Do we all go to the same heaven ?

I went to a Serbian orthodox wedding the yesterday with my girlfriend and her sister who has just completed
studying at UNI to teach a at Cathoic schools. Anyway i asked my girlfriend "so these will be another masssive
Catholic Wedding ?", to which she reipled "no no Serbian orthodox is completely different to the Catholic faith". That
got me thinking with so many people of different faiths, DO WE ALL GO TO THE SAME HEAVEN ?. Which got me really
thinking so i asked other Catholics at the wedding and was told everything from no, yes, yeah but not gays...etc.


So my second question is if we all end up in the same heaven why do religious people ostrasize gays, lesbains,
Pro choice...etc if God finds them acceptable enough to enter heaven ?. Its just sounds extremely unrealistic
to have multiple heavens for different faiths after all most of these religions or versions stem from the same
man, who after meant heaven and not Serbian orthodox heaven or Oriental Orthodoxy heaven. So do Jews, Muslims, Gays and greys
all go the same heaven ?, if not where are the different heavens ?

Yes... we all go to the same Heaven. Heaven is in essence, the Spirit Realm. Within the Spirit Realm there are endless "places" one may travel to, but it's all the same place. Religion has absolutely NOTHING to do with salvation.

God judges us by what is in our hearts. If someone was a relatively good person, who lived a good life and even if they were gay, or Muslim, Jewish or any other faith that did not declare Christ as Lord and Savior; after passing over they will be counseled on the Truth and God's sovereign laws. A humble heart will accept this truth and Christ as their savior, but because we still have free will even after death, they then have the opportunity to accept the Truth, Christ and God's laws and abide by them, or join Satan's side of the Spiritual War. There's no sitting on the fence allowed.

Not all sins carry the same punishments. While being gay is a sin, it is not considered a vile sin like that of murder, rape, suicide etc. Unless you commit a vile sin or go beyond Adamic Sin under God's laws, and do not repent for that sin and remain unforgiven, you still have a chance even after death. This is because of Christ's Ransom Sacrifice for us.

This is why we are told never to judge one another. We cannot possibly know what the condition of someone else's heart is. Whether they be gay, muslim, jew, whatever. And we cannot possibly know what they are truly sorry for, or not sorry for or even if they would accept Christ as their savior once they were counseled on the truth either. Only God knows.

The only time this will change is during Armageddon. Because at Armageddon, those who are left behind (those who were deemed by Father and Christ to not have a good heart and acceptance of Christ within them) will have a limited time to accept the Truth because they will have lost out on the chance to counseling once they've passed over. The two conditions for being able to obtain Eternal life is through a good heart condition and acceptance of Christ as Lord and Savior. All others will perish.

[edit on 12-1-2008 by ReginaAdonnaAaron]

reply to post by helium3


Replying to your subject line ONLY, my answer (after many years of thinking deeply about this) is: no. No, we don't. Because "heaven" is custom-made for each one of us - BY each one of us.

What you expect and actively HOPE for in your heart (this is NOT a metaphor), will be realised as the "here and now" after you leave the physical body.

As for "Hell"... it's understanding and feeling the full impact of what you made other living beings go though.

Since Heaven is a word most associated with Christianity, I'll assume that is the religion you want to focus on.

There is only one Heaven and one way to get there. If you accept that one way, then you are going to that one Heaven.

reply to post by helium3


One tool that Satan uses to mislead people is false religion.

Think about it. All religious beliefs cannot be right. Many contradict eachother.

One lie that a false religion uses is that the soul will live forever, whereas God said that the soul that sins will surely die. Why would a religion teach the opposite of what God said?

Mankind has yet to well acchieve understanding of the afterworlds, let us not start thinking on heaven vs heavens, as you not a clue.

Originally posted by ReginaAdonnaAaron
While being gay is a sin, it is not considered a vile sin like that of murder, rape, suicide etc. Unless you commit a vile sin or go beyond Adamic Sin under God's laws, and do not repent for that sin and remain unforgiven, you still have a chance even after death. This is because of Christ's Ransom Sacrifice for us.

So according to God, through the voice of you, if someone commits suicide they have no chance of redemption?

So Christ's Ransom Sacrifice, as you put it, only goes so far - there is a line drawn between misdemeanor sins and felony type sins.

Originally posted by ben91069
So according to God, through the voice of you, if someone commits suicide they have no chance of redemption?

So Christ's Ransom Sacrifice, as you put it, only goes so far - there is a line drawn between misdemeanor sins and felony type sins.

Whether or not they have a chance of redemption is up to God. But... suicide is murder of yourself and would be considered a vile crime.

God is the one who determines what sins are forgivable and which are unforgivable. I've just given a few examples of what a vile crime would be. Like I said, God is the judge. He knows our hearts.

reply to post by ReginaAdonnaAaron


Fair enough. Sorry, I got off topic. I liken heaven to a mansion with many rooms, each one individually tailored to the individual.

So under your foolish religious laws. You can kill someone in defence of another life?

If this is the case.

What if someone was a danger to humanity, and if they continued living, the would sure to kill someone or a group of people, but rather then that they just killed themself.

How do you feel god will judge that case?

Originally posted by ben91069
Fair enough. Sorry, I got off topic. I liken heaven to a mansion with many rooms, each one individually tailored to the individual.

No worries I like your vision of Heaven...sounds neat.

Did not Jesus Christ Commit Suicide?

Jesus was in full aware that he could just stop doing what he was doing and live.

Wasn't his contued action Just suicide?

So then it isn't suicide to set infront of a moving bus?

Originally posted by Incarnated
Did not Jesus Christ Commit Suicide?

Jesus was in full aware that he could just stop doing what he was doing and live.

So then it isn't suicide to set infront of a moving bus?

Whoa- big difference. We are also told a man has no greater love than to lay down his life for a friend. Am I committing suicide if I take a bullet for my child? No. And Jesus took the ultimate bullet for humanity.

But I don't believe suicides go to Hell anyways if they are saved (just an opinion).

reply to post by helium3


As a Catholic, let me say that asking the average Catholic anything and hoping to get the teaching of the Church is as unlikely as George Bush renouncing warfare.

Catholic teaching believes in Covenants that God has made with various parts of humanity. The Church believes that God continues to uphold all of His Covenants so that His covenant with Noah is still in effect. The covenant with Moses is still in effect and the Covenant with Jesus is in effect.

What a Catholic can say with certainty is that Jesus promised to prepare a place in the heavens for those who followed his teachings and loved God with all their heart, mind, soul, and strength.

Variously Catholics have believed that there are at least three heavens and at most nine heavens. These ideas get expressed in many and various ways, but the idea is that there is an ongoing movement of the soul toward the Innermost where one finds the abode of the Forever One known as the Ancient of Days, the Eternal God, the Everlasting Father etc.

Those who reject God, Life, and Creation walk on their own 2 spiritual feet out of God's presence into "the outer darkness" or "into the Gates of Hell" because of their own choices to reject God and the Life-giving Way.

Originally posted by ReginaAdonnaAaron
Yes... we all go to the same Heaven. Heaven is in essence, the Spirit Realm. Within the Spirit Realm there are endless "places" one may travel to, but it's all the same place. Religion has absolutely NOTHING to do with salvation.

God judges us by what is in our hearts. If someone was a relatively good person, who lived a good life and even if they were gay, or Muslim, Jewish or any other faith that did not declare Christ as Lord and Savior; after passing over they will be counseled on the Truth and God's sovereign laws. A humble heart will accept this truth and Christ as their savior, but because we still have free will even after death, they then have the opportunity to accept the Truth, Christ and God's laws and abide by them, or join Satan's side of the Spiritual War. There's no sitting on the fence allowed.

Not all sins carry the same punishments. While being gay is a sin, it is not considered a vile sin like that of murder, rape, suicide etc. Unless you commit a vile sin or go beyond Adamic Sin under God's laws, and do not repent for that sin and remain unforgiven, you still have a chance even after death. This is because of Christ's Ransom Sacrifice for us.

This is why we are told never to judge one another. We cannot possibly know what the condition of someone else's heart is. Whether they be gay, muslim, jew, whatever. And we cannot possibly know what they are truly sorry for, or not sorry for or even if they would accept Christ as their savior once they were counseled on the truth either. Only God knows.

The only time this will change is during Armageddon. Because at Armageddon, those who are left behind (those who were deemed by Father and Christ to not have a good heart and acceptance of Christ within them) will have a limited time to accept the Truth because they will have lost out on the chance to counseling once they've passed over. The two conditions for being able to obtain Eternal life is through a good heart condition and acceptance of Christ as Lord and Savior. All others will perish.

[edit on 12-1-2008 by ReginaAdonnaAaron]

Excellent post, even if I disagree with you on my world view. I've always figured that if the Christian God exists, he would give those who didn't believe in him in life a second chance like you described. By the way, are any of those views supported by scripture, or are they UPG? Just curious.


As for my view on the afterlife, I agree with Vanitas, more or less. I see the universe as having millions, perhaps even billions, of 'layers'(or 'planes', if you're into the more metaphysical-type stuff), of which the Physical universe is a small(though unique) slice. I feel that after death, the soul gravitates to a different 'layer' which it feels most comfortable with(which would be, most often, based on an individual's view of the afterlife).

There is only one heaven and hell. All the are of God and pure hearted will go to heaven or the new jerslum. Not everyone that is saved goes to heaven. only a 144 thousand thousand go to heaven the rest will be on the new earth in the new jerslum with Jesus.

As for gay and lesbian going to heaven or being saved. its hard for me to believe only cuz scripture says otherwise. I think its possible for a gay or les to be of good heart and God to say he forgives you. Remember

"bless are they who sins are forgotten."

Originally posted by helium3
That
got me thinking with so many people of different faiths, ...

Since faith is a gift from the creator and there is only one creator, there is only one faith. The result of that faith, is that we believe on him who he sent into the world.

Just because somebody chose to fire up a load of religion and call it a faith. Doesn't make it the gift given only by GOD. Which is THE ONLY FAITH.

Originally posted by helium3
DO WE ALL GO TO THE SAME HEAVEN ?

According to the testimony of that one who was sent into the world, (which one can only truly believe if it's given to them). Unless a man is born again, by the supernatural work of GOD. They will not only NOT enter the kingdom of heaven, but they also will NOT see it.

Beside heaven there is only one other option. A man will at some point die, finding himself in what is known as "hell" awaiting judgment day. Following that, thrown alive into a lake of fire. Few can hear this. Those who can should seek him while he may be found and not give up until they do find.

Originally posted by helium3
So my second question is if we all end up in the same heaven why do religious people ostrasize gays, lesbains,
Pro choice...etc if God finds them acceptable enough to enter heaven ?

They are an abomination, but I'm not pointing fingers. I in my natural state am an abomination to GOD also. Had I not been given the gift of salvation by him and my sins covered by his blood. I would be blindly wandering off to the lake of fire myself.

Sin is sin, it's the natural nature in a man. Every man in his natural state is capable of any of the most extreme wickedness you care to name. The out working of that nature is the sin(s), whether it be a simple childish lie or mass murder, it's an outworking of the wretched nature of MAN.

This nature is the enemy of GOD and must be dealt with in order for a man to enter his kingdom.

Being born again puts that nature in check, and one is then governed, that is if one allows him to rule over them, but the nature is still there in a sense. The reason being is we still remain in our fallen bodies. The spiritual man is dealt with.

Originally posted by helium3
So do Jews, Muslims, Gays and greys
all go the same heaven ?

Those who aren't born again into the family of GOD go to the same lake of fire.

Being found in Jesus Christ is the only option. Everyone else burns.

Originally posted by helium3
I went to a Serbian orthodox wedding the yesterday with my girlfriend and her sister who has just completed
studying at UNI to teach a at Cathoic schools. Anyway i asked my girlfriend "so these will be another masssive
Catholic Wedding ?", to which she reipled "no no Serbian orthodox is completely different to the Catholic faith". That
got me thinking with so many people of different faiths, DO WE ALL GO TO THE SAME HEAVEN ?. Which got me really
thinking so i asked other Catholics at the wedding and was told everything from no, yes, yeah but not gays...etc.

There is no such a thing ‘Serbian Orthodoxy’. All Orthodox Churches teach and believe the same.
We have common things with Roman Catholics, but even more differences.

Sure, I'd like to believe that we all go to the same heaven. This would be a nice place to meet all our former spouses (hehehe), family, friends, relatives, pets and even strangers that we have met along the way. And we could share all sorts of stories about each other.

no eye has seen,

no mind can conceive

what god has prepared

for those that love him..1 corin 2:3

in my fathers house there are many mansions...