's going to happen? i think s___'s gonna hit the fan (if it already hasn't) even if this bill is passed or not ... $700 billion dollars isn't a small amount of money ... one way or another this will affect everyone not only in the U.S. but world wide.

reply to post by baseball101


This has no bearing on what's going to happen because what's going to happen has been scripted so far in advance that one way or the other, what they chose to have happen will in fact happen. We are merely along for the ride.

The Bail-Out/Rescue deal seems to be coming apart at the seams
all of a sudden. We, the majority of the taxpayers are being
heard by our elected leaders. Excllent!!

BREAKING: ABC NEWS LINK:
abcnews.go.com...

-cwm