The Amended Immigration Bill

Originally posted by jsobecky
I am against this bill. It rewards unethical and immoral behavior.

Yup, escaping persecution and desperately breaking laws for a new life. "Unethical and immoral."

Justen,
thanks a lot for chiming in.
Thanks for letting us know what you have heard about the kids on capital hill. Also thanks for backing up the advise for people to contact there representatives.

Originally posted by SteveR

Originally posted by jsobecky
I am against this bill. It rewards unethical and immoral behavior.

Yup, escaping persecution and desperately breaking laws for a new life. "Unethical and immoral."

You're missing the point. Notice we are talking about UNDOCUMENTED people in this country. You see, you seem to be implying that just because these people are trying to find a "better situation," that we should as a nation should put OUR LAWS aside. Codswallop!!

[edit on 5-6-2007 by SpeakerofTruth]

For humanity perhaps you should. God cares not about borders.

You obviously do not live in the U.S, Steve. We have given free reign to anyone who has wanted to come here for much too long. That has led to the current mess we find ourselves in.

[edit on 5-6-2007 by SpeakerofTruth]

My opinions are decentralized.



Want to discuss it, take it somewhere else.

Originally posted by SteveR
My opinions are decentralized.

Want to discuss it, take it somewhere else.

What? You are going to ... Wow, I had better not say what I am about to say. All I can say is,wow, dude, you have got some nerve.

Realign yourself with God "speaker of truth" and perhaps you will be able to say anything you like without fear of retribution.

Believe me, God and I are fine. Have a good day now.

[edit on 5-6-2007 by SpeakerofTruth]

I am sure you are fine. Even the most hopeless are warmly accepted.

That does not confer alignment.

Good days..

Originally posted by SteveR
I am sure you are fine. Even the most hopeless are warmly accepted.

That does not confer alignment.

Good days..

And that is YOU OPINION, good day.

Originally posted by SteveR
For humanity perhaps you should. God cares not about borders.

Steve,
yes that is one good example. The U.S. as a country has taken that approach, but what has been the out come of that approach?
Prior to the terror attacks the U.S. was the largest charity provider of food to Afghanistan, where did that get the U.S?

Redgolem, it just gained us more hate. That's all. It matters not the good we do. It seems to me all people focus on is the "bad" that our nation has allegedly committed. Oh, but how quick people are to forget the good things that america has done. How quickly they forget indeed.

Then, when there is a national outcry to secure our borders, which no one should be concerned about but AMERICANS, then we have committed some type of "sin" against humanity!! Wow, yeah, okay, if you say so.

[edit on 5-6-2007 by SpeakerofTruth]

Originally posted by RedGolem
Steve,
yes that is one good example....where did that get the U.S?

Exactly where "it" wanted to be.

Originally posted by RedGolem
Justen, thanks a lot for chiming in.
Thanks for letting us know what you have heard about the kids on capital hill. Also thanks for backing up the advise for people to contact there representatives.

In spite of what we have been encouraged to believe, we are not victims. We get the government that we deserve. the debate over this immigration bill will be the defining discussion of this decade. For some of you, it may be "the issue" of or for your generation.

For those of you under 30, I'd like to point out that this issue will affect your generation more than it will effect mine. I have education, credentials, and most importantly work experience that remove me from the socio economic layer that will be most impacted by this issue. I'm not trying to be snooty, I'm just stating a fact. I don't mean to offend anyone.

If this bill turns in to the wrong kind of law, it could impact your professional future in ways that you may not have considered. A huge influx of cheap labor means that your own wages will not rise very fast over a very long period. Consider that you will have to be making 3x the minimum wage to be at the top of the labor scale. Not beyond it, just at the top of it. Even with a college degree, I didn't see that kind of money until I was 38. Are you ready to chase that until you're 45?

I'm not trying to pick a fight, but I am trying to give you something to think about. It's find and well to embrace the idealism and want to help, but ask yourself one question. When 'help' means wealth redistribution, how much of YOUR help are you willing to give? That's a question that you and your generation will have to answer.

Originally posted by RedGolem
Again here is the link to a site that will tell you who your representatives are and how you can contact them. Via phone, e-mail, or snail mail.

Don't forget the link to NumbersUSA that I posted above. It is far-reaching, and it is free, so take advantage of it.

www.numbersusa.com...

All resources are important to use, so be sure to use them. NumbersUSA has delivered hundreds of thousands of free faxes to our senators and representatives. They also provide a handy reference source for voting records, contact names and addresses, etc.

Becky,
Thanks for the link. It is cool to be able to send a free fax. What I like about the link for My Gov is it sends me an e-mail as a head up for upcoming votes, and how my representatives voted.

Originally posted by Justin Oldham

It's find and well to embrace the idealism and want to help, but ask yourself one question. When 'help' means wealth redistribution, how much of YOUR help are you willing to give? That's a question that you and your generation will have to answer.

Yeah, I once was idealistic as well, when I was about 17-18 years old. However, once the realization hit me that things will never be the way that I idealize them to be, I moved from an idealistic mentality to a realistic one.

It all well and good to be compassionate. Hell, I care for others too, but when that starts interfering with not only the welfare of your nation, but your own personal future, you start thinking much more rationally about issues.

[edit on 6-6-2007 by SpeakerofTruth]

Here is an update to what is happening with the ammended bill.

They had turned back a bid to reduce the number of illegal immigrants who could gain lawful status. They also defeated an effort to postpone the bill's shift to an emphasis on education and skills among visa applicants as opposed to family connections.

And they fended off an amendment, by Sen. Barack Obama (news, bio, voting record), D-Ill., that would have ended a new point system for those seeking permanent resident "green cards" after five years rather than 14 years.

All three amendments were seen as potentially fatal blows to the bill, which would tighten borders, hike penalties for those who hire illegals and give many of the country's estimated 12 million illegal immigrants a pathway to legal status.

The Senate voted 51-46 to reject a proposal by Sen. John Cornyn (news, bio, voting record), R-Texas, to bar criminals — including those ordered by judges to be deported — from gaining legal status. Democrats siphoned support from Cornyn's proposal by winning adoption, 66-32, of a rival version that would bar a more limited set of criminals, including certain gang members and sex offenders, from gaining legalization.

Good or bad it looks like to to much is happening with it.
News

While watching C-Span over the last few days, iwas glad to hear politicians from both sides of the aisle whine about the deluge of phone cales, faxes, e-mail, and postal correspondence that they've been getting. It's worth noting that in theri elitist tantrum, they complain that the average American doesn't understand what they're trying to do. I think we understand all too well what they're trying to do, and that's why we're going out of our way to say that we don't want it.