The Questions U.F.O. skeptics can't answer

Originally posted by TruthTellist
Judging From what I have witnessed on Larry King as of Late; The Burden of Proof is now on the Non-believers.

I'm sorry but that statement is simply asinine.

And to Malevolent Alien you can confirm with ATS if you don't believe it.

You can follow the link at the top of the page:

"Special event community interviews with guest speakers."

Obviously someone has a difficulty in reading or comprehension.

I've heard him say in a radio interview somewhere a few years back saying the EXACT SAME THING.

And obviously for a believer of 'flying saucers' they don't even pay attention to what their leading researchers do. If I were you I'd be ashamed of myself (or rather, kill myself)













[edit on 27-7-2008 by AntisepticSkeptic]

Originally posted by greeneyedleo
Well, I'm with the camp: It is on the "believer" to show us the proof. Not the other way around.

I would have thought there is more than enough proof. It should be up to the skeptics to prove everyone is lying and that every piece of video evidence is false. I would have thought that was obvious.

It is easy as a skeptic to sit there and keep saying day after day "I want more" when you blindly refuse to acknowledge what is already there.

Originally posted by greeneyedleo
I have yet to see anything that proves there are "aliens" and "alien craft" visiting us from outside Earth. UFO (unidentified flying objects)?? Yes, I believe they exist. But I also believe that UOs (unidentified objects) exist on the ground too

So you believe UFOs that can pull off manouvers that we are yet to see.... are all man made? You believe 100's of years ago when the only thing flying in the sky was a kite... and people saw UFO's then that they were all man made as well?

Originally posted by greeneyedleo
All photos and video I see are HORRIBLE quality or obviously fake. IMO. I dont even look at YouTube videos anymore. If its not the crappy music added....the editing with titles, subtitles and credits....then its the shoddy camera work.

There have been some excellent photos and video footage.... problem is when people see a photo that looks clear it is just dismissed as "Too fake looking". Damned if you do and damned if you don't.

Originally posted by greeneyedleo
I also do not take witnesses words as 100% truth....just because someone can tell a story, means nothing to me. I feel this way about witnesses in court too....and I'm a criminal justice major. Witnesses are humans. Humans have the ability to lie and make mistakes in their accounts of things. I ALWAYS take this into account first when someone tells me a story (court matter or a UFO matter). Hmmm. Can you imagine me as an interrogator?

I don't care what title is behind someone's name. I don't care how many times they say "I swear this is the truth!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!" They are still just human and subject to human behavior. I need to be able to look into someone's eyes. Know their history, their lifestyle and so on. Many things come into account before I trust one's word....no matter what the subject is.

Well thats kinda sad then... because if that is the case WHEN the US Govt does come out and admit aliens are real and we have known about them.... you won't be able to believe that either... due to the theory above that people lie. So why are you here then? It appears the only way you will believe in this is if you shake the hand of an alien and then try pulling his skin to see if he's real and not wearing a costume.

Originally posted by greeneyedleo
What will it take me to believe with no doubts? Not some cheesy youtube video. Not some anonymous person saying "I was abducted, here is my story". Maybe me witnessing something. Maybe someone who is clearly not looking for fame and attention....and they have CLEAR unedited photos/video. Maybe a captured alien. Maybe a mass CLEAR sighting like we saw in the movie "Independence Day". I mean, are any of these things NOT possible? Not a logical expectation???? I think they are.

I refuse to blindly believe, because someone says to. However, im this way about ANYTHING.

*Still hoping. Still waiting.*

In that case I suggest you no longer bother trying to talk about anything to do with the UFO/Alien phenomenon... because if you believing relies on you having that much proof you may as well sit back... have a glass of lemonade and wait... because 99% of the entire world will know Aliens exist before it finally registers with you.

Originally posted by andre18
Since we’re on the subject of scepticism, how do you as sceptics explain pilots claiming to have seen ufo’s?


[edit on 27-7-2008 by andre18]

As early as the 1950's Karl Jung studied pilots reports of UFO's. He concluded that individuals working in isolation who routinely have to immerse themselve in demanding roles within high level of concentration(like pilots do) whose consciousness i contracted on details and careful observation(one-sided) experienced, at the same time, their subconcious striving to fill the void of the empty space that surrounded them. Jung believed that this left them prone to spontaneous psychic phenomena. But he did mischieviously say "either pyschic projections throw back a radar echo, or else real objects affords an opportunity for mythological projections." Micheal Persinger and Susan Blackmore took up Jungs thoughts and many others have sought to answers similar questions raised by sightings.
Also, this thread is about ET/extra-dimensional beings and those skeptical of them. I think UFO is quiet often used to prove the existence of ET/extra-dimensional. Are there any videos where pilots see Aliens or extra-dimensional beings. I think that would shut the skeptics up.

reply to post by AntisepticSkeptic

If that was really him, I don't believe a word of it and will take him as a dis-information agent. I met William Cooper with John Lear years ago and though I do not agree with everything William Cooper had to say it doesn't change the few most important things that he did know as he witnessed UFO's and knew very well about the government cover up and MJ-12. He was threatened mulitiple times in his life by the military/government to shut up about what he knew or else.

I will take the facts of what I believe William Cooper did know who in my opinion was a great man and I do not believe for a second he open fired on an officer as they would have you believe. He was murdered plain and simple, they wanted to get rid of him because he was exposing the truth and someone that was close to it. He predicted 9/11 before it happened.

"Cooper had spent the last month challenging the government's claims about the cause of the destruction of the World Trade Center on September 11, two months before his death.

Antisepticskeptic, It's funny how quickly you can believe one mans testimony of something that you really have zero knowledge of but deny 1000's of other testimonies out there all claiming that extraterrestrials exist.

Originally posted by atlasastro

Originally posted by andre18
Since we’re on the subject of scepticism, how do you as sceptics explain pilots claiming to have seen ufo’s?


[edit on 27-7-2008 by andre18]

As early as the 1950's Karl Jung studied pilots reports of UFO's. He concluded that individuals working in isolation who routinely have to immerse themselve in demanding roles within high level of concentration(like pilots do) whose consciousness i contracted on details and careful observation(one-sided) experienced, at the same time, their subconcious striving to fill the void of the empty space that surrounded them. Jung believed that this left them prone to spontaneous psychic phenomena. But he did mischieviously say "either pyschic projections throw back a radar echo, or else real objects affords an opportunity for mythological projections." Micheal Persinger and Susan Blackmore took up Jungs thoughts and many others have sought to answers similar questions raised by sightings.
Also, this thread is about ET/extra-dimensional beings and those skeptical of them. I think UFO is quiet often used to prove the existence of ET/extra-dimensional. Are there any videos where pilots see Aliens or extra-dimensional beings. I think that would shut the skeptics up.

Yeah and the BIG problem with Karl Jung's theory as he stated was of course while he thought it was all in the pilots mind... there was proof on Radar that an object was out there.... blowing his theory out of the water.

Although I am not a mod (where are the mods when you need them ) I would like to point that personal attacks should be avoided, and I think some of the people posting in this thread should stop a little and rethink (if not re-read) what they have been saying and the way they said it.

It does not cost that much to think a little before clicking the "Post Reply" button.

Originally posted by Malevolent_Aliens
reply to post by AntisepticSkeptic

 

Yadda yadda yadda ZERO PROOF

Yadda yadda yadda ZERO PROOF

Yadda yadda yadda ZERO PROOF

Antisepticskeptic, It's funny how quickly you can believe one mans testimony of something that you really have zero knowledge of but deny 1000's of other testimonies out there all claiming that extraterrestrials exist.

Believing about the confirmation that a kook made up facts out of thin air is more logical than something than the existence of ETs that cannot be proven .

William Cooper is a kook. YESS!!!!

ETs visiting us? Noooooooppeee...

Go ahead you can believe him. You can use his Beware Pale Horse$hit as a bible for all I care. To me he isn't worth my time arguing over.

And I'm done arguing about somethng that doesn't exist. (E.Ts) I have something else important to do (unlike some people)






[edit on 27-7-2008 by AntisepticSkeptic]

reply to post by AntisepticSkeptic


I suggest you calm down right now and start treating people with a minimum of respect. This is ATS, a discussion forum, not a gladiator arena. No need to get personal just because you disagree with someone.

Originally posted by AntisepticSkeptic
"So wait...you want me to prove that something I can't see, hear, touch, smell, or taste is not real?"

Like.........air. Well, I suppose you CAN hear wind.

Originally posted by AntisepticSkeptic
Oh and William Cooper was a kook. He's been debunked by Stanton Friedman.

The SAME Stanton Friedman you vilified on the "CNN Shows UFO Destroying Nuke....Thread? (Strangely, we were in AGREEMENT that thread title was mis-leading.)

And now you "conveniently" use him to prove your point?

Oh and BTW, it was not a typo. I MEANT William Cowper.

"Absence of Proof is not Proof of Absence."

www.brainyquote.com...


(English poet, Lived during 1700's)

And you suggest I do MY homework.

regards........kk

And another famous Cowper quote, just for you......

"A fool must now and then be right, by chance."

www.brainyquote.com...


[edit on 27-7-2008 by kinda kurious]

reply to post by AntisepticSkeptic


"And I'm done arguing about something that doesn't exist. (E.Ts) I have something else important to do (unlike some people)"

I don't think you have something important to go and do.

I think this is just your way of conceding defeat.

I would also like to know how you managed to prove a negative?
-Since you have already done what we all know to be impossible by 'proving a negative' - is it such a stretch to believe in Extra-terrestrial UFOs?

I would like to note that I also disapprove of your personal attacks on other member. Please stop.

Edit:

[edit on 27-7-2008 by TruthTellist]

reply to post by AntisepticSkeptic

Go ahead you can believe him. To me he isn't worth my time arguing over.

He is not worth your time because you have no idea what your talking about----Talk about eating your own words like you said earlier.

"At least this guy made his homework. Obviously you haven't done yours."

Clearly, you haven't done yours.

If I were you I'd be ashamed of myself (or rather, kill myself)

Yes for a die-hard dis-believer such as yourself who has not done his homework the above suggestion is not a bad idea afterall.


Usually those who tend to be extremely close minded dis-believers have never really done the research and in your case it's clear you have never done the research. Everything coming out of your mouth is.

"Blah blah blah blah
Yadda yadda yadda yadda
That is all you can say about the subject other than
Zero evidence.
Seek medical help.
Go see a doctor."

Hmmm and where is your credibility?



For The Record:
Here is what another poster on ATS who also knew William Cooper had to say:

Originally posted by antar
Having known W.C. personally, I can tell you that I do not believe he was the first to shoot. NO.

Without saying too much here I will say I knew the caliber of P.O. he encountered in the final shootout at his ranch.

They were very tough and above the law.

[edit on 27-7-2008 by Malevolent_Aliens]

Originally posted by Total Package



Yeah and the BIG problem with Karl Jung's theory as he stated was of course while he thought it was all in the pilots mind... there was proof on Radar that an object was out there.... blowing his theory out of the water.

Well not necessarily, but i thought that it was important to note. He does also say that even if these objects are real, we are prone to attributing the source of the objects to mythical perojections.

Why is it that pointless threads get into double page figures?

This thread should be locked,it is nothing more than meaningless bickering.It was obvious from the OP first post,that this thread was designed to inflame opinions,abuse the scientific method,nothing more.

Also the lack of understanding,and lack of respect for the scientific method is appalling.

It has been noted than too many people choose to cherry pick,believe a certain scientific claim as it supports their argument and ignore the rest of the science,well,it doesn`t work that way.

This bickering and lack of a falsifiable theory is why the subject has got nowhere in 60 years.

The word skeptic is also being abused.A proper skeptic will never say UFO`s cannot be alien craft,they dont exist,in doing so places the burden of proof upon them.All a skeptic looks for is more evidence to convince themselves that a claim may be valid,people are confusing this with a naysayer,a foolish act along with blind acceptance.Also a debunker is not a debunker unless they can falsify a given claim.Too many people make the mistake of useing these terms interchangably as they do not know their correct definitions.

Both sides,as far as im concerned have valid points,but the believer camp are well known to persue blind acceptance,creating an ideology for themselves which they refuse to let go.

reply to post by atlasastro


That's a good point. I'd go a bit further and say that people tend to anthropomorphise the unexplained. E.T. spacecraft aren't just a mythical explanation, they're an anthropomorphised explanation. A UFO is just a UFO, but if we explain it as E.T.'s, then a UFO can become intelligent and have motives and an intelligent designer just like a man-made spacecraft.

So I'm a bit of a skeptic myself, but I do think the dragonfly drones are pretty damned impressive.

---Double Post Error---

[edit on 27-7-2008 by Malevolent_Aliens]

heres a question you cant answer, people have been saying aliens are here for a long time and now in an age where literally everyone has a camera on them(cell phone) there still is nothing significant supporting your views, so why are you not a skeptic?

heres a question you cant answer, people have been saying aliens are here for a long time and now in an age where literally everyone has a camera on them(cell phone) there still is nothing significant supporting your views, so why are you not a skeptic?

Some skeptics get almost to the unskeptical stance. Some are willing to bet they are gov mil experimental craft.

Heres where it gets tricky;

Are they man made things that are being passed off as ETs or
are they ET made things being passed off to man . You know how man likes to be credited, respected and looked up to I'm the one that discovered faster than light propagation in a vacum...Now I get more grant money, more respect from my peers, and a better life because I discovered it from so so much work and research. Love me, look up to me, pet me.

Originally posted by AntisepticSkeptic

Originally posted by re22666

Originally posted by AntisepticSkeptic



Surely only a paranoid delusiuonal freak would believe with no doubt whatsoever in the existence of E.Ts with this kind of steaming pile "my dog ate my evidence" B.S. happening EVERY SINGLE TIME in the last 50 years.



[edit on 27-7-2008 by AntisepticSkeptic]

wow 50 years?????

that seals it.
thank god people didnt "KNOW" that the earth was flat for as long as 50 whole years. whew. that was close.

I was refering to the modern phenomena of alleged E.T./flying saucer visitation/interaction that peaked in the last 50 years (give or take) of our modern age and the lack of physical evidence to support and how the believers make up excuses when they supposedly had the 'smoking gun', given that modern technology of that period was more than enough to acquire physical evidence from the field.

I don't know where you come up with the nonsense about people knowing the earth is flat for 50 years (maybe from etherspace?)

Thank you for the comprehension that only a demented orang utan can devise.

[edit on 27-7-2008 by AntisepticSkeptic]

what i said about people knowing the earth was flat for 50 years was rediculous. obviously they knew it was flat for FAR LONGER THAN THAT. but you said 50 years as if that was long enough to no prove aliens dont exsist. we have been talking about it for 50 years and no proof? must be fake. well.......how long do you think people went without any proof the world was round? far longer than 50 years, so how is 50 years any kind of measurement for debunking UFO's????
its ok, i can see by your posts that you only respond to what you understand correctly, or what you feel you can shoot down. if you did not understand what i was saying, all you had to do was read the post i was replying to and put 2 and 2 together. sorry did not mean to challenge you so much


my point is
saying that they have talked about UFO's for 50 years but no evidence yet and that is long enough.....
is pretty stupid when you think how long people went without evidence of most other things that were unkown to man at some point. much much much longer than 50 years.

Corum, you been here to long to know ufos are a real thing, Aliens have been visited planet earth for a very long time,

look at the alien artifacts drewings, in biblical paintings, eygptions drewing etc

for so many stars, u really are a disinfo poster

sham on U, u didnt mention nothing about the above.