Your Sigil Results, this stuff works!

reply to post by Earthscum


Very nice idea about the history of all this. Couldn't agree more. Why though has this all been SO well hidden? I have personally been reading about it for years but never tried it. This does seem in retrospect to be absurd.

I wonder whether the fact that much of this is associated with underground movements hasn't imbued it with "don't do it, talk about it or admit you're doing it" type of label, mainly to keep it secret and underground in times when it was wiser to do so. Thoughts?

reply to post by Cythraul


Basically, you want to forget about it instead of dwelling on it waiting for results. Like I told a member in U2U, it's like when you are a kid on x-mas eve... the sooner you go to sleep, the sooner Santa will show up. You are excited to know what you got for xmas, but you have to put it out of your head and sleep. You know the presents will be there, but if you keep expecting great things for presents, you will be disappointed. Somehow you have to get what the presents are out of your head so you can sleep. That's all. If you ask for money to help pay for your mother's surgery, don't sit around thinking about it after charging the sigil, but you will still have that intent in your heart. Keep trying for yourself to obtain that money, and most likely the sigil will work in your favor and something may happen, be it a charitable donation from someone who doesn't even know your family, or you get news of a family inheritance that has been recently discovered, etc. Like Grant said, if you make a sigil to win the lottery, you better have had bought a lottery ticket! If you completely forget about your sigil, then you've also forgotten your intent.

I apologize, but it is about as hard to explain that as it is to explain an acid trip to someone who has never touched their mind with altering substances.

reply to post by Earthscum


This kind of thing is EXTREMELY difficult to explain but I must say you have done a pretty good job! Far better than some attempts of mine in the past.

Many of these things, like your acid analogy, are hard to explain/understand because they require a shift in perspective or of paradigm. The best way to solve this that I know of is to try the thing in question. I am a firm believer in the idea that intellectual understanding must be combined with emotional understanding (understanding being equivalent to experience or knowing in this instance) and that it is only the combination of the two that produce tru experience or Gnosis or experiential knowledge.

Sorry if this more confusing than the original subject!

reply to post by Kupios


Honestly, I think (my gf and I just ahd this discussion like 10 seconds ago!) the demonization of paganism, satanism, etc. comes from the idea that so many religions fall back to their faith in 'bibles'. "My bible is good, and I deal with my God directly, and he provides for me. You appear to gain things that my god does not provide me, thusly you must be obtaining it from an evil source". That is not just christian or catholic or muslim, etc... that is almost all religions. MHO is that religion itself is suppressive to one's true spiritual being, much like being a self-proclaimed Skeptic closes a person's mind to even attemting things... an argument I've heard (paraphrasing, of course) was that "I tried it, and it didn't work for me... see? It doesn't work, and I proved it!". My counter to that is that you have set your mind that it isn't going to work... just like the Bicycle analogy, which I'll take a bit farther. If I truely thing that I will wreck, I will probably wreck, even if subconsciously, just to prove the other person wrong. See? I really can't ride a bike without wrecking! Neither can you! Basically it's bad philosophy (ironic since a good skeptic adheres strongly to philosophy). Then, again... everything is a double edged sword. Like the difference between Black and White magic. There IS NO DIFFERENCE EXCEPT IN THE INTENT OF THE MAJICK. I can build a house with a hammer, but I can also use that same tool to dismantle a house.


Btw, I don't think you made anything more confusing. By restating things in different ways, you simply open up the explanation to more audiences. They may not understand a word of what I said, but they may understand your wording for it

Edit: just want to note for others... majick, in all it's forms, are based on nature, natural things, and natural occurances. I' personally, don't believe in a creator of ME. This body I inhabit was created from the earth. The seeds were sown into the ground and grew to grains which fed my mother and the animals my mother ate. Those grains and meats are what my body was made from, therefore I am personally born of the earth, and the earth is my priority, as it should be others. I don't believe (in the context of god entities) that a god would save someone if they weren't willing to save themselves first. Saving yourself includes saving the earth for the future generations out of respect for past generations making it possible for you to be born. It's a cycle. Majick beliefs stemmed from this. Your intent within sigils should reflect this. Greed comes when you want something for yourself just for that purpose. If I wished for money, it is with the intent that I can distribute that wealth in other ways to the less fortunate, if nothing else, simply because I wouldn't be a slave to a job, and I could possibly create new jobs for people who need them, or volunteer to help build or repair someone's home with the free time. I would want to help complete the cycle, and help someone else to complete their cycle, and hope that they extend that to the next person. It's really all we have in life is the fullfillment of a birth to death cycle, and helping others enjoy that cycle.

[edit on 15-5-2008 by Earthscum]

Originally posted by Earthscum
reply to post by Cythraul

 

As The Parallelogram stated, sigils in music is so common that people don't realize they are doing it... especially when the music is a collaborative effort from the soul. I still like to use Incubus and Pink Floyd as examples. Incubus has an overall feeling in their music and lyrics that invoke feelings in the listener. Incubus' music actually has power to change people spiritually, intellectually, and emotionally. This is their intent, and they want to make the world a better place.

Hey Earthscum. I must thank you for taking the time to help me understand. Your 2nd post addressing my question about "keeping at it" clarified things perfectly for me. I'm vaguely familiar with sigil magick previous to this thread so the concept's not totally new to me. I just wanted a minor point clearing up.

Regarding musical sigils - I was referring specifically to exclusively musical sigils. I get the feeling you're talking about using music as an accompaniment to visual sigils. Is there a practical method for using musical composition as the actual sigil, with no drawing involved? You mentioned Pink Floyd and Incubus as being powerfully charged - I agree, I think music is often magickal whether the artist knows it or not. But Pink Floyd and Incubus' music won't have been charged with YOUR intent so surely they are useless for the purposes of declaring your own desire and only useful for heightening your emotional state - therefore they can only be used to compliment a visual sigil.

I'm wondering if anyone can give a practical example of how you might use musical composition as the sigil, with no drawn symbols involved at all. Or did I misinterpret what was said earlier? Is this even possible?

reply to post by Cythraul


Obviously I am not an expert as I haven't even gotten to the drawing of one yet, but I am operating on the belief that the phenomenon it is not mechanically connected to a drawing per se. I think it has more to do with intent and then doing something symbolically to further enhance or reinforce that intent. Hindu's, to my understanding, use an assortment of idols to support their connection to "God". In the end, the idol itself is not so much the "god" as a tool to an end. Similarly, the Sigil might just be a tool in the same way an idol is. I see no reason why any piece of music or even just sounds that have some special effect on you couldn't also be a tool to the same use as a Sigil, if it has the power to take your attention away from mundane life problems for the moment.
I can't say for sure if Sigil majick is more than the examples I've sighted until I have actually managed to do something with it.
However, I don't think the phenomenon is due to a hard and fast procedure. In my guess it probably has more to do with the power of intent than anything, along with summoning up whatever forces there might be out there in the ether to help make it happen. Like religion, its the base message that is important; not so much the specific rituals. Many approaches work there, why not with this?
Perhaps you can experiment and tell us.

reply to post by wayno


You might very well be right wayno. I personally feel that the drawing of the sigil could have at least two functions:

As a reflection/reminder of the intent

As a new symbolic depiction of an intent that would otherwise manifest itself differently. I.e. you are giving the intent a new dimension by working on it and drawing it.

Yeah, well the end to the means. You get out what you put into it. It is all about desire. More important is your ability to learn what you most desire. In comparison to the enormous forces of this world, our desires are tiny things, yet with the properly applied leverage, we can do tremendous things with well placed desires. Get my drift?

reply to post by Kupios


I,ve never heard of this what is it and how do you find it?

reply to post by Cythraul


Good reply by Wayno.

My theory on the music thing is basically that sound is geometric in nature. 4 beats per measure, 4 measures per line makes 4/4 time. Within those beats you can have triangles (triplets), squares (4 beats within the common beat), etc. I believe this is how the sigil is created. Tool uses strange time signatures, but they still happen within a harmonic range that the soul and body can attune to.
The song is the main structure of the sigil. Typically, a song will have intro (mood setter/time for the body to align harmonics), verse, chorus, verse, chorus, breakdown, verse, chorus repeated. This creates a sort of shape in itself. The verse has it's own shape to it via it's time signature. Each chorus has it's own shape, as well. The breakdown is a 'cool-off' period, like a space in a sentence. Also, you have an outtro. This is the ending of the song. The outtro should leave someone in another state of mind, similar to the point where you have thoughts totally clear and you are focused on the sigil and nothing else. This lets you move directly to the next song and forget the first song, such as you would practice while charging sigils. Also, each note has a hormonic resonance to adjacent notes. This is why some music sounds harsh, and some music sounds soothing... in the metal genre, harmonic balance is key to even making a song. The distortion is chosen by the player by how it sounds to him or her. 2 guitarists will tend to work really well together or be nearly polar opposites, and generally the 2 guitarists who work well together have distortions that are harmonically compatable... all depending on the equipment, of course. It's similar to how like souls will resonate together in harmony, and different souls will repel, like the gears don't mesh.

So, that's my theory. I've always created music based on the shapes it makes, and now I just may have an application for it beyond just entertaining the soul I haven't put it into practice yet, but plan to very soon. I think I may have just answered my own question as to why our songs don't feel as solid as we know they should (especially when we record).

BTW, I know it's gonna come up, so you can hear my band's music at 3WGBS - MySpace

Originally posted by wayno
Perhaps you can experiment and tell us.

Indeed. Thanks for your response. I suspected this to be the case and I've got little doubt that a musical sigil will be just as effective as a visual one. I was just wondering if anyone had used composition and could demonstrate how they went about the ritual. I have a pretty good idea as to how I'm going to go about it so I'll post up my results.

@ Earthscum:
Nice band you've got there. I've played in a couple myself and have always been the main riff and song writer, which is why I feel quite confident about my own ability to create a musical sigil. I'll see how it goes anyway.

reply to post by Cythraul


If you're happy with the resulting song, and comfortable with it, would you post it online somewhere and post link to it here? I'd be very interested to hear the music, as I'm sure others may. I actually have a metal song I've been working on and off since '99... just haven't caught an idea that sticks well with it, but this thread kind of inspired some possible lyrics. About a month ago I finally decided to rework and record the song... don't know why, lol... I have my guesses (finger pointing me in the right direction, imo).

reply to post by Kupios


here's the real magic about this whole topic- LOA law of attraction

you are creating reality every moment of every day, unconciously, we all do it- whether you want to be accountable for what you create is another matter.

this is the danger of mindlessly living your life
when you focus, make a sygil, light a candle, you are conciously creating reality.

if you inject fear into making a sygil then you might have a bad experience, and live to tell your own cautionary tale. If you are afraid to make sygils or practice magic, then don't do it.

Charging a sygil or intent is simply putting days worth of meditation into one moment, thus charging it. Then forget it. You don't put a letter in the mail then worry endlessly whether it will arrive. You are certain that by putting that letter into a mailbox, the postal system will work and you forget about it.

please just remember that you are creating reality every moment of every day. What you create is up to you

reply to post by Anonymous ATS


That's very well said.
I wish I could give you a star... :-)



P.S.
It seems I can, after all.
And I have.






[edit on 15-5-2008 by Vanitas]

I have been a lurker for years, and this thread made me register!

I tried this yesterday and will keep people informed either way with what happened. I am the last person you would think might ever try this, but lately I find myself with a more open mind on some things.

Great job with all of the discussion here!

j

Originally posted by Cuhail

The Sigil Garden

Did you see the sigils that are posted on that site? They are on this link:
www.sigilgarden.com...

It shows that sigils can be so much more creative and colorful but most of them don't appear to contain letters (unless they are too hidden). I think that the more colorful they are, the more impact they could have for me, but I'm wondering how important it is to use the letters.

It's funny that you bring that up, I've been just recently adding different colors that I think connect with my different intent sigil designs. I feel that that adds to the power and energy, but I also really have been enjoying seeing everyones different methods, techniques, suggestions and thoughts. The music, as well as the creative designs with the letters, colors too. I think this has really got everyone's creative juices working and you really can't do much wrong if your doing what feels right to you in your gut and heart.

I was also inspired by Grant Morrison's lecture on the disinformation dvd to try sigil magik. I tried it relentlessly for a couple of months...and nothing happened.
I tried various techniques but still nothing.

Interesting topic. I wonder, are there any taboo's, or, something you absolutely should not do with these sigils? And how long will it take/did it take before something happened? And also, how do you differ from the "magic" and what "would happen" anyway?

well I have to tell you all that the group of folks I saw on the news had a really awesome thing go their way today and things are looking up.

hmmmmmmm.
Was it my sigil?

I don't know, so I guess more sigils are needed to know if I am actually getting results or not.

heh.