It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.


Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.


FLIGHT 93 - The Biggest 911 Smoking Gun!

page: 86
<< 83  84  85    87  88  89 >>

log in


posted on Feb, 24 2008 @ 08:24 PM
Ok. No one has every convinced anyone that a fully fueled massive Boeing 757 with 50+ passengers crashed in this tiny hole.

To say that Flight 93 crashed in Shanksville is really the most unbelievable conspiracy theory of 911. There is no proof the a Beoing 757 crashed in Shanksville on 9/11 and the evidence actually contradicts the official story.

Looks like a cruise missile hit.

The official version's and debunker's imaginative twisting of facts rivals that of Arlan Specter's Magic Bullet in the Warren Report. We all know why the impossible magic bullet was invented.

Originally posted by beachnut

The witnesses confirm the FDR, as does the FDR the witnesses. Sorry, but I have seen the testimony and the FDR evidence. But then the DNA blows the presentation out of the water!

Sigh. Ive seen people with this agenda only to fall on their faces as usual.

You obviously haven't read anything.





Contact: Robert Balsamo

Pilots for 9/11 Truth, an international organization of pilots and aviation professionals, petitioned the National Transportation and Safety Board (NTSB) via the Freedom of Information Act to obtain United Flight 93 Flight Data Recorder information, consisting of a Comma Separated Value (CSV) file and Flight Path Animation, allegedly derived from Flight 93 Flight Data Recorder (FDR). The data provided by the NTSB contradict observed events in several significant ways:

The NTSB Flight Path Animation approach path and altitude does not support observations.
All Altitude data on the northern approach contradicts witnesses published by the New York Times.
Witness observations of approach path contradict northern approach as described by Popular Mechanics and the US Govt. Several witnesses observed the aircraft approaching from southeast over Indian Lake and from the south prior to witnessing explosion. Parts found in New Baltimore, 8 miles southeast of crater is a direct contradiction to the northern approach claimed by the US Govt.
Environmental Protection Agency reports no soil contamination of jet fuel after testing 5,000-6,000 yards of earth including 3 ground wells. Smoke plume photographed by a witness does not suggest a jet fuel rich explosion.
Impact angle according to Flight Data Recorder does not support an almost vertical impact as the govt story and crater suggests.
In May, 2007, members of Pilots for 9/11 Truth received these documents from the NTSB and began a close analysis of the data they contain. After expert review and cross check, Pilots for 9/11 Truth has concluded that the information in these NTSB documents does not support, and in some instances factually contradicts, the official government position that United Airlines Flight 93 created the impact crater as reported, in Somerset County, PA on the morning of September 11, 2001 .According to the US Govt, United Airlines Flight 93 approached Somerset County from the North-Northwest at a high altitude on the morning of September 11, 200 1 . However, many witnesses contradict altitude as well as approach path. Also according to reports, and as the impact crater suggests, United Airlines Flight 93 impacted terrain at an almost vertical 90 degree angle, while the Flight Data Recorder shows a 35 degree angle with up-sloping terrain, further reducing impact angle.

The information provided by the US Government does not support reports of United Airlines Flight 93 approach, impact angles, and lack of jet fuel at Somerset Country, PA.

Pilots for 9/11 Truth is committed to discovering the truth surrounding the events of September 11, 2001 . We have contacted both the NTSB and the FBI regarding these and other inconsistencies. To date, they have refused to comment on, correct, refute, retract or offer side-letters that might explain the discrepancies between what they claim are the data extracted from the FDR of United Flight 93 and the events observed. .As concerned citizens and professionals in the aviation industry, Pilots for 9/11 Truth asks, why have these discrepancies not been addressed by agencies within the United States Government? Pilots for 9/11 Truth takes the position that an official government inquiry into these discrepancies is warranted and long overdue. We call upon our fellow citizens to write to their Congressional representatives to inform them of these discrepancies and call for an immediate investigation into this matter. For more information and in depth analysis please visit

Members of Pilots For 9/11 Truth at

ENCLOSURE: Cover letter of FOIA requests.

Beechnut. All your theories of flight 93 has been debunked long ago before you joined this thread 2 days ago.

To get you up to date, the conspiracy that got debunked was that a Boeing crashed in Shanksville on 9/11.

The crash site was part of a Mock hijacking shootdown crash exercise scheduled for September 11th, 2001. Some of the craft over Pennsylvania was a white lear jet acting as a cruise missile surrogate and a c-130 possibly launching real cruise missiles. This exercise was made live and to this day some people actually think it was a real plane crash but those people are usually naive and or poorly misinformed.

If you would like the names of the exercises/drills taking place all over north america on September 11th,2001,let me know.

Thanks for you contribution tho,

[edit on 24-2-2008 by IvanZana]

posted on Feb, 24 2008 @ 08:27 PM

Originally posted by johnlear
Originally posted by Swampfox46_1999

Except for the facts that plenty of aircraft wreckage was found, not to mention personal effects of the passengers and crew, and oh yes, the remains of said crew and passengers.........your theory might make sense.

Thanks for the post Swampfox46_1999. I know of no wreckage that was found the parts of which were matched with any maintenance records.

Yes there was an Arab bandana found in perfect condition. As were 4 or 5 other items of planted evidence.

There were no remains of anybody found on the day of the crash according to the Coronor that day. Since that date the Coronor has changed his story, probably under threat as many others have.

In fact there was no crash. In fact the crash site video was not released until 5pm about 6 hours after the alleged crash and that was because they had to have time to fake the crash site.

But thanks for your post as uninformed as it was.

Mr John Lear is the son of the creator of the Lear jet, this man know planes and he said no plane crashed in Shanksville.

posted on Feb, 24 2008 @ 08:52 PM
reply to post by beachnut

Yes, 93 crashed in the hole, even the DNA proves it.

I have seen no proof that any DNA ecidence was collected at the scene. Please provide the proof. Not someone's testimony. Proof.

EDIT to add:

The FDR proves it. Aircraft parts prove it.

There are unexplained anomalies regarding the FDR evidence. I have seen no definitive evidence linking materials recovered at the scene, to flight 93.

[edit on 2/24/0808 by jackinthebox]

posted on Feb, 24 2008 @ 08:58 PM
reply to post by beachnut

No it does not bounce! It is not a ball of rubber.

Perhaps "bounce" is not quite an accurate word to use in this case. But at the impact angle, the ground certainly would have deflected the plane, like a bullet ricochet. Planes will glance off the surface of water, which is much more pliable than Earth.

posted on Feb, 24 2008 @ 09:10 PM
reply to post by beachnut

I have seen the video of the F-4 impact which you have shown us the still shots of. It is impressive, but it does not show us the debris zone once all the dust had settled. One thing I would still expect to find, are the engines.

Are you suggesting that the engines of Flight 93 desintigrated into tiny little unrecognizeable pieces, without leaving a dent in the ground, and yet a large window portion of the fuselage managed to survive?

I am also still waiting for a valid explanation of where all the fuel went.

Perhaps I should also toss this into the mix once again at this point. Why was the blast effect at an angle incongruous with the officially reported flight path?

[edit on 2/24/0808 by jackinthebox]

posted on Feb, 25 2008 @ 10:46 AM

No plane here. Plane crash simulation exercise site.

posted on Feb, 26 2008 @ 11:37 AM

Originally posted by dbates

Originally posted by IvanZana

Here's the list from the flight manifest of flight 93. Surely the victims' families would have spoke up, or the person themself, if they had not died. The list mentions the names and hometown of all the deceased. Out of this list of 45 people, have any been shown to be false? The story that the passengers didn't exist falls apart when you track down the people in the real world. Where did these 45 people go?

Who's to say they didn't just shuffle these people off into one of the underground camps and were told they would never see light of day again, revealed the truth about the planet changes coming up and that most everyone would die in the process... ??

posted on Feb, 26 2008 @ 01:08 PM
reply to post by 4204peace

4204peace did a good thing by finding that post by dbates...

Not to diminish what YOU posted, 4204, but dbates had a good point that should be further addressed, IMO.

WHERE are those 45 people? WAS there DNA recovered that could be positively identified and matched with any of those victims?

From my position of wonderment, the majority of the discussion seems to be constantly steered towards the 'lack' of crash debris, or red herrings about 'mock exercises'...when the real human tragedy is ignored.

Seems because of some questions involving the physicality of the aftermath, and whatever perceived anomalies you wish to focus on, the reality of 45 people's lives gone missing gets lost in the discussions.

[added]...counted the posted manifest link, looked like 40, but either way even ONE life must matter!

[edit on 26-2-2008 by weedwhacker]

posted on Feb, 26 2008 @ 02:59 PM
reply to post by weedwhacker

How do we actually know those identities were not completely fabricated? I have never met any of the people who were supposed to be on the plane, or their families. I know it's a stretch, but just because we saw families crying on TV, does not mean there even are grieving families. I'm not saying there aren't families who lost their loved ones, I'm just saying that from where I am sitting, it is possible that all of the identities and families were fiction. (For the record, I do not see this as a possiblity for Flight 11, as I have personal knowledge of a man who lost his life on the plane.)

But let us say that there were in fact regular people on the planes that day. Which I actually believe is a more accurate assumption, as opposed to the proposition I made above. There were 260 people on board all four planes used in the 9/11 attacks. Two months and a day later, American Airlines Flight 587 crashed in a Queens neighborhood. All on-board were killed. I'll give you one guess how many people were on-board. Yup, 260 people.

So you see, there are plauseable scenarios that the fate of the passengers on Flight 93 was not met in Shanksville. The mystery of their whereabouts is not proof that Flight 93 crashed where "they" say it did, or even that these people were actually killed.

If there is anyone reading this who did in fact have a loved one on Flight 93, I offer my most sincere condolences. I only hope that the mystery is solved, so that you may truly know their fate once and for all.

posted on Feb, 26 2008 @ 03:19 PM
reply to post by jackinthebox


YOU have never met any of the family members...neither have I.

I have never met, does that mean you, and members of YOUR family do not matter?

I have never met the Queen of England, nor Prince Charles, nor Princess Diana. Two outta three, there, are still alive...unless you want to debate?

posted on Feb, 26 2008 @ 03:51 PM
reply to post by weedwhacker

I have never met, does that mean you, and members of YOUR family do not matter?

I am NOT saying these people do not matter. I was presenting what I consider to be a possibility. I could send you hours worth of video of me and my family, suffering from some great calamity, to pull on your heart strings. Would you send a donation? No, because you know that my "family" might just very well be paid actors.

And even there, ask yourself this. How many of the fourty-five families have you actually even seen on TV? In an interview. At a funeral. I honestly can't remember more than a few people talking about their losses. And one of them happened to be flat out lieing as it turns out.

BREAKING 9/11 NEWS: FBI Says Barbara Olsen Did Not Call Ted Olsen. Bush Solicitor General LIED !!

posted on Feb, 26 2008 @ 10:25 PM
reply to post by jackinthebox

I personally attended the funeral of the First Officer of AA 77.

David Charlebois

This has noting to do ith this thread, I know...since it is about UA93...

But I can only sob as I sit here, at my cmputer, and write this post.

posted on Feb, 27 2008 @ 09:12 AM
Mr Lear also stated that holographic planes hit the WTC and a missle hit the Pentagon. The people on that plane existed until the moment of impact. All of the information is there is you choose to research rather than beleive what prison planet or other such sites provide.

The coverup is the fact that 93 was shot down. Period. End of story. FDR data could be changed to not show the disruption of the flight from the impact of cannon fire and/or a ATA missle. Why can it be one way and not another?

If you want to see the surviving familes, look up any of the reunions at the site of the crrash and you will see them. They were real and they had real families. They are not living in secret internment camps waiting to be tunred into zombies and usher in the NWO for King Bush and company.

posted on Feb, 28 2008 @ 01:49 PM
FUnny. All this jibber jabber does not change the fact that no plane crashed in Shanksville on Septmber 11.

Remember, no plane crashed in Shanksville.

Wow. I am totally convinced now more than ever that NO Boeing Crashed in Shanksville, on Spetmeber 11th,2001.

Originally posted by IvanZana

This picture is avoided and undebunkable.

There is no proof of a boeing 757 crashing.

The shoot down theory is proven disinformation started by the people who brought you " Missile on the WTC " Pentagon Hologram ", WTC holograms, not controlled demo, NUKES,... etc.

These people actually start the silly theories so they can easily debunk them later looking 1/2 intelligent, but thats another thread.

As you can see no fuel, no fire, no parts, NO Boeing 757 at Shanksville on 9/11

Mabey they are looking for cruise missile parts?



At the horseshoe-shaped Indian Lake, about a mile east of the official crash site, several eyewitnesses recalled hearing “a screaming thing” that “screeched” as it passed over the golf course and lakeside community immediately before a huge explosion shook the ground.

Chris Smith, the groundskeeper at the golf course, said something with a “very loud screeching sound” passed over in the immediate vicinity of the golf course before he heard a huge explosion.

Cruise missile video. Look like a small white plane.

Would someone like to add to this? The shoot down story was part of the simulation exercise of mock hijacking and shoot downs. Debris field 6 miles away was also part of the exercise.

posted on Feb, 29 2008 @ 12:14 AM
reply to post by weedwhacker

My condolences.

I think perhaps I should clarify something here. I am NOT saying that there weren't real vicitims and real families. I am only trying to more closely examine the possibilites, now that we know with certainty that our government has lied to us. And one of thos possibilities is that victim infomation may have been manipulated and/or fabricated in some instances. I think most of us would feel better about our government lieing to us, if they had not in fact sacrificed real human lives.

posted on Mar, 3 2008 @ 10:23 AM
reply to post by jackinthebox

Good work jack. There is no more hiding the truth. We know and will know more in the days to come.

posted on Mar, 8 2008 @ 04:37 AM
I thouroughly believe there is a cover up concerning flight 93, but not of the nature which many of you believe. It is my belief that the US government ordered that flight 93 be shot down to avoid it being used in the same manner as the other 3 planes. Of course our government would not want to admit killing innocent americans, but they killed them to save potentially many more, hence the 'hero' stories that appeared involving this flight. I also think that this single cover up has perpetuated (due to the fact that we know something is not right about it) a much more scandalous theory, those about the WTC and the Pentagon.

[edit on 8-3-2008 by space cadet]

posted on Mar, 9 2008 @ 01:58 AM
reply to post by space cadet

If they lied to us about one-third of the crime, it calls into question the validity of the entire case as it has been presented to us.

Let us make a comparison on a macro scale. A man is chareged with comitting three murders. At each murder scene there was a witness. At the first murder scene, the witness did not lie about what he saw intentionally, but has been proven to be factually incorrect based on the physical evidence. At the second murder scene, the witness statement cannot be corrobrated. And at the third murder scene, the witness is proven to be outright lieing intentionally. Will you still believe the assertion of the DA, that the accused is guilty of being a serial killer?

Even if you are still willing to accept that the accused may have killed the first two victims, it would no be left for you to decide. A mistrial would be declared, and a whole new investigation would have to be made with the modified version presented to a new jury.

posted on Mar, 10 2008 @ 02:55 AM
the crash area looks nothing like a downed airliner crash site ever...2 the coroner changed his mind-not one drop of blood.john lear is merely guilty of giving adam west-batman the clap by proxy not for mistaking a crash scene so obviuosly not.

posted on Mar, 10 2008 @ 04:36 AM
bobby charlebois was part of a small group responsible for attempting to derail the canada landing ufo story there is a current thread here on ats about it the second link on page4 details this.are these people related flight77 officer and bobby charlebois?mr lear could you comment on the other thread please-melbourne australia

top topics

<< 83  84  85    87  88  89 >>

log in