Ontario claims power to seize, destroy modified cars

Anyone else find this a little disturbing? I have a car that I like to modify a little, however I don't race. It's just a hobby for me. I can understand them banning Nitrous Oxide in a vehicle, simply because there are numerous safety issues unrelated to racing, but this is putting way too much power in the hands of the police.

Edit: Shortened Quoted Text

[edit on 3-8-2007 by chissler]

“We will seize it and you will never see it again. We will crush your car, we will crush the parts.”

Thats rather kind of them.Illegally seize your property and destroy it without just cause. I'm pretty sure if they tried this you would have a real good Charter of Rights case to take them to court with.

Originally posted by GAOTU789
Thats rather kind of them.Illegally seize your property and destroy it without just cause. I'm pretty sure if they tried this you would have a real good Charter of Rights case to take them to court with.

I can't wait to see what happens when they crush some lawyer's customized Porsche. The junk will hit the fan then!

With the recent fad of altering vehicles, there needs to be some strong legislation to govern what people are doing. It's not that uncommon for people to have explosives in their own vehicle. Other modifications that are becoming more and more regular are extremely unsafe, and really put the driver and pedestrians in danger.

I believe that if someone wants to modify their car, they should be able to legally do so. But there needs to be some legislation to govern it. For instance, under no circumstances should any vehicle on the road, have any sort of explosive in it.

What scares me, is that the people who have these explosives in their vehicle, they are the same ones who have it dropped right to the ground. Car meets pavement? Sparks anyone? Sparks meet explosives? Fourth of July anyone?

I don't agree with a blanket rule that any modification will result in the destruction of your car. But I do stand for some legislation to govern it.

[edit on 3-8-2007 by chissler]

Originally posted by chissler
I believe that if someone wants to modify their car, they should be able to legally do so. But there needs to be some legislation to govern it. For instance, under no circumstances should any vehicle on the road, have any sort of explosive in it.

Except for gasoline of course

The problem is that politicians are seeing street racing as a vehicular problem, when in reality it's a driver problem. They should be targeting the drivers that are racing, and not assuming that all modified vehicles are intended for racing.

This legislation looks to me like a cheap attempt to score political points rather than a legitimate attempt to make streets safer. I'm sure there are more effective solutions available.

Thats so awesome. I thought I hated the opp before. They can seize property and destroy because it looks a certain way now...thats so awesome. Thanks god I live i Alberta. What we have is atuomatic seizure of any vehicle CAUGHT racing and $300 fines for spectators...it seems to be slowly working. Besides seizing cars based on looks stops nothing, have they ever heard of sleeper cars?

I'm sure they know of "sleeper" or "stock 'looking'" cars.

I think this is based on insurance.
Everyone knows you have to tell your insurance company of any modifications- they even ask when you go to sign the insurance papers.

If you get pulled over because your car has spoilers on it, or a different body kit than what was registered, they have reasonable doubt.

I DO NOT agree with this legislation. However, given how many people are caught racing, and how many people, TECHNICALLY 'fraudulenty' insure vehicles, and how many people die, can you blame them?
And I mean fraudulent by not being honest, or at least telling a company of a certain mod when you get it.

Originally posted by HCLogo
The problem is that politicians are seeing street racing as a vehicular problem, when in reality it's a driver problem. They should be targeting the drivers that are racing, and not assuming that all modified vehicles are intended for racing.

This legislation looks to me like a cheap attempt to score political points rather than a legitimate attempt to make streets safer. I'm sure there are more effective solutions available.

Good post! Star for it.

Im on the fence with this legislation tbh and here's why.

Recently my girlfriends sisters best friend and her boy friend got into a serious accident on the 400 south. He had an "illegal engine" (as he put it, not sure on the details) and he rolled his car into a ditch after screwing up a lane change. The girl is fine, well a swore back and some bruises, but otherwise ok. However, her boyfriend is now a quadrapalegic. He had serious spine damage that resulted in the loss of the use of all his limbs.
The claim is that they were racing some friends back home from a camping trip.

As the above quoted post says, its not about the cars, its about the drivers, but it is lucky that this driver didnt kill or hurt anyone but himself.

I have mixed feeling about this one...

The street racing problem is getting serious in Vancouver.
A friend of mine was killed by a streetracer. Another had his car totaled by one. Both of the racers ran.

Street racers tend to be of Asian origins and are kids with rich parents. I'm not stereo-typing... I have a friend that works at Lordco selling auto parts and he figures more than 90% of his customers fit into that category. Spoiled Asian brats with very little understanding of personal responsibility.

I'm all for taking their toys away and crushing them. I think they should make the owners watch.

HOWEVER
There needs to be regulations as to what is a legal modification and what is not. Tinkering with cars can be fun. There's lots of modifications that can be done that are not for streetracing. You can improve efficiency, handling, and traction to improve a car's performance in normal day to day use. Even bottom-end acceleration is useful in urban driving.

This might not be the right direction to go... but at least something pro-active is being done.

I think some better ideas would be;
A One Strike and You're Out policy for racers. Get busted streetracing and you can NEVER get your license back.

Ban the sale of NOS.

Education/media campaign showing how stupid and destructive streetracing is. This was rather effective for drinking and driving in my youth... it became extremely un-cool thanks to the awareness that was bludgeoned into my generation.

Originally posted by chissler
But there needs to be some legislation to govern it. For instance, under no circumstances should any vehicle on the road, have any sort of explosive in it.

well, then you should have no problem turning over your keys. EVERY CAR HAS EXPLOSIVES...its called gasoline!!!
the engine by definition is explosive "internal COMBUSTION"

[edit on 13-10-2007 by icybreeze]

Honestly, sorry to be a buzzkill, but I am totally with them on this one. My friend recently got in a serious car accident. He had a very fast vehicle, I think a honda civic hatch-back, with H22 engine and turbo. He got in a accident with a semi-truck, he will be in the hospital for a few months undergoing surgery and such.
There is no point to have racing cars on the streets, I mean take them to the track or something.

I drive on the 400 series of highways in toronto every day and usually the morons that are speeding, not indicating and making unsafe lane changes, etc... are the ones without modified cars.

The problem here is that it's up to the police officers judgement to decide whether or not to seize the vehicle.. which is a bit disturbing..

I do like the new law however, anyone going 50 km/h over the speed limit will have their car seized and held for 7 days.

Nitrous oxide has no practicality on the street. This is the only thing that should really be banned, minus modifications that effect emissions in a negative way.

You should have EVERY RIGHT to modify the outside and inside of the vehicle as long as it doesn't impact visibility to a point of being dangerous ... you also would still be required to have tail-lights, reverse, tag, and headlights, blinkers. But all other things they shouldn't have a say on.

If you put an intake on your car, it is up to you. It can improve reliability on some cars and may slightly increase mileage (single digit percentage). The same can be said with exhaust, as long as they still use a catalytic converter and pass emissions.

There are a lot of people who have modded cars that do not and will not participate in street racing. Some take their daily driven cars to drag strips, race tracks, and auto-cross events.

Cracking down on street racers is good, but not on those who wish to beautify their cars ... since a car lover ... their vehicle is an extension of themselves and their personality. I may not agree with a lot of visual modifications, but it should be their right to make their car look ugly


So ... does this legislation mean if someone buys aftermarket rims, they can seize and crush the car? What if someone just likes the looks of the rims and tires. How about a paint job? Where does it stop?

To me, this is absolutely ridiculous and should have never been considered.

I have to agree with the legislation. I think it's a good step to prevent those people with vehicles who street race thereby causing a clear threat to public safety. I believe that there is a requirement to crack down legally on these people. They are a dangerous threat to the public.

I agree that is the driver who is at fault and when you crush the 30k car with 40k in mods that they have because they were a complete moron then that would make them think twice. Unless of course they are drug dealers then we should hang them.(I hate drug dealers by the way)

I believe that there should be an inspection done on the vehicles which will dictate what would deem them dangerous vehicles. Its one thing to take your car in the shop and bore out the engine but it's another to chip it out and add intakes, blowers and suspensions specifically designed for racing.

I believe that there should also be mandatory 20 day driver’s education courses at the ages of 14, 16, 18, 25 and 30. The fact that road safety is hammered into a person repeatedly will make drivers more aware of what they are doing and the serious effects they can have on themselves as well as the general public.

While some believe it is again their human rights to have their toy taken away by the government I would suggest those that do make an effort to volunteer with at a local hospital and care facility and see firsthand just how devastating street racing accidents are.

I’m very supportive of those people who pay their $125.00 to spend a day on the track and speed to their hearts content, make side bets, even race for pink slips. They need to keep it in a controlled environment where they do not put the public at risk.

Thank you all for your time,

Arcticnull



[edit on 10/21/0707 by Arcticnull]

[edit on 10/21/0707 by Arcticnull]

While some believe it is again their human rights to have their toy taken away by the government I would suggest those that do make an effort to volunteer with at a local hospital and care facility and see firsthand just how devastating street racing accidents are.

Couldent have said it better, some of the racers seem to think that it is a totally harmless thing.

Here on Long Island, drag racing is a very big problem and they do it on all the major roads at night and God help you if you have to drive at that hour as they weave in and out of traffic. About 10 Long Islanders a year are killed thanks to drag racing.

But let's take it from a responsible enthusiasts standpoint. You all are looking at it as the only people who mod their car like that are idiots.

I drive slow, casual. If I bought another RX-7, I have researched for years, I know exactly what I would do to it. That wouldn't change how I drive, but I still would like to do those things. Now, with that law, I am law abiding, driving responsible, but, I get my car crushed and lose all that money (that goes into the economy) because I did what I liked to my car and some joker was irresponsible with a dodge neon who put hubcap spinner on it and pushed the car off the road around a corner.

How is that fair to the responsible people who have the money and wish to mod their car and NOT drive like a maniac? Punish those who deserve it. I have had several cars that would have been crushed that I only drove 2 miles to work and back, no racing, no safety risk. I just want to argue the other side.

You do realize that a lot of modifications make the car more reliable and safer, right? When you modify the suspension, it handles and responds better in emergency situations. When you replace rubber bushings for polyurethane is takes away some of the cushion from the road, but makes the suspension work better, more accurately, steer better, more accurately. When you put on stiffer springs and struts/shocks, similar things ... less lean in turns ... the vehicle and driver are more connected, thus, more able to avoid accidents, more in control of the vehicle on the interstate, and on on/off-ramps. Suspension mods equal safety but giving up comfort. If you research cars, you will see some factory vehicles come with better suspension than a lot of mods people do. Not everyone buys a kia.

When you put a 'street legal' intake and exhuast ... you allow the engine to breath better, increasing gas mileage and lessening the heat soak in the engine block, thereby increasing its longevity. A chip tunes the engine to run most efficiently and rarely gives you a large leap in performance. All these thing barely add any power ... to bore and stroke the engine increases its power as much or more than all those combined.

Now ... superchargers and turbos do add loads of power. Some cars come with them stock. Cars with low torque can benefit greatly from a supercharger ... turbos are usually more for high rpm powerbands ... so less needed on the street.


Still, you can buy a Viper that has 500 hp and 500 torque for 80,000 usd ... so does that get crushed because it is a beast that is more powerful than 90% of the modded cars off the showroom floor? The investment is about the same. What about a Cadillac XLR? Corvette? Does someone who buys a Hemi qualify to be crushed?


Don't you realize that most accidents DON'T involve street racing? Most of the deadly or severe casualties are from people with cell phones, playing with dials, shaving, make-up/hair, looking at themselves in the mirror, driving while exhausted, without glasses that need them, or just plain out bad drivers or cars in disrepair.

To label all car enthusiasts are moronic street racers and destroy their life savings by destroying their one true passion - their car - that they invested in for just knowing they have it the best they can is ridiculous.

I full agree with the illegal-ness of street racing. They should have their license suspended ... and if they do it again, permanently revoked. They should have their cars confiscated ... but why not use them as undercover cars? Send them to a different region and let the police use the cars to their advantage? OR ... donate them to driving schools to teach people how to drive? Use them to fund these driving lesson programs that I fully agree with ... since most people don't even deserve a license in my opinion.

I also agree that ALL RACING should be in controlled environments ... on closed courses. Auto-cross events, road tracks, drag strips, etc. They should NEVER be on the public road system. Too many variables and too dangerous to all those around. It is completely irresponsible and unacceptable.


I still don't think that punishing the responsible enthusiast is ever the way to go. It would be the same as restricting your freedom of speech because someone else is a moron and says horrible things that have inspired hate and violence. It would be the same as forbidding people from going camping because some idiot doesn't know how to safely contain a fire in the wilderness. Banning bicycles because someone lost control and fell, breaking their neck (or rollerskates, skateboards, etc.).


Extreme measures against law abiding people because of a few idiots ... well, that is just wrong.


How about this ... find abandoned parking lots and set up weekend or daily races for those people ... or anyplace that will let them use a large patch of concrete ... of course, have them all sign waivers to enter.

I know, it is an odd way to solve the problem, but, it is kind of like after school programs ... you give them a way to do something they like in a legal way, they are less likely to do something irrational that will harm others. If those 'street-racers' had somewhere to play for free, they would, I am almost certain ... except for maybe a few real morons.

It reminds me of the mass of people around here that used to go out to some dirt areas 'mudding' with their trucks ... they got busted ... but they were in wilderness, doing mud runs, hill climbs, etc. of course, I am certain they found a new place to play, but, why not give them someplace to do this without it being wrong? I only went once, since I am not redneck, but, they were having fun with each other. Never been to a street race, but, know of them, and they are doing it for fun as well.

We should help them make it legal and safe, then throw the book at the rest. And confiscate those cars and let those who can't afford it race in the legally defined place.


Before you discredit something ... like a modified vehicle ... drive one. Know the difference between how sloppy the average stock suspension is compared to a tuned one. Know how it is to try and get a 60 hp vehicle up to speed on a crowded interstate versus beefing it up a bit. There are good reasons sometimes. And leaving it to a person to decide, there is too much room for discretion and discrimination.

Target the bad ones, not everyone.