If it gets crazy in U.S, what country to move to?

In the hypothetical situation I'd leave, I'd pick New Zealand.

I lack the patience to learn another language and it is out of the way.

But, not gonna happen. Why? Wussing out on your country when it's gone down the crapper is cowardly.

NovusOrdoMundi and I share the same beliefs regarding this; I am not giving up.

Exposed to tons of anti-Americanism before first hand and being utterly irritated by it but also realizing there are huge problems here that need to be dealt with; for me just giving up on this place is not an option.

Originally posted by Dr Love
reply to post by dr_strangecraft

 

My family and I are moving in with Dr. Strangecraft and family, he just doesn't know it yet. He's the survival expert and I'm an expert on letting the survival expert be the expert while I drink my Jack Daniels (which I'll supply if he really wants to be a jerk about it).

Peace

I busted out laughing when I read this. Frau Dr. wanted to know what was funny so I read it to her. She says, "Come on. Always room for a few more---we need more babysitters!"


While I admire the sentiment of the American "last standers" who have posted, I am also aware that I come from a long line of refugees. When the Tsar or the Kaiser or whomever wants to play at global risk, the little people are the ones who get paved over. They are also the ones forced to do the paving.

I don't worry much about "fleeing" America, because of these thoughts:

-America is a big enough place to allow for a lot of refuges within itself.

-Even in an insane society, there are islands of relative calm. The rulers will always create bunkers for themselves. The trick is to mimic what they do. Currently, they have build fortresses for themselves using liability law. They create fictive persons (corporations) to hold their assets, in case they are sued. So I do the same. They threaten to raise the capital gains tax, because they don't pay it; so I arrange it so that I'm not taxed on capital gains either. It's the same reason they'll never outlaw private education or private schools: they want those perks for themselves. Those of us "little people" who are creative can use those perks as well.

-If america becomes a fascist superstate (it isn't yet, not by a million miles, despite rabid ATS'ers), the US will no doubt be exporting fascism, so fleeing may not be an escape. Germans fleeing the results of the 1933 elections were basically not allowed into the US and England. Many of them had to settle for France, Poland, or Czechoslovakia. The Swiss weren't receptive either, and regularly sold out German refugees to their nazi mentors, since they were pro-fascist themselves. In short, if America sucks so bad, a lot of other places will soon be worse.

.

Personnally I would go to Costa Rica... great place. But it's more and more touristic, more industrialized... destroying the beauty of it.

NZ seems good, there's a right to bear arms and pretty far from trouble.

But eh, I already live in Canada which is good. If the crap hit the fan, under canada-us treaties, US troops would come here to make police... and that means a fight. So americans, stay in your country, when you defeat your tyranny and UN troops, please come to save us.

well, ill take this opportunity to invite you all to Croatia, the country in which i live in.

its in europe, but not yet in the european union, so we dont have all the strict laws as the rest of the nations. The people here really dont care where youre from, as long as your not stuck up, and are willing to buy a drink. Its a few hours drive from Italy, Germany, Austria and Hungary...

We dont have surveillance, black ops, american military bases, terrorists, rednecks, fundamentalists, the kkk, so its really a nice place to live in. Theres a great sea side, mountains, all the cities have a lot of history, the people are nice, once you get to know them.

And, theres like a giant fortified american embassy just ouside our capitol, so if you ever feel threatened, you can go there

anyways, ill rent you room, for a very fair price

reply to post by nightsider2007

I've considered Croatia, but you will soon be part of NATO and the EU, which is bad. Do you have the right to bear arms?

If Croatia would stay the same, it would be a great place to go!

Originally posted by nightsider2007
well, ill take this opportunity to invite you all to Croatia, the country in which i live in.

its in europe, but not yet in the european union, so we dont have all the strict laws as the rest of the nations. The people here really dont care where youre from, as long as your not stuck up, and are willing to buy a drink. Its a few hours drive from Italy, Germany, Austria and Hungary...

We dont have surveillance, black ops, american military bases, terrorists, rednecks, fundamentalists, the kkk, so its really a nice place to live in. Theres a great sea side, mountains, all the cities have a lot of history, the people are nice, once you get to know them.

And, theres like a giant fortified american embassy just ouside our capitol, so if you ever feel threatened, you can go there

anyways, ill rent you room, for a very fair price

I've read about Croatia I find it interesting; but moving there for people would be difficult I mean for instance Croatian is not a widely learned language as far as I know.

But I've seen photos of Dubrovnik and I was awestruck...it looks like some place in a fantasy movie, it is so beautiful.

reply to post by dr_strangecraft


Well said,Doc.

First and foremost, US citizens have massive amounts of guns. A police state won't be tolerated. Americans already find most mainstream corporate news as suspect. Most folks under age 40 have tuned out mainstream TV and are getting their news over the internet. I'm 45 and the last news story I followed on TV was Katrina over 2 years ago. I'll stick it out here because I've seen how bad things can get. The UK is a near fascist-socialist state and its Commonwealth countries aren't far behind. The Latin American countries are on low simmer right now but could boil over tomorrow without notice. That includes Mexico, Belize and Costa Rica. Lots of poor pissed off natives who wouldn't hesitate to kill or molest a gringo.

I have some family in Slovakia near Brno, and since I am only the third generation to be over here in the States, it would be alot easier for me to get citizenship. I'm heading there next summer to check it out. Hopefully it won't be too late to leave the country by then. I doubt it, but you never know!!!

Haven t had the opportunity to read all the replies, but lets say the Antichrist rises and starts ww3 and numerous other wars along with the implementation of the mark of the beast. The only country that seems to escape his grasp or influence is Jordan. Not sure why but that is the only country that the bible says escapes his grip along with all the wrath, judgment and general chaos. So when you see these things start to come to pass. I highly recommend you pack your bag and get a passport to Jordan.

Interesting thread. How does one go about making the actual move? What are the first steps and how much money would it take, especially for a young single person with no attachments?

Originally posted by crgintx
reply to post by dr_strangecraft

 

Well said,Doc.

First and foremost, US citizens have massive amounts of guns. A police state won't be tolerated.

This quote reminds me of what the government did sevral weeks ago in Florida: Turn in your guns for Nike shoes. I think some guy turned in a rocket launcher! I also heard, 90% of American households own firearms. I believe the government is trying to disarm the public so we can be controlled more easily. They (the governemnt) want to leave us unarmed so we have nothing to fight back with. I would rather buy you a pair of shoes then see you turn in your gun. This is our country, and when push comes to shove, I will gladly fight alongside like-minded individuals to preserve our rights as American citizens. Some people are fighting overseas (for a war that's not theirs) to defend our freedom. I believe there will come a point that we have to fight that same war at home against our government. I don't condone the use of firearms unless it's used for defense in a life-threatning situation, but if you believe in what our country was founded for and for what it stands, you'll keep your defense mechanism close by to fight for our people. Don't leave this country because of the government, stay because of the people. United we stand, divided we fall! P.S. As much as I would love to buy you shoes, I can't because my wife would kill me.

Wow, it's amazing how many of you would want to live in Canada. One thing we have to know about is what type of natural disaster, or world event would be happening. If it was nuclear war, I wouldn't suggest living in Canada at all, because of the proximity to the United States. If it was a world war, then Canada would be a prime target, because we leave our norther borders open to anyone that would want to come.

Don't get me wrong Canada is a great country, but to truly get away from a hypothetical war, then you would have to at least live in the Yukon, NWT, or Nunavut, don't even think about living in Alberta, that's where our oil production is slated.

Oh and Vancouver Island, word of warning to anyone living here (like I do), or anyone thinking of moving, if there was any type of natural disaster were shut off from the rest of the world, unless we have our own boat or plane

- Azure

Other than that as a Canadian, I would welcome anyone who wants to live here, me personally, if it wasn't Canada I would be living in the next best place... the USA

NovusOrdoMundi, and Dominicus, I have started a new thread and replied to your posts here So, you think you could do it better becase I didnt want to disrespect you or anyone else by taking this thread off topic again.

On topic, the only thing that could make me move is a natural disaster. If that was the case, I would move to the nearest safezone until we could re-enter and start rebuilding.

i think the standard of living in many country's throughout the world will be in decline soon.

The credit expansion cycle created by the fed is not being allowed to correct itself due to the huge amount of leverage and thus "jacked up asset values" that would come tumbling down if this global credit cycle was to run it's course. the only thing left to do is inflate the money supply thru intrest rate cuts. i think social security reform will get people to be pressured to parking their S.S pensions into the stock market to drive up one last boom. as this occurs price inflation (food especially) will increase and discretionary income will likely fall as well as unemployment rises as well. when the majority of pensions are in the markets they will be allowed to crash, and the gov't will have S.S off their debt obligations just in time for the global shift in power to be finalized as baby boomers retire (in 2010) and the population becomes increasingly older and "unproductive" /retired. I think gold will be a great place to STORE Wealth. then the NAU is formed and a extreme two tier society will result, with lot's of civil unrest.

the way i see it you have two years to get your house in order (end of 09)
although i could be wrong.

iceland sounds nice, although living in florida i may like somewhere warmer (however i am from boston) and iceland's weather isn't that much different believe it or not.

Originally posted by Darth Logan
I also heard, 90% of American households own firearms.

Where the hell did you hear that from?

I have only touched a gun once in my life and it was at a military expo; it was a n M-16 and I held it. It was disabled and without ammo.

My house has no guns in it; we own none. I have never fired a gun, no one on my block has a gun.

I'd still say more than half of Americans do not own guns. It's typically more of a southern thing.

reply to post by Kacen


No, it's an awareness thing and a rural life thing. Be aware: the gov't and police can't and don't protect you from violent criminals especially those armed with guns. There are regions of the US where most folks have figured this out and having taken steps to protect themselves and their loved ones by the most economic means possible: a firearm.
Farm folks have to protect livestock from predators, both 2 legged and 4 legged . Crops also have to be protected by from predation as well. Plus deer and other game animals are extra protein.

A firearm is a device which directs chemical explosive force/energy precisely into as small an area as possible for the purpose of destroying or disabling a target that is a threat without destroying the surrounding area. It is the most economic use of chemical explosive force. Grenades and other small explosive devices are often as hazardous to their users as it is their intended targets.

While many in our country believe the myth that the police and gov't can/will protect them from those intent on doing them harm, may I point out that if the events of 9/11/01 aren't enough to convince you that the police and other govt forces can't stop 19 guys armed with box cutters from murdering nearly 3000 people with 4 commercial transport aircraft, how are they going to protect 300 million individuals at the same time?

Our military forces are there to protect the Republic from the threat of large armies and aren't really good at doing much else. They destroy other armies. That is their purpose. The police are there to clean up the mess only after the crime has happened. It's up to you as an individual to protect yourself and your loved ones from violent crime.

i'm thinking i might visit Dubai ... after November '07 & before April '08...

if the balloon goes up over here, i'll have no choice but o stay there for awhile,
seeing as how a lot of Corps. are moving their HQs there,
see: npr.org...

i can see myself picking up some civil engineering position among all
the dedicated ex-patriots running construction, energy, golf, arms transfer
companies over there.

Ha Ha Ha stupied question, I would stay and fight, I was born here and I will die here. If you would leave then do it now save us the trouble.

reply to post by Kacen


It was reported by the anti-gun advocates at the UN that US citizens own 270 million firearms. That's not including the firearms owned buy the gov't and military. That's one gun for 90% of the population.

I suspect you figure of over 50% of households owning guns maybe a bit high, I'd put it somewhere between 35-40%. Still that's at least 105-120 million folks. Any country foolish enough to militarily invade the US would be slaughtered completely.

The Powers-that-be are very lucky that Americans are a tolerant and peaceful lot . If we were half as dissatisfied as many of the other disarmed populations around the world, the bloodshed would be horrendous. It would make the French Revolution's Reign of Terror look like a tea party.

Dubai seems pretty exposed to me. Water supply issues, electricity and food issues. If a new power or regional empire emerges in the ME, you can expect to see non-militarist states swept aside and their people "annexed."

Call it the Luxembourg syndrome.

Others were talking about Croatia. I'd have similar concerns there; I find it doubtful that all racial/religious strife has completely ended in that region. Not a swipe against Croatia, but at some of its neighbors.

One of the things about living in the US midwest is that you are "militarily remote." Even the rumored Al Qaeda attack on multiple US centers involves its port cities, with one exception. If an invasion comes my way, I will have some advance notice.

The more subtle (and likely) scenario is probably a militaristic coup, where a segment of the US decides to quit being an open society, and embrace a totalist state. If the US did this, I think you'd see the trend go world-wide, and most other liberal democracies would rapidly follow suit.

Most people today have no idea of how many "2nd tier" nations in the 1920's and 1930's embraced fascism, because Italy, Germany, and Spain did. No americans every talk about the fact that while FDR was a socialist, even his govt copied the trappings of fascism, down to the decorations and rhetoric.

Imagine the psychological impact in other democracies if a totalist were elected to the presidency, and congress willingly dissolved itself so "the leader" could rule more effectively. Especially if it was accompanied by military and economic gains (germany agian).

In this scenario, don't you think there would be voices in Canada and Australia that would advocate following America's lead, especially if it was working? What about the EU?

In that case, "running" might not do much good. Unless you pick one of America's "enemies."