im british btw.

i wasnt really calling you anti-american.... but alot of anti-war people are pro-saddam without knowing it. they firmly believe bush is a worse man that saddam hussein.

the result of the war will be a democratic iraq.... EVENTUALLY, hopefully, we will live in a worldwide democracy. the freedom of the people of iraq is what is important. its not the americans that making the iraqis life hell, its the saddam loyalists and terrorists.

wasnt the UN HQ bombed a few months ago (or another important UN building)? that wasnt the americans fault - that was the work of the people america is fighting against. and i think they are the people everyone should be fighting against.

but alot of anti-war people are pro-saddam without knowing it.

If you support someone you would know it.

Just because someone thinks Bush is a craptoid does not mean they like Saddam.

It is easy to dislike both of them, as I do.

How many Saddam Supporters are there in America?

Very, very few if not none.

"If you support someone you would know it.

Just because someone thinks Bush is a craptoid does not mean they like Saddam.

It is easy to dislike both of them, as I do.

How many Saddam Supporters are there in America?

Very, very few if not none."

i didnt really mean it like that
i meant people will happily watch bush fail and they would be happy if saddam would never be caught just because it puts more strain on bush and gives them another thing to moan about.

Originally posted by rahboni

NOTICE: You must have the latest DIVX decoding software to see this video properly.

Originally posted by rahboni

NOTICE: You must have the latest DIVX decoding software to see this video properly.

Look, I've downloaded the latest Microsoft WMP Version & codecs, idem with Real One Player. But the video is still frozing after 5 seconds. Then I just have the sound.

It is easy for people not in Iraq to be arm chair soldiers and generals but the circumstances around this event tell the tale.

Does anyone know if this activity was going on at night? Most farmers are early to bed and early to rise...

I wouldn't personally be handling any white hot, tractor exhaust? Would you?

After watching the longer version I noted the following:

• It does not look like all of this is happening along a roadway but rather in the middle of a field. The "farmer" is plowing a portion of the field.
  
  
• One of the men carried what definitely looked like an RPG tube into the field as well as a smaller unidentifiable object.
  
  
• The hot exhaust stack on the tractor was exactly that. This is not the same item that was taken into the field
  
  
• The sequence of vehicle arrival is interesting. First the big truck, then the pick-up, then finally the tractor shows up after the shenanigans with the launcher tube.
  
  
• The men new or sensed that there was a helicopter nearby as they consistently looked in the direction of the camera.
  
  
• There was an isolated burst of gunfire that was not directed at these men and was not apparently from this Apache. When they heard it, the men ducked and ran about quicker. But they did not leave the scene.
  
  
• Maybe it was the type of headgear worn, but it almost looks as though one of the men has a long ponytail to just below the shoulders.
  
  

All of this raises a few questions.

1. Did all three men show up at the same time in that field as a part of a predetermined meeting, or was the farmer just an innocent bystander? (I think not, it would be too much of a coincidence. I think that the farmer was there to plow over the attack/ weapons cache burial location to hide it).
   
   
2. Why is the shorter, more ambiguous, version even out there? Is this an effort to create a "sensationalized" video for anti-war purposes?
   
   
   
   
   [Edited on 18-1-2004 by HowardRoark]
   
   [Edited on 18-1-2004 by HowardRoark]
   

Ok, thx

Of course now it's different. It's clear the guy who' s running has something on his right hand and it's pretty looking like an rpg-7. It seems we were not talking about the same " tube ".



[Edited on 18-1-2004 by ultra_phoenix]

there would be no reason why the troops would kill these people if they didnt believe they were a threat to other troops/civilians. they get enough bad publicity from all the anti-war people (which, i must say, nitpick non-stop). i'd imagine they are being very careful atm of who they kill.

umm whoever says theres a tractor on this video has obviously never seen a tractor in their life also you can clearly see the guy getting rid of an rpg with a rocket still on it, look at the shape of it and you see its no pipe.

Originally posted by namehere
umm whoever says theres a tractor on this video has obviously never seen a tractor in their life also you can clearly see the guy getting rid of an rpg with a rocket still on it, look at the shape of it and you see its no pipe.

I saw three vehicles, a truck, a pickup, and what looked like a tractor dragging a harrow/rake (or whatever it is called).

What did you see?

"These men were no threat to the helicopter. This looks like murder."

Isn't every WAR about murder?

Any nation that invades past the border of a nation and kills the nations soldiers are murders.

If chiniese troops invaded america, i bet all the americans wills will state murder.

I think it is pretty plain to see that the object that was removed from the pick up truck was an RPG. He was more then likely putting it in the field for future use against our Soldiers. That Apache crew had every right to fire upon them. If there was one RPG in the truck there was sure to be more or possibly other weapons. Why was he putting the object in the field? The truck of choice for the insurgents hitting our troops seems to be pickup trucks.

Originally posted by namehere

1) umm whoever says theres a tractor on this video has obviously never seen a tractor in their life

2) also you can clearly see the guy getting rid of an rpg with a rocket still on it, look at the shape of it and you see its no pipe.

1) There is one.

2) On the first video, that part was missing. Hopefully, someone has posted the whole video.

Originally posted by Springer
Then with military precision they destroyed their equipment, the trucks they were transporting weapons in.

Sure, only they weren't really shooting at the trucks. They were shooting at the people. Surely, if it was their intention to disable the vehicles and what may have been weapons, they could have easily done just that.

Now that someone mentioned it, that does look exactly like a tractor. I can see the big back tires. My question is, how the hell do they even know these were Iraqis? The entire attack appears to be based on the same # this war is based on....hunches and speculation.

[Edited on 1-20-2004 by Satyr]

I’ve been coming to this site for quite some time now. I've looked through the posts here and have never answered anything posted, nor have I really seen anything that inclined me to do so. But this makes my blood boil. We have men and women in Iraq getting attacked everyday by people hiding in shadows, and then run into a crowd of civilians to take cover. They use coward tactics and kill AMERICANS on a daily basis. They fire at us from crowds of women and children, so we cannot fight back. We die while they are allowed to continue to fight by these rules. So people whine when we do the same to them. We don’t know the full story behind the video. Maybe we intercepted a message, maybe we were told about them who knows. All that is being told is that they were part of the terrorist group. Now I know we cannot always believe what we are told by our government. I served in the Navy for 14 years, so I know how true that statement really is. Nor do I believe in killing innocent people, but because we attack a group that is presumed as the enemy, how is that wrong? Please someone explain it to me. Yeah the government lies in our faces all the time. I know it, I’ve seen it first hand, and some of it you would not believe. So because we have an unfair advantage MOST of the time, I guess that makes it wrong to fight back. Our government is not the greatest and they lie the most out of any other. They hide everything from us, and I want to know just as bad as the rest of you about it all. I want to know what we have, and what is real. Our government may not be the best, but I’d rather be here than anywhere else on the face of the planet.

alexandernevermind, nice post and everything.. but dont forget that its not ONLY the united states fighting...

got any examples of when the government has lied to the american people?

What I see are nightscoped people running around like they do in my "Medal of Honor" game. I hide in the grass and target them with an (X) mounted sight. I lead the targets, just like they did, when they walk around and then eliminate them on the orders of my "superiors". It makes me feel like a good robot.

Sometimes on this maximum-security-prison-planet, you just have to fire up the PS2 and vent some rage. Some do it on the couch, some on the computer and some in an Apache helicopter. Its helpful for the ego to behave robotically now and then. Death is an illusion...but one we must take seriously.

You are absolutely free

voice_of_doom, i know what ure tryina get at.... dont even go there.

for thousands of years, people have followed orders. no orders = chaos

Order based on reason.