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Man claims to know source of Phoenix Lights UFO sighting (Video)

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posted on Jul, 10 2008 @ 10:44 AM
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Good Day Forumerions,

Not only does 'Dr. James R. Bartzen' claim to know the origin of the Phoenix Lights UFOs, he encompasses "all UFOs!"


An astrophysicist claims to know the true source of a strange grouping of lights that appeared in the Arizona night sky 11 years ago.
Dr. James R. Bartzen said he has indisputable proof that the so-called "Phoenix Lights" were a product of secret man-made technology being shielded from the public.

He works at the Russian-American Institute of Space Science.

"There are no theories, there is only evidence," Bartzen told ABC15. "The government desires people to believe in space aliens so they don't have to reveal the technologies that both we and the Russians have."


The rest of the story . . .

Cheers,
Frank

[edit on 10-7-2008 by Frank Warren]




posted on Jul, 10 2008 @ 10:52 AM
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if indeed, all the 'ufos' people are seeing are man made vehicles, it raises the question: "where did we get the brain bravado to design these futuristic machines?"

if the pace by which modern science is going doesn't permit for these craft to do what they do (90degree angle turns at heart attack speeds), then it's logical to assume that indeed something or someone taught to us these methods by either classroom or reverse engineering of something that either crash landed in say... roswell new mexico.

this is a piece of disclosure however. thank you for linking us to this article.



posted on Jul, 10 2008 @ 11:03 AM
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I'm really not sure I buy this guys story. If he is an astro physics super secret space genius protoge like he appears to be, then he certainly hasn't done his research on UFO accounts from credible sources.

1) His claim that aliens don't exist is convenient. He has conveniently neglected to inquire to other highers ups within his own military about the existence of ET.

2) ".....There are no more classified secrets between international space agencies..." Not sure i buy that either.

3) "No theories....only evidence".....Evidence? Thats convenient 10+ years later when we cant go back in time (when apparently there were classified secrets between space agencies) and explain why our govt. would choose to fly its own highly classified ship over populated airspace and then say it was flares. Right. Got it.



posted on Jul, 10 2008 @ 11:08 AM
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reply to post by Frank Warren
 


This certainly appears to blow the "flares" explanation out of the water no?


Springer...



posted on Jul, 10 2008 @ 11:09 AM
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I don't believe that the pheonix lights were of alien origin. all the video's and all the accounts don't support evidence of alien craft, infact it's movement patterns, and flight paths seem very terrestrial. you know, f-16's do more alien things than the pheonix lights did.

some ufo sightings, i'm sure, this guy would not have an answer to, but the pheonix lights, not alien.



posted on Jul, 10 2008 @ 11:15 AM
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Originally posted by Springer
reply to post by Frank Warren
 


This certainly appears to blow the "flares" explanation out of the water no?


Springer...


I'm willing to believe that the PHX lights could be a govt. project. But why would they deliberately do it over civilian airspace and then say it were flares?

Not only that, but the man claiming all of this has apparently decided for the whole planet that there are no aliens, despite the testimony of people within his own ranks. Seems like a pretty quick leap of reasoning to me. Feels like mostly ego gratification and less real nuts n bolts truth.



posted on Jul, 10 2008 @ 11:19 AM
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why would the gov't say they're flares? hmmm lets see.

angry mob comes to their door step saying "if that wasn't you what was it?"
if gov't says "aliens" then they'll have to reveal what they actually know
if the gov't says "oh it's a secret project" they'll likely have to reveal what it is, or atleast let the world know by saying so that they have crazy secret technology
or, if the gov't says "oh they're flares guys" then they laugh at our gullibility, and keep their secret project secret.

my logic is flawed, but seriously, why would the gov't admit to it being a test flight for some super tech? the people in pheonix would be pissed that tech was being tested over their homes.



posted on Jul, 10 2008 @ 11:23 AM
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Originally posted by Crabmeat
why would the gov't say they're flares? hmmm lets see.

angry mob comes to their door step saying "if that wasn't you what was it?"
if gov't says "aliens" then they'll have to reveal what they actually know
if the gov't says "oh it's a secret project" they'll likely have to reveal what it is, or atleast let the world know by saying so that they have crazy secret technology
or, if the gov't says "oh they're flares guys" then they laugh at our gullibility, and keep their secret project secret.

my logic is flawed, but seriously, why would the gov't admit to it being a test flight for some super tech? the people in pheonix would be pissed that tech was being tested over their homes.


You seemed to have forgotten that there's a whole lot of desert in Arizona to test things like this. Not to mention Nevada. It still makes no sense to me to fly this stuff over civilian airspace unless you are actually doing to test public reaction of seeing a highly classified ship. Not so classified anymore, I guess?

[edit on 10-7-2008 by NightVision]



posted on Jul, 10 2008 @ 11:24 AM
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I noticed that Mr. Bartzen is selling tickets to his big disclosure event July 19th. 30 dollars for non-reserved seating, 50 dollars for reserved seating. One meal and one drink included at The Red Planet Diner.


I have no idea if this guy is right or not, and I think it is highly possible that some of the UFO sightings are actually sightings of military and man made crafts. But personally I get a bit suspicious when people are out to make money on their claims.

Link to the invitation: www.russianamericaninstituteofspacescience.com...



posted on Jul, 10 2008 @ 11:25 AM
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"It was flares!!!!!! I have seen those lights just like the Phoenix lights as far back as the 1980s. Flares."

That's from someone in the comments section of the article.



posted on Jul, 10 2008 @ 11:26 AM
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you're right on the money

why would the military create any sort of new military tech if not to use it on people?

it'd be too expensive, and too risky to fly the thing across the atlantic to test it out on people who are not americans.

Just look at it this way, in the Battle of LA the object was not US military in origin, and the navy responded in short notice.

the pheonix lights, which were seen for hours, were not shot at by a single weapon. why? because the military knew about the test.



posted on Jul, 10 2008 @ 11:32 AM
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Originally posted by Crabmeat
you're right on the money

why would the military create any sort of new military tech if not to use it on people?

it'd be too expensive, and too risky to fly the thing across the atlantic to test it out on people who are not americans.

Just look at it this way, in the Battle of LA the object was not US military in origin, and the navy responded in short notice.

the pheonix lights, which were seen for hours, were not shot at by a single weapon. why? because the military knew about the test.


Fair enough, but this 'test has been done many times before. In fact. Thousands. Thousands of reports have come in, claiming a person saw a UFO that was really govt. tech. This guy seems all to willing to charge 50 bucks a head for his presentation, but lets see what happens when you ask him why they flew it over public and highly populated airspace.



posted on Jul, 10 2008 @ 11:34 AM
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How much sightings does Russia, Europe, China, and India have per year?

If we can get those figures, compare them to sightings recorded per year in the US, we might able to determine that this is just really us/eu shared technology.



posted on Jul, 10 2008 @ 11:38 AM
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reply to post by Crabmeat
 


If you look at it from another point of view, back in the LA incident, we didn't have much if any knowlege of "ET", after many encounters, the powers in charge have a much better idea of the "unknown".
I am not so interested in the lights themselves, as I am of the reports of the Giant ship that was not photographed. there is my 1.2 cents worth.



posted on Jul, 10 2008 @ 11:40 AM
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i didnt know about that costly presentation bs.

but you asked why fly it over such a highly populated area? well ask yourself just that, why would they?

a few reasons that i can come up with off the top of my head follow:

a. to see how the populace would react
b. to scare people just for #s and giggles (you think they care about scaring people?)
c. someone who was prominent in the crafts design told them 'fly it here, i'll be in pheonix and i want to see the craft fly over my head'
d. to throw people off about the crafts true purpose

there's tons more that i can fart out. the fact of the matter is, the object didn't exhibit any out of this world capability, and the gov't saying their flares is a a clear slap in the face, "i'm not telling", meaning they do know.
if it was indeed a UFO, i doubt they'd use such a silly explanation.



posted on Jul, 10 2008 @ 11:45 AM
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Originally posted by Crabmeat

if it was indeed a UFO, i doubt they'd (the govt)use such a silly explanation.


Ever read the Warren Commission Report?

Roswell "Weather Balloons"?

J. Allen Hynek's "UFO's are swamp gas..." theory?

Happens all the time.

$50 to hear a guy say that the PHX lights are a govt. craft? I hear alarm bells ringing everywhere.



posted on Jul, 10 2008 @ 11:47 AM
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Good Day Mark,


Originally posted by Springer
reply to post by Frank Warren
 


This certainly appears to blow the "flares" explanation out of the water no?


Springer...


No it doesn't at all. There is a boat load of evidence that supports the notion that the "10:00 pm" videos were indeed flares; however, that certainly doesn't negate the activity in the "8:00 pm hour" as well the reports from earlier that day, as well as all of the other similar reports nationally in the month of March of that year (of large "V-shaped objects").

In playing devil's advocate, so far what we've seen from this fellow is "great advertising" for his upcoming talk . . .

Cheers,
Frank



posted on Jul, 10 2008 @ 11:48 AM
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I think this is a "stall story".

We constantly get "programmed" with article like these just to make us doubt. In other words, "they" see to it that different kinds of theroies and "disclosures" gets out just so we ( believers ) don't know what to believe anymore.

I have a VERY hard time to believe that ever sighting of UFO are man made.

Some most likely are, no disclosure dude have never denied that.

We also have to remember that the people of Arizone did not ONLY see these lights. They also saw a HUGE black "shape" fly over them, silently.

And I don't understand why they would like to test a flying vehicle on people? For what reason? They never did anything? They were just hovering above their air space. What is there to test? ???

Beats me.

This might have been a military testing sure. But one should not generelize every sighting to be a testing event.

Just look at the NASA videos out there.

They are most extraordinary in my opinion.
So to me this article does not convince me in anyway that Aliens do NOT exist. Cause to me it is more impossible that they don't.



posted on Jul, 10 2008 @ 11:53 AM
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Good Day Crabmeat,


Originally posted by Crabmeat
I don't believe that the pheonix lights were of alien origin. all the video's and all the accounts don't support evidence of alien craft, infact it's movement patterns, and flight paths seem very terrestrial. you know, f-16's do more alien things than the pheonix lights did.

some ufo sightings, i'm sure, this guy would not have an answer to, but the pheonix lights, not alien.


Based on your statements, I would suggest that you re-familiarize yourself with the event; witness reports in the "8:00 hour" do everything "but" describe anything conventional or terrestrial, based on current technology, and or anything we (man) have in the inventory.

Cheers,
Frank



posted on Jul, 10 2008 @ 12:08 PM
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Frank,

the scientific community is like congress. they're there for show. the real workings of the government are concealed. when they deem it time to reveal a piece of information then they reveal it. for all we know (and this is very likely as i remember reading many articles about it) a cure for cancer, a DEFINITE cure has been found, only it was black boxed because cancer will help with the elimination of a large portion of the overpopulated human race.
the same applies to things other than medicine. if we had the capability to fly to Mars in under an hour, it wouldn't be revealed because we're not ready for that technology to be mainstreamed.



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