The Secret-Positive Thinking Sucks

Originally posted by jackinthebox
I think this whole "movement" is very dangerous brainwashing. With any good brainwashing there is some truth in it, but the overall results are contrary to what is good for people.

Dude... Seriously. What isn't dangerous brainwashing? Almost everything is, from your upbringing, to your tv etc... Have you ever thought of that?

If you don't have what you need, it's your own fault. You're not thinking right. You're not really applying the secret. You have not fully unlocked your potential. Blah blah blah. All this does is allows the powerful to escape any responsibility to the masses. If you're starving to death, it's not the fault of the corrupt government and mismanaged economy. It is your fault for not being grateful. What a load of horseapples.

So you'd rather do the blaming game, which is IMO a total waste of time and resources (although I still find myself doing exactly that sometimes, call me a hypocrite) than take full responsibility for your own life.

And even better yet, you can even use this in your own family. Don't feel guilty about not helping your family when they are in need.

Uhm wrong... Remember the Golden rule of all of the ancient religions? Do unto others? Well when you help people you are showing that you have the means and the ways to help people, which will bring you in more situations in which you will be able to help more people. It's that simple. If you want money, give other people money. If you want help, give other people help. You want to be happy, make other people happy. etc...

It's divide and conquer, at $49.95 a copy.

The information is also available for free on the net.

Btw.. It's not New Age. Although New agey huggy feely people are trying to take advantage of it.

reply to post by TheBandit795


While I agree that in principle, it makes sense, in the hands of many, it does become a victim-blaming strategy for people who have become severely ill, disabled, or have survived violent crime. The basic thought process goes: If The Secret or whatever works, then they must have been doing something wrong for those things to have happened to them, and therefore they must deserve it.

Maybe you don't feel that way (although your "take responsibility for your own life" indicates to me that you might), but a lot of people feel that way without something like The Secret or a belief in the Power of Positive Thinking.

reply to post by asilvahalo


IMO the problem lies with the limiting beliefs the majority of us were forced to adopt when we were children. The majority of people will have those beliefs until they die. Causing the same situations to happen time and time again.

Let's say you're a 3-4 year old child and your parents are arguing, your father calls your mother "worthless". You as a child will not understand that he's talking to your mother and not to you. At that point you believe all communication going around you is about you. You take it to heart as a strong core belief, which will bring experiences to you throughout your life that will prove that you are indeed worthless. You will be in a deadbeat job for example with a boss who is constantly screaming at you how worthless you are. You will have an abusive spouse, you will develop a debilitating disease which will cause you to feel worthless.

Unless you are finally able to change your core belief about that situation, you will keep attracting into your reality the feeling that you are and forever will be worthless, and all evidences of that. That's how it works. With untrained people (like myself) their subconscious minds control their thoughts and actions. A simple reprogramming of their subconscious will cause them to have different thoughts, act in different ways to situations and create a different life.

To put it short. You have an operating system that is mostly programmed during your early childhood. This operating system is the main cause of your life. And to change your life you have to upgrade it. If you have Windows 98 in your subconscious, to experience a better life it has to be upgraded to Windows XP (forget Vista.. I hate Vista )

So I'm not saying that the victim has to be blamed for his or her fate. Far from that. What I'm saying is that the victim simply does not now that because of his/her beliefs he/she is attracting their own fate. You can only blame someone when they are doing something consciously IMO. They are not doing it consciously, their subconscious beliefs are the cause of it.

Originally posted by bringthelight
i never believed it until it worked for me. Its not as easy as "thinking happy thoughts." You have to come to terms with the fact that you are attracting the bad stuff that happens to you , and thats too much to handle for most people. I got really interested when i started looking into quantum physics aspect of it all. There is solid scientific evidence to back it all up and like I said it really worked for me. It takes awhile and a lot of visualization but i had two amazing things happen to me that freaked me out and made me believe in the secret wholeheartedly.

I didn't believe this hokey thing would possibly work for me and resisted jumping on "The Secret" bandwagon. Then I found that I was constantly seeing references to the Law of Attraction in my spiritual quest, so I decided to investigate. That title appealed to me more than any 'secret' book touted by Oprah Winfrey, so I started reading books by other authors and began to undertand the principles behind the law.

I sincerely gave it a try and I am amazed at how well this seems to work for me, too. I have received money in the exact amounts I needed. My daughter's grades improved once I decided that she would do better without my interference. But it's my latest success that has me convinced.

I lost contact with a dear friend almost 3 years ago. She had moved and I had no phone # or address for her. About a month ago I set my intention that she would be able to find me because I have had the same phone number for 20 years. I felt the great feeling I would have when I finally talked to her again and then I let it go. She called last night and said she had been thinking about me non-stop for a month and finally Googled me and found my phone number. I know its a small thing, but for me its a mini miracle.

If you don't have yourself in order emotionally, mentally, physically and spiritually, positive thinking doesn't work. You have to be at peace with yourself in order for the positives to really start manifesting themselves. It's a hard process that most will never have the will to endure.

I'm still striving for it myself.

Peace

reply to post by jackinthebox


People throw around new age like they knew what they were talking about but ask them where it came from and they have no clue at all. That is a whole other topic, for another time.

Well I don't usually mention any of those works myself. I refer to the four gospels, the method of prayer in private to be rewarded openly, the ask believe and receive, and the parable of the talents.

Some peoples talents have been canceled out through refusal to use them.

But Jackinthebox, this reply is specific to you. Look at your threads 'jacked up by the police' and read the descriptions of your actions. The broken window was an accident, but was it really? You had been involved in an ongoing feud for a while there.

To be more precise, you created by default. The settings were anger resentment and lack of care or respect for your fellow man. You harbored these feelings and believed to to point of action. You did indeed use the LOA but it was used by the default value of what you harbored inside. You indeed manifested a situation and set in motion the chain of events that lead to the broken window, accident or not.

Choose to create in the proper manner by changing you inside and harbor the proper feelings for your fellow man. You will be very surprised when you make the effort. Your headed down the dark side, and its a rapidly progressing spiral. Unload the attitude, and hate , jealousy and resentment and it will flip 180, but you have to give some time for all the bad that is already in motion to catch up so you can move past it.

What can you do with the law of attraction to fix your problem with the neighbors? You already had an event involving matter. (window) Buy them a vase of flowers and some sort of non edible utilitarian type of gift. Write a heartfelt apology on a card with your phone number and leave all on their doorstep. Possibly invite them for a beer if you have the brass ones to do so.
These are the people who become the greatest of allies in life when its all over. You are not so different from them, tell them so.


So to recap you do not feel it is working for you, but it is in fact working full force at your own default settings. Turn your knobs to a different setting and it will start working for you like it does for all these other folks with good reports. It works each time and every time without fail. Most however do not correlate what they did with what they got.

Best to you my friend. I hope this clicks and you understand.

I was skeptical for a while, but lately as I've come to an understanding of how it works, I've seen so many synchronicities that there's no way they can all be just coincidences.

Stop letting your subconscious create your world and start doing in consciously. Be mindful of your thoughts or they may betray you. Quiet the mind and do everything with intent.

reply to post by TheBandit795

Dude... Seriously. What isn't dangerous brainwashing? Almost everything is, from your upbringing, to your tv etc... Have you ever thought of that?

Of course. I wouldn't be here on ATS if I hadn't.

Seriously though, I think this stuff is more dnagerous than most of the routine brainwashing. It is hitting the mainstream at a crucial point in the history of civilization and the development of Man's spirit. I was taken in by it at first, as were many members of my family. Now I am the only one out of all of them, to have cracked the psychosis to see the the more sinister aspects hidden behind a veil of hope, tranquility, happiness, etc.

So you'd rather do the blaming game, which is IMO a total waste of time and resources (although I still find myself doing exactly that sometimes, call me a hypocrite) than take full responsibility for your own life.

No man is an island. We all rely on eachother for something. And I resent it when people accuse me of "the blaming game" simply because I choose to have a voice and address the legitimate issues and problems that people face. Now I would agree that there are irresponsible people out there who should step up, but there are millions, even billions of people suffering each day through no fault of their own, but because of a select group of people who sit in a comfortable room making decisions on how they can retain their own wealth and power.

Uhm wrong... Remember the Golden rule of all of the ancient religions? Do unto others? Well when you help people you are showing that you have the means and the ways to help people, which will bring you in more situations in which you will be able to help more people. It's that simple. If you want money, give other people money. If you want help, give other people help. You want to be happy, make other people happy. etc...

Believe me, I am all for charity, and helping my fellow Man. That is exactly what broke me of this form of brainwashing. I forget who the guy was, but he was on Larry King one night talking about all this stuff. And he told a woman in the audience to let her friends and family to fall by the wayside. That she should not allow herself to be hindered by them. That they had to allow themselves to become "enlightened." So, as I said, divide and conquer.

reply to post by Illahee

Look at your threads 'jacked up by the police' and read the descriptions of your actions. The broken window was an accident, but was it really? You had been involved in an ongoing feud for a while there.

Yes, it was really an accident. And I wouldn't call what was ongoing there as a "feud." So once again, I see the blame the victim mentality appear. Somehow it is my fault that I was violently attacked and beaten by people who are supposed to be the protectors of our community.

Buy them a vase of flowers and some sort of non edible utilitarian type of gift. Write a heartfelt apology on a card with your phone number and leave all on their doorstep. Possibly invite them for a beer if you have the brass ones to do so.

Let me add another detail to this case then, to highlight what sort of person I really am. Only days before this incident, I overheard the couple talking on their front porch at about two in the morning, when I went to take out a bag of trash. They were arguing a bit, because the man had to be to the hospital in the morning, having already been in the hospital for a few weeks. I don't know what ailed him, but I was concerned about the fact that they did not even have the money to buy the gasoline to get him there.

Now I am not a rich person by far. But I dug into my pocket, and gave them fifteen dollars to make sure that they could get to the hospital in the morning. Not because i was expecting something in return, or some good fortune to rain down on me, but because it was the right thing to do.

Dr Love wrote:

If you don't have yourself in order emotionally, mentally, physically and spiritually, positive thinking doesn't work. You have to be at peace with yourself in order for the positives to really start manifesting themselves. It's a hard process that most will never have the will to endure.

You got it exactly right. To make "positive thinking" and manifestation work, you have to look at your own demons and clear all the subconscious debris out of you. Good news is, you don't have to be squeaky "clean" to get started on manifestation -- it's enough to have a well-working insight into your own psychology, your special "buttons" that can get easily pushed, etc.

Also, wishing for a luxury motorcycle doesn't quite seem the thing to ask for, IMO. That's the kind of self-centered bullsh** the universe doesn't support. There are rules for manifestation, and you have to know them to make it work for you.

It seem to me there is a bit of a tug-of-war going on here.

On one hand there are age-old principles which can be employed to better align oneself to the natural laws of the universe and thereby achieve a state of contentment and security.

On the other hand there is a new age movement keen to capitalise on people's discontent with their lives by selling drivel puporting to be a key to using those principles to satisfy every whim and fancy.

I guess that as long as people seek quick fix ways to one-up on their neighbours there will be an army of shonky gurus to feed their desires.

Also, wishing for a luxury motorcycle doesn't quite seem the thing to ask for, IMO. That's the kind of self-centered bullsh** the universe doesn't support.

Oh, I don't know about that, Sylvie... My (own and observed) experiences don't seem to confirm that.

And, after all, we are, each one of us, the ONLY "centre" we have. In a very real sense, each one of us not only IS the "centre of the universe" but also its creator.

Again, I am not speaking in metaphors (I rarely do).

An individual mind cannot function without itself as a point of reference.
(It can exist but not function AS an individual mind.)

And being an individual mind, one has all kinds of experiences and desires that are there for a reason.

I don't think there is anything inherently "bad" - let me rephrase that: nothing inherently non Universe-serving (I bet now you're sorry I rephrased it, eh? ) - about desiring material things that give us pleasure, unless attracting them into our life would inflict damage on somebody else.
(After all, why DO things give us pleasure? It's not a purely physical thing - in fact, it's anything BUT. Through them we address, resolve and DISCOVER all kinds of issues - and, ideally, gain insights - that are far too subtle to be dealt with by means of ratiocination.)

It goes without saying that an obsession with material things leads nowhere fast - but that's a different issue.







[edit on 23-5-2008 by Vanitas]

I can vouch for positive thinking ala The Secret actually working. It's taken awhile to kick in but I am having things fall in my lap now that I dreamed about for a long long time. I don't see anything dangerous about The Secret at all. It's almost funny, in hindsight, how hard I used to make life for myself.

Your life is a reflection of your perspective on it. If you go around seeing things as being terrible, they inherently will be.

That doesn't mean I can manifest things.

I can beat a tambourine all day long but that doesn't make me a musician. (and why does that thought always remind me of John Lear? Sorry, off topic.)

I have this life, right now. I can spend it wailing about the injustice of it all or I can be happy and grateful for the moment.

It's possible this one life I have will be the only one I have. I won't waste it on the negative things that will make it seem a curse.

I'm going to smell the roses, Grow my garden, Love my children, Have interesting conversations with the fascinating people I meet, share what I have learned with my kindred souls on ATS, Love being in the moment for it may be all I have.

If you want to walk around seeing the world as a terrible place, thats your choice.

Just ignore the guy who's laughing and smiling and having fun as he walks past you.

That would be me.

Honestly, I could never understand the whole "Positive thinking" thing. At least not the way it's written in those books.

This is what I see:

Negative thinking: "I wish my band would make it big already! I'm sick of playing local shows!"

Positive thinking: "We're a really good band, and we get lots of compliments! Hopefully we can make it big someday!"

I don't believe that Positive Thought can make things materialize out of thin air, however I do believe in what Anton LaVey calls "Lesser Magic":

From The Satanic Bible
Non-ritual or manipulative magic, sometimes called "LESSER MAGIC," consists of the wile and guile obtained through various devices and contrived situations, which when utilized, can create "change, in accordance with one's will." In olden times this would be called "fascination," "glamour," or the "evil eye."

Ever notice that most millionaires are very charismatic? I'm not, and I'm broke. If you carry yourself with a positive attitude and self worth, you recieve more. If you appear doubtful with a negative attitude, people ignore you and blow you off (personal experience). THIS is what "Positive Thinking" is really about.

reply to post by mrwupy


lol... yeah, what you said. Damn us artists, always wallowing around in our heads... makes communication difficult

The gist of books like The Secret, and other self-help notables, such as Deepak Chopra, can be simply stated as a mere pimping of the language. A controversial book debunking all self-help, including the Secret and its so-called Law of Attraction, is going to be in print Sep 1 2008. The website www.pauldamien.net has details for those who are interested.

Originally posted by TheBandit795
If you want money, give other people money.

I think this is why its dangerous to some. Its easy to manipulate people who are desperate into thinking that if just think happy thoughts... and give $ to their "church", they can begin to receive whatever they want. And as time goes on, they just need to give a little more.

2 observations:

I don't hear about anyone behind "the Secret" passing around plates asking for money.

Until you learn to love yourself you can never really have a deep realtionship with another lover. I feel the world works this way with each of us as well. We have so much we are spoiled.

Originally posted by alchemy

The Secret-Positive Thinking Sucks

I read the OP, and in the eternal words of Giuseppe franco: "I don't own this product, in fact I don't know anything about it."

However if the title is anything to go by, I think you might be doing it wrong.

As for positive thoughts my take is relatively simple:

There's nothing in the universe, no matter how beautiful or miraculous, that thought, given enough time, will not destroy.
Liberating the mind of thought itself, triggers true knowledge.
I'm still working on it. Non-dualism is an elusive mistress.