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A more alien-like economy (that can't fail)

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posted on Sep, 20 2008 @ 01:53 AM
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reply to post by sty
 


The definition of artificial life is an imitation of life. IE: Not real intelligence or life. Just something that appears to be such to that. It is a mere illusion as the entire basis of what that life thinks is true is based on what it is programmed to do. It doesn't know 1+1=2 because it understands it, it knows 1+1=2 because it was programmed to know that 1+1=2. As Einstein once say, any fool can know. The point is to understand. And without consciousness, you can not understand.

Real intelligence requires consciousness. Or what religion considers to be the soul. Our bodies are really just a big nanobot and our DNA is the coding.



sty

posted on Sep, 20 2008 @ 02:10 AM
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reply to post by badmedia
 


the real Artificiall Intelligence is not a program that executes line by line, but a program that can collect information from the provided source then it would change it`s own code in order to achieve a certain goal.

Intelligence = the capacity of achieving complex goals in complex environments.
it can be biological , or of course artificial.

Sure I have to agree- there is no guarantee that an AI complex enough would achieve consciousness or what we call "soul" but if a biological brain can achieves it, there is no reason to believe that an artificial one cannot achieve soul or consciousness .

[edit on 20-9-2008 by sty]



posted on Sep, 20 2008 @ 02:21 AM
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While I dunno about the alien factor here or interfacing with hyper-space, but I whole-heartedly agree with the economic principal of having fractions of what is available rather than considering(and banking on) potential. Seems like it should be a no-brainer.

Then again, I'm one of those types that has managed to stay out of debt by living modestly, only bought what I already had the money for and only recently got a credit card for emergency use(and renting cars/U-hauls etc).

S&F4U for the nice write-up.



posted on Sep, 20 2008 @ 02:22 AM
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Wait I thought Bush was a reptilian........

Here is the line that makes this a non one-liner.



posted on Sep, 20 2008 @ 02:36 AM
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I kind of skimmed through your post because it's late, and I'm tired, but I see what you're trying to say. In economics, there's a lot of things that go unaccounted for, and have for many years and perhaps even centuries if you're speaking about Europe's economies. And yes, our depletion of natural resources are one of those things that will go unaccounted for, but there has been an improvement and our government has recognized this problem. After all, it is our natural resources that keep us sustainable as a nation.

[edit on 20-9-2008 by laiguana]



posted on Sep, 20 2008 @ 02:37 AM
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reply to post by sty
 


Sorry, don't want to take this thread on detour. But it was once my life goal to create AI, and I spent quite a bit of time thinking about it and such. Part of doing that required me to take an honest look at what is intelligence. I ultimately came the conclusion that anything I created would merely be the illusion of intelligence, as it would be confined to the limits I put in the programming.

In fact, to get a truly intelligent being requires multiple intelligences working together. It also requires death to rid the intelligence of any false notions. For every question, multiple perspectives must be available, or you are programming in ignorance by default. Basically, you have to recreate that which you live in now and is already created.

In attempting to create AI, I mostly just came out with a better understanding of the world I live in. Because ultimately, that is all AI is trying to mimic.

Creating consciousness is to create the observer in quantum physics. Without it, it's just a bunch of patterns being forced out, even if the pattern itself has the random chance of changing itself. You need that "man in the machine".

And to bring this back towards the original topic somewhat, this goes for any so called aliens as well. If we did create actual intelligence with a consciousness, who among us will respect the freewill of that creation? Doing so would be the sign of someone with high enough intelligence to realize what they are working with. So how could an alien race with higher intelligence subscribe to communistic and centralized organizations?

As soon as I see aliens having government, I run for the hills. Because government is only needed when their is evil in this society. If these aliens are of actual higher intelligence then they will not need a government, because they will be respective of each others free will and consciousness.

The OP is either making stuff up, or is being misled. This discussion is really no different than the conversations the founding fathers had when making this country when it came to banking. Only cloaked in aliens to make his suggestions appear as being "more intelligent".

Can someone please point me to the aliens who actually respect free will and are actual individuals rather than being a bunch of bees in some form of communistic government(which btw, is exactly what the NWO is about)? I really don't want to live in an ant or bee like society.



posted on Sep, 20 2008 @ 02:50 AM
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reply to post by 4N6310
 


Staying debt free is the real answer. As Ben Franklin once said, a man in debt is but merely a slave. What does that make a nation who is 9 trillion dollars in debt? And to whom do we actually owe this money too? Who are these people who have 9 trillion dollars to loan out? We are supposed to be the richest country in the world, yet their are people out there who can loan us 9 trillion dollars?

I am also debt free like you. And I refuse to take any credit either. I use pre-paid credit/debit cards even.

We live in a debt based economy rather than an economy of surplus as intended.

We live in a government of limited rights, of which are being scraped away, rather than a limited government whose specific duties are listed and that is all they do as intended.

In every political issue there is always 2 questions. The first question is always "Is this the job of the government". If that answer is yes, then 2nd question is "How do we handle it".

The democrats and the republicans keep the 1st question silent. They all agree on 1 thing, they should always be given the power to decide how to do things. And while doing this, they provide both sides of how they should handle it for you to vote on. But all that is really need is for you to give them power.

I'm sure we've all seen the movie the matrix. In that movie there is a part where it says the Oracle stumbled on a way for most people to accept the program even if only on a subconscious level. And that is exactly what is going on now. We are giving them permission to control our lives, and it's done on a subconscious level only because the majority of people are focused and arguing over the 2nd question. Just like in this thread.

You take the programs the democrats want. And then you combine it with the programs the republicans want. What do you end up with? Total government control over everything. You never see the other side getting rid of the other programs. That is exactly where we are heading. There is a reason for it, and if you just look for new answers without understanding the problems beyond - "They are bad people" then we are doomed to continue the pattern. We are doomed for people to keep accepting things, if only on that subconscious level.

Apparently, these higher intelligence aliens are subconsciously approve the same program if they are only arguing for the 2nd question. If we are to believe the OP's claims.



posted on Sep, 20 2008 @ 05:39 AM
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Well, this is my first time here, I just registered, and I've been reading alot of posts here for quite some time and this was the one that finally made me break down and create a profile.


I'll try to be brief and summarize my comment to this topic.

I've seen Zeitgeist, I've watched many ufo disclosure videos..., I've watched hours upon hours upon hours of video material on youtube and read many different articles on. So how I see all of this relating and why I see this topic posted as being, if anything else, another method of attacking this corrupt system we live in, whether it be true or false, it's still necessary as another method to undo whats been done by the "government inside the government", to coin the Clinton phrase. I know about the Federal Reserve, that they soley create our money as a completely seperate entity that we end up owing money to for every dollar created we owe a percentage of interest greater on that dollar and so we spiral down with no ability ever to emerge from this continuing debt. As a side note they own alot more than just the money system, also the main resource... oil, "if" I'm correct. In anycase whether it be by the act of the entire country of over-throwing this power above the powers that be, an alien species coming to our planet to over-throw them in any manner you can think of, peaceful or otherwise, or by their very existance in our society dictating to us new ideas as an entire country and there by forcing whatever goverment that exists out of office... We need a plan. I believe aliens exist, I may have programmed myself from watching to many youtube videos and reading to much on the subject to soon, because I've only just recently become a believer and went nuts researching as much of whomevers research as I could to inform myself. Bottom line, I think it's all connected, I think things are coming to a head, I think the government may have it's own fail-safe agenda in place... I read somewhere that when start to research all of this stuff all the pieces begin to come together and all becomes very simple to understand. Wrapping this up, I now watch the skies, every night and I pray for a solution to this society they've created, though I'm fairly on the borders of atheism and agnosticism... I can't help but feel helpless because in the past weeks that I've tried to get people to watch zeitgeist or I've tried to clue them in to some ufo disclosure videos I thought we're particularly informative... no one takes it seriously enough or they just never bother. So as much as a may thing the October 14th stuff I've been reading is garbage, a part of me once it to be true because I believe they'll be here sooner or later, but the sooner the better.



posted on Sep, 20 2008 @ 05:44 AM
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Wow, I can't believe all the typos I just wrote... that'll teach me not to preview a post. My brain thinks faster than my fingers type... and apparently "once" should be "wants" somewhere near the last part of my comment. Cocaines a hell of a drug.



posted on Sep, 20 2008 @ 05:45 AM
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Wow, I can't believe all the typos I just wrote... that'll teach me not to preview a post. My brain thinks faster than my fingers type... and apparently "once" should be "wants" somewhere near the last part of my comment. Cocaines a hell of a drug.



posted on Sep, 20 2008 @ 06:51 AM
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Originally posted by m4edit
Well, this is my first time here, I just registered, and I've been reading alot of posts here for quite some time and this was the one that finally made me break down and create a profile.


I'll try to be brief and summarize my comment to this topic.

I've seen Zeitgeist, I've watched many ufo disclosure videos..., I've watched hours upon hours upon hours of video material on youtube and read many different articles on. So how I see all of this relating and why I see this topic posted as being, if anything else, another method of attacking this corrupt system we live in, whether it be true or false, it's still necessary as another method to undo whats been done by the "government inside the government", to coin the Clinton phrase. I know about the Federal Reserve, that they soley create our money as a completely seperate entity that we end up owing money to for every dollar created we owe a percentage of interest greater on that dollar and so we spiral down with no ability ever to emerge from this continuing debt. As a side note they own alot more than just the money system, also the main resource... oil, "if" I'm correct. In anycase whether it be by the act of the entire country of over-throwing this power above the powers that be, an alien species coming to our planet to over-throw them in any manner you can think of, peaceful or otherwise, or by their very existance in our society dictating to us new ideas as an entire country and there by forcing whatever goverment that exists out of office... We need a plan. I believe aliens exist, I may have programmed myself from watching to many youtube videos and reading to much on the subject to soon, because I've only just recently become a believer and went nuts researching as much of whomevers research as I could to inform myself. Bottom line, I think it's all connected, I think things are coming to a head, I think the government may have it's own fail-safe agenda in place... I read somewhere that when start to research all of this stuff all the pieces begin to come together and all becomes very simple to understand. Wrapping this up, I now watch the skies, every night and I pray for a solution to this society they've created, though I'm fairly on the borders of atheism and agnosticism... I can't help but feel helpless because in the past weeks that I've tried to get people to watch zeitgeist or I've tried to clue them in to some ufo disclosure videos I thought we're particularly informative... no one takes it seriously enough or they just never bother. So as much as a may thing the October 14th stuff I've been reading is garbage, a part of me once it to be true because I believe they'll be here sooner or later, but the sooner the better.


I too have absorbed a ton of info in the last year or so and I my veiw is about the same as yours.
I thought it would be easy to have people see what I see so to speak , not so . Very few want to even listen and some think I have lost my mind. But those few do seem to understand and willing to open their minds enough to realize there is something else is going on then what we are being told.
Sometimes I sit back and think how hard it must have been for others in the past to try to relay these messages.....its hard enough at this time and space , must have seemed impossible and many would have been " burned at the stake" so to speak.



posted on Sep, 20 2008 @ 07:12 AM
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I'm sorry, but could someone give me a link that talks about the Oct. 14 thing?

Thanks.


~ Devin



posted on Sep, 20 2008 @ 09:02 AM
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Ah, yes. The next phase in the alien problem-reaction-solution strategy.

Step 1: Create the Problem :: Prop up the most selfish humans and feed their greed at the expense of the entire population.

Step 2: Wait for the Reaction :: Who, besides the rich and selfish, do not want a more equal way of living?

Step 3: Present your Solution :: An alien take over will not be a war-of-worlds scenario. It will be by the consent of the majority of the population.

Any voice of warning will be drowned out by the undeniable logic of a closed-loop scenario where the target population is not aware of all the options available.

Simple and effective.



posted on Sep, 20 2008 @ 09:24 AM
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reply to post by gl2
 

"Finally, aliens don't need quantum computers in their brains."

But, aren't they themselves quantum computers. That's my take on it. ET could be as small as a peanut or as big as a two story house. They're in those ships, but they are IN the ship. A part of it.



posted on Sep, 20 2008 @ 09:58 AM
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I agree with a lot of what the OP is saying about future economies.

Leader of the International Raëlian Movement, Raël, received a message from our ET parents and within it also contained information as to how we should regulate our economy.

Firstly, the limit of child births should indeed be limited to two children per adult woman. Secondly, we should install what Raël calls a humanitarian economy. See it explained on Wikipedia: en.wikipedia.org...(Ra%C3%ABlianism)

He also has spoken of our recent economic slip: www.youtube.com...



posted on Sep, 20 2008 @ 10:10 AM
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This is probably the best 'pro New World Order' argument i have ever heard. Globalization is an obvious step forward for humanity and this argument for a global, centrally controlled economy is compelling and shows that in the end, it is the correct choice.

The main problems i have with the current moves toward this end is the individuals who are pushing it and all the frills attached in regards barcoding the population etc.



posted on Sep, 20 2008 @ 10:26 AM
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What a load of Bull, the economy would work perfectly well as it does now, just put the value of the money back into the hands of the public or even the government instead of a stinky central bank. I mean why do we pay interest on our own money?? Why why why why are we still using this model, revolt people... revolt!!!



posted on Sep, 20 2008 @ 11:54 AM
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Am I the only one here that doesn't speak about aliens in a mater-of-fact tone like 'of course they are with us, just as sure as the races of other countries!'
I'm sorry but I can't buy into that world...
I know there are strange things happening in the world today but people continue to talk about underground cities and yet offer not one shred of proof! Where are the photos of these cities, aliens? If someone does come up with something (like the alien autopsy video) it seems it is later discovered to be a hoax so these people that are "sure" there are aliens living among us needs to look at the big picture, mainly the proof.
People talk about how much 'power' it would take to override the transmitters in the UK during that broadcast, that's not true.. all you need is 'slightly' more power in the audio link to overpower the original signal and the audio/video links are low-power microwave, all you have to do is 'intercept' the line-of-site signal, insert your own and you have it! With FM the higher power "owns" the band unlike AM if you put another signal into it it would squeal and sound awful. So as far as I'm concerned the "voice from space" was really easy to do and I'm sure one of these days someone (if they haven't already) will spill the beans and admit to the hoax.



posted on Sep, 20 2008 @ 11:59 AM
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People do you want to learn about an "alien" economy?
Why not check out our current economy?
It is as "alien" as it can be. It doesn't make much sense. In fact it does for the bankers (take take take) but it never did for us. (lose lose lose)

Talking about another paradigm of economy, taking into consideration hypothetical races living in hypothetical other worlds.

Don't you people believe that a linearity has to be present for even the simplest economy to succeed?
How can I build economy with other species if they don't exist in the same dimension? What measures and limits could we use for dealing with other dimensions in order for us to establish a common basis of exchange with a race?
Trade is a vital part of an economy. Even if you check the Indian epics as Mahabarata you could see descriptions of technology like ships, weapons, etc. You may not see currency but you can see everything else. Those things need resources to materialize. Trading of resources is a thing you can base an economy on. It is something that gives you power, gives you status and leverage.
You don't expect people to meditate all day long until food materializes on the table. This ain't going to happen. If there was chances of this indeed happening then you don't need any aliens to teach you this. You can do this from your own.
We have 2 hands, 5 fingers, 2 feet, one head, two eyes one body, and are all there for a purpose. We are made for manufacturing things and gathering resources. This is how it is going to work with other hypothetical alien races too. They will have to match the same league we are in in order for us to establish an economy with. Talking about hypothetical economies from energy beings that can store unlimited amounts of energy in very small spaces for instances makes same sense like trying passing around the idea of having an economy with God. It does not make sense. God does not need an economy, advanced godlike beings do not have uses for economies like our own. We and races similar to us do! And probably there are plenty to go around in this Universe.

Now the term alien and the term resources and the term trade go hand in hand. If you are willing to separate any vital term of the above from the equation then bye bye aliens, we don't need them.

To make it more simple. We don't need another new religion so stop talking about hypothetical other dimensions and BS aliens. We need new paradigms, new technology and new markets.

My 2 cents.

[edit on 20-9-2008 by spacebot]



posted on Sep, 20 2008 @ 12:01 PM
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Originally posted by Simplynoone
LOL HI sty ...yes it was on my thread .
I asked that question and as soon as I posted it this thread popped up on the recent posts ..so I came to check it out too ..

Thanks for posting to my thread too Sty ..

i noticed that too..he he, i was like...wait a minute, did i read her title wrong?...funny.



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