Justin,
There is many levels to this issue. I know what it means to me, and why I don't want it. I think everyone may say something different. I know some good may come out of the bill, but that is just not the point to me. I don't want our representatives to put a band aid over this problem, I want them to actually do something to fix it. I know there are no easy answers, you have spelled that out in many of your responses, very nicely worded also, thanks.

Originally posted by RedGolem
Justin, There is many levels to this issue. I know what it means to me, and why I don't want it. I think everyone may say something different. I know some good may come out of the bill, but that is just not the point to me. I don't want our representatives to put a band aid over this problem, I want them to actually do something to fix it. I know there are no easy answers, you have spelled that out in many of your responses, very nicely worded also, thanks.

You've summed it up. One size does not fit at all. That's why we've got to take some time out of our busy lives to write a few lines or say a few words to our leaders in Washington. they can't rightfully do the people's business unless they rightly know what the people think.

The immigration bill is stalled in teh Senate, and it may be "tabled." That's fancy talk for put on the shelf. We should avoid the temptation to let these guys and gals walk away from this for the rest of the summer. that's what they'll do if they can. If we let them. As you make your suggestions, insist on a solution (a bill whic will become law) in this year.

Justin,
I like that you want the law makers to actually do work and get something done, I am just not to sure I want something similar to what was written to be put into law. I just think there are many other things and issues that need to be addressed more.
I have called to tell my representative about some of those items just in case you were going to ask.

Originally posted by RedGolem
Justin,
I like that you want the law makers to actually do work and get something done, I am just not to sure I want something similar to what was written to be put into law. I just think there are many other things and issues that need to be addressed more.
I have called to tell my representative about some of those items just in case you were going to ask.

You should never be afraid to talk to your elected officials. They are paid with your taxes. They work for you. In regards to the immigration bill, you may get your wish. If it gets tabled, it won't come up again until after the primaries next year. My own hope is that they will at least push for greater enforcement of laws that are already on the books.

Justin.
When a bill gets tabled I was not to sure if it ever comes up again, but speaking of the primaries I was intending to badger my representative some what around that time. I want them to deal with the eminent domain issue. There is a bill that is tabled already that will make it so your property can not be taken by the government for personal gain. I was thinking that might be a good time to get them to look into getting them to vote on that one again.

It now looks asthought the immigration bill is dead for the remainder of this Congress. We won't see it come up again until next year. that odesn't mean that we should stop talking to our Senators and Representatives about it. It's a political cop-out for them to table this measure and stop the debate. It's more proof that they don't care who gets hurts...as long as its not them.

Justen,
Yes I heard it was being tabled. I did not loot at it as being a cop out but yes I suppose it is. Yes I do plan to continue telling my representatives what I think on the issues that I understand or have an opinion on. What I don't seem to be able to do is figure out a way for them to untable an issue.

In both the House and the senate, bills are managed by the committee chairs and the majority leaders. In the case of the Senate, Harry Reid isthe majority leder, and as such, he does have the authority to decide what bills are debated and which stay "on the table." Find aw ay to convince him, and you'll have that option you wanted.

[edit on 12-6-2007 by Justin Oldham]

Justin
Harry Ried is not my representative. So does that not mean that I can not call his office and ask if it would be possible to bring to discussion a bill that has been tabled?
Or is it that I need to talk to my representative and ask them to bring to discussion the bill that has been tabled? If the latter is the correct method it has already been done with out it doing any good.

Actually, you are entitled to write, phone, or e-mail any and all members of Congress. Harry Reid is a Senator, and he's also the Senate Majority Leader. Anyone can send him a note or call his office to leave a message.

For those who need a check list, try this.

1. Google "Senate Majority Leader" to get the web page for the Senate Majority Leader. Click on the contact link to send him an e-mail. Write dow nteh phone number you see, and call it.

2. Go to House dot-gov to look for YOUR State's Representatives. Click through the fields to find their addresses, phone numbers, and an option to send e-mail. Be polite and get right to the point.

3. Go to Senate dot-gov to look for YOUR State's Senators. Click through the fields to find their addresses, phone numbers, and an option to send e-mail. Be polite and get right to the point.

4. Write a single page letter, with signature block. cut and paste the correct addresses into each version, one for every Representative and Senator that you want to talk to. Some people really do mail form letters to every-body.

Insider secret: If your letter has a real signature on it, they'll never know its a form letter sent to lots of different addresses. Always take the time to change that "Dear []" line to 'prove' that you're not spamming.

For all of you who are so opposed to this immigration bill and illegal aliens a question:

If we seal the borders and prevent ALL illegals from crossing.... are you willing to go out and pick lettuce... pluck poultry... clean offices... dig ditches and do all the jobs that they do for the wages they are paid and the hours they work?

Thought not.

Originally posted by grover
For all of you who are so opposed to this immigration bill and illegal aliens a question:

If we seal the borders and prevent ALL illegals from crossing.... are you willing to go out and pick lettuce... pluck poultry... clean offices... dig ditches and do all the jobs that they do for the wages they are paid and the hours they work?

Thought not.

Without illegals here to do the menial work, these jobs would suddenly become higher paying. Higher paying jobs means more people lining up for them. Economics 101!

I guess you are on the side of big business on this one Grover. More illegals working for low wages makes big business happy! I'm sure they thank you for your support!

This ammesty bill needs to be killed for good. We have procedures in place right now to secure the border, and to rid our society of illegals. All we need is enforcement, but the rules in place now are being ignored.

Just a few months ago a bill was passed authorizing a 700 mile fence to further secure the border. 2 miles of the 700 have been constructed to date. So this amnesty bill is not about security...it is strictly about amnesty.

Once again you are wrong RR but at least you are consistant. No I do not support big business... far from it... in fact I go out of my way to buy local from small businesses whenever I can... unlike many I am willing to pay more to support our local small businesses. It was a rhetorical question and one you will find that affects small businesses more than large corporations. large corporations hire low wages because they are cut throat bastards who want a profit at any cost... hence the hiring of illegals and the out sourcing of jobs. Small businesses hire illegals because cheap labor is the only way they can compete.

In all reality it is not the illegals fault, all they want is a job... the fault lies with the modern cut throat capitalism that has taken over this country. It is obscene and it is wrong.

Bad policy is bad policy. Our leaders have insisted for for the last six decades that border security regs NOT be enforced. If we simply enforced the laws we have on the books now, a lot of this would go away. Unfortunately, that won't happened. It says a lot that they won't allow enforcement in the first place. It says a great deal more that they don't want enforcement now.

Ultimately, that particular voting block has become too large. Our leaders are afraid of it, and what it would mean to 'cross' such a large and growing segment of the society.

Speaking purely for myself, illegal is illegal regardless of race, creed, color, sex, or religion.

All this talk about border security and keeping illegals out might be understandable on a knee jerk level but the bottom line is that it is impossible to enforce short of building a wall around the country and creating a police state. Even then it would fail... human populations have been on the move since there there have been human populations... we might as well accept the fact that borders are political constructs and not immutable barriers and deal with the issue in a more intelligent manner.

In some respects, I think the Republicans and Democrats both were taken by surprise in this matter. I don't think either party realized just how volatile this issue is with voters at the moment. The Republicans have tried to take th ball and run with it only to discover that what they want is not what their base wants.

Originally posted by Justin Oldham


Ultimately, that particular voting block has become too large. Our leaders are afraid of it, and what it would mean to 'cross' such a large and growing segment of the society.

Speaking purely for myself, illegal is illegal regardless of race, creed, color, sex, or religion.

Justin,
to me it also says something about the people that would vote in favor for people who are breaking the law. As this bill shows there are legal ways to go about changing laws and the governments policy. I don't think people should be rewarded for breaking the law.

I'm with you. Illegal is illegal, no matter who you are or where you come from. As citizens, we are called upon to obey the spirit and the letter of the law. Politicians, after a fashion, are enclined to say "yeah, but" because they see an angle that they can exploit. When laws are NOT enforced, it is because the people at the top tell the people at the bottom to NOT enforce.