The Second American Revolution: Turning Point

reply to post by maudeeb


Thanks everyone, and I'm not quite sure what your refering too about conspiracies on deleted posts... That might be a different thread..

What I am coming to terms on is quite simple,

The way we are being governed, the future of our security, and our childrens is at stake

"We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defense, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America."

Or...

We the Politicians of the United States, in order to form a less perfect government, establish a police state, insure domestic chaos, provide for the common elite, promote the corporate welfare, and secure the Blessings of Tyranny to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution not for common men in the United States of America.

The second is the modern day definition in my minds. Capitalism is a good thing, but only so far. Our leaders and governors have failed, and tried to prove themselves over and over again yet they fail. In my mind they need to give it up and give the government back to the common men. Not by mob rule, but sovereignty ruling ourselves.

Or simply calling our own fouls too.

That is Why I called the Second American Revolution. So all can hear and see why we need reform. For our children sake and for the sake of our future. Do this not for you, but for the future.

“Among the natural rights of the colonists are these: First a right to life, secondly to liberty, and thirdly to property; together with the right to defend them in the best manner they can”-Samuel Adams, Member of the Son's of Liberty

Originally posted by flyingwoody
I fully agree that we need a revolution. I am tire of sitting around waiting. We need to take action. Even if it's a small group and we lose out, at least our actions will be noted and hopefully it will inspire more people to rise up and awaken. America was once a dreamland full of hope and wonder. Now it has become a jail.

We must rise up. I am in Florida and am willing to do anything needed that I am able to. I think ATS is a great place to get it started. We should start it right here.

You're an ignorant little poke, aren't you? First of all, the revolution has already been fought. The U.S. has gained it's independence from oppression a long time ago and established itself as a soverign nation.

We have a system in place that works fine for making all the changes you want - it's called Democracy. Instead of complaining that it doesn't work like a snivveling little brat why don't you try doing something productive like actually getting out on the campaign train, or choosing a candidate and getting involved in campaigning for their cause?

Yes, the nation has plenty of problems that need fixing and it all starts with whom we elect to do the job to represent us. If you would pay attention in school instead of tuning into Comedy Central for your political knowledge you might actually learn some of this and know what the hell you're talking about, instead of making ignorant statements like "America is a jail".

You've got ZERO clue what a nation that imitates a jail is like, dude and you obviously have no respect for the freedoms that you do have in this country. If you think you are oppressed in any way, shape or form, I urge you to visit one of the milder countries like Cuba. Spend a summer there and then come back to the U.S. and try to tell me again that America is like a jail. You won't be able to do it.

Originally posted by jtma508
There is alot of adolescent testosterone-induced hyperbole flying around. It's good to see people fired-up but that, in and of itself, will solve nothing. My $.02 related to earlier posts:

Heroes:

No. We don't need them or want them. THEY offer up heroes so we will all fall in line behind said hero so THEY can lead us where they want us to go. No heoroes this time kids. We have to do this one on our own.


The Vote:

I know, I know... not as sexy as burning the Govenor's house but in the near term we do have a unique opportunity to make a statement that WILL be heard above the noise and political manipulation. If we can ALL get sufficiently together we can vote against EVERY incumbent. Every single one. Completely disrupt the existing alliances and special interest relationships that permeate the government. And I mean at EVRY electoral level --- local, state, federal. IF we could pull this off it would be unprecedented and unmistakeable by everyone at every level. Including the MSM. We will make a statement that we are DONE.

This isn't the complete solution. But it is a start. We need to put ALL politicians and their support networks on-notice. Make them realize that we ARE aware of what is going on and who is repsonsible and that we ARE capable and willing to organize.

Please help. Anyone could do this and it is free from any left/right, Rep/Dem aspects. This is it people. This is the real deal. Don't kid yourselves, we are in very, very serious trouble here.

I'm sorry, but "adolescent testosterone-induced hyperbole"? The one made me laugh.

Heroes-"display courage and the will for self-sacrifice – that is, heroism – for some greater good, originally of martial courage or excellence but extended to more general moral excellence."

Heroes are in a sense martyrs. Going back to my Revolution, Pre-1776 Discussion.

The reason why the revolution happened was because of some key, vital figures such as Samuel Adams and Ebeneezer McIntosh. Also Patrick Henry.

Did they ever become politicians, were they ever in the Continental Congress? No, they weren't they, they put their own life on the line for arrest and hanging to defy authorities.

You think of what happened Pre-Declaration of Independence. By today's stands it would appall many people; riots, mobs, boycotts (I mean, who could convince the entire nation not to eat McDonalds for a few years?).

I can bet that many middle aged people are shocked are ideas of revolution. But look back to history.

I think that history needs to repeat itself this time.

I lead contributing factor to the Revolution was that building up decades before the Revolution, Urban Artisans (Middle Income; aged) men slowly gained higher jobs in government and in the system there, for there they were able to convince many people of their ways.


That's what I'm saying, run for office, campaign , you'll be surprised.

That is why American needs this. History repeats itself, aka Roman Empire and all other 'Empires' to follow. America shouldn't be a Empire because Empire's rise and fall. America should be a Democracy. Not a republic, a full Democracy. I call for Town Meetings again and more focus on community.

That is another reason why I believe American needs the Second American Revolution, and we are reaching our Turning Point on whether we choose to do that or not.

I must say... I agree.

But, the problem here is that we're talking about a revolution on a message board instead of actually DOING something.
I've been planning something to take place... globally.

A widespread movement of education for the masses... and by education, I mean knowledge on the subjects that are very important at this time.
To help awaken others to what's happening around them, and prepare them for the moment we've all been waiting for.

The shift of power.

People are preparing everywhere, and I am doing my best to supply resources and information for those who need it.

If you are serious about getting involved, and stepping up to the plate (while still using logic), we should discuss this, and get the ball rolling.
This applies to anyone here who is ready, also.

Hope to hear from you...

-Alex

Originally posted by sos37

Originally posted by flyingwoody
I fully agree that we need a revolution. I am tire of sitting around waiting. We need to take action. Even if it's a small group and we lose out, at least our actions will be noted and hopefully it will inspire more people to rise up and awaken. America was once a dreamland full of hope and wonder. Now it has become a jail.

We must rise up. I am in Florida and am willing to do anything needed that I am able to. I think ATS is a great place to get it started. We should start it right here.

You're an ignorant little poke, aren't you? First of all, the revolution has already been fought. The U.S. has gained it's independence from oppression a long time ago and established itself as a soverign nation.

We have a system in place that works fine for making all the changes you want - it's called Democracy. Instead of complaining that it doesn't work like a snivveling little brat why don't you try doing something productive like actually getting out on the campaign train, or choosing a candidate and getting involved in campaigning for their cause?

Yes, the nation has plenty of problems that need fixing and it all starts with whom we elect to do the job to represent us. If you would pay attention in school instead of tuning into Comedy Central for your political knowledge you might actually learn some of this and know what the hell you're talking about, instead of making ignorant statements like "America is a jail".

You've got ZERO clue what a nation that imitates a jail is like, dude and you obviously have no respect for the freedoms that you do have in this country. If you think you are oppressed in any way, shape or form, I urge you to visit one of the milder countries like Cuba. Spend a summer there and then come back to the U.S. and try to tell me again that America is like a jail. You won't be able to do it.

Okay, now for you and your very narrow-minded statements.......

America is a jail, very simply to put it. What is it, 1 out of every 100 Americans are in jail/have been? That is terrible.

Freedoms? What freedoms? The FBI is probably watching me post this. There is something else called the Patriot Act.... I won't get into that, but you need to look it up, a MUST read.

"We have a system in place that works fine for making all the changes you want - it's called Democracy"

Uh, no it isn't. The United States of America is a Republic. We are very few. That is why we have a President, no Parliament, and not a Prime Minister too.

It isn't a system where we can make changes. I would pull up the money numbers and crunch them for this months total. Its been roughly put that either candidate has spent over 100 Million Dollars on the Campaign alone?

I can write to my senator and representative, but who knows if they're ever going to hear me and even care. Sure they say that they do, but why are we still in Iraq and we haven't captured Osama bin Laden yet?

You know what is it, I can't put my finger on it, but isn't it something like 70% of American's think we went into Iraq because of 9-11. The media connects the dots for the public, and they were wrong.

"The U.S. has gained it's independence from oppression a long time ago and established itself as a soverign nation."

But yes, we have gained it's indepandence from oppression! That is why I am being oppressed and I can go to jail for this most likely. We are being oppressed, its as simple as that.

Example: Presidentail Directives: A terrible thing, the president can do what ever he thinks he wants to do. Its all legal. The State can take my house for a building project, it that not legal?

" I urge you to visit one of the milder countries like Cuba."

Actually, I quite will, they have a very good tourist system, that's where all the European tourists like to go. Being oppressed in Cuba, its just the same here, it is also because of the lower education rate. I you want, I can explain that later, but I can save that.




"You're an ignorant little poke, aren't you?"
"like a snivveling little brat "
"You've got ZERO clue"

Yet again, this is WHY we cannot lead a Revolution is because some people choose not to cooperate. It is a terrible thing to say those because of the reason's I listed above, if you care, you can rebuke them.

For every action we make on a powerful level, there will be resistance.
We will disrupt what many people believe to be a "normal" way of life.

We must disrupt the herd of sheep... separate them, and let them think for themselves instead of mindlessly following what they've been taught all their lives to follow.

This is an extraordinary moment in history, and if we play our cards right, some of us may change the way the history books have been written.

Ok so I did not read all the posts but I had a great idea when I was reading them. Ok so how about put up, upside down flags everywhere? Like put flags up like what we saw after 9-11. Hell you could even very anomalously walk around and put any flag you saw upside down. We have like 3 Massive flags around my town alone and it's a small one. Anyone in the military/army/ what ever knows what it means. It would be propaganda for the good side kinda... What do you think about this?

I don't think there is anything wrong with doing this I mean your not stealing it or anything... just putting it upside down but I dunno

reply to post by sos37


At first your response angered me. But then I realized that you are in the minority here. YOU are the ignorant one. Wake up and look around you, maybe once you get your face out of the media-fed bull you will see just how bad things are around here. It's sad when a 17 year old can see this but many adults cannot. And you said to pay attention in school? Well it's a little bit hard to teach how the government is taking away all of our personal freedoms when the teachers are paid by the government (that said I, personally, don't think public school is as bad as some people here make it out to be, just needs a little reworking).

I won't stoop to your level of propaganda by trying to make me look foolish and uneducated so this is where I will leave off for now.

Originally posted by tensetek
Ok so I did not read all the posts but I had a great idea when I was reading them. Ok so how about put up, upside down flags everywhere? Like put flags up like what we saw after 9-11.

We would need to do this on a large scale in order for us to get our point across.
One person turning a few flags upside down in their city won't do much unless hundreds or thousands of people in all of their cities begin doing it.

But, even if it was done, we would need to leave some kind of note or message next to it -- to really let them know what's goin' on.

reply to post by PieKeeper


Glad to see another Queensryche fan on here

Definitely not a one liner.

I love it when people exhort you to use a demonstrably broken political apparatus to effect changes that would eviscerate the income streams of the people glommed onto said system like leeches.

reply to post by bvproductions


Well w/e just an idea. I was just trying to think peaceful and outside the box

reply to post by bvproductions


I don't think coordinating upside down flags would do a whole lot here (T&C). It would work on a mass scale, but then they would charge us with trespassing.

reply to post by tensetek


Nope, not to you.

not a one liner.

reply to post by truth_seeker3


How many times has the FBI personally been to your house to tell you to shut up? How many times to take your machines away? Yeah, none. Do you have proof that they are even taking an interest in you? Perhaps you overestimate your own importance in the grand scheme of national security?

Like I said, if you really believe America is a jail, go and spend time in Cuba. It's obvious you haven't so much as seen a third world country let alone spent any time in one. I have. I've seen how a real dictatorship works and treats its people. The United States of America is a place of many freedoms. I love my country, the U.S., in good times and bad.

Maybe when you guys grow up and start to care about something other than yourselves, you'll see that this country really is a land of opportunity and free choices. Until then, countless many good men and women will go into battles and die to uphold your rights, no matter how often you throw them away.

Originally posted by flyingwoody
reply to post by sos37

 

At first your response angered me. But then I realized that you are in the minority here. YOU are the ignorant one. Wake up and look around you, maybe once you get your face out of the media-fed bull you will see just how bad things are around here. It's sad when a 17 year old can see this but many adults cannot. And you said to pay attention in school? Well it's a little bit hard to teach how the government is taking away all of our personal freedoms when the teachers are paid by the government (that said I, personally, don't think public school is as bad as some people here make it out to be, just needs a little reworking).

I won't stoop to your level of propaganda by trying to make me look foolish and uneducated so this is where I will leave off for now.

Oh I see. You say you cannot pay attention in school because teachers are paid by the government? Naturally they must be on the side of the government? So that makes everything they have to tell you BS right? You can't trust them? Rage against the machine, right?

And my level of propaganda, huh? Tell you what my level of Propaganda is. It's actually doing something about making changes in the world. In my last post I mentioned that I'd spent some time in Cuba. If you think things are so bad where you are, I'd invite you to go spend time there. No, of course you won't do that, because it's far easier for you to sit back behind your screen and flex your cyber-muscle, reveling in your own faux-superiority and judge the world that you obviously know nothing about. And, let's face it, at 17, you know NOTHING about NOTHING about NOTHING, no matter what you think you know.

Oh and just this week, soldiers have died for your right to sit on your ass, smoke your joint and judge the U.S. and that makes it "a jail". Ponder it for a moment. Just for a moment. Now think about doing something else for a change besides whining behind a computer screen about how bad the country is. Join the military, get on the campaign trail and back and candidate or do something to make somebody's life in your community better. Hey look at that. Those are choices you are free to make.

Originally posted by seejanerun
I wonder what it would take to get most Americans off their butts and really start a revolution.

You would have to make thier lives miserable.

- Cut off all government disability checks
- Send thier children to die for profit in a far off land
- Make them serve multiple tours of duty in said conflict
- Foreclose on millions of houses (Throw them on the street)
- Drain thier wallets at the gas pump and in the grocery stores
- Eliminate thier jobs and cut them off from all government re-education grants and assistance
- Control thier media outlets and pump out continuos propaganda to the masses
- Manipulate government statistics to hide the real data
- Use government tax dollars to enrich the wealthy
- Drain thier wallets to pay for a dysfunctional, piecemeal heathcare system that only benefits a few
- Fail to provide any kind of central leadership for the country

Basically you would have to tax them to death, not represent thier interests and starve them out.

Thank god we live in a country where none of that bad stuff has happened yet.


[edit on 24-9-2008 by In nothing we trust]

Originally posted by sos37
reply to post by truth_seeker3

 

How many times has the FBI personally been to your house to tell you to shut up? How many times to take your machines away? Yeah, none. Do you have proof that they are even taking an interest in you? Perhaps you overestimate your own importance in the grand scheme of national security?

Like I said, if you really believe America is a jail, go and spend time in Cuba. It's obvious you haven't so much as seen a third world country let alone spent any time in one. I have. I've seen how a real dictatorship works and treats its people. The United States of America is a place of many freedoms. I love my country, the U.S., in good times and bad.

Maybe when you guys grow up and start to care about something other than yourselves, you'll see that this country really is a land of opportunity and free choices. Until then, countless many good men and women will go into battles and die to uphold your rights, no matter how often you throw them away.

Okay, here we go again......

"How many times has the FBI personally been to your house to tell you to shut up? How many times to take your machines away? Yeah, none. Do you have proof that they are even taking an interest in you? Perhaps you overestimate your own importance in the grand scheme of national security?"

To tell you the truth, no, no, and nope. To tell you the truth, that is not how they operate. The FBI, in most cases operates like.... They will monitor to see any illegal activites, and or terrorist activites... Did you know what?

If Nelson Mandela was on the terrorist watch list *AKA* No Fly List*, including,

Ted Kennedy
U.S. Representative John Lewis
U.S. Representative Don Young
Former US Marines
Many journalists

*Wikipeida*

Acually, many little kids were on the list too. It is believed that over one million Americans are too. That is because of their system that if other people have the same name, they are on the list too. Last time I looked into TSA, they were strapped for cash. If they are so concerned about safety, wouldn't they dump some cash into there? Nope, guess not.

Maybe Cuba is a hellhole, I see that you've spent time there. Have you heard of the 'Shot Heard Around the World" You need to look it up, until then, I will not say anymore on that


"you'll see that this country really is a land of opportunity and free choices"

Opportunity? (I would use some more colorful words to describe my rage, but I decided against it). Tell me it is opportunity where most Americans are exposed to competition so raged that the normal person cannot go anywhere.

If you wanted to go somewhere in life and do something, most of the time is because you cannot afford it, you say on que,

Its America, the Land of Opportunity! You should have worked harder.

Wait, reality is coming back to you.

Your a single mom with two kids
You had to drop out of school
You in debt
You cannot find a better job
Your job doesn't pay really well
Your house foreclosed

And my level of propaganda, huh? Tell you what my level of Propaganda is. It's actually doing something about making changes in the world. In my last post I mentioned that I'd spent some time in Cuba. If you think things are so bad where you are, I'd invite you to go spend time there. No, of course you won't do that, because it's far easier for you to sit back behind your screen and flex your cyber-muscle, reveling in your own faux-superiority and judge the world that you obviously know nothing about. And, let's face it, at 17, you know NOTHING about NOTHING about NOTHING, no matter what you think you know.

Wait, four words, that I will not explain, you seem all-knowing, so you should know it already:

The Nine-Eleven Cover-Up


If you want to I can explain in a rather short statement, but I do not want to get into details, since this thread is not about this



"A single good government becomes... a blessing to the whole earth, its welcome to the oppressed restraining within certain limits the measure of their oppressions. But should even this be counteracted by violence on the right of expatriation, the other branch of our example then presents itself for imitation: to rise on their rulers and do as we have done." --Thomas Jefferson to George Flower, 1817. ME 15:141

"We surely cannot deny to any nation that right whereon our own government is founded, that every one may govern itself according to whatever form it pleases and change these forms at its own will... The will of the nation is the only thing essential to be regarded." --Thomas Jefferson to Gouverneur Morris, 1792. ME 9:36

Originally posted by seejanerun
I wonder what it would take to get most Americans off their butts and really start a revolution. While some things may have changed, some things never do.

The people quoted below are national heroes, yet had they failed, what would we call them ?

They wrote and created this government. They all faced the same things we are facing today. (well politically anyway) They knew what they were doing or it may have been the Grace of God, but somehow we let it go horribly wrong.

Thomas Jefferson is known to have said periodic revolution was necessary to remove the excesses, corruption, and­– yes–­ violation of rights that tend to show up in government. The quote often attributed to him goes, “we need a revolution every 75 years because that is how long it takes for it to become so bad that it can’t be corrected.”

While signing the Declaration of Independence in 1776, Benjamin Franklin made the remark "We must, indeed, all hang together, or most assuredly we shall all hang separately."

They were as unhappy as most of us are today but they did something about it. We couldn't get that organized if we tried I am afraid.

Excuse me, we have the internet, to say we couldnt organize is just unrealistic. We can organize better than anyone in history has ever been able, faster than they could imagine possible.

the problem is dedication. Revolutions are messy and most people don't want to get their hands dirty. Or they have family they worry about and they just don't want to rock the boat.

But look at this rate I think things are gonna sort themselves out I mean when you have so many jobless homeless pissed off suffering people who have lost everything and have nothing to lose, well really, how hard is it to stuff a dirty rag in a half full bottle of vodka and light it up and destroy a hell of a lot of people places and things. The disenfranchised will ignite this powderkeg when their numbers are large enough. What do you think this police state martial law concentration camp garbage is about. The elite see it coming plain as day. To be a sucess though well, there will have to be a lot of people on the peoples side working within the system too. I think a large percentage of people are saying they would sooner wipe their arses with this 700bn bill than pay it.

Originally posted by guyopitz
... when you have so many jobless homeless pissed off suffering people who have lost everything and have nothing to lose, well really, how hard is it to stuff a dirty rag in a half full bottle of vodka and light it up and destroy a hell of a lot of people places and things.

The disenfranchised will ignite this powderkeg when their numbers are large enough.

They have been training the troops in Iraq to handle just this thing.

To be a sucess though well, there will have to be a lot of people on the peoples side working within the system too.

Military aid will have to be funneled into America by other countries as well. The revolution will need Surface-to-Air missles, C-4 explosives (Lots of it), LOng range sniper rifles, anti-armor weapons, mortars, automatic weapons, and of course lot's of ammunition and intel.

[edit on 24-9-2008 by In nothing we trust]