FBI Raids "Liberty Dollar" Company Offices - Confiscates All "Ron Paul Dollars"

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posted on Nov, 15 2007 @ 06:15 PM
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It seems quite simple to me. You give them your real hard earned money and they give you THIS


Notice it says "Negotiable" on the face.

[edit on 11/15/2007 by Blaine91555]




posted on Nov, 15 2007 @ 06:29 PM
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This just gets better. Read this.
SOURCE

Liberty Dollars are Yours Risk-Free
Here is the best news of all. I have been intending to create this web site for a long time. So now that it is finally completed, you have arrived just in time to take advantage of this unprecedented offer!

Everybody in the Liberty Dollar organization thinks that our normal dollar-for-dollar exchange rate for those who are not Liberty Associates and the market driven discounted rate for Liberty Associates is amazingly low for such a valuable currency. But because the Internet has reduced many of our costs, I'm doing a test until 11/15/2007 . Depending on its effect, we may or may not continue this Special Offer after that date.

However, if you order the SPECIAL OFFER before midnight on 11/15/2007 , it's yours risk-free for only $107 with our first 100% satisfaction guarantee. (Please read the details of the guarantee below.)

Finally, because I really want this test to increase the popularity of the new currency, I'm adding three exciting Free Bonuses if you order before midnight 11/15/2007.


This is a Pyramid Scheme in my opinion.
Liberty Associates


If they sent this out in the mail they are in deep you know what.

Edited to add that spot for gold is $791.20 and these guys are selling one ounce gold coins for $1,000.00 each.

[edit on 11/15/2007 by Blaine91555]



posted on Nov, 15 2007 @ 07:01 PM
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reply to post by Blaine91555
 


I know it sounds a little wacky, buy what I think the real threat is not against those who bought into the Liberty Dollar Scheme, but that the threat is against the Federal Reserve. People pay real dollars, Legal Tender, for Liberty Dollars. The Liberty Dollar Company, or whatever, issues its currency to the customers. The Liberty Dollar Company then honors its end of the deal, would be unlawful if it didn't, and takes the Legal Tender gained from the sale of Liberty Dollars and buys real Gold and Silver to back up the Liberty Dollars. The Liberty Dollar Company doesn't issue more Liberty Dollars than it has gold and silver on hand to back up the Liberty Dollars in circulation. Businesses nationwide show a sign in their storefronts that say they accept Liberty Dollars for goods and services. Circulation of Liberty Dollars increase as more businesses honor the currency, thus having an adverse effect on the circulation of Legal Tender. Legal Tender gradually gets displaced and replaced by Liberty Dollars. Then Banks that honor only Liberty Dollars, gold and silver open for business. Businesses then begin to pay employees, at least in part, in Liberty Dollars wherever local economies show strong favor or tolerance for Liberty Dollars.

Honestly I cannot find fault in the program other than the possibility that it was illegal to undertake. Though, I don't know why it would be illegal other than it would have a destabilizing effect on the economy based on the exchange of Legal Tender for goods and services. Legal Tender would become more worthless than it is even now.

Can anybody poke holes in this little scenario? I love to hear it. Right now I can't think of any, but I will post later if I do.





[edit on 15-11-2007 by Areal51]


apc

posted on Nov, 15 2007 @ 07:04 PM
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I thought that was pretty funny too. The [SPECIAL OFFER] date is scripted to the current server date.

I think the Liberty was in the clear until they started circulating paper notes. Until then, they were just like any other precious metals dealer. The only thing special about them was they marketed their coins to be used for common barter in place of Federal Reserve notes. The same as exchanging jewelry for goods.

Printing notes was a big mistake. That's money. Printing money under US law is a no-no. Unfair and disenfranchising, sure. Still stupid to go ahead and do it.

[edit on 15-11-2007 by apc]



posted on Nov, 15 2007 @ 07:19 PM
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reply to post by Areal51
 


Do you really think this company is not out to make a profit? They are not a Charity.

They are selling Gold coins for far more than the price of Gold. How is that beneficial when you can buy from a Gold Dealer for about 1.5% over spot? I don't understand why anyone would buy into that let alone paper money based on metals that may or may not exist. If someone wants gold it is easy to buy and without risk. What happens when Gold falls in price, and it will. How do they cover the difference between the price of gold and the paper certificates? Gold is at about $360 per ounce to produce the last I paid attention. Golds price often drops below the cost of production. Mining is expensive. It takes years and millions to open a small operation.

Why are they accepting US Currency in exchange for Gold? To make a profit off you? You bet!!!

This company is taking advantage of peoples fears. They scare you and then sell you something at a great profit. How does anyone defend that practice.



posted on Nov, 15 2007 @ 07:42 PM
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Look up "Local Currency" on Wikipedia and the wide world of local currencies will open unto you...

The most successful local currencies I know of are the Ithaca Hours and www.berkshares.org.... Berkshares are perhaps the best example of how to run a local currency.

The raid on the Liberty Dollar does not seem to me like a raid on a "Local Currency" as much as it is an effort to make sure those Ron Paul Silver and Gold coins never see the light of day.



There are also many others who mint "fantasy coins" or "prototype coins" in copper, silver, gold, and titanium. The most famous of these is Daniel Carr's (www.dc-coin.com...) fantasy coin version of the Amero -- the currency to replace the US dollar, Can. Dollar and the Mexican peso.



[edit on 15/11/07 by Pellevoisin]



posted on Nov, 15 2007 @ 07:43 PM
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ILLEGAL.

The government can't tell people what they can or can't exchange in their private business.

Using the liberty dollar only means that your transactions won't be backed up in government courts if you want to sue somebody over payment.

But for most other people, they don't care. Being backed by gold and silver is more backing than the dollars our government would have us use.

And to restrict people's options of what medium of exchange we use is both illegal and impractical.

People use all sorts of things as part of their exchange process. Favors, "money", sex, and material goods of infinite variety.

Just because gold and liberty dollars were being used in the same way that federal reserve notes are used, doesn't mean they don't fall under the category of bartered exchanges.

That our government would do this should frighten everybody.



posted on Nov, 15 2007 @ 07:52 PM
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Originally posted by apc

Printing notes was a big mistake. That's money. Printing money under US law is a no-no. Unfair and disenfranchising, sure. Still stupid to go ahead and do it.



Actually, that is not true. See the link above I posted for BerkShares.

[edit on 15/11/07 by Pellevoisin]



posted on Nov, 15 2007 @ 07:52 PM
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double post ... hiccup!

BerkShares: that other currency

[edit on 15/11/07 by Pellevoisin]



posted on Nov, 15 2007 @ 08:01 PM
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The value of money is based simply on your faith that it is valuable.

Due to recent changes in our country, there is a growing number of people who are losing faith in the value of federal reserve notes.

This is the reason why the liberty dollar came into being, and was being used by thousands of people for their day-to-day exchanges. They had a similar level of faith in this "money" that they had for federal reserve notes.

The only difference between a liberty dollar and a fed note is that the us court system will enforce payments using fed notes, but if you use liberty dollars to buy and sell, you take your own risks.

The only things standing in the way of the liberty dollar was time. In time it would become the preferred method for small transactions, due to the fact that it was backed by precious metals which hold their value, whereas the dollar is in the middle of a kamikazee plunge due to world events.

Now the federal government is going to try and convince people that they can't use this "money" to trade goods and services with. If the government has the right to do this, then they also have the right to:

- Stop your grandma from hiring her 11 year old neighbor boy to mow her lawn, and paying him with an apple pie.

- Stop your uncle from accepting a vintage jukebox in exchange for some transmission work on his buddy's corvette.

- Stop you from trading a stack of comic books for a stack of old NES video games.

- Stop rare coin and stamp traders from ever buying anything using the proceeds of their sale.

- Stop all casinos from using chips as "money" while in the casino.

- Stop all putt putt golf and video arcades from issuing tokens for use in their video game machines.


Do you see why this is stupid? The government doesn't have a legal leg to stand on here, but they're going to try and bully the country into never using anything but their corrupt, debt-driven money system.

We as Americans must fight this atrocity if we are ever to say that this country is OURS again.

YOU ARE ALLOWED TO USE ANY MEDIUM OF EXCHANGE YOU WISH.

Telling us otherwise is an outright lie, and a violation of our legal rights.


apc

posted on Nov, 15 2007 @ 08:03 PM
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reply to post by Pellevoisin
 


I had forgotten about BerkShares. Perhaps the core of the issue here is Liberty making a profit on top of the exchange rate.



posted on Nov, 15 2007 @ 08:07 PM
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Originally posted by Blaine91555
Why are they accepting US Currency in exchange for Gold? To make a profit off you? You bet!!!

This company is taking advantage of peoples fears. They scare you and then sell you something at a great profit. How does anyone defend that practice.


I don't understand how people can defend the practice of the Federal Reserve. At least when someone buys liberty dollars they are buying something tangible. Federal Reserve notes have no intrinsic worth besides the paper they are printed on. The only backing they have is our military. When a country decides to no longer trade oil in dollars we invade them (Iraq, and soon to be Iran.)

THAT is what dictates our foreign policy. THAT is why we have military bases around the world. And THAT is why no mainstream politician supports non-interventionism.



posted on Nov, 15 2007 @ 08:13 PM
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Originally posted by apc
 


I had forgotten about BerkShares. Perhaps the core of the issue here is Liberty making a profit on top of the exchange rate.



We keep wanting there to be a legitimate reasonable explanation.

I don't believe there is one. This is the US government run amok.

Or perhaps it is all the shadow government's doing along with the Rothschild banking mafia.

[edit on 15/11/07 by Pellevoisin]



posted on Nov, 15 2007 @ 08:18 PM
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They killed Kennedy for it.

More.

Don't try and screw with the Fed monopoly, they don't seem to like that, no matter who you are.


apc

posted on Nov, 15 2007 @ 08:18 PM
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There has to be at least a reasonable interpretation of the law, even if it's a very recently signed law. As of yet they haven't slapped terrorism charges on anyone so the court doors will be open.



posted on Nov, 15 2007 @ 08:19 PM
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There is a really good video on the net that shows how simple the money and banking system really is. It also reveals the fraud that is going on in this "industry".

This video really leaves you with that "aha!" feeling.

video.google.com...


If you're still in the mood to see more, a few other videos I would recommend are "The Money Masters" "Monopoly Men" and "Freedom to Fascism".


"The study of money, above all other fields in economics, is one in which complexity is used to disguise truth or to evade truth, not to reveal it." - John Kenneth Galbraith, in his book "Money: Whence It Came, Where It Went", 1975


"All the perplexities, confusions, and distresses in America arise, not from defects in the Constitution or confederation, not from want of honor or virtue, as much as from downright ignorance of the nature of coin, credit, and circulation." - John Quincy Adams


"It is well enough that people of the nation do not understand our banking and monetary system, for if they did, I believe there would be a revolution before tomorrow morning. The one aim of these financiers is world control by the creation of inextinguishable debts." - Henry Ford


"Neither paper currency nor deposits have value as commodities, intrinsically, a 'dollar' bill is just a piece of paper. Deposits are merely book entries." - Modern Money Mechanics Workbook, Federal Reserve Bank of Chicago, 1975


"The central bank is an institution of the most deadly hostility existing against the Principles and form of our Constitution. I am an Enemy to all banks discounting bills or notes for anything but Coin. If the American People allow private banks to control the issuance of their currency, first by inflation and then by deflation, the banks and corporations that will grow up around them will deprive the People of all their Property until their Children will wake up homeless on the continent their Fathers conquered." - Thomas Jefferson.


"The Federal Reserve banks are one of the most corrupt institutions the world has ever seen. There is not a man within the sound of my voice who does not know that this nation is run by the International bankers." - Congressman Louis T. McFadden (Rep. Pa)




posted on Nov, 15 2007 @ 08:22 PM
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Originally posted by apc
There has to be at least a reasonable interpretation of the law, even if it's a very recently signed law. As of yet they haven't slapped terrorism charges on anyone so the court doors will be open.


Sorry to have to disagree again. There need be no law at all. All there has to be is an Executive Order from George W. Bush -- and that is most definitely not "law" but rather "imperial decree".


apc

posted on Nov, 15 2007 @ 08:27 PM
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Executive orders can not violate law. I detailed this in another thread around here somewhere, but basically they can only command a Federal agency to perform some action (within the law).

Executive orders are also public I believe. You can find them on whitehouse.gov. National Security orders however are not.

Charges are filed. This is going through due process of law. If they weren't worried about the law they would have just disappeared them or set up a home invasion or something.



posted on Nov, 15 2007 @ 08:33 PM
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reply to post by apc
 


Not all EO's are public. With George W. Bush's EO's one sometimes encounters the most vague of general descriptions in summary BUT the actual details are not published. I suspect future generations will discern the truth of the illegality of many of Mr. Bush's activities including many of these EO's especially perhaps No. 51.



posted on Nov, 15 2007 @ 08:40 PM
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Originally posted by apc
Charges are filed. This is going through due process of law. If they weren't worried about the law they would have just disappeared them or set up a home invasion or something.


Clearly this wasn't just about doing in one individual. Messages are sent via FBI raids like this.

In the USA, the more money you have, the more due process you get -- unless you are on the wrong side of the banking elite.

Any show of concern for the law went out the window long ago with Pres. G.W. Bush who views the US Constitution as "just a g***amned piece of paper". With the death of Habeas Corpus and all of the restructuring of government with the development of the Department of Homeland Security (which was developed with ex-Stasi from East Germany and ex-KGB) there should be enough of a stench to let US Americans know that they are not living under the same rule of law that obtained before 9/11.





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