The thread is very interesting. I have enjoyed reading and following it.
I agree, to a degree with, “that’s just weird” that we have made inroads in civil rights since the 60’s.
I also agree with “weird’s” statement about radical Islam being a danger that could be compared to communism.
I find that one of the thread's assumptions is misplaced. Namely, comparing the social dynamic of the 1960’s to the social dynamic we have in
If we look at the 60’s we see the counter cultures developing from a few areas. The 60”s came out of the social construct of post WW2 and a
nesting syndrome of the 1950’s. Namely the idea of the “perfect family” (Leave it to Beaver) , the beginning of the suburbs, jobs were plenty,
we had won the war, wages were good, Unions were strong etc.
Everything seemed fine in America besides the “red scare” as Kennedy took over from Eisenhower.
Eisenhower, a brilliant General, WW2 vet, upon giving over the keys of power to Kennedy warned us of a military industrial complex. If you read some
of his speeches he seems to lament over the money spent upon the military as opposed to money spent upon American infrastructure. In my opinion it
reflects the friction between those who wanted to place money into military buildup as opposed to those who wanted to build roads, bridges, dams,
hospitals etc. In fact, Eisenhower built highways with the consensus “protecting America.” It seems to me he wanted to do much more on the civil
side then he was able too.
I think we can see the friction building in reading some of Eisenhower speeches in contrast to General Lemays comments and writing. I agree that this
is simplified but I want to bring up a contrast that occurred in the 1950’s. Namely those who were post partum WW2 (The Lemays, Macarthur’s) in
contrast to those who wanted to build the “perfect American family/dream”. (The Eisenhower’s, academia etc)
The 1950’s brought an explosion of new tech and new idea’s to America as well. Ham radio (SSB), television, the great American automobile,
advances in medicine, Christian revival, (Billy Graham, Oral Roberts revivals), Golden era of the Motion Picture Industry.
Sexual ideas began to change in the 1950’s as well…with the beginning of Playboy, Kinsey report, the “non-virgin clubs”, etc. Of course we
also have the Beat Generation which influenced the counter culture heavily. We have On the Road, Howl, Lord of the Rings, Lord of the Flies, coming
from the writers of the day. (Lord of the Rings. British)
Music changed in the 1950’s from conservative “square” music to cutting edge country (Cash, Willie Nelson), rock and roll (Jerry Lee, Elvis,
Buddy Holly, Valens), Jazz ( Dizzy, Coltrane, Miles).
We can see the beginning of a culture clash in the 1950’s with Christian revival, “perfect” family in opposition to Kinsey, The Beats and new
Is this a Maslow thing? Were we comfortable and able to push the boundaries because we were comfortable? What was the tipping point?
The sixties came in very tame. We had the Civil Rights Movement being monitored by an ever more secretive and powerful FBI. We had the CIA securing
Mexico, Central America, and South America with the leftovers of Operation Paperclip. We were in the middle of MKUltra….etc
In my opinion one of the tipping points was the assignation of JFK. This coupled with Kesey and the Merry Pranksters beginning there exploits in the
USA. There is a reason Timothy Leary was labeled the most dangerous man in America in the late sixties by Nixon.
'___' had an incredible effect on the counter culture. It seemed to launch brave new ideas. Drop out of Society. Berkley Free Speech Movement,
The sixties roared into peak attitude during 67/68 and then seemed to die off suddenly. The FBI had infiltrated Abby Hoffman’s thing, the
Underground Movement was infiltrated and scattered and the hippies were starting to have babies of there own.
'___' was now illegal and the standard culture of the day began to absorb some of the counterculture ideas. A good example would be the adoption of
wearing blue jeans. Once a hippie thing…now it is chique.
The seventies mainstream embraced more of the counterculture thereby watering down much of the radical ideology and viewing it in a romantic way.
Being a radical is very hard, and unless there is substantial support it is hard to sustain.
Again this is simplified…yet if compared to 2008 we see a lot of differences. I would conclude that they would be hard to compare.
The things we have in common with the sixties would be the peace movement and the radical power plays by the ruling elite. This also occured in the
1980's to a degree.
We do have reason to believe that something may occur. I say this because there seems to be evidence that the Elite are looking for another power
grab with very little government resistance. This is the scary thing…..the Elite are now governing…not the people. We no longer have government
for the people, by the people. This is very sobering.
[edit on 4-3-2008 by whiteraven]
[edit on 4-3-2008 by whiteraven]