The "Anonymous" Scientology Protest is an NSA/FBI Fishing Expedition, page 2
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ATS Members have flagged this thread 117 times


reply posted on 24-2-2008 @ 04:52 PM by Im a Marty
Hrmmm, I think its a tad ignorant to think that 'ANY' group would not have the NSA/FBI interested in them, even the local Barbie Dolls' Club around the corner.

What if they used these dolls for major illicit drug transportation, a conspiracy of parents taking their childrens Barbies, and telling them to lend it to their friends so their friends parents can access the stuff.

I was going a bit extreme with that example, but to think that 'Anonymous' themselves believe they are immune to survelliance indicates them as people with heads the size of beachballs, 65% with Ego, the rest with whatever makes the 65% an active part of the personality - PC tech comes to mind.

Bringing down of boards and removing content is one of the last things NSA/FBI/GOV/FED/KFC have on their list to do, its common to allow for communication for simple monitoring and as a source to see what they have been upto and what they will be upto in the future. Remove this from them, and they'll find another way to get around it and start again, more time and $$$ wasted to re-trace the group and start all over again for monitoring. Pointless.

Locate their communications, monitor, and collect any data of use for intelligence. Remove their comms, and they lose access to all this.

(One reason I believe ATS hasn't been brought down btw, members will spread elsewhere, new nicknames, different boards, harder to track).

Anon, I don't know what any of you do as careers - but I suggest if you haven't done so already, go and get a life changing experience in a job involving Internet Security, or anything high paid, satisfying that can use your skills for bettering yourself and others. Maybe then, you won't need to pirate that random software because you can afford it, and you'll feel more accomplished knowing that a multi-billion dollar company is safe and secure in your hands.

Then when an Anonymous member starts to DDOS your servers or tries to find backdoors, you'll realise how much more you now know compared to when you were part of them, and think to yourself *How L4M3*, shaking your head as you re-configure the security.

Anon obviously has some talent, wish they can use it more productively if they haven't done so already! With the Co$, if they are the evil cult people claim them to be, it will be their own undo-ing, don't underestimate the power of good over evil

Peace

PS: Starred and Flagged


reply posted on 24-2-2008 @ 04:53 PM by Os Wilkes
For those who credit mr.old.school's position-

I have a bit of a problem with my brain and need some help working something out to get a bigger picture. Here's the deal:

Anonymous is organizing an "Ides of March" (March 15) public demonstration against Scientology. This coincides with already established anti-war demonstrations being staged across the country on the same date. Yet, their "humanitarian" and "civil rights" complaints against Scientology are dwarfed by the same antisocial behaviours engaged in by the Administration and it's business cronies (such as Enron & Haliburton). In fact, the Administration turns a blind eye to the abuses of Scientology, and has granted it special tax exemptions to further enable it's rapacious activities on it's membership.

Rather than dilute coverage for either event, anonymous should change the date of it's protest. I asked them to consider this, both for the benefit of the peacemakers who want to shed light on the abuses of this Administration, and for their own benefit, in that the real culprit in the advance of Scientology is none other than the Federal Government itself.

The answer I am given to this question is that anonymous has a short attention span and therefore cannot change the date. I am handed a vague sort of "chaos theory" about them having no leadership.

Well, who suggested and set the date then?

BTW- here are some L. Ron Hubbard documents which should raise everybody's hackles.

ocmb.xenu.net...

Especially note the "Targets Defense" document.

No doubt our Federal Agencies SHOULD BE looking at Scientology. No doubt they are. Here's the plot twist and the point I am looking at carefully:

Anonymous engaged in acts of terrorism clearly defined in the Patriot Act (such as the DoS attacks and the white powder attacks denied by but widely attributed to them). Anonymous has made an alliance with and is mobilizing the current Anti-Scientology movement including ex members to protest at it's ORGANIZED EVENTS.

Who do you think the Feds are looking at now?

Any comments are appreciated.


Love,

Os
P.S.~ Great post mr.old.school. I have flagged this thread.


reply posted on 24-2-2008 @ 05:08 PM by Im a Marty
reply to post by Os Wilkes


Totally Agree there Os Wilkes, although I have a problem with Xenu.net and any info I find from there. Don't know what it is, but something smells a little rotten over there. Perhaps it was when I was in Co$, I was told that a lot of Anti-Co$ sites are setup by them, although no names were mentioned, obviously Xenu.net wasn't mentioned, but it gives the "WTF ??" type reaction.

Don't forget, a major operation of Co$ in their belief of SP (Suppressives - 1 in 5 people with anti-social behaviour) or PTS (PTS, LOL - Potential Trouble Source) is to remove that part of these people either through Dianetics or Co$ tech, or get rid of them altogether, either via incarceration etc... What better way to get a group like Anon to open the can of worms in being able to identify these Suppressives and Potential Trouble Sources. First remove DIRECT competition (People supportive of protests against Scientology), then take care of the ones who simple don't believe, then take care of the ones who are not sure, then take care of their lower echelon into improving them.

Don't forget, in 2001 I was at a seminar held by a Co$ member from USA, at the local church, and he did state, and I am absolutely 100% serious here... .that their GLOBAL agenda will be in full swing between 7 and 10 years from then. Do the calculations, and you now get 2008 - 2011 timeframe. All this around the world with Anti-Co$ just verifies for me that its definately a possiblity its occuring.

On another note, I remember a Co$ member stating that the usual re-incarnation between bodies in 'time', when bypassing implant stations (Spiritual brainwashing - to forget etc..) the period is roughly 20 years between physical death, and re-birth.

Hubbard died 1986. Do you know what year Suri Cruise was born

BTW, Suri looks nothing like Hubbard, as for the Bio on Cruise saying it was Hubbards sperm, highly doubt that, as Suri looks like both Katie and Tom. On another note, are Michael Jacksons' Kids black or white? I'm pretty certain they'd be tanned with a white mother and black father. The colour of Mike now has nothing to do with DNA, somethings suss there, probably not his kids


reply posted on 24-2-2008 @ 05:09 PM by Dark Angel
The Anon group started out as about 1oo internet freaks but the many others, primarily uni graduates have joined. most have no idea what they have joined but it is "fun" Called Lutz. It is for laughs.

However there is a serious hardcore within the group determined to take down the church.

A few points worth clarifying here as I see all the repeated Clichés trotted out whenever scientology is mentioned.

1, The Church was granted Tax Exempt Status by the IRS in a special deal. How come this church and no other gets tax exempt status? As the church is worth an estimated 3 billion dollars (remember they pay no tax, charge exorbitant rates for services and don't have staff salaries to pay) how come this cult (which it is what it has become) gets away with NOT paying million in taxes.

It is unlikely the US government will investigate the church to whom they have granted such a bounty.

2. Robert Trumbull Crowley was a senior Central Intelligence Agency officer from 1948 until the mid-1980s. He left a book citing hundreds of 'operatives" of the CIA. The Head Honcho of the church (David Miscaviage) and his sidekick were two of them.

Both are listed as CIA sources.

3. The services the church offers were effective and popular and not too expensive when Hubbard was in charge. Directly after is "strange" death Miscaviage took over and the church "changed". Families were alienated, services became massively expensive, The services offered changed so they became ineffective.


4. Many people who had assisted Hubbard were booted out. thousands in fact. Now the people involved are kids who have no idea what scientology is. They are stuck in the there on the promise of salvation. They are alienated away from their families, live in poor conditions, poor food and no salaries.

In short, the church became the scientology church that does not practice scientology any more. It is now a fraud. Hence the disgust so many people feel by it.

No the FBI are not behind the Anon group, although they MAY have some interest in how it is going and some operatives checking it out. With the interest the FBI have in such matters as drugs, terrorist activities, the church, as big as it is,m is small fry.

The only place one can actually get scientology these days, if one wants it, is in the scientology freezone. If the FBI was keep to destroy scientology the Freezone woudl be a target also, in fact it is the opposite.

References:
cryptome.org...
www.sc-i-r-s-ology.pair.com...
scientologistsfreezone.com...
the-scientologist.com...


reply posted on 24-2-2008 @ 05:14 PM by GoblinBlix
reply to post by mister.old.school


This is the least tenable conspiracy theory I have ever seen on this board. From the disconnected logic of the original post, I would say they are a cult member themselves.


reply posted on 24-2-2008 @ 05:20 PM by marcabconfederacy
Anyone who know scientologists knows that their high OT7 training includes mind penetration from distance. I'm sorry but mister old school, they have got into your mind and are affecting you're mental database.

The cult of scientology (CO$) is an evil organisation that makes the FBI look like school children.

In fact the obvious answer to a lot of your conspiricy theories come from and were formed by the cult of scientology. Enter their mind set at your own peril. You have been warned.

We would wish the FBI would help but unfortunatly they are partly infiltrated BY CO$ as are most government departments. Like someone said before me check out operation snow white.

I suggest members before progressing down this path to check out the facts in relation. Unlike a lot of hythosesising that goes on in these boards they are fully tracable facts in this dimension called reality.

Anonymous is fighting for the minds that are trapped in this cult. See exc scientologista board to see what these people are enduring including mind control, brainwashing, imprisonment, suppresion etc etc... There's enough real Mind control there to have you wetting your pants and maybe you can fight some real enemies for a change.

I suggest that if it is your will to fight for freedom then do your research and join anonymous in this fight.

If you join scientology on this front, do so at your own peril. You cannot say, you have not been warned.

"In my opinion the church has one of the most effective intelligence operations in the U.S. rivaling even that of the FBI."
--Ted Gunderson, former head of the FBI's Los Angeles office, quoted in Time May 6, 1991

Research, research, research....


reply posted on 24-2-2008 @ 06:26 PM by ElizabethRI
reply to post by Skyfloating


I have a question... Now how do you actually know if it is one of "them" who is posting info here ?

- obviously you can tell by what their answers are...

very interesting



reply posted on 24-2-2008 @ 06:35 PM by marcabconfederacy
Originally posted by mister.old.school
Statement One: The NSA and FBI track online connectivity


Agreed.




Statement Two: The tracking works best with the introduction of a known parameter


Agreed.




Statement Three: The NSA has been found "tapping into the Internet"


OK



Statement Four: The FBI has a history of proactive counter intelligence


Agreed

Statement Five: The group, "Anonymous", takes a public stance: Project Chanology


Can someone explain to me how a loose-knit subculture of hacker children from 4chan and IRC, formerly known for not much more than defacing MySpace pages and other nuisance hacks/pranks, suddenly takes a public stance on a socially complex issue? And part of the public stance of this "Anonymous" group involves the very un-anonymous action of public space protests.


While you present a point that is agreed you ad propositions that have no relation to your point.

If you want to know the answer to this question why not ask members of anonymous for the reasons?

Your proposition while uniformed and defamatory against anonymous is very weak.

You are stating that how could a group all of the sudden get social concience?

I'm sorry but history is littered of this through the 1960's hippies movement to the very conspirasy movement that you advocate that results in this discussion.

Are you saying that the conpiracy movement is really just a FBI created event? Are you saying these boards and the people that post on them are really just playing to FBI hands? Your proposition may have merit but i doubt it.

Statement Six: The group, "Anonymous", is a target of the NSA and FBI


Regardless of the more realistic likelihood that this group is nothing more than bored 15-year olds, both of these agencies have labeled the group "cyber terrorists" and have placed a high priority on infiltration and prosecution.


Quite possible. I'd like to see your refrences.

proposition: No one knows who anonymous are so how can you say this? This is exactly what the CO$ are putting out in their attacks to defame the movement.


Statement Seven: The cult, "Church of Scientology", is also targeted by the NSA and FBI




While the U.S. Government would never make the overt mistake of classifying the CoS as a cult, several law enforcement agencies and covert intelligence bodies have applied the distinction of "dangerous cult". Several low-level covert infiltration operations are underway. The operation running through the NSA is rumored to be called "Project Voltar" (the rationale for the name is unknown) and supposedly involves the study of recruitment tactics.


I hope so and about *snip* time.


Final Statement: The Chanology Project is a covert pattern injection by the NSA and FBI


I've been able to engage three members of intelligence agencies about the "Chanology Project" purported to be initiated by the "Anonymous" group. All three unequivocally agree that the initiative has all the earmarks of a covert NSA pattern injection that follows the tactical traditions of FBI CoIntelPro. It brilliantly serves two known objectives: 1- identify connectivity patterns related to the "Anonymous" group; 2- increase public criticism of the Scientology cult without risk of discovering a government agency connection
.

Lets face it, all you have is "I've been able to engage three members of intelligence agencies" Not strong at all. The connection between your propositions and conclusion is weak.

My conclusion is you are a member of the church, probably an osa spy who is trying to plant dissent on a popular movement against an evil and destructive cult.

Mod Edit: Profanity/Circumvention Of Censors – Please Review This Link.

fixed bbcode



[edit on 24-2-2008 by GAOTU789]

[edit on 24-2-2008 by GAOTU789]


reply posted on 24-2-2008 @ 06:42 PM by Os Wilkes
Originally posted by Im a Marty
reply to post by Os Wilkes


Totally Agree there Os Wilkes, although I have a problem with Xenu.net and any info I find from there. Don't know what it is, but something smells a little rotten over there. Perhaps it was when I was in Co$, I was told that a lot of Anti-Co$ sites are setup by them, although no names were mentioned, obviously Xenu.net wasn't mentioned, but it gives the "WTF ??" type reaction.

(...) What better way to get a group like Anon to open the can of worms in being able to identify these Suppressives and Potential Trouble Sources.


My take is not the same as yours specifically, but there is overlap.

I do not know why the people on OCMB choose to turn a blind eye to the criminal activities of anonymous whilst harping about Scientology's similar crimes. Your idea fits the facts to some degree.

What anonymous is doing is serving Scientology by getting the Feds to investigate it's critics. By apologizing for, covering for, and otherwise aiding and abetting anonymous, the critics of Scientology are incriminating themselves.

I have been doing a "Press to Test" on this phenomenon. One of my first issues with the board was the way they hopped on the anonymous bandwagon AFTER the terrorist acts. Most folks disagreed with me and I get the drift I am considered OSA or obstructionist for my comments which were intended for their protection. Smitty posted the facts:

ocmb.xenu.net...

Second "Press to Test" was on the subject of the suspected "OSA Van". At the February anti-Scn protest, an ice delivery truck with blacked-out windows was discovered parked nearby. A vocal critic of Scientology physically challenged the van, drawing attention to it (called "interfering" if they are legal ops). My understanding is that members of anonymous hung back while this was happening. It was later reported that the license plates were run by the Sheriff and determined to be counterfeits. Soo... I suggested that the witnessses use their photos (which included the plates) and file a report with the LAPD, since this is a felony in CA. If the van DID belong to OSA instead of the Feds, they would be subject to time in the can and substantial penalties. Whereas my posts on the subject didn't get plonked, they did get scrupulously ignored. Now, if the critics TRULY believed the surveillance operation was OSA not FBI, then they SHOULD HAVE reported it to the police.

Third "Press to Test" was in regards to the "righteous indignation" which anonymous claims to be motivated by. If they are mad at Scientology for killing, imprisoning, surreptitiously hypnotizing and otherwise brainwashing tens of thousands because it is WRONG, then why not acknowledge that the same thing is done in megascale by the Admin which is nailing the people of the United States in the same manner, using the same tech (so to speak)? I challenged their choice of the date March 15, as it is stepping on universal protests against the Fascist war machine, which by extention enables Scientology to exist in the first place. The "humanitarian righteous indignation" of anonymous non leadership dried up pretty quickly in the lamest dickdance I have ever witnessed- ie. "we can't set a date, we don't have a leader, we have a short attention span, we will be in school on other days, we weren't there, we didn't see anything, the kid down the street did it, my hand is NOT on that cookie and that is NOT a cookie jar...". These are not the "marching morons" of sci-fi lore who can organize worldwide events, set the dates- but not change them. This date was intended to conflict with antiwar events. Yet another hint that mr.old.school is correct as this would certainly flush out the subversive anti-Fascist elements if there were any and identify the leadership.

Love,

Os


reply posted on 24-2-2008 @ 07:20 PM by Os Wilkes
Originally posted by marcabconfederacy

Final Statement: The Chanology Project is a covert pattern injection by the NSA and FBI


I've been able to engage three members of intelligence agencies about the "Chanology Project" purported to be initiated by the "Anonymous" group. All three unequivocally agree that the initiative has all the earmarks of a covert NSA pattern injection that follows the tactical traditions of FBI CoIntelPro. It brilliantly serves two known objectives: 1- identify connectivity patterns related to the "Anonymous" group; 2- increase public criticism of the Scientology cult without risk of discovering a government agency connection
.

Lets face it, all you have is "I've been able to engage three members of intelligence agencies" Not strong at all. The connection between your propositions and conclusion is weak.

My conclusion is you are a member of the church, probably an osa spy who is trying to plant dissent on a popular movement against an evil and destructive cult.



I agree with mr.old.school about the operation except on one major point. I don't agree anonymous raises public criticism of Scientology. Awareness, maybe. Lots of folk believe that any media coverage is good media coverage- case in point Scientology's deployment of footbullet Tom Cruise. Scientology plausibly and categorically denies the charges against it, even the ones already proven in court. Facts are meaningless when the jurisdiction holding the current trial is "the Court of Public Opinion". And Scientology is a major intelligence gathering agency on it's own, whose resources would be invaluable to any illegal or unconstitutional investigation of private citizenry. Scientology's bread is buttered by the same tax dollars that support the FBI. It is unlikely that this operation is really intended to point a criminal finger at Scientology or that would have already been undertaken and successful.

Now lets look at the idea of public criticism a little closer:

The antics of anonymous actually vindicate the most paranoid tenets of Scientology to the "in" Scientologists whilst making Scientology appear to the public as a sympathetic target of malicious religious bigotry. Scientology is in fact PROMOTED. During the course of minding it's own business- individual Scientologists serving at their posts are inconvenienced or even terrorized. Local businesses, entire city blocks, numerous emergency personnel add to the collateral damage of crimes perpetrated by anonymous agents (this includes DoS attacks, Pizza Bombs, Verbal Threats posted on the net, and White Powder Attacks).

I think anonymous and Scientology make great bedfellows in this regard.

I will continue to warn critics of Scientology that when something seems to be too good to be true, it invariably is. Hitching your wagon to a horse that is driven by a criminal element is a very dangerous thing to do. You might think you are taking advantage of a great opportunity to raise awareness for your cause. But at what cost? Aligning one's movement with folks who are terrorists by definition of the Patriot Act is one of the worst things you can do if you value your privacy.

If you are a "Suppressive Person", you are a criminal in the minds of Scientology. What better way to prove this than harness the energy of the FBI to investigate the critics of Scientology? Get the taxpayers to pay for this investigation because Scientology's own investigative thuggery has been causing a big PR flap these days.

I'm not a Scientologist. Certainly not OSA. I disagree fully with all pseudo Fascism and won't put on a pair of jackboots unless it makes me look cool in my avatar. I'm just one John Q. Public who doesn't like anonymous any better than I like Scientology, and for the same reasons.


Love,

Os
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