Why do you think people join the Freemasons?

"Asking why something is not like you believe it shou[ld] be, is a hard question to get an answer from someone else."

That's not the question I've been asking.

reply to post by applebiter


I understand what you're saying now. It is a fair question. I suppose it's all a matter of faith. Does this man choose to believe that this time those words are true? Or is it just another example of lies and hypocrisy? There's no way to know until he's on the inside.

Why would someone take such a grave oath on faith alone that he's not swearing allegiance to a bunch of a-holes? If he does indeed have faith, then I guess that is enough. How else can a blind leap be described?

No, but it was a question you asked, and one i saw and responded to. Sorry, usually I don't post on these sort of thrads except for the info I actually have or am sure of. Must be getting tired.

reply to post by RuneSpider


No, it's cool. I don't think there is a *right* answer to the question. I just want to make sure the question is clear because I think it is a worthwhile one. All I ask is a good faith opinion.

The fact is, I have been making phone calls and efforts to get into the local blue lodge, myself. I have my own reasons now, but the question is still important. Don't you think?

[edit on 12-7-2008 by applebiter]

How about I approach it from this angle:

1. Any oath, obligation, promise, etc. is only as good as the sincerity of the person making it.
   
2. All candidates who take the obligation are told "...before you can proceed further in our customs, it becomes necessary for you to take upon yourself a solemn obligation, which I, as Worshipful Master of this lodge, assure you will not interfere with your duty to God, your country, your neighbor or yourself. With this assurance, are you willing to proceed?"
   
3. Likewise, after having taken the obligation, in the Charge to the Entered Apprentice Mason, you are told:

   
   There are three great duties which, as a Mason, you are charged to inculcate—to God, your neighbor, and yourself. To God, in never mentioning His name but with that reverential awe, which is due from a creature to his Creator; to implore His aid in all your laudable undertakings, and to esteem Him as the chief good. To your neighbor, in acting upon the square, doing unto him as your wish he should do unto you; and to yourself, in avoiding all irregularity and intemperance, which may impair your faculties, or debase the dignity of your profession. A zealous attachment to these duities will insure public and private esteem.
   
   As a citizen, you are to be a quiet and peaceable subject, true to your government, and just to your country; you are not to countenance disloyalty or rebellion, but patiently submit to legal authority, and conform with cheerfulness to the government of the country in which you live.

   The Monitor of the Lodge

Will there be some men who don't learn the lessons or take them to heart? Certainly. We're all imperfect, but as a whole, it's up to each individual who hears those words to do his best to live by them, and THAT is Masonry. So long as there are more men who believe those teachings, and pass them on to the new initiates, Masonry as a whole cannot be corrupt.

(It's kind of like my whole argument of why there can't be secret "high-level" Masons pulling the strings... If we're ALL taught that the 3rd degree is the highest degree, then why would we pay any attention to someone who say's he's something else? How would we take orders, or more to the point, why would we listen beyond simple courtesy we'd extend to any brother.)

My grandfather was in the Masons. He joined it for the sense of fraternity. I think many people join them to help with charity work. Only the higher echelons would be privy to the secrets (if there were any), not the main levels who join. If you join thinking they will take you to the Reptillian/alien who runs it, I think you will be disappointed.

I doubt any hardliners here will believe me, but I'll toss this in anyways.

First of all, one must consider the age of a Freemason in 2008 is generally around 50 - often times older (not to say there are no younger ones, mind you; just not nearly as many.) The Freemasons do not actively recruit, instead there's the creed, 'To be one, ask one'. So what you see here is a sort of social atmosphere ... you either have an older relative who is a Mason or you work with one and eventually ask about it out of curiosity.

Any Mason will tell you what the purpose of modern Freemasonry is right off; to make good men better, by reinforcing morality, ethics and social goodwill. There's no illuminati, no conspiracies.

It really is that simple.

It is done with respect, dignity, and reverence to religion, community, patriotism. It's really a no brainer as to why so many of the mature population are sympathetic to such ideals, as it hearkens back to an era before the deconstruction of America and Americans was in vogue.

The Shriners are an extension of the Lodge, sort of a playground for Masons wealthy enough to afford it's benefits ... but they simply play as hard as they work ... go to any Shriner's Hospital to see that.

Now, this is not to say there aren't fringe benefits to being a Mason ... but to think that just because someone is a lodge brother or has been one, that suddenly the world is your oyster and all your wishes come true through such a connection - it's just not so. Masons are just regular folks, like any other social club member ... doctors, lawyers, indian chiefs ... The Elks or the Moose or even the VFW, sans the alcohol and a bit more studious.

Have there been Presidents that have been Masons; of course. Really that's a bit like saying Lawyers and Generals have been Presidents too; the difference only being those professions hold allot more sway in reality than simply being a Master Mason does.

While each Lodge is under a Grand Lodge ... this hardly indicates any sort of real unity. In fact, unless one frequents other lodges regularly, one has no idea what they are doing. It's hardly a tight organization in any sense.

Honestly, Masons are far too busy voting on what flavors of ice cream to serve at their next Ice Cream Social rather than being any threat to your personal freedoms, i.e. Illuminati, Skull and Bones, et al.
Even then, it might take a few weeks to hammer out such details ... lol.

But why all the secrecy? Aside from proving the integrity of the individual, it's a PR thing and always has been. There are no real secrets in Freemasonry anymore, what with the internet being what it is. The 'secret' is what binds these men in brotherhood and gives them a sense of belonging. It also creates interest in the group, to non members ... for instance ... 'What's this all about anyways? ..."

Really folks, there's nothing to it, despite what David Icke or any other 'conspiracy master' tells you.

TFD.

Hey applebiter, while I appreciate your response to my post, you are missing the point I made with regards to Faith. Part of becoming a part of any group will entail a faith that the group is what you are looking for. Your analogy re the old businessman is valid, however, if anyone were to complete the first degree of Masonry, which explains the core beliefs of the craft, and does not agree with the tenets put forth, is able to step away and disconnect with no further obligation required. Those who choose to go forward will gain expanded knowledge based on the tenets inculcated in that initial degree, and furthermore, are able to step out at any time should they not agree with the lessons of Masonry. I alluded to some of the negative posts I have seen, perhaps as a knee jerk reaction, but my point was that there are no hidden deep dark sinister facets of Masonry, which goes back to your old businessman story. Your question is a very valid one, but every man who becomes a mason will give you a different answer as to why they joined the fraternity.

Peace

Freemasonry does not recruit.

At all.

We ONLY accept those who ASK to join .. meaning they where searching for something and felt Masonry was right for them.

Why do people join?

Infinite reasons. Some like the comradeship .. some like the history .. some want to do good in the community.. some want a social club .. some are looking for something constructive to do with their time .. some perhaps joined because their father and grand father where Masons. .

EVERY Mason has his own reasons, and few are ever alike.

If you fear taking an oath (which is nothing more then a swear to RESPECT the institution) ...

Masonry is not for you and I would encourage you to stay away from it.

I don't know about you, but words spoken would never interfere with my religious duties.. and quite honestly if it effected anyone, I would hazard a guess your religious beliefs are weak and hanging by a thread to begin with.

Probably so they can wear funny hats and drink cheaper priced cheap beer and avoid the "'ol battle axe" at home.

I am in the middle of joining my local lodge, there is no cult at least at this one in American terms its like joining the local 'Country Club'. Its pro family and pro religion, nothing sinister no blood oaths etc.

At my induction they told me about the various rituals which are intended to be a form of 'spoken history', i think they are most scared of it dying off because of all the conspiracy stories etc have given it a bad public image.

Most people join because the are looking to develop business contacts as am i, also for somthing to do i am in my thirties single and with a lot of spare time as most of my friends have families these days.

I think people seek to become Freemasons because they want to be in the company of like-minded people who seek to achieve and who have similar goals of bettering themselves and helping mankind.

Because people like to eat and drink with friends. Really, go to any lodge on a meeting night and just watch the people going in.

Even if you have to swear secrecy, you only have to swear you won't reveal the specific signs used for recognizing each other, the contents of the ceremonies is a fuzzy area.

Also, masons aren't allowed to let 'the craft' get in the way of their family or lives.

You aren't obligated to stay a freemason either.

So, where is the moral contradiction there?

my grandfather was in the freemasons, but I know nothing about his experiences with it.

It seems like a brotherhood or fraternity of individuals, nothing more.. people meet, have get togethers, etc.. great food, good times, goood connections.. nothing more, nothing less...

[edit on 7/12/2008 by porky1981]

I've got some family thats in and also worked with a few guys who were in, and independantly they say all they do is get drunk, go visit other lodges (to get drunk), do charity work etc

I really don't think theres any conspiracy amongst the masons other than they make new friends a contacts through it who can scratch their back through life

No more sinister than being a golf club member imo

Because its fun to do.
ha

reply to post by applebiter


People swear oaths of secrecy in every college fraternity and sorority. In the Elks, and in the Odd Fellows. Heck, even the boy scouts has a branch where members are sworn to secrecy.

People join freemasonry for the same reason they join the above organizations. They find some sort of common bond or have researched the organization and find themselves aligned with what it stands for. You can find out what a organization is about before joining it, even if you may not know the precise details. Since you can leave at any time for any reason, there is nothing to lose from joining.

[edit on 12-7-2008 by ALightinDarkness]

I originally joined in order to exploit the brotherhood in my unquenchable bloodthirst for power, riches and total world domination, ever keen to enslave the ignorant. Then I realized its not about that at all and found fellowship, mutual respect and the values of kindness and uprightness in daily life.

Originally posted by Malevolent_Aliens
Swearing oaths in secrecy ARE against many religions out there including Christianity. Didn't Jesus himself say not to swear by anything on earth or in heaven?

I am a Christian, and this is one part of the dogma that irritates me when people try to use it against masonry. Every Christian today has sworn a oath. Citizenship is an oath, even if you never take the oath personally. Marriage is an oath. Going to court, you often have to swear an oath.

And yet, no one claims this is wrong because....?

reply to post by ALightinDarkness

Heck, even the boy scouts has a branch where members are sworn to secrecy.

The OA was founded by Freemasons.