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Why do people continually give their money to the church?

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posted on Nov, 19 2007 @ 10:16 PM
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This is a topic that just really gets at me. Why do people give their money to a rich establishment instead of to people who actually need it? Do people think it will 'buy' them a higher place in heaven (Catholic church selling indulgences) than helping a fellow man? If I was God, I would much rather have people helping each other out than forking their money over to me and my church. Check this out:

1/5 of the world is starving to death

1 billion people in the world do not have access to clean water

Nearly a billion people entered the 21st century unable to read a book or sign their names

The lives of 1.7 million children will be needlessly lost this year because world governments have failed to reduce poverty levels

According to UNICEF, 30,000 children die each day due to poverty. That is about 210,000 children each week, or just under 11 million children under five years of age, each year

Some 1.1 billion people in developing countries have inadequate access to water, and 2.6 billion lack basic sanitation

Some 1.8 million child deaths each year as a result of diarrhoea from drinking bad water

Number of children in the world
2.2 billion

Number in poverty
1 billion (every second child)

Shelter, safe water and health
For the 1.9 billion children from the developing world, there are:

640 million without adequate shelter (1 in 3)
400 million with no access to safe water (1 in 5)
270 million with no access to health services (1 in 7)

Children out of education worldwide
121 million

Survival for children
Worldwide, 10.6 million died in 2003 before they reached the age of 5 (same as children population in France, Germany, Greece and Italy)
1.4 million die each year from lack of access to safe drinking water and adequate sanitation

Health of children
Worldwide, 2.2 million children die each year because they are not immunized
15 million children orphaned due to HIV/AIDS (similar to the total children population in Germany or United Kingdom)


And here are 2 websites you HAVE to check out. The first one tells about how the church likes to spend the money that is given to them, the second is, well pretty interesting:

www.the-tribulation-network.com...

www.poodwaddle.com...

So why in the world would someone take their money and give it to an establishment who wastes it instead of people who really need it? Is it more important to educate people about God than it is to help them survive? Or is it more important that a preacher drives a BMW than it is to sponsor just one child living in extreme poverty?




[edit on 11/19/2007 by bigbert81]




posted on Nov, 19 2007 @ 10:29 PM
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namely, to keep the club house open and in repair! plus, and there's the entertainment costs...

that said, many churches do give $$ to causes all around the world and in their community, not always straight cash donations, but by utilizing their resources to send people to help, clothing and food drives etc... afterall, no one lets them have a phone for nothing or the heat on at no cost... though perhaps they should



posted on Nov, 19 2007 @ 10:30 PM
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My guess is that most people don't want to be directly involved with the poor. If they give the money to the church, they will save themselves the trouble of locating the poor, perhaps giving them more money than you'd give away at church, and not have to live with the images for the rest of their lives.



posted on Nov, 19 2007 @ 10:38 PM
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reply to post by Impreza
 


What about non-profit organizations?

Why give your money to a church to waste, and give some of it to the needy instead of a non-profit which uses most of the money you give them for good?

Problem solved.



posted on Nov, 19 2007 @ 10:52 PM
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sometimes the needy don't know what to do with it... have you ever tossed someone a coin on the street and wondered if they'll by booze or drugs with it? and sometimes people who are in need don't want to beg directly.. a church can be a place they can get help without anyone really knowing about it...

the question is always, what are you doing personally to help... forget what others do... and i mean that rhetorically... you don't have to answer



posted on Nov, 19 2007 @ 10:53 PM
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Well You are obviously not into the Church, speaking from when I was younger ( I am afraid I am not a big fan of organized religion anymore) Our church used to to keep it school open, to pay for the church, the nuns and priests living, heat etc, Youth centers, soup kitchens for 10s of thousands. these things cost lots of dough. The Catholic Church in a lower middle income area isnt what it used to be. Sure they had money to buy and build some beautiful buildings back in the day, but not they barely have enough to keep it open, and had to close the school after only being able to take government assisted students.

I know its not what you want to hear ,but a lot of churches do not waste their money and are trying to just keep there community together.

Now Evangelists, the guys who preach the lake of fire crap, those guys are the ones you need to be on not most normal Christian churches IMHO

[edit on 19-11-2007 by ShiftTrio]



posted on Nov, 19 2007 @ 11:10 PM
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reply to post by never_tell
 


Once again, let me say NON-PROFIT ORGANIZATIONS.

They can do the same thing that SOME churches do to help others out. Yes not ALL churches do what I'm saying. There are always exceptions.

Look at how rich the Vatican is. Sure they do do some good, but they make billions. Couldn't they do a whole lot more?



posted on Nov, 19 2007 @ 11:15 PM
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I will say something about people giving money to their local church.

It costs money to turn the lights & electricity on. It also costs money to operate different things in the church: feeding the homeless, classes, daycare, etc etc.

Then there is the pastor. This is a full time job. I know this because my parents were pastors for most of my life - up until about 10yrs ago.

It is literally a full time job. My father worked 7 days a week. He was on call 24/7 w/ people calling him in crisis over this or that. He had to do a few services on Sun, a couple throughout the week, and did seminars, etc etc. The list goes on and on.

There is no way he would have been able to hold a job. In fact, before he became a pastor, he owned a number of business which did really well.

The church paid him based on money they took in from offerings/donations. He barely got paid anything. Id say he was brining in about $30k for a family of 5 and no insurance.

The church didnt have an excess of money. The money was used to keep it running, pay my parents and provide services to its members and the community.

He loved his job and felt called to it, but retired


I think if people are using the services of a church, they should at least donate to keep it going. If they dont, who is going to pay for the services provided?

With that said. I do not believe we have to tithe. I do not tithe my income....as I dont attend any church. I do donate money to legit charities though.

[edit on 19-11-2007 by greeneyedleo]

[edit on 19-11-2007 by greeneyedleo]



posted on Nov, 19 2007 @ 11:22 PM
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"Why do people continually give their money to the church?"



..Because their Dumbarses..





..Or they cant do anything for themselves so they have to pay for it..that includes trying to bribe some type of God like figure to go to the promised Donut King..



posted on Nov, 19 2007 @ 11:30 PM
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reply to post by greeneyedleo
 


Firstly, I agree that not all churches misuse or waste money. I understand that there are many churces that do just have enough money to stay open.

Here's my beef though, how many lives could be saved if they shut down that church and used all the money for one of the many causes I've listed above?

Basically, what's more important to you, keeping a church running, or saving lives? And don't say that your church saved lives. It didn't save near as many as donating the money. It's funny that a $2000 water filtration system can save an entire village.



posted on Nov, 19 2007 @ 11:50 PM
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Originally posted by bigbert81
reply to post by Impreza
 


What about non-profit organizations?

Why give your money to a church to waste, and give some of it to the needy instead of a non-profit which uses most of the money you give them for good?

Problem solved.

Hmmmm... looks like another case of ill-informed people. Who says the Catholic church wastes money? DO you belong to the Catholic church? Do you SEE what they do with the money that is donated?? Do you go and visit the poor that the money is used to help? Do you see the suffering the money is used to relieve?

The Catholic church does NOT say you HAVE to give 10% of your money to them unlike other "Christian organizations" that have their "pastors/leaders" driving around in Mercedes Benz's etc!

Do you KNOW what priests of the Catholic Church earn? Do you know what they own? Do you see them in fancy cars? Do they wear fancy suits? Some Catholic churches don't even put flowers in the church unless they are donated because they use the money toward the SICK, the NEEDY the ELDERLY, the DYING, needy children's' education - those that have NOTHING receive from the church from that which people donate!! Some churches do NOT have rich members and they give what they can to help THEIR fellow man.

Sometimes i wish people would do their homework before bashing that which they know absolutely nothing about. Don't tell me on the internet you found this and that. You need to look at reality people not your imagined reality.

I have first hand witnessed and seen those that the donations have helped. People who are too frail to move and the CATHOLIC CHURCH pays for the assistance they get from DONATIONS WE make. Elderly who HAVE children who do NOT CARE or HELP their OWN mothers and fathers. It is people like this that bitch about the Catholic Church getting donations.

It is the CATHOLIC CHURCH that asks for donations at times so a little girl can have a HEART OPERATION so that she can live to be 5!! It is Catholic people that GIVE these donations and do NOT ask for anything in return. We GIVE so that OTHERS may HAVE SOMETHING for Christmas lunch and a blanket over their legs so they may be a LITTLE MORE comfortable than their offspring have left them - people like those bitching about donating to the Catholic Church.

Don't sit there and crap in your pants because the CATHOLIC CHURCH gets donations. What they get they DO NOT ASK for unless it is a serious cause. I have never been in a Catholic Church in South Africa that ASKS for money - they just get donations. IF it is SERIOUS they may ASK please help this cause!!

Don't sit there and preach about what the Vatican has. That is 2000 years of collecting - kind of what you, YOURSELF, may amass over 2000 years. Yes, they can sell it and THEN WHAT? It is once off assistance. And THEN what?

Does anyone actually think about the human side of the donations or do they just think the church gets rich?? I see a serious need for donations to send people to SCHOOL for edukasun!!!

Sometimes i read posts and i get so damn angry at how openly and blatantly uneducated people are or can appear.

I mean this as no attack on anyone personally but in general people need to actually phone a Catholic Church and ask if they can visit some of the people the donations assist. The Church ALSO does not always get money AND food donated. They go with that money and BUY food at the shops/stores and hand the bags of food to the needy family/s. There are NO luxuries. Sometimes a SMALL bag of sugar etc s the ONLY luxury. Children who do now know what a doll or a little car is.

In fact my heart is literally broken when i think of those i have seen. DO you KNOW what it feels like to have an old man or old lady open the door and see you there with a small bag of food for them. Have you EVER experienced the joy those people have, the tears they shed for the LITTLE they get and then they STILL offer you a cup of tea from the little they have. Think about it!!

Do you KNOW what a new blanket means to those elderly? Do you KNOW what a bag of diapers/nappies means to a mother who cannot support her baby because she is disabled. DO YOU KNOW what a can of formula means to that mother that her baby will not cry all night because it is hungry.

Do you know what it means to the elderly that the church can send a taxi to their house to take the person to the doctor or hospital so they can get physio or dialysis or get a warm bed to die in. There is SO much to be considered. I can go on and on but it just will not go into the heads of some but, HOPEFULLY, some will get my point.

Please don't sit there and bash what you have NO idea about at all. What you have NO idea about helps SO SO many!! I hope to God i am not wasting my time typing this and that SOMEONE takes from it what is meant.

And THEN you get bigbert81 saying:

Here's my beef though, how many lives could be saved if they shut down that church and used all the money for one of the many causes I've listed above?

Ok i will try and hold my tongue BUT, yeah, shortsighted? to say the least!! YEah shut down the church and help ONE of the MANY causes. Oh gees, ok control now control, ONE of the many causes and then? What about the other MANY causes? Perhaps one needs to understand, i mean actually understand what has been said. The Catholic Church can help MANY causes by staying open not just ONE of the many causes. Nope, the church didn't save lives, the PEOPLE in the CHURCH saved lives!!

[edit on 19/11/2007 by shearder]



posted on Nov, 20 2007 @ 12:02 AM
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i would have to say that the vatican doesnt' make billions, but they do have assests worth billions,

they have the most land of any organization with the exception of mcdonalds i believe( which is valued in billions. their art, libraries, and relics are also worth in the billions.

so no they don't need the money, because they can liquify their assets and sustain themselves for another millenia. but why would they do that.
so donations are there to sustain their wealth. and to keep it status quo.



posted on Nov, 20 2007 @ 12:56 AM
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Originally posted by ferrabi
so no they don't need the money, because they can liquify their assets and sustain themselves for another millenia. but why would they do that.
so donations are there to sustain their wealth. and to keep it status quo.

I respectfully request that you go and read what i wrote if you didn't already.

Also, if you do just a LITTLE research you will have all the answers you thought you had but they will be real answers. Hopefully others will also get the truth.

Read this - no i mean really read it so you can understand better. The Vatican may have a lot of assets but that is support for what they have globally. The money they bring in goes, and has gone, for building churches, schools, hospitals, orphanages, old age homes etc etc. NOW, do a search and see how many have been built over the MANY years and then put a price to it and see for yourself and THEN also calculate how many people have been helped buy these buildings being erected. AHH but that may just be too much hassle cos it is easier to walk around oblivious to the real facts.

I did a search, amazing this internet thing, and in New York alone there are over 400 Catholic Churches. Now i wonder who built them? I got up to 560 and gave up count. Ok some, only a few in the search, actually fell under NJ. Go figure. I am sure Bill didn't build them so possibly the money came from donations and the Vatican built them? hmmmm

[edit on 20/11/2007 by shearder]



posted on Nov, 20 2007 @ 01:16 AM
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reply to post by shearder
 


Wow, you're absolutely right, thank you for setting me straight. We SHOULD be giving our money to the church to invest with it, or buy stocks, or fight sexual assault charges (yes, now over $1 billion). Heck, if Mother Theresa were still alive, we could build more shelters for people to go and suffer and die in. Wasn't she worth about $40 million at the time of her death? Anyway...

I love it when people come into a thread overly arrogant trying to discredit people, and in turn looking like fools.



Hmmmm... looks like another case of ill-informed people. Who says the Catholic church wastes money

Sometimes i wish people would do their homework before bashing that which they know absolutely nothing about.


Sometimes I wish people would take the time to review the links I spend time putting in my posts. I've done MY homework. Don't be so arrogant and learn something yourself.

BTW, I'm not just speaking of the Catholic church.



What they get they DO NOT ASK for unless it is a serious cause. I have never been in a Catholic Church in South Africa that ASKS for money - they just get donations. IF it is SERIOUS they may ASK please help this cause!!


Hmmm, is that their justification for selling indulgences? Oh, my bad, the church would NEVER ask for money unless it's a good cause, and paying for your future sins must definitely fall into that category.



YEah shut down the church and help ONE of the MANY causes


You're right, unless we can save everybody at the same time, we shouldn't save anybody. Gotcha.

The point is (other than stop being so overly arrogant), is that the money would go further and save more people in the hands of non-profit organizations than in the hands of a church that uses it like the link I provided already which you, apparently, don't have the time to read because you'd prefer to come here and try to make yourself seem smarter than you are.

[edit on 11/20/2007 by bigbert81]



posted on Nov, 20 2007 @ 01:56 AM
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[edit on 20-11-2007 by luxor311]



posted on Nov, 20 2007 @ 01:57 AM
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i'd suggest the "church" is no different than other not-for-profit organizations.. world vision, united way, amnesty international... they are filled with people who want to help, but can't actually do it without making a living too... all rely on donations and "membership fees" and volunteers...

i think to suggest one is better than another is wrong, but ultimately if these types of places didn't exist do you think we'd have a better world or a worse one? so a church passes a plate around looking for contributions to keep the lights on or the pastor paid... i think anyone that has a problem with this probably hasn't done a lot of fundraising themselves as things cost money

all in all, the people involved in these kinds of endevours are good people trying to make a difference.. imagine selling of the church assets to help... who? who gets to choose who is helped? and then what? the vatican owns alot of land and makes a lot of money from leases and rents around the world which goes to keep churches open and programs going... if it's a business, they're in the business of helping others and themselves at the same time

i say all this as someone who has never gone to church, nor has any need/want to, but i do recognize good intent when i see it... as was suggested, i think it's a bit naive to be "dumping" on people who want to help others and I hope who ever feels that it's a waste of money and time, never needs their help.... it would be ironic... wouldn't it?

[edit on 20-11-2007 by never_tell]



posted on Nov, 20 2007 @ 02:04 AM
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Originally posted by bigbert81
Wow, you're absolutely right, thank you for setting me straight.

You are most welcome. Glad i could help.


Mother Theresa were still alive, we could build more shelters for people to go and suffer and die in. Wasn't she worth about $40 million at the time of her death?
Can you give me a link which shows her personal net wealth as being $40mil?


Sometimes I wish people would take the time to review the links I spend time putting in my posts. I've done MY homework. Don't be so arrogant and learn something yourself.

Are you serious? I mean really - are you serious? Are those links to prove something about the Catholic Church? You give this in your OP:

Do people think it will 'buy' them a higher place in heaven (Catholic church selling indulgences) than helping a fellow man?
and then you post links that don't mention the Catholic Church? You aren't really serious are you. You just pulling my leg - good one. You got me.


BTW, I'm not just speaking of the Catholic church.

Then don't mention the Catholic Church as it then does not constitute generalization with Christian churches.


Hmmm, is that their justification for selling indulgences?
Can you give me an example of these indulgences that i am obviously missing out on? Ok i will do the leg work for you - Myths About Indulgences Simple really easy to understand.


Oh, my bad, the church would NEVER ask for money unless it's a good cause, and paying for your future sins must definitely fall into that category.

Paying for future sins? How? No they don't ask unless for a good cause, and if they do it is not sanctioned by the people. They offer the means to donate by sending a collection box etc but one does NOT have to give. It's a personal thing at the end of the day unlike some Christian Churches.


You're right, unless we can save everybody at the same time, we shouldn't save anybody. Gotcha.
OK so we should save 200 people and let millions die? Yeah i guess that could make sense in some quarters.
So what do you think would happen if we sold all the churches and helped the causes. Would the "causes" cease at that point?? Unfortunately it will never end so a once off "fix" isn't logical - is it?


...the money would go further and save more people in the hands of non-profit organizations than in the hands of a church

The Catholic Church is non-profit. The money they make goes to building new churches and church upkeep and what i have mentioned before in terms of helping people.


...like the link I provided already which you, apparently, don't have the time to read because you'd prefer to come here and try to make yourself seem smarter than you are.

Oh i am smarter than i think i am or give myself credit for. That link generalizes Christian churches. In fact has to do with Evangelical/Pentecostals/Charismatics/Neocharismatics specifically. But then you knew that and just added "Catholic Church" for effect? Right?

Now if you look at your first post, is it the Churches that need to fix all this or the people, in the countries, themselves?? Not a trick question at all - very logical. It is not for the Church to fix this but SOME churches do assist where they can and then want to stop donating so they can't assist anymore. I guess that is what is expected? Why don't you go out and help someone yourself?? Then come and tell us about what you did instead of expecting someone else to fix the worlds problems. Each individual is responsible for fixing the wrongs in the world starting with fixing their OWN wrongs - not the Catholic Church. When we have that right we won't need to donate and some churches won't have leaders driving expensive cars.



posted on Nov, 20 2007 @ 02:19 AM
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[edit on 20-11-2007 by luxor311]



posted on Nov, 20 2007 @ 03:08 AM
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Originally posted by luxor311
The Catholic church has been one of the most corrupt organizations in history.
An opinion to which you are allowed.


Have you been to Rome?
Nope.


Dont you remember paying a "fee" to go every where within the Vatican walls.
The cost depends on the tourism company you go with. On the last Sunday of the month it is free. Fees in general are used to maintain the Vatican and the grounds and other running costs.


Why did mother Theresa in 1988 go to the UN asking for money? because the Vatican was in the middle of a multi million restoration of the sistine chapel (15 million to be exact). They never gave her a penny. That gives you an idea where the Catholic Churches priorities are.
That is actually a very small amount in relation to what the church spends annually for good causes. And the Sistine Chapel was restored for $3mil December 11th 1999.


Throughout history it has tried to dominate the peoples minds with the fear factor and has gained power as a result.
ahhhh history. Yes, history is a bugger is it not.


Why dont you ask the Jews how they feel about Pope Pius XII conveniently turning his head during the holocaust.
Lets ask Jews how they feel about

Catholic Church under Pius XII was instrumental in saving 860,000 Jews from Nazi death camps
Again, more Jews were rescued in WWII than Catholics BY the Catholic Church. Pius is old news and the history is as one would like it to be and has been miscommunicated so i will leave the research up to you. I have done this in other threads. Do a search on what i added. AND ok here it comes:

It is well documented by Jewish scholars like Joseph Lichten of B'nai B"rith that Pius used the assets of the Vatican to ransom Jews from the Nazis and that the Vatican under Pius ran an extensive network of hide-outs. Even the Pope's summer residence, Castel Gondolfo, was used to hide fugitive Jews. The Pope, moreover, took personal repsonsibility for the children of deported Jews;


Here and
here

That is a simple outline of the case. The Church's record was not perfect, but how many other institutions did this much?



The missionaries are not well funded by the church they are currently more concerned about addressing their "priest" problem...truth.
Again your opinion?


FYI I was born and raised Catholic went to Catholic schools all my life Studied in Rome for six months and volunteered in Haiti for three months. My girlfriend is a Jew. Im sure you would love to hear what she thinks of the church.
And your point? I am also Catholic etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc. My wife isn't Jewish. Catholics rescued Jews in the war - what does she think about that? In fact more Jews than Catholics. Now what do Catholics think about that? How many Catholics did the Jews save?? Ask her about that.

I did a google search: "jews saved catholics" - did not match any documents.

I rest my case.

EDIT to add:
This is not a Jew Catholic thing. I don't want the topic to be side tracked with Jew/Catholic BS. I was making a point based on a comment. Peace.

[edit on 20/11/2007 by shearder]



posted on Nov, 20 2007 @ 06:05 AM
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I'm curious, who do you (the OP) give money too and why?

I'm one of those people who gives money to a church. My tithes go to my wifes church which I don't attend. (I don't speak Korean) But I don't see anything wrong with giving it to a non-profit organization (NPO) either. To me, the point is to give back something. But even some of the NPO's that you seem to be campaigning for are as bad as some of the churches. I've seen NPO who take over 80 percent of the donations for so called overhead cost. The same is true of churches. If you want to give and you're worried about where your money is going then ask them to show you the records. If they refuse, then give it to someone else.

As for me, I believe that if I give, I will get it back 10 fold. So far, my faith hasn't let me down. In the last 30 years of giving, I have a comfortable home, car, food, and way to many toys. While one of my brothers who doesn't give or believe in such things is going through bankruptcy (sp?) And the other brother is in prison serving a Life sentence without parole.

I can't say their problems are caused by their lack of faith or giving, but I sometimes wonder if their situations might not have been different if they had. In my case, I believe my faith in God has kept me well off and my giving has increased my earthly rewards. And the times I did have trouble, I can trace back to something I did to cause it. But I also learned that for every bad experience I've ever had, I have been able to draw on it to help someone else through a bad spell they were havinging.

So I will keep giving my money to my wifes church until I feel the need to give it to someone else. And I'll leave it up to God watch over those who I give it to to do the right thing. But the bottom line is, I will keep giving.



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